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Ten Cars That Sank Detroit

I ran across the following article on Yahoo! titled 10 Cars That Sank Detroit that I want to share. When the 3 auto manufacturers came to DC (both times) asking for a bailout, there was a lot of talk about unions bleeding the companies, high pension costs, etc. Now those are important considerations, but in my opionion not the #1 problem. I've said it several times here and I'll repeat it again: the #1 reason Detroit has problems is because for the most part, their products stink. American cars do not compare to imports and that's the bottom line.

Sure we make good SUVs and we make good pickups too, but that's not the bulk of autos on the road. And those few that we do a decent job at are often not fuel efficient. Back to the cars......what cars do we have that are good? The Corvette......what else? Pretty much nothing

If I had my way, I'd keep the Corvette, Jeep Wrangler and Cherokee and perhaps a few select cars. The rest I'd ditch in the Mariana Trench and start clean. Study the Germans and Japanese and learn from them. Japan automobile imports went from crummy to hot in about 20 years. I think the US can match their counterparts in 5 years. I have never owned and American car and never will if they don't commit to a better product. Detroit needs to get their heads out of their nether regions and recognize the real reason they're sinking.

Posted by Tchaka Owen on 04/03/2009 11:15 PM

Comments (38)

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38 Comments on Ten Cars That Sank Detroit

APR

Unfair, Tcharack. My old GMC Jimmy only leaked refrigerant into the passenger side.

APR

Let's face it...their entire business model needs a HUGE extreme makeover. Why delay the inevitable? Allow American capitalism to work. If they need to restructure or shut down operations, then so be it. Bailouts are a temporal bandaid and offer no longterm resolution.

My last 2 cars have been a Chevy Blazer and a Jeep Cherokee. Both good vehicles. I agree that many of the cars they produce are lame, and I do think that is a big part of their problem. I also think that the unions are a giant anchor around the necks of these automakers. If they can't compete, then they need to be merged in with other companies or file bankruptcy and re-structure.

Tchaka - a somewhat biased article with certain innacurracies. The Explorer was developed to combat the Chevy S-10 Blazer, which had been very successful for almost a decade before that. Ford also had the Bronco, there version of the full size blazer and full size Wagoneer. Additionally, they had a smaller 4wd, the Bronco II, that the Explorer replaced because it wasn't selling against the blazer and small jeeps. Manufacturers, including Toyota, are cutting production on Prius type vehicles because they lose money on them, even at the outrageous prices charged, and, if not used within a city, they actually increase the amount of fuel used. It also fails to mention regulations that have sunk the industry, Ford & GM were not allowed to import high mileage vehicles that they build in Europe and Asia, mostly diesel.

Tchaka, interesting that the wingnuts are overlooking what the auto companies did to themselves, and of course blaming their demise on the unions. But those are the same people who say they want American jobs for American workers. When it all boils down, the union wages and benefits are miniscule to the overall cost of operating the Big 3. I agree with you about dumping most models. We used to manufacture "cool" cars with "cool" personalities. Then over time makes and models all started looking the same, and you could no longer easily tell who made what. The PT Cruiser and the HHR are proof the public is looking again for "cool" and add to that fuel efficient, at a reasonable price.

Terry - the PT Cruiser is less fuel efficient than my pickup truck, carries less, and is an ergonomic piece of crap. But hey, it looks cool....

Mike don't try to confuse Terrry with fact, first of all you are assuming she reads the posts before comenting onthem, disagreeing with her only revs her up , If you really want to confuse her agree with her than she'll change positions quicker than Obama breaks promises

What about that survivor car the Pontiac Aztec? That was one ugly car!

Larry - you are correct, that is uglier than the short lived (but cool) Volkswagon Thing BTW - interesting fact (I believe) the PT Cruiser is classified as a light truck.

I was a little confused by the post. I thought you were focusing on cars that the Big 3 should keep but you said you would keep the Jeep Wrangler....does that classify as a car?

I want to hope when you said "throw the rest in the Mariana Trench" you werent including the light trucks/trucks/SUVs. If you were that would make no sense. GM has 20 lines of auto 11 are profitable and they are all light truck/truck and SUV class.

