Real estate is local when it comes to market conditions and market trends. Real estate differs from region to region in styles, architecture and amenities generally speaking. For instance; in Florida fireplaces are not the norm whereas in cold winter areas such as Colorado, fireplaces are a standard addition to a home. In some areas of our country people have wood burning stoves and others have coal burning furnaces. There are areas of our country such as here in Florida where you would not dare live without Air Conditioning but in many homes in Washington for instance, air conditioning is more of a luxury than a necessity.

So when we are discussing the effects of cap and trade in your real estate business you will need to take into account the region in which you live as some areas will be more effected than others. 

Here is a really good interactive map from the New York Times. The map I posted below is the map of the votes in the House for and against the Cap and Tax bill that just passed the House. But if you click on the link of the New York Times map, it is interactive.

cap and trade house vote new york times

 

You can move your mouse over the map and see who voted, what party they belong to and their district. You will be able to see that no matter whether they were democrats or republicans if they are in the farm country of America, high manufacturing areas of America, low energy bills of America and the heartland of America- they voted NO on this bill and for very good reasons. 

"For a household of four, energy costs go up $436 that year, and they eventually reach $1,241 in 2035 and average $829 annually over that span. Electricity costs go up 90 percent by 2035, gasoline by 58 percent, and natural gas by 55 percent by 2035. The cumulative higher energy costs for a family of four by then will be nearly $20,000.

But direct energy costs are only part of the consumer impact. Nearly everything goes up, since higher energy costs raise production costs. If you look at the total cost of Waxman-Markey, it works out to an average of $2,979 annually from 2012-2035 for a household of four. By 2035 alone, the total cost is over $4,600." Heritage Foundation.

You will notice that the states where the votes were yes are also the states that already have the highest energy bills. The states that voted no are mostly states with presently low energy bills.

Instead of calling this to Cap and Trade- We can really call it the Tax On Electricity Bill.

How does this information pertain to real estate agents? If you live in the lower energy pricing states you are going to be seeing huge increases in household energy bills. If you live in states that are coal powered or oil powered you will see the largest increases ever in your energy bills because those energy sources are going to be punished with taxation.

  • How is that going to effect home prices?
  • How is that going to effect movement in and out of your state?
  • How is that going to effect your real estate office utility bills and who is going to pay for this?

The House is at it again. This was a 1,300 page bill and again as with so many large bills was not read by most of those that voted yes or no. What is it that they don't get? The American people expect our leaders to read what they vote on.

So what else is tucked away neatly into this bill that perhaps no one knows the full implications of yet?

How about the Federal imposition and takeover of building codes? Your local planning and building offices will not be qualified for any Federal funding of any kind unless they adopt what the FEDS say is the new energy efficient building standards. This will create higher prices in building new homes which is then passed on the homebuyers and then you as a real estate agent are also effected because less buyers will be able to afford to buy a new home built . Not to mention having to wait for the Feds to come and inspect the builders and the homes.

How about the new Federal Energy Nazis Inspectors who will come and rate your home before you can sell your home. So before you can list a home for sale, the seller will have to wait for the Federal inspectors to come out. DMV lines anyone? Once that inspector comes out, he or she will give the home an energy rating. If the home does not meet the guidelines the seller will be required to do the work necessary to bring the home up to energy standards before they can sell the home! Can we say money? Does that mean that there will be homeowners who will become prisoners in their homes because they can not afford to make the energy repairs that the feds require? Is that an invasion of your privacy as well as an attack on your property rights?

Hmmm, how is that going to effect short sales where the seller has no money to make the repairs and adjustments?

  • How is that going to effect your ability to get listings in a timely manner?
  • How is that going to effect your seller who is about to lose their home in a foreclosure?
  • How is that going to effect the seller who has to relocate for their job?
  • How is that going to effect the estates with heirs having to do these repairs and such when there won't be any money until the estate is sold?

I wonder if our House of Representatives and our Congress men and women EVER thought to actually ask us in the field working this business day in and day out how these bills will effect the housing market?

Of course, the US will be living Cap and Tax while the real perpetrators of dirty air like China and India get off scott free. There will be an unfair advantage in pricing products and manufacturing to the point that if a US company even stands a chance of staying in the manufacturing business will have no choice but to move their company oversees which in turn will cause a massive layoff of people increasing the already high unemployment problem we are facing in our country.

  • How will the unemployment effect your real estate business?
  • How will the unemployment effect the REOs and massive foreclosures in your community?
  • How will the unemployment effect home values as you get more and more vacant properties in your area?

If you are an agent in America's farmland you will begin to see farms no longer being able to produce a profit. Farms use a lot of energy. Energy use will be punished. This is why nearly every politician from a farm land state no matter what party they are affiliated with voted no to this bill. Their districts will suffer terribly. As this happens we will be buying more and more produce from other countries with far less health standards than our own. I don't trust foods, especially produce from China or other countries except Europe. But we don't import our veggies from Europe! 

  • How is this going to effect your real esate business if you live and work in a farm land state?

When it comes down to the nitty and the gritty about this bill you must remember that GE is the biggest supporter of this bill. They stand to make billions of dollars from the passage of this bill. The politicians voting yes on this bill, many of them are getting paid to vote yes. And Al Gore will become the very first GREEN billionaire. It is just too bad that he is not a real capitalist. He could not become a billionaire playing fair and square. Instead, he has an unfair advantage, legislation to make him filthy rich. Not exactly the free market way. It is all about the money.

Contact your Senators now to vote NO now. Click on this link to find your Senators and contact them by email, phone and fax today. Let them know how this is going to effect your business and your community homeowners and buyers. Pass this on...

 

 
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249 Comments on How Will Cap and Trade Effect Your Real Estate Business?

JUN
30
330,295 Points 3 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

I can't see any benefits whatsoever to Cap and Trade for our industry or just about any other.

11:27pm • #1
622,949 Points 104 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

Christine- I do see it as raising taxes on the poor and middle class which was a promise made to be broken.

11:47pm • #2
1 Featured Post Outside Blog

I totally agree with you and thanks for including the link... we have a new senator from Alaska and there is some hope he will not vote party but vote the right way and say NO to the cap and trade bill ... I sure hope so...

11:55pm • #3
JUL
01
1 Featured Post Outside Blog Hit Router

Katerina,

I just keep thinking while reading, YOU ROCK!! Thank you for the well thought out and informational post. I just reblogged!! Keep up the Fight!!!

12:16am • #4
195,903 Points 19 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Good to see that our local represenatives voted "no" on this bill.  I think the # of pages says it all.  Clever name and a ton of paper are pretty good signs that not all is well.

12:23am • #5
291,687 Points 1 Featured Post Outside Blog

Katerina, Great information, this is outrageous!  I am more outraged that one of our legislative branches passed this without even reading it!!  If it were a great idea, there would be no need to try to sneak it in during the dead of night!  What a joke, and how stupid is it to raise taxes on necessary items ie electricity during a recession!  I think that members of Congress that vote without reading a bill, should face immediate recall elections!  I believe that even when they vote on bills that I am in favor of!  We need to educate the people and remember that everyone is capable of good and bad ideas regardless of their political leanings!  Thanks for the information!

12:26am • #6
191,947 Points 1 Featured Post Outside Blog

Hey Katerina...This took a while to Compile, Great Post I like the interactive New York Times Map,

Cheers, thanks for sharing :O))

12:55am • #7
267,114 Points Outside Blog

Nancy P from San Fran stands to become a Billionaire if Cap and Trade passes. Obama is a one term president if he doesn't wake up.

3:10am • #8
364,866 Points 14 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

I am just wondering why we haven't heard a loud outcry from the NAR on this issue....

5:59am • #9

Cap and Tax is an absolute attack on the America People.  It's time we send a messge to Washington.  We need to send every person in congress a pink slip and introduce them to the unemployment line.

6:16am • #10

How will living on a dead planet affect our business?   Compare US per capita emissions to anywhere on this planet.  Wake up and smell the roses! 

Don Sherblom
6:20am • #11

States must envoke their 10th Amendment rights to stop this nonsense.

6:38am • #13

I'm in complete agreement with all of the comments here - Cap and Trade is a disaster that will complete the destruction of our economy. 

Brenda and David:  Check out www.GradeGov.com, a website where you can give your congressperson and senators a grade and send them a letter about their performance.  Nothing will happen unless we make our voices heard!!

Sue Smith
6:43am • #14

Are we all against Clean Energy???

I thought the idea of this bill was to stimulate solar, wind, and other alternative energy sources. I will definitely have to examine this further.

Out with coal and in with solar, where possible!

6:51am • #15
548,376 Points 95 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

Great post, Katerina. Did you read the emails from the EPA Research Scientist that got ignored and was told to not work on the project. If you need a copy I will send it. He said there is no global warming, we are actually in a global cooling period.

I am just amazed that people think this is OK, what a waste of money to no avail. Once again on the backs of us middle class American's.

I don't even know what to say anymore, somedays I feel like saying, "just wake me up when this nightmare is over. "

6:52am • #16
548,376 Points 95 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

Oh that map rocks, of course in MI they all voted along party lines.

6:53am • #17

Fantastic post! 

My representative (democrat) voted no.  Thanks Bill Foster!  I wrote tricky Dick Durbin.  He sent me a form letter extolling the virtues of "saving the planet" and "all of the jobs that will be created".  Yeah, right!

What about short sales and REOs?  If people can't afford their mortgages, how in the *#% are they going to be able to afford this?  Will banks (REOs) be held to the same rules?  Heck, they aren't fixing safety issues!

Thanks for the link!

 

Nan Gagliano, GRI (Baird & Warner)
6:54am • #18

I have down loaded the HR Bill HR 2454 text and have reviewed about 100 pages as it pertains to the housing and energy labeling proposed.  There are drastic repercussions as I reviewed this bill that could devastate the resale housing for a generation or more. If there are Building Performance Labeling standards to be assigned to homes complete with inspections and requirements to upgrade homes to a base line standard (arbitrarily able to be changed) many of the older homes will not sell unless modification are made. This will cause values to plummet in my opinion. The creation of wealth with home ownership will be a hollow echo and a fleeting fantasy.  For Florida Realtors we may forget the baby boomers being able to sell their northern homes and relocate here. This is a frightening thought.

I am not an expert by any measure.  However, I would hope NAR is having someone go through the implications on housing.   The bill I have down loaded is nearly 1500 pages. Section 201 (beginning on page 320 of the version I have) starts the housing and building efficiency section.  This section is so hard to follow you need a compass and chart.  The section is about 100 pages long.  There may be additional amendments to the bill.

Once again the house has voted YES on this bill with out reading the bill since there is no way to do it and understand. The alarm I have is our representatives in Washington are passing legislation without reading the material. The right tools right now is to understand how we handle this legislation that will cripple the resale market and housing.

 THIS WAS TO HAVE HAPPENED LAST WEEK: Houses Passes Climate Bill with Energy Labeling Exemption

 The U.S. House of Representatives approved H.R. 2454, the American Clean Energy and Security Act by Reps. Waxman (D-CA) and Markey (D-MA).  The bill, re-numbered H.R. 2998, includes NAR-supported provisions which were championed by Rep. Perlmutter (D-CO) that exempt existing homes and buildings from the bill's energy labeling program.

After multiple meetings to discuss the Waxman-Markey bill, the NAR Land Use, Property Rights and Environment Committee directed NAR staff to concentrate on the real estate provisions in the bill. As a result, NAR issued calls for action and made this a talking point for Capitol Hill visits during its recent Midyear meeting. Overall, Realtors succeeded in making a number of positive changes to the bill. Thanks to Realtors, the House-approved bill:

  • Limits the energy labeling provisions to new construction only;
  • Prohibits the Environmental Protection Agency from regulating carbon emissions from residential and commercial buildings under the Clean Air Act;
  • Eliminates an early proposal to bolster a private right of action so that citizens could sue over minor climate risks under the Clean Air Act; that proposal is no longer in the bill as passed by the House;
  • Provides property owners with significant financial incentives, matching grants and the tools to make property improvements and reduce their energy bills; and
  • Establishes a multitude of green building incentives for HUD housing, including a loan program for renewable energy, block grants and credit for upgrades in mortgage underwriting.

While H.R. 2998 includes many positive changes, NAR will have additional opportunities to make further changes to address unresolved issues, such as the bill's building energy code targets. The Senate must still pass its version of an energy and climate bill.  There would be a House-Senate conference committee to reconcile differences between the House and Senate bills. The timing for a vote in the Senate is not clear as the Environment and Public Works Committee still must develop the climate provisions to "cap and trade" carbon emissions. The Senate Energy and Natural Resources Committee has approved the energy provisions (to which climate provisions would be coupled), which include building standards that are more realistic and preserve state flexibility to develop and enforce building codes. While the bill as approved by the House represents a significant improvement over the bill that was introduced, NAR will continue to work to address these issues as the legislative process continues.

An NAR summary of climate issues, which summarizes NAR policy, may be accessed on Realtor.org.  Here is the link:

http://www.realtor.org/fedistrk.nsf/c2c6e17e27e92119852572f8005cd953/4c238a3be8220682852573d4006f1dfc?OpenDocument

Still the overall bill is complete with all the ingredients to doom the economy.  We need a call to action to the Senate!

Sincerely,

Al

Al DiNicola
6:55am • #19

How could anyone support this bill.  If it passes in the senate we have big problems.  Even if it doesn't we still have big problems.  The people in Washington (either side) do not read and ask what the ripple effects will be of any of these bills.  It seems they are grabbing as much power as possible and to hell with the country.  Thanks Katerina for posting this. 

Larry Bunch
6:56am • #20

Great post.  What is the position of NAR?  I haven't heard a word.  Maybe they haven't read the bill either!

6:57am • #21
1 Featured Post

Truly and fantastic post, Kat and Nestor.  Thanks for all the work this one took.  Al, I'm mostly in agreement with your comment, except on labeling.  Labeling should absolutely be required so that homeowners can tell the quality of the product they are buying.  This process is no different than having a regular inspection.  This way it all becomes a negotiation.  People can choose if they want to spend less money on a house that needs a lot of work, or pay more up front for a home that performs better.  But the bottom line, buyers have a right to know what they are buying.

That being said, I am definitely against any legislation, such as the current bill, that mandates the improvements to be made.  Once again, this is a private matter that should be negotiated. 

This is a great opportunity for Realtors to be more valuable to their clients and distinguish themselves.  Buyers now want to know more about the construction quality, materials used, techniques... what's going on behind the walls and in the attic.  Prove that the investment they are making will have a better ROI than the house next door.  Realtors who can demonstrate this will come out on top.

Steve Rosenbaum
http://GetRatedNow.com/news

7:08am • #22

I'm really not on top of this yet ! Thanks for your post !

7:11am • #23

As an environmental engineer, this bill is absolutely ridiculous.  There isn't an ounce of science in the bill nor in the "reasons" behind the bill.

Some of you are absolutely right that this will hurt the poor the most. 

I'll give you a good example of environmentalism "ideas" hurting small business.  The idea that leaking underground storage tanks (gasoline & diesel) were ruining drinking water supplies became very popular during the Carter Administration.  So, instead of just requiring new systems to be tighter, small gasoline station owners had to remove tanks & replace them.  In addition, they had to clean up or monitor grondwater quality as well.  I managed over 300 of these projects in my career.  The MINIMUM one of my clients spent as $10,000.  Many spent much more.  Out of 300 proejcts, we had one (1) drinking water well which was affected slightly.  It was a very deep well that served a small town.  In reality, the amount of benzene in the well was much less than you would intake while breathing benzene when you fill up your car.  For only about $30,000 we were able to treat that well water to remove the benzene.  So, in simple terms, we could have spent $30,000 to fix a problem that actually cost small business way over $3,000,000.

Also, once we build these "tight" houses that meet the environmental standards, guess what's going to happen?  They are going to have much worse air quality problems from contaminants in carpet, contaminants emitted from house plants, dust and mold.  Homes should not be airtight.  They aren't healthy that way.  So, this bill will cause it to be harder to sell your home, reduce home values, make homes less healthy and increase health care costs.  BRILLIANT

Michael Hickman
7:15am • #24
108,775 Points 1 Featured Post

It is a time in our country where those in power are trying to seize even more power from states and individuals. The states need to stand up for their rights!

7:16am • #25
165,242 Points 7 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

WOW! Scary stuff!  Pretty soon we might be selling real estate in India or some other 2nd or 3rd world country where you can afford to make a living!!!