How's this for an American car story. Back in 2006 my wife, then my girlfriend, was looking for a new smaller SUV. We went to the Lincoln dealership and looked at various models. We found a cute 4wd Mercury Mariner my wife really liked. We got it on a lease and drove it home. The first winter we had it, I noticed it didn't do very well in the snow. I just figured it was an inferior car. The next year we got stuck numerous times and when I was pushing us out, I noticed only one of the wheels was spinning.

In that time, the dealership we purchased the car from had gone out of business, so we took it to another dealership in a different city. We had them check the four wheel drive and, surprise, were informed the car was a two wheel drive. Not even an all wheel drive. A two wheel drive. The car even has a chrome emblem on the rear that says 4wd. Talk about getting ripped off.

We called the parent company to complain and they said they wouldn't do anything for us. Our only recourse was to hire a lawyer and attempt to find the owner of the dealership that sold it to us and sue him. But they were not willing to lift a finger to help us.

Israel - I think you hired a bad lawyer.

Look on the bright side with Government Motors we will be able to count on the government for our warranty work

Tckaka - you've never owned an American car???????? We've owned pretty much everything - Toyota, VW, Chevy, Ford, GM, Chrysler..(my husband likes vehicles...) We've had good and bad experiences with all of them. I do blame them for their own demise, but not because of their cars - any company that agrees to pay for health insurance for 750,000 former employees and their families for life deserves to go under. It's an unsustainable situation. They obviously were not thinking long term. We're not even talking about pensions. I'm not bashing unions - my hubby has been a Teamster for nearly 20 years (although he doesn't buy into their propaganda one bit).

Paul - LOL!! I guess your car was better than others. :-)

Rich - I can't say if bailouts for Detroit is good or bad (I haven't studied that enough), but yeah the business models do need that huge....er HUGE makeover!

Rob - Yet again, you and I are on the same page.

Mike - There might be a few inaccuracies, but the message the author is sending is quite clear. And the reason I'm sharing is because it supports what I've been saying all along. Perhaps he could have swapped out a car or two, I don't have a problem with that. The message doesn't really change though. Prius type vehicles might not be making money but they are a great step in the progression towards fuel efficiency. A decade ago we had electric cars that were very costly and didn't go far (nor fast). Look where we are now. So what will we have in 10 years? And must a vehicle be a hybrid in order to be efficient? There are many that aren't which still go far on a gallon. Regarding diesel vehicles, Americans for the most part don't like them. And what's the keep Ford & GM from building "high mileage vehicles" here?

Tchaka - they were not allowed to either bring them in or build them because of regulations on diesel engines. They would have been prohibitively expensive and the various requirements would have cut the efficiency tremendously. Electric cars are still extremely expensive, for the most part, unless you are talking about the little mini things that really don't take the place of a family car.

Mike- Really? A light truck? Thats strange. I almost bought a rag top PT a few years ago. The price was right but I changed my mind

APR

I still have one of these in my garage....

And one of these... .

They both run like tops and an idiot can work on them....unlike most modern vehicles in which no one can do their on repairs. These two cars are precisely tuned and burn clean, the AC blows cold on the GTO after 42 years and the 8 track tape works on the SS after 40 years. Both will outrun most of Japan's finest today and are guaranteed to offer a good chunck of Detroit iron between the Driver and whatever he runs into. AND They both look COOL after 40 plus years.... Oh, and they can make the geekeist nerd look cool too. I wonder how that Japanese model will appeal to Cool after 40 years?

Detroit did it right for a long long time. Mistakes were made. I do agree with Rich however on allowing capitalism to naturally take its course. Who knows ....maybe the Auto manufactures will save themselves. That is what is great about this country. If they really want to survive, it will happen one way or another.

Larry - yep - light truck, they did that in order to not lower the average mpg of their passenger cars and to raise the mpg of their trucks.

Trey - you just gotta love an "Old Goat"! I miss my '68.