7:19am • #26
269,660 Points 42 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Al- comprehensive and well summarized.  No doubt this bill is going to have negative impact on a fragile economy. As far as the jobs it "May" create- they are immeasurably low in comparison to the billions of dollars to be made as a result of Fed intervention.  Since January 20th what measurable improvements has the new administration actually made?  Are we better off now than we were 7 months ago?  No, not really. 

Our great grandchildren will inherit our "new" multi-trillion dollar debt, unemployment is at all time highs, bills are passed routinely without being read and more families are losing homes than are able to buy homes.  Folks we are in deep $%^&*(  here.

7:19am • #27
315,468 Points 64 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Especially would like to see NAR focus on this, " How about the new Federal Energy Nazis Inspectors who will come and rate your home before you can sell your home. So before you can list a home for sale, the seller will have to wait for the Federal inspectors to come out. "

Implications are HUGE. Maybe not "doomed" as Lenn says...but maybe time to add Energy Rater to our toolbox...

7:20am • #28

WAKE UP EVERYONE BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE!!!  THIS IS NOT THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA THAT OUR FORFATHERS ESTABLISHED.....LIFE, LIBERTY AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS.  WHEN DID ALL THIS OTHER CRAP GET INTO THE PICTURE???

7:22am • #29
155,948 Points 1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor

Thank you for taking the time to provide such a well written, comprehensive post. The map is excellent. You are right we must ALL act now and get this dblueberryefeated! I agree we in in deep $%^&$$!!

7:23am • #30
100,749 Points

Katerina - Here is one of these long bills again. What congressmen really reads this bill all the way through. It seems lately that when they want to pass a long bill like this they wait until everybody is focusing on something else and slide it through quietly. The congressman are only raising taxes and passing all these bills so they can raise revenue to pay for all their wasteful spending. First, I think they need to stop all this wasteful spending. Second, we need to start drilling for oil in Alaska before someone else marches right in there and takes it from us. Just like the Chinese are doing in the Gulf of Mexico. Third, lower the corporate tax rate and get unemployment down again. We elect congressmen to speak for the people for our benefit and not for their personal interests.  

7:25am • #31

So very true, it is all about the $$,  This is an awful shame

7:27am • #32

Katerina & Nester, Thanks for posting this. Just what this country doesn't need right now, more incredibly far reaching bills that have neither been read nor understood by our elected officials. Embarassing that all of CT and the North East voted for this bill, our region especially will get creamed by any bill that makes it more difficult and expensive to sell the older homes. Al, Thanks for the further research and insight.

7:28am • #33
595,535 Points 244 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Grerat post Katerina. I have to admit that I am not up on this at all. Thanks for giving me a resource and place to start.

7:30am • #34

I'll skip all the cheerleading and back-patting. I agree that some of the provisions go too far. However, I was personally offended by the use of the wod "nazis" to describe the fedeal inspectors. This is reminiscent of the phrase "jack-booted nazis" used by the right wing nuts to describe the ATF . These people are just doing their job. One thing you learn when you ge into any kind of code/law enforcement is that you don't have to agree with the law. You didn't make it.

You have every right to criiocize. You do not have the right to overdo it. This bill has not passed yet. It still has miles to go and one of the things you, and all those who play chicken little every time anything is proposed  that might cost them a nickel, risk, is that the general public will tire of your incessant whining and nay-saying, then simply turn you off.

It;s time we stepped up and admitted that our environment is important. Maintaining it and taking steps to slow the degradation of it are important. Where were you guys when the "poor", who you suddenly discovered just lately, were being blamed for the ramifications of the greed of Wall Street?

The real estate, banking and investment industries share a major portion of the blame for the current economic situation. There's a saying about those who live in glass houses. You might want to heed it.

 

 

 

 

Jim
7:30am • #35
516,820 Points 11 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Katerina,

Thanks for a great post. You know that I am adamantly against this bill. Thanks for the additional insight. :)

Steve

7:32am • #36
201,300 Points 34 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Such a great post that I reblogged it.

I had the same questions that you bring up.  Selling homes just got a lot more cumbersome.

7:33am • #37

So here is my question:

Are there any supporters of this bill who have actually read it and considered the impact?

I've seen posts from people that argue that we need to "save the planet" and support the bill, but I've never actually seen any of those posters defend the far reaching implications of this legislation.

It is as if some people are supporting it based on the title of the bill. That historically is a really bad idea.

This bill, and this kind of "vote before reading" both need to be stopped.

7:34am • #38
1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor Hit Router

Expensive and intrusive - -when are they going to write bills that match the title and don't have a bunch of other junk added in?  Energy bills in Maine are already a huge burden and many of our towns have significant inventory of antique homes - both our reps voted yes - I will email today and ask them if they've actually read the bill and understand it will basically achieve the opposite of its purpose.  Thanks for the great piece.

7:38am • #39
5 Featured Posts

What a great breakdown of the ramifications of this bill-Thanks for it. I have been telling everyone to call in and say no to this bill, but of course the House did not listen. I hope the Senate can stand tall and say NO. Personally, 6 months of the "Obama-Nation" is enough as My grand-childrens, Grand Children will still feel the reprecussions of this Admin.

7:41am • #40

It is sad for me to see so many comments from real estate agents who show no understanding of the real, tragic climate issues this bill is attempting to address.  Thinking about what we are leaving for our children and grandchildren should at least create some sensitivity to these problems.

As Thomas Friedman described in the New York Times today, this bill has many features that are not good.  However, it is probably the best that can be done at this time and is essential to our country's and the world's future.

7:41am • #41

Dean:  WHAT climate change issues?  There is not one shred of PROOF that climate change exists.  It's all about lining the pockets of the likes of Al Gore and GE.  Wake up.

Sue Smith
7:49am • #42
4 Featured Posts Hit Router

Congrats on yet another feature.

Wow.  I guess I never really understood the potential affects of cap and trade.

Thanks for clearing it up

Have a great day

Leander

7:52am • #43
347,382 Points 9 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Oh my, what will they hit us with next?  We do not need higher energy bills.  It seems that the government right now is trying to take money from the citizens every way they can and give it to banks and auto makers.

7:53am • #44

Hang on folks. This sort of hyperbole was cast about the Clean Air Act of 1990, which reduced sulphur emissions that was causing devastating acid rain. That Act was a complete success, at a far lesser cost than even the government had projected. Cap and trade was designed, tested and proven here in the United States, as a program within the 1990 Clean Air Act Amendments. The success of this program led The Economist magazine to crown it "probably the greatest green success story of the past decade." (July 6, 2002).  Go here http://www.edf.org/page.cfm?tagID=1085 to read the real-world facts and figures of what that cap and trade program cost and yielded -- not some party-line nonsense about taxes.

Initial estimates by the Congressional Budget Office project that an economy-wide cap-and-trade program to reduce carbon dioxide and other noxious emissions would generate at least $50 billion per year, but could reach up to $300 billion. Approximately 10 percent of this revenue should be allocated to help offset costs to businesses and shareholders of affected industries. Of the remaining revenue, approximately half should be devoted to help offset any energy price increases for low- and middle-income Americans that may occur as a result of the transition to more efficient energy sources. The other half of the remaining revenue should be used to invest in renewable energy, efficiency, low-carbon transportation technologies, green-collar job training, and the transition to a low-carbon economy. Some resources should also be invested in the energy, environment, and infrastructure sectors in developing nations to alleviate energy poverty with low-carbon energy systems and help these nations adapt to the inevitable effects of global warming. Revenues from the permit auction would essentially be "recycled" back into the economy to facilitate the transition to an efficient, low-carbon energy economy and ensure that consumers are not unduly burdened by potentially higher energy costs.

 

7:54am • #45
244,782 Points 1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

Great blog katerina. I am for coming up with alternative things and to help our country be more energy efficient but like you said each area is different and across the board rules are not right. Thanks for the map too!

7:59am • #46
Hit Router

Very informative and comprehensive post! My husband has been in the power industry for years and has been saying the same things.   The technology is not there yet for wind and solar, nuclear is the answer.  This is just a way to jack up the prices on coal and electricity. Plus the environmentalists are not going to allow wind farms and additional transmission lines.  Thank you for posting this important issue with the effects to consumers.

The Regan Team

"Come to the Beautiful North Georgia Mountains"

8:05am • #47

This bill makes no sense. After all global warming does not exist. Everyone knows that.

It's normal to degrade this bill becuase your feel like your pockets are threatened. To those who say their children's, children will be paying for it- George Bush sent us down that road a long time ago.

The fact is whether or not global warming exists is no longer a debate to be had, the evidence is overwhelming. Put your nose up to the exhaust of school bus and breathe deeply and you'll see what I'm talking about. Let's get all the facts together about this bill before we go running around yelling fire in a crowded theatre.

And let's have the vision to make a better future for our children- by leaving them a cleaner world to live in. Even if it does mean adjusting our current way of life.

anon
8:06am • #48
234,065 Points 9 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

America is finally awakening to the fact we cannot continue to consume energy and natural resources with the same insatiable greed we have exhibited in the past.  However, we're not quite sure how to approach the problem, and this bill is a mixture of both good and bad solutions.  The problems were not created overnight and one bill will not solve them, but solve them we must. 

8:07am • #49
31 Featured Posts

Just reblogged this, thanks for taking the time to lay it out.  Also enjoyed reading some of the comments.  Off to email my senators.

And PS - you have EVERY right to 'overdo it'! 

8:08am • #50

A very important change to the house bill was left out of the "sky is falling" summary---The new standards apply to new construction, not existing homes. We need to consider what is best for the country as a whole and the planet, not just what is best for our pocketbooks.

Sybil Harrison
8:11am • #51
410,612 Points 81 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

I have never seen this information laid out quite so clearly, and I thank you for taking the time to do this.  I have to shake my head at the naivete of some people in this industry who don't accept that this Bill completely changes life as we know it through its long arm into housing, manufacturing, transportation...  The things you've outlined barely touch the hundreds of pages of changes that we will face, while other countries will not be hampered by the same restrictions.  There goes any hope for balance of trade and value of the dollar.

8:22am • #52
122,130 Points 4 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor

Great information and a lot to absorb.  I have not formed an opinion yet and this information helps.

8:24am • #53

Cap and Trade, nothing more than a tax hike for everyone.   Yes we all want alternative energy sources, tax credits for wind and solar energy, and a cleaner planet.  But this is not what this bill is about.  It is taking away freedom of choice and a power grab for bigger Government.  It's about control, who has it, who wants it, and how far some people are willing to go for it.

 

 

 

 

8:30am • #54

Great Post!

I also have wondered where our leaders in at NAR stand on this issue.  From what I have been able to read, they are still "ON THE FENCE".

I guess they are too busy planning the next convention instead of worrying about global warming.  Has anyone determine the carbon footprint of the conventions?  Corporate executives have been blasted and many events have been cancelled because they were afraind of Obama and Acorn.

Below is a petition that all should sign.

 http://www.americansolutions.com/energytax/petition_thank_you.php?success=1&updated=1

 

Respectfully

Stanley Cobb

Realty Executives Coastal Empire

Savannah, GA

 

 

8:33am • #55
327,040 Points 4 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Katerina - I was watching some Sunday morning news program and one of the commentators had this to say

"Congress is very good at legislating, at getting bills passed. Unfortunately, they are terrible at legislating solutions."

Cap and Trade is just another of the recent examples that prove this theorem.

It is an economy busting bill and will result in the largest migration of U.S. jobs to other countries ever seen.

8:35am • #56

What is really scary is that is all by design - to bring down the US Economy to a "level playing field". All the talk about "going green" wrt this bill is a complete scam and money grab. And where is the "transparency" when it comes to Al Gore and Nancy Pelosi personally benefiting from this bill.  You don't "stimulate" the economy by passing the largest tax increase in history due to "global warming" - oops, I mean "climate change". Did you notice, they don't call it "global warming" anymore - for obvious reasons. There is extreme urgency to get this bill passed NOW before more people wake up to what is really going on. 

8:36am • #57

Even more stupid, unread legislation coming from this group. They do all need to get their pink slips. I hope the masses wake up before it is too late for our country.

8:37am • #58

Thanks for putting this out there.  We all know that real estate is a very local business.  Of all people, we should know that blanket rules do not work well for everyone.  The power of the federal government vs the state governments is part of the issue here.  Our country is a republic, not a top-heavy, ruled from the top country.

The biggest point to me about this issue is: (1) global warming is scientifically unproven even though the "believers" in this do not welcome questioning of their theories. (2) the federal government should not be involved in our everyday life to the point hat a federal inspector is required for an individual home!

Realtors always cherish the freedom to run their businesses as they see fit.  I think state and local governments are not supposed to be ruled by the federal government.  Its the other way around.

This effort to "help" the country is a symptom of the reverse power balance that is currently favored by this administration.

Laura Dickenson
8:38am • #59
410,612 Points 81 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

'Just linked to this post from Twitter, Katerina

8:39am • #60

I can not find any reason to support any bill that is 1200 pages long and has a last minute addendum of 300 pages without having time to read the document before voting.  Where did the text of the bill come from?  It had to be from special interests, think tanks and maybe a few legislators who knew some of the details.  Any bill that takes this much text has got to be filled with unintended consequences because it has not been exposed to critical review and debate.

As shown in Al's comment the NAR is claiming credit for a few good changes but the NAR should have opposed this bill in its entirety!  They appear to have focused on one little 100 page segment of a 1500 page document.  As the comments here show you have to understand the whole thing in order to know what you are supporting.  NAR failed us big time with this bill.

Robert M Galbraith
8:48am • #61

I just linked and sent a message to my Senator, or one of the two.  The other is still having his new suit fitted so he can fit in lock step with the others who did not read, or care, about the bill.  I called Jim Oberstars office (our rep) and asked his position the morning that the 315 extra pages came in.  His aide said, at 10:30 am, "we heard a rumor about it, but have not seen it yet!"  It came out at 3 am to my understanding.  What a perfect job, Nancy tells you what to do, and your paycheck is secure.  I come from farm country, rapidly diminishing into commuter country.  Neither can afford an energy increase, they have already lost the farm, gone to the cities for jobs, and now can't afford the gas to get there.  Dick Morris, President Clintons advisor, was speaking yesterday on how he could not believe that the big o could be going back on his 'no outsourcing jobs' promise when this bill would have the largest impact on forcing industry to go offshores to get away from the carbon credit fines.  Again, China will benefit.  I also don't think it paranoid when I hear that China has been the largest beneficiary of the new administration, not the American people.  The American Dream is going away fast for my children. The future we had tried to build for them is being sold, in one fell swoop, everything our parents fought and died for is being sold.  When we people wake up?

8:52am • #62
Way to use such an unbiased source like the Heritage Foundation. If you want your analysis to be believable you should state the opposite case and refute it. Just sayin'
Erion Shehaj
8:53am • #63

THIS IS A JOBS BILL.

This will create jobs and job training programs all over the country.  This will help America become energy independent (which is a national security issue) and make green energy more affordable.

I guess people against this bill would rather be controlled by foreign oil prices?

Should we wait until it's too expensive to change our energy resources and consumption?  We are becoming unsustainable.

These figures of how much our prices will go up are ridiculous.  They don't account for higher energy efficiency or market based competition bringing th price down.  And all houses are not the same size and they don't all use the same amount of energy.

This is America for goodness sake.  We don't just think of ourselves over here and by doing so overcome any obstacle in our way.  WAKE UP AND LOOK AT THE BIGGER PICTURE.

9:00am • #64

Im sorry but just becuase you read the NY Times (That bastion of truth ..lol) doesnt mean your intelect somehow surpasses others here.

In your mind we are just peons who are members of the great unwashed I suppose.

There was proof in a report however, by a gentleman at the EPA that disproves Global Warming(google it!) but The department decided it should be suppressing inconvenient truths about Obama's politicized global warming agenda and I'm wondering if he's still employed this morning.

Global Warming is a hoax,It's been a powergrab from day one.It's also been widely discussed by communists,socailists,progressive thinkers and fascists for many years as a wokrable way to destroy Capitalism.The powers that be in DC have been co-opted and are more concerned with accumulating power and controling our lives than the destruction of the American Way of Life that has to take place for them to get there.

Please don't forget that the Original words were."Life, Liberty and the Persuit of "PROPERTY"!!