Really Mike? About the PT Cruiser? I had one, I didn't find it at all "less fuel efficient than a pickup." And carries less? Lets see, we evacuated in 04 right before hurricane Frances. I had 5 cats in large cages, two medium size dogs, all the stuff we needed to haul out of the house and take with, such as computers and boxes of important papers, clothing, pet food, and then my husband and myself. I was extremely pleased with the amount of cargo space in that car. On the other hand I wouldnt own a pickup. I know what kind of gas mileage they get.

Terry - PT Cruisers get notoriously bad mileage, that is one of the primary complaints about them, along with excessive oil burning and poor performance, especailly the 4 cyl. I have had them as rental vehicles several times, I know people that have them, my Ranger gets better highway mileage and combined mileage. If you are carrying four passengers, there is very little room for cargo in what passes for the trunk. On the other hand, I can carry four in my truck and still have over six feet of cargo bed available. Or, I could have carried everything you did, plus still have room for mor than twice as much more. It is obvious that you have no clue what mileage pickups get.

I had a bet with a General Contractor on a job site where I was working - that hated women being present on the site. I was both the interior designer and the faux finishing contractor. So he gave me hell whenever he saw a possible glimmer of an opportunity. Anyway, I was lamenting that I wished I could buy a car that was serviceable to my faux finishing business that wouldn't depreciate. He overheard and said, no way, impossible...I bet you $500.00 there is no way you will ever find such a thing...

I was once a person that only purchased European cars. First car was an Audi, then a BMW then a Jaguar and then another BMW, then the strangest thing happened. This GC irritated me so much that I investigated auto possibilities. Well, I bought an older 6 cylinder El Camino for next to nothing, and I love it. It is the least expensive car to maintain, is really versatile in terms of what it can carry. And I get offers way above what I paid for it almost weekly. I am not saying that I am a true convert, but this particular American Car is my dream car. Oh, and I got a $500.00 bonus from someone who will never bet a woman on a job site again.

Mike, my PT got 24-26 mpg. Notoriously bad mileage? BTW the car was NOT classified as a light truck! Where do you get all that misinformation? Not FIX noise I hope.

Michelle, I drool over El Caminos! They are the coolest!

APR

Terry - From the InternetAutoGuide "The Chrysler PT Cruiser is designed by Chrysler, offers a spacious interior large enough for five passengers, and it is a front wheel drive automobile that is classified as a light truck/compact vehicle". Do a little research. The PT Cruiser was specifically designed to meet the NHTSA requirements for a light truck. It's a bit of game playing the manufacturers use. Let me give you another hint, enter PT Cruiser Light Truck into google and you will get hundreds of references.

In regards to mileage, except for one model, they get worse mpg than my ranger. And the only model that gets better has the anemic engine with manual transmission. Yes, they get notoriously bad mileage, like I said, one of the top three complaints, mileage, burning excess oil, lack of power.

Michelle - I love the El Camino, which year was yours? I had to chose between an SS 396 or a loaded GTO, I went for the GTO.

Mike excuse me, my insurance company rated that car as a car not a truck, and I drove that car for 5 years so think I might know a litle more about the gas mileage than you. Oh and it never burned oil and had great pickup. I guess I had the only PT on the planet that was worth a darn eh?

Terry - what your insurance company rates the car as has nothing to do with what the government rates it. Perhaps you were one of the lucky ones.

The PT Cruiser was designed with a flat floor pan and foldable seats in order to qualify as a light truck and not just a station wagon.

I had a boat that was 21 ft long, but, for insurance purposes was only 19'6".

APR

Jay - No, I'm focusing on the fact that most vehicles, particularly cars made by the Big 3 are not of a quality that I care for. In the part your referring to, I'm giving *my* suggestion on what I would do, however not relegated to cars only. Perhaps I should have used the term "vehicle". As for what a Wrangler is, I asked my gf and she says she doesn't consider hers a "car". Perhaps it's a true SUV...I mean, the people I know who own them actually don't relegate the tires to asphalt.

Why doesn't GM rid of everything and sell the 11 light truck/truck and SUV class vehicles and make loads of money?

I don't know the answer, but if I were to guess, I would say that they did well while the economy was booming and people were buying, not caring about gas mileage. Things have changed a bit. I'm curious if all 11 of those lines are still profitable. Also, there isn't all that much foreign competition for some of these vehicles, so consumers don't have that much choice in terms of what they buy. If I wanted a pickup truck, I'm probably going to buy American.