 

Jim
9:06am • #65

I contacted my local US Representative to protest this bill.  Keith Ellison return message stated he wanted to be the very best Representative . . . "  Yet, it is well documented House members didn't have time to read the bill.  If he did not read what he voted on how can he be the very best Representative?

PS.  Adam, don't be so naive.

9:06am • #66

Oh and jobs bill?

Research what it has done for Spain.It virtually the same legislation.

For every job it creates it kills 2.2 other jobs how is that a jobs bill?

Please get out of lockstep this is an American issue not a left right issue

9:10am • #67
196,854 Points 56 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Ok, I think we should look at this in a little different way. 

If we look at what local government across the Nation is doing, Cities and Counties are already passing these laws.  They are already increasing energy codes, requiring energy ratings on homes that are for sale, or at the least requiring that there be an MLS field for it.

Seriously, do you really think it will pass that homes MUST be brought up to energy code prior to selling?  That is the single most part of law changes that has been wiped from multiple states over the last year and was only passed in a couple of areas because of the cost to do so.

What this WILL do is probably offer more incentives to make energy efficiency changes MORE affordable. 

Home efficiency is a HUGELY political topic right now and has been for a couple years now.  This is not new.  Whether it be at a Federal, State or City level - these changes will be made in code over the next few years.  And the tax on electric bills, we should have seen that coming.

There are a lot of Federal Incentives to make farms more energy efficient by the way.

9:11am • #68

OH my my,

How do you think we've come to this place and time and situation.

People better get off of the idea "awww come on do you really think that.... insert statement of choice that can't happen here!

Look at where we are.Wake up people

9:16am • #69
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This bill has not been read by those who voted on it.

Special interest groups are responsible for it's content.

Most Solar and Wind energy is federally subsidized. It's looks like it will continue.

Nuclear Power is the only real form of dependable energy that will meet demand.

Very interesting Post

9:18am • #70

Again with the scary predictions. Rupert Murdoch controls our 'liberal' corporate for profit media. The talking points grow old, and the problem remains. It is time for freedom from big oil/coal, and to move to a more decentralized generation model.

Vincent Tedeschi
9:19am • #71

I agree with Charlene Blevins: the building industry (and that includes us Realtors) is just as much at fault in getting us in this financial and environmental (they go hand in hand) predicament as the energy industry, the banking industry or the government.  We overbuilt.  We built homes and buildings that were not energy efficient.  We used wasteful building practices that caused the rape of our forests, our Appalachian mountainsides, our rivers and and our air.  We hid our heads in the sand as Germany, New Zealand, Sweden, Japan and other 1st-world nations invested in clean energy and energy efficiency, and now their economies are far stronger than ours.  And now we're angry that a new piece of legislation might harm our business?

What about what happens if we do NOTHING?  I live on the Georgia coast, just a few feet above sea level.  Global warming is real and happening far faster than the general public realizes.  Climate researchers like Ronald Prinn (see http://web.rollins.edu/~jsiry/Climate%20_MIT_Ronald-Prinn.html) say unless we make drastic changes in our world economies, we are facing "a one in four chance of the Earth warming up at least 3 degrees centigrade, and the beginning of an irreversible melting of polar ice sheets."

If the polar ice caps melt, say goodbye to waterfront property on our coasts.  Say sayonara to the gulfstream that makes the northeast liveable.  And bury and mourn the many species that sustain life on earth such as bees, bats, other insects and birds that now pollinate our crops, yet face mass extinction because of human activity.  This is not about "the environment"; this is about US!!!!!  Just because we make our living off of selling property doesn't mean we should be ignorant and pollyannish about what's happening all around us, to our current generation and those to come.  Read the New Yorker article about how amphibians and bats, bellweather species all over the globe, are dying off by the millions (see http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2009/05/25/090525fa_fact_kolbert ).

IT'S TIME TO ACT, FOLKS!

If you don't like this bill, then write your representiatives, senators and the president and offer him a better solution.  Whatever you do, don't pretend as if we can blithely continue to soil our human backyard indefinitely.  We need to change our ways because if we don't, the US will become a 3rd-world backwater mired in smog, nuclear waste, filthy waterways and a barren landscape.  We need to change our ways because we're killing our own children with coal dust that creates asthma and respiratory problems, now epidemic among American youth.  We need to change because, frankly, it's time for America to kick ass again!  I am sick and tired of smaller countries beating us to the eco-punch.  We have the smartest, most innovative, most enthusiastic workforce in the world.  We can solve this!  Contrary to what some posters said above, solar, wind, geothermal, biofuel and other clean technolgies already exist and are working well.  We have no excuse except laziness, fear and greed.

As to how this will affect our real estate business--let's get real here.  What business?  Aside from REOs, short sales and foreclosures, what business is actually taking place these days?  The fact that we are essentially auctioning off America piece by piece should be a sign that something is rotten in the state of the old US of A.  As someone wise once said, instead of shooting at the elephant's behind with arrows, we should be figuring out a way to get in front of that pachyderm, digging a big hole and watching with glee as it falls in!  Let's be a part of the solution, not obstructionists.  I am profoundly, 100 percent American, so though I may disagree with you, I'll defend to the death your right to say it.  That said, let's stop bickering, get into the eco-trenches, work side by side and figure this (*^% out!

 

Katherine W. Oxnard
9:27am • #72

Adam VanZee, what does your bigger picture tell you?? You are right,  this is America but we better wake up before it's to late.   Get out the pitchforks -

Ingrid Heil (Ingridable Design Homestaging)
9:28am • #73

What a timely and relevant post. Thank you for taking the time to this compilation!

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Helen
9:29am • #74

I am sorry, but who pays for these "incentives"..one persons incentive is another persons tax.  I spoke to our local electric company, and the local wind generator/solar  company about all the options available for my little country store.  The cheapest alternative would cost me, up front, a minimum of $35,000 after credits..with a payback period of over 20 years.  Wind will not work during power outages, solar would not be efficient enough for my type of operation.  Our electric bill is already huge, with coolers, signage etc.  We have insulated, sided, reroofed, installed new HVAC and done everything possible to lower these bills ourselves, did not need someone to mandate it for us, and I did not need the government to tell me saving energy could save me money!  The mindset that the people need to be told what to do, think and say is one that has been tried in Iraq, China, Iran, Saudi Arabia..why are we allowing to happen here? 

9:30am • #75
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Stephanie- There is a HUGE difference between the local governments making building codes for their local areas but when you get into the FEDS taking over everything, that is a loss of state's rights and sovereignty. The loss of liberty is much more important than any energy efficient house.

What FEDERAL program can you quote to me that actually works? Look at our great examples, FEMA! What a disaster! Oxymoron:) 

This country was not founded on one federal government telling the states all what to do.

But even worse, this cap and trade bill goes much deeper than just housing. It only benefits the very rich.

It will increase everyone's utility bills, there is no doubt about that, even the President said it will increase utility bills. This is not fair to the poor. The rich can do their offsets and not change a thing about the way they live while we will all pay for a lower standard of living.

You can look at the bright side of a bill that no one in the house has read but at the end of the day, who has the right to tell me how long I can run my shower or what kind of light bulb I can use.

 

9:32am • #76
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WOW! What a response! I woke up this morning, turned on my computer, opened Active Rain- which is the first thing I do each morning:) and saw this post had been featured and has a lot of comments!

There are a lot of these that I want to address. I will be coming back as soon as I finish some of the real estate stuff that I have to attend to with some offers and follow up with some agents who made offers. I will get back then. Keep them coming.

Thank you to all who are reblogging this post! I appreciate it.

I am getting ready to Call Mel Martinez office today because Steve says that Mel says he does not have a position yet. If you live in Florida please call him now! Stop what you are doing and call him!

There are 2 days left where the house reps can change their vote. Please look at the map and call the reps in your district that voted yes and tell them to change their vote and that you will remember their vote in 2010!

9:36am • #77
196,854 Points 56 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

And for those that do not see how these changes can help the economy - I recommend reading Hot Flat and Crowded by Thomas L. Friedman. 

And for the comment about the part of existing homes not being able to be sold without being at todays energy codes - would that not apply to foreclosures as well?  There is just no way that it will stay in there.  People can't even get loans to get the work done right now.

While there is much that has not been read, there is even more that is not understood.  I guess its possible that I could be sticking my foot in my mouth in a few weeks, but closely following this legislation for a couple years now, there is the same exact hype and frustration in this bill as there has been all over the Nation at a local level.

If the words 'climate change', 'greenhouse gases' 'carbon footprint' we no where related to this Bill, would you have the same reaction?  Probably not. 

And the cost to make a home 30% more efficient is typically only a few hundred dollars.  It involves caulk and sealing tape.  And many states have programs that require the utility companies to provide that service for FREE.

9:37am • #78
Localism Sponsor

There are weather cycles, economic cycles, and too many other cycles to mention. We cannot control tornados, hurricanes, or hail. So why would any rational person believe we can do much about controlling temperature. I continue to be amazed by the number of people who see this Global Warming-Climate Change-Cap and Trade stuff as anything more than a money grab by the politically well-connected.

So we will have new financial instruments that will allow some to "sell" their rights to produce carbon to others. Bernie Madoff would be very proud of this scheme.

9:39am • #79

Thank you for writing this, I am so glad to see the spirited debate going on.

I'll keep ths short for now, but I felt yours was a commentary that makes way too many assumptions about what the lawmakers are doing.  How do you know which of the lawmakers has read the bill?  Since it is long, obviously they have not read it?  That is an assumption which casts a lot of doubt in my mind on the other assumptions you are making in your statment.  Your use of an emotional term like "Nazis" also casts a lot of doubt.  Have you read the 1300 page bill?  Do you truly feel that some homeowners are in danger of becoming "prisoners in their homes"?  Or that real energy problems are best addressed by ignoring them?

This is a purely personal response but if we knew there was some damage to the community water source happening from faulty plumbing practices, we would make regulations to correct that.  Why do we value our air quality any less than that?  Just in the same way cars with major emmissions problems are found by an inpection before you get your tabs, doesn't it make sense as we become aware of the true impact of some outdated building practices that energy arrangements by builders be subject to standards or that older homes get the check up just like cars do now?  Am interested in what other people think about this.

Again, thanks for bringing this to our attention!

Edy

 

9:42am • #80

Well, this is shaping up as a debate between two groups that have already made up their minds...Basic decisions must be made, quickly and by those who will directly affect the future generations of not only Americans, but the entire world.  One faction (and the majority of commenters on this site) are against the bill as it would to some degree create additional layers of regulation over many industries, levy some new taxes and stiffle the status quo of some entites. On the other hand, the Pay it Forward faction (of which I belong) believe it is a first step towards taking control of our destiny, avoiding significant (bankrupting) future costs, creating new industries and business for the future and taxing the largest polluters (aka carbon-emitters) their fair share...Good debate, but, as so many debates in America today, most people stake out positions, then find facts to back that up..

10:00am • #82

This will be a crushing blow to America as we know it.  This will have a negative impact on jobs.  This is not conjecture it is fact. 

Spain has led the world in spending for "green" jobs.  The net result, for every green job they lost 2.2 regular jobs.  Only 2 out of 10 green jobs are permanent.

Obama talks about 100,000's of green jobs.  What is a green job?  Is it a job in a plant making solar panels?  Making solar panels (solar photovoltaic) is an energy intensive and high pollutant causing business.  The EPA will most likely not allow companies here to make solar panels on a scale large enough to serve the US.  They will be made in China, so when Obama talks about green jobs, know that he is not talking about jobs in America.

This energy bill will chase jobs overseas into countries that laugh at such restraint on business and economy. 

Mostly this bill will, in Obama's own words, "necessarily make energy bills skyrocket".  People are having a hard time paying their mortgage now.  What happens when their electric bill goes up by 50% or 100%.  What happens to this nation when the choice is "eat or heat".

As for your businesses?  How do people save for a down payment when the government taxes away every bit of disposable income you have?  How much can they afford when interest rates start to increase under the inflation that everyone is expecting, with the deficit spending unlike anything we've ever seen.  Add the healthcare bill on top of it all...  I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel. 

It is not ONE thing, it is all things and it is coming fast because they want it to come so fast that you can't comprehend it all.  1000 page pieces of legislation being passed with no one reading it.  300 pages added at the very end and the drones just vote it in because "we need to do something".  Czars being appointed to fix (control) things (without any checks and balances, without confirmation hearings).  One second Obama says the government will not have day to day involvement in GM, the next moment the CEO of GM says that the Car Czar calls him everyday. 

Have you had enough CHANGE yet?

Call your senators, get involved, they think you don't care, they think they know better than you.  Tell them that voting yes on this energy bill and the healthcare bill will be like writing a resignation letter.

10:02am • #83

You're spot on with your comments - Most people only see a bill as something they'd like enacted & don't look down the road to see the future implications.

10:03am • #84

I sent my no vote to my Senator!

Let's do it!!!

Kathy Opatka

10:12am • #86

Great post - the truth shall always set you free!

10:13am • #87
638,265 Points 108 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Katerina - Thanks very much for this thorough analysis of the bill.  I kept hearing about it this past week, but I wasn't even sure what the ramifications were.

10:15am • #88
177,177 Points 13 Featured Posts

"Of course, the US will be living Cap and Tax while the real perpetrators of dirty air like China and India get off scott free. There will be an unfair advantage in pricing products and manufacturing to the point that if a US company even stands a chance of staying in the manufacturing business will have no choice but to move their company oversees which in turn will cause a massive layoff of people increasing the already high unemployment problem we are facing in our country."

This is a REALLY good point, we are afterall in a global economy.  Additionally, I think that it is a bad idea to raise taxes on anything when the economy is in shambles.

10:22am • #90

Thanks for the great post, and the willingness to take the time to explain it clearly and succinctly.  I appreciate your efforts to wake us up.

10:24am • #91
165,193 Points 1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

I could argue with you about this Bill all night. As a quick study read Michael Chrichton's book "State of Fear." It is fiction, but well documented. Kind of like Earth in the Balance is Fiction, but this book is more accurate.

This is just one of the major issues we are being pummled with on a daily basis.  The real issue is Freedom and the United States is under attack by it's own government.  I am a big defender of Freedom and I think Big business helps build a Big economy and provides many jobs, however, I am concerned by the growing alliance of Big Business and Big Government to control this economy and this country.

10:30am • #92

I am not going to say the bill in it's current form is the absolute answer to address the problem of global warming, a term that the last administration refused to allow officials to use. The softer more kinder term of global climate change was cloned to make the situation sound not as bad. Sea level in the past 100 years has elevated 9 inches and is expected to do so at the same or higher rate over the next 100 years. Here in the Florida Keysalong with other coastal communities, that would be devastating.

I think more agents should have been upset when a tax credit was given to people buying vehicles over 5000 pounds GVW. Unfortunately we had many Realtors taking advantage of that, buying Hummers and other vehicles that just added to the crisis. Not to mention how it motivated our auto industry to fall so far behind there foreign competitors.

To go greener is not a bad thing. At least this is an attempt to address a problem that was swept under the carpet for the past 8 years.

John Nazzaro
10:39am • #93

Great debate ... the "green" side of the debate ignores all of the recent evident that points to no climate change. Al Gore's global scientific consensus is rapidly falling apart. Couple this with the EPA squashing one of its own studies that debunks the climate change arguement .. well .. this whole bill becomes unnecessary. Which is the most frustrating part .. it's Tax & Spend.  Someone mentioned the billions of projected revenues - a piddling sum in view of the trillions of government spending. Plus, someone pays for those revenues - that would be us in the form of new taxes and energy costs. One estimate (CBO) estimates gas at $5.00 per gallon - and that's before any additional upward price pressures created by OPEC and market speculation.  This bill is TOO big, TOO broad, and TOO unnecessary. Now .. speak of the effect on the economy and struggling home market .. it's ugly

Bruce
10:41am • #94
237,343 Points 2 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Katerina - Greeat post. I reblogged it so that my office will read it in our workshop tomorrow.

10:43am • #95
1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Katerina as always very clear and concise. You know I often wonder when I read these bills - Who are the idiots that come up with this stuff. Do they even Think about the impact this will have on our nation? Do they even care?

What's scary is how many people are totally unaware of this, what it means and how little is being covered in the media. As Glen Beck said we care more about the dead of a super star than we do about something that will cripple this nation if passed. I for sure will re-blog this one.

10:46am • #96
315,468 Points 64 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Sybil made an important point: The new standards apply to new construction, not existing homes...