Susan - No, I haven't. I've owned 5 cars...2 from Japan, 2 from Germany and 1 from Sweden. I feel that overall American cars have improved over the past decade or two, the problem is that other manufacturers have improved more rapidly. Look at how far the Koreans have come in 2 decades! I do agree with you that there are good and bad with all, I'm just dismayed that our country doesn't own the industry worldwide.

And I'm not discounting the problem(s) with the unions, I'm just saying that a quality product is or should be the priority.

Trey - WOW!!!

Michelle - An El Camino, eh? I rarely see those on the road anymore. That would probably qualify as a "unique vehicle". Maybe we should give your car to Detroit and have them use that as the blueprint for good cars? ;-)

APR

Dear Tchaka,

I have had both American cars and foreign cars. My fave it still an American made 1965 Chevy Corvair convertible. At the moment I drive a Honda CRV.

Betina

APR

I have never had an American car and think foreign cars are a better investment because they have fewer problems and last longer. My husband has a Jeep Wrangler and I don't think we will ever sell it, it's been a great vehicle for us.

APR

Tchaka - They are still the only profitable lines (this is recent info). Some people try to say that electric is more popular and the Prius is the second coming. Its so funny. GMC Sierra/Chevy Silverado sold 5 times more than the Prius did in 2008 despite gas prices.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevy_Silverado#Yearly_American_sales

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prius#Sales

The business model of the Auto Companies is what ruined them. How could any company afford to pay for life time benefits of over 700,000 people. Think of like a cart with people riding and people pushing. Eventually if too many people become riders you wont be able to move the cart.

APR

Betina - That Corvair must be nice!! If I had zillions I'd get a Shelby Cobra 427. :-)

Patricia - You and I are on the same wavelength, thanks for commenting!

Jay - Thanks for the links. Several things I must point out:

1. Higher total sales does not make one better than the other. Case in point: there were probably less than 10,000 M3s sold in the US in 2008.

2. This blog isn't about GMC Sierra/Chevy Silverado vs. electric cars and Priuses....or Priae?

Tchaka - I thought the title of the post was about what cars sank Detroit? One would think cars that dont sell would sink an automaker. The prius remark was because it seems on AR there is alot of thought that nobody buys the SUV/Trucks from GM and people prefer the Prius because of mileage. The purpose of the links was to dispell that myth.

I dont know the prural spelling for Prius either..hahaha

MAY

Dear Tchaka,

I love the Shelby too! I would not turn it down if someone handed me the keys!! The Corvair is a cousin to the Corvette and Camero. In fact the corvair had the famous rear suspension before the Corvette. I think we should toss all the oversized SUV's into a pit. Don't put them in the ocean it would kill more fish!

;)

MAY

Well, it appears one automaker has been reading this blog. ;-)

Here's a piece that just appeared on CNN's Money site: New Ford Plants

We cannot expect electric cars to be cost-effective at this juncture, it will take time, development and modifications to fit our needs. But at some point in the future (10 years?) they will have a significant impact.

MAY

Tchaka, Interesting post. I thought it was significant that 2 of the 3 cars you mentioned that you would own are made by the American car company who is having the hardest time. Just goes to show that Chrysler management is a huge problem.

Personally, I can't imagine who is running those companies. The brands they are keeping don't make a lot of sense to me....Buick, really? Most Buicks on the road are 10-15 years old; it speaks to their quality, but who is buying them? I can't think of a single person I know who owns a Buick.

I was considering looking at Saturns because they make cars that have good reputations and good milage (as well as being attractive). They are getting rid of that one. Who are they using for their market studies?

The whole thing is confounding to me...right now we don't own an American car (and haven't since 1994) because we haven't found one that provided all that we needed--and wanted.

MAY

It astounds me that American cars have never been quality products.

Take a look at any 10 or 15 year old American car and compare it to a 10 or 15 year old Japanese or German Car, and please be sure that both vehicles have been maintatined equally as dilligently.

I'm sure the American car will be worse-for-wear.

MAY

I can't disagree, Stewart.....I drive a 12 year old German car that's hot!

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