10:50am • #97
327,040 Points 4 Featured Posts Outside Blog

To all those who think it only applies to new homes! REEP, Retrofit for Energy and Environmental Performance, applies to existing homes, not just new construction.

10:59am • #98
237,663 Points 1 Featured Post Outside Blog

It is amazing that the Democrats after all their preaching about looking out for the poor and middle class would vote nearly unanimously for something like this.  Yes we all need to be as green and conservation minded as possible, but not to the tune of piling on more and more taxes directly onto the poor and middle class.  What a bunch of hypocrites!

11:03am • #99

Fantastic post. NAR, time to step up and get this bill stopped! I'm so sick of the federal government telling the states what to do.

11:05am • #100
254,683 Points 34 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

The give and take of our government is so one sided. Give a tax credit and then make us pay it back!

Can you say, "SOCIALISM?"

Our President promised change...

Well, here it is.

If the bill is strictly for new construction I can understand it. To a degree.

Remember when the government first passed the seat belt law? People were totally angry that the law could tell us what to do in our own vehicles. People were screaming "socialism" then.

Shall we all meet in Boston and drop some tea?

Deb

11:12am • #101

So, let me get this straight: China opposes any binding emission reduction targets on itself; China wants the U.S. to accept draconian emission reduction targets that will continue to cripple the U.S. economy; and on top of that, China wants the U.S. to subsidize its economy with billions of dollars in foreign aid. In the final analysis, one must give China credit for seeking its economic self-interest. I sure hope the Obama administration will do the same for America… -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mr. Inhofe, a Republican, is ranking member of the Senate Environmental and Public Works committee

The logic is not difficult to understand. Carbon caps, according to reams of independent analyses, will severely damage America's global economic competitiveness, principally by raising the cost of doing business here relative to other countries that have no mandatory carbon policies. So jobs and businesses will move overseas, most likely to China. This so-called "leakage effect" would tip the global economic balance in favor of China and other strategic competitors of the U.S. Clearly, unilateral U.S. action redounds to the benefit of China and to the great detriment of the U.S.

11:12am • #102
9 Featured Posts

Hey Guys!

Congrats on the Feature and a VERY well put together blog!  I saw a blog on this just the other day here in the RAIN, and had not even HEARD of this!  Nothing coming thru on the lending side that I have seen, but if there is...I would reblog you, and add it!  Also, you might want to check out the other blog....( Im sorry, but I dont remember WHO did it..), and be really cool...and put a link in YOUR blog to theirs!    Just a thought!  With your pulling power, it would be a great way to help out a fellow rainer!  You might have to search it, but I think it was on Monday!-  Thanks!  Bucky...err...Darin

11:26am • #103
222,784 Points 1 Featured Post Outside Blog

Thanks for writing this post.  Very helpful and really does not sound at all look a good bill overall. I think it has potential to crush home values even more. I have noticed in Minnesota the citys that have the required inspections the values have went down massively.  Same would likely happen with this.

11:57am • #104
288,496 Points 16 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Katerina, very timely and informational post! It's good to get the word out on this issue. I've been ranting on Twitter and on FB so that those who are unaware of this ridiculous plan slipped in without any fanfare. ;-)

AND, given 24 hours to read 1300+ pages and decide which way to vote? Hellooooooo!!!! Lots of pork contained in them there pages as well. Unbelievable what is happening in our country!!!

12:01pm • #105

Wow. That was incredibly one-sided and misinformed. For a BALANCED view of this legislation from a number of prominent figures on the other side in the so-called climate change debate, may I suggest this article at worldchanging.org:

http://www.worldchanging.com/archives/010010.html

(I say so-called climate change debate, because from a scientific perspective, there is phenomenal consensus across a huge range of disciplines that anthropogenic climate change is a real and pressing concern. Scientists are an ornery bunch, not easily swayed by political concerns, and taught from the earliest stages of grad school to look for flaws in hypotheses. The achievement of this kind of consensus is not trivial. Anyone who tells you otherwise probably has a vested interest in the status quo.)

Deborah Merriam, ecoDomestica reDesign, eco-consultant and stager

 

Deborah Merriam
12:05pm • #106

Katerina,

You always keep us so informed.  Great Info.

12:08pm • #107

On the surface all of these bills are made to sound beneficial to society and that is the "hook".  If you read the actual bill (and those who voted have not, and likley never will).  Pick it up and read it for yourself and you will soon realize the USA is being hijacked under the guise of "correcting" an environmental problem.  Who are they fooling, taxing the issues here won't fix anything.  All of the heavy polluters are offshore, so the less we pollute the more they will.  It's all tied to productivity. We won't be producing anything soon except more poverty.

Steve Baker
12:28pm • #108

Katerina this is one of your all time best posts!  I have reblogged it. 

How can you possible understand the implications of a bill you have never read let alone in good conscience vote yes to it. 

Now that my state has put Al Franken in the Senate the Democrats are filibuster proof.  People, we haven't even gotten to health care yet!!! 

 

12:38pm • #109
Outside Blog

Welcome to Big Brother running everything and taking alot more of your money. The negative effect on housing will be terrible. There are better ways to get green and promote smarter use of electricity.

12:51pm • #110

In response to Debra Mirriam's post, I personally do not have a vested interest in the status quo, except in regards to the notion of misguided "change".  I followed your link and read the opposing viewpoints - most of which were from far-left liberals who have been espousing this type of governmental control for decades.  The big problem I have with the concept of climate change is this: sudden and cataclysmic climate change has occurred several times over the earth's history.  A great read by sicentists Walter Pittman and William Ryan, called "Noah's Flood" (it is not a religious tome, these guys were not out to prove the Biblical story either way), clearly defines a major climate change as recently as 10,000 - 7,000 years ago.  Now, I wasn't around at that time to corroborate this, but I do believe that this was well before CO2 emmissions from burning fossil fuels and human farming activity ever took hold.  How do we explain that?  Now...no one will promote the idea that we shouldn't be good stewards of what we are given, and that includes our air, water and green earth, but to promote a bill as potentially economically devastating as this one is ludicrous!

12:59pm • #111

1. The bill would not force polluters to cut their own pollution until more than a decade from now. Instead, they could buy "offsets," paying a farmer who temporarily traps CO2 in the soil by not tilling it as much, rather than preventing pollution at the smokestack.

The bill awards 10 times as much money to speculative carbon capture and sequestration projects as to all green jobs training and aid to displaced workers, combined.

Waxman-Markey's flaws are huge but discrete, and they can be addressed in the years ahead. Meanwhile, we have to pass something to give the Obama Administration the necessary credibility to create global momentum before Copenhagen. Toward that end, Waxman-Markey is the only credible game in town.

What may be more relevant to people concerned about how to put bread on the table is that some analyses have the bill producing no more clean energy than business as usual for the next few decades. This means the millions of jobs we can create by transitioning to a clean energy economy won't come from this bill.

These are some of the "balanced" views from the worldchanging view website.  Damned by faint praise?  If a swimmer is drowning, and you do not know how to swim, do you dive in anyway, just to take action? 

1:03pm • #112
6 Featured Posts

Katerina - great post!  Very well explained and detailed.  I have contacted our Senator about this and many other issues that are going on.  It just blows my mind what is going on.  Seems like they want to keep kicking us while we are down.  If this passes, I bet they will come out with some great tax credit though that homeowners can use to make their homes "green".  Oh yeah but someone has to pay that back right? Socialism in the making.

1:06pm • #113
280,333 Points Outside Blog

Nancy Pelosi says this is a jobs bill and when you think about it with all the money shewill make look how many more plastic surgeons she will be able to hire.

Seriously this is just another step to completely destroy the economy of the country so hte secularists can rebuild it according to their misguided dreams.

1:27pm • #114
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John Nazzaro- The carbon emmission guilt tripping has gone way too far. We need carbons. Scientists have even proven that carbons are not contributing to climate change.

Carbon Dioxide is a life giving gas which we would do very well with more of. The notion that this gas is now somehow a pollutant is frankly ridiculous to say the least. Carbon Dioxide benefits us in several ways, directly and indirectly. Edward Townes

"Carbon Dioxide is plant food. There are numerous empirical studies that show doubling the CO2 in the air plants live in leads directly to a 20%-50% increase in bio-productivity, depending on the type of vegetation. The plants grow faster, have more leaves, buds, and other features, use water more efficiently, and grow more densely. It is no accident that commercial growers intentionally pump 3/4 times more CO2 in greenhouses than in the relatively carbon starved outside. Since plants capture Earth's only source of energy (bar atomic), their increased growth leads directly to an increase in vitality the whole way up the food chain. This helps explain why dinosaurs were so large, because in an era with 5 times as much atmospheric CO2 they could find the sustenance to survive. Carbon dioxide levels only begin to get toxic for animals at 5% and over, which is roughly 100 times the current atmospheric level. In summation, more CO2 is of huge direct benefit to the environment."

1:31pm • #115
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Deborah- You could not be more wrong about scientists being unbiased and without political agenda!!!

Have you ever heard of the movie EXPELLED? Scientists are not even to allowed to bring up intelligent design.

Have you ever heard of grants? You don't think that politics play any part in grants to scientists?

Have you ever heard of BIG PHARMA??? FDA??? Hmmm, those are certainly unbiased, LOL!

1:41pm • #116
Hit Router

I'd contact one of my congressmen but I'm pretty sure they're all having lunch with Al Gore and planning how to spend their carbon credit kickback money. 

First, we need to quit relying on non-renewable resources for our energy needs.  Period!  This strategy causes us to make political decisions that are not in the best long-term interest of the country.  So let's agree we need to change (I hate that word now).

Second, the information contained in these blogs seems to indicate this is not good legislation, but simply a gambit to achieve some political end.

The thing that irks me more than the contents of the legislation is that, once again, our representatives in Washington are ready to approve legislation THEY HAVE NOT READ!  THIS IS CRIMINAL!  THIS SHOULD OUTRAGE YOU!  THIS SHOULD MAKE THE PHONES RING IN WASHINGTON!  THIS SHOULD GET YOU IN TO THE STREETS TOMORROW!  WHAT IN THE HELL HAS HAPPENED TO US?  WE ARE MOLLIFIED CODDLED COWARDS WITH NO ANSWERS BECAUSE WE'VE LET THESE CRIMINALS THINK FOR US FOR SO LONG.  WAKE UP NOW AS IN THIS MOMENT AND DO SOMETHING!  ANYTHING!  CALL YOUR NEIGHBOR, YOUR CONGRESSMAN/WOMAN AND DON'T BE POLITE ABOUT IT. 

We have been asleep, content to let others craft our lives for us.  Well, they have and they like doing it.  Pretty soon we won't have a life, we'll endure an existence.  This is no joke.  Those Americans who preceded us would be hanging their heads in shame at how we've let ourselves be led down this road.  We have the greatest country/system/opportunities/life on the planet and we're giving it away.  Let's stop doing that.  Start right now, do something and I'll do something too.  Good luck.

Sorry, this hit a nerve.

1:43pm • #117
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Anyone who votes on a bill that they do not read and says they know that this bill is good for the planet or for humans is not speaking the truth.

Has anyone found out NAR stand on this issue yet?

1:54pm • #118
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Those of you who are saying this applies to just NEW HOMES- that is NOT TRUE!!!

Read the whole Bill!

The bill has one section for new home construction and another section for resale homes. Resale homes must meet the new energy codes or they will not be able to be placed on the market. There are already a couple of states that do this now. Also, here in Florida there are homeowners who are the victims of this type of legislation on a state level regarding septic tanks. These septic tanks must be inspected by the state before you can put your home on the market in certain parts of central Florida. The cost to the homeowners for bringing their septics up to the new environmental standards costs an average of $25,000 to $75,000 per house. Most of these homeowners can not sell their homes now. They just don't have the money to do the upgrades/replacements/etc.

2:01pm • #119
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Watch out- before you can sell your home you will even need to make sure that you have only government mandated and approved light bulbs in your lights!

2:03pm • #120

Far more scientists deny Global Warming than the ones who say it is true.  No doubt the ones saying it is true are being paid off by those who are going to become very wealthy off of all of us smucks!

Cleaning up the environment and slowing our usage of foreign oil is very necessary.  This bill is NOT the answer to those problems!!s

Natural GAS Bill HR 1835 is a GREAT bill.  It replaces foreign oil with our own abundant natural gas!  Why isn't obama and his band of thieves talking about that bill? 

Al Gore is nothing but a liar and scam artist.  We are to believe he cares about the environment when he personally polluts the air FAR MORE than 99% of the population?  Please!  As he jets around in his private jet place to place.  He has made in excess of 100MILLION dollars on Cap and Trade world wide!  Pelosi is already swimming in tax payer money from the TARP money which HER HUSBAND is getting. 

Liars and thieves are in charge of our earnings folks!

Georgia
2:03pm • #121
Outside Blog

As with most periods in our history and moreso in the industrial side.  We have "historically" incurred a cost in the name of progress. The problem I am seeing in this blog, that like most of America we have and are consistently thinking about "ME".  We tend to spiral deeper into this mind set and we collectively fail to realize that our forefathers, leaders, scientists, businesses, etc, all had sacrificed billions of dollars for the sake of progress. 

Although I agree there is pork in this legislation, it is also relevant to state that the Power Lobby has also waged a war on this therefore spitting out propaganda  and check$ in order to dispel the idea of progress.  DO NOT be fooled and think that it is all bad.   This will create jobs (maybe not in the next month) but it will however.  If we pay more taxes then so what!! We will also be selling and financing more homes all the while = MORE INCOME!! 

Statements like "We're DOOMED" are statements that have been made for the last  50-60 years in our history and we are a better country for not listening to those pundits.  One thing I can tell you and this is a fact for many of you, We are better off than we were in the last 2 1/2 years

STOP, LISTEN, LEARN AND BE WILLING TO TAKE RISKS!!!

2:05pm • #122
Outside Blog

Georgia, please show me the proof of where there are more scientists that believe Global Warming is a farse.   Please!!!

The truth is, my uncle is a scientist that strongly states that Global Warming is not the culprit to our environment rather "Historical Certainty".  What he means to say, is that the earth has a historical pattern of going through extreme environmental changes.  However, my uncle will also expand that due to the consumption of fossil fuels and other types of pollution, the earth's environmental pattern is accelerating at a rapid pace. 

In short, we are kicking our environment across the finish line faster than it can run. 

Now please show me "real, valid and intellectual" information showing me that our earth is not at peril.

2:11pm • #123
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Please read comment #24 by  Michael Hickma. He is an environmental engineer. He makes some very valid points based on his professional experience. 

You are right, Michael, the poor will suffer the most under this legislation.

Indoor pollution is worse than the outside 'pollution'. You are right, our homes need to be aired out, windows open, doors open, etc.

You are right, we don't have carpets in our homes because they are very toxic to us.

I choose my products and actions based on health reasons, the health of my family. Not because they are labeled 'green' or 'save the planet'.

2:12pm • #124
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Also there is a group of more than 31,000 scientists that says:

"There is no convincing scientific evidence that human release of carbon dioxide, methane or other greenhouse gasses is causing or will, in the foreseeable future, cause catastrophic heating of the Earth's atmosphere and disruption of the Earth's climate.
"Moreover, there is substantial scientific evidence that increases in atmospheric carbon dioxide produce many beneficial effects upon the natural plant and animal environments of the Earth."
To see a list of those scientists and read the scientific basis for their statement, go to www.petitionproject.org online.
2:26pm • #125
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From the Arizona Sun:

● There is no evidence that carbon dioxide is, or ever has been, a significant driver of temperature. All the scary scenarios we hear exist only in the virtual world of computer modeling, modeling based on assumptions that are proving to be wrong.
● There is good evidence that the greenhouse model used by the United Nation's Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change is wrong. The panel's greenhouse theory holds that temperature trends (rate of warming, not absolute temperature) should increase by 200 percent to 300 percent with altitude, peaking at around 10 kilometers — a characteristic "fingerprint" for green house warming.
However, actual measurements from weather balloons and satellites show the opposite result: no increasing temperature trend with altitude. In other words, the model-predicted "fingerprint" of anthropogenic, greenhouse warming is absent in nature.
● Restriction of carbon emissions will harm our economy by making energy more expensive and increasing compliance costs for businesses, schools and government buildings.
● Even if you believe that carbon dioxide emissions have a significant effect on temperature, the human contribution to total greenhouse gas emissions is insignificant — approximately two-tenths of 1 percent (0.2 percent). Therefore any scheme to limit emissions will fail to have an effect on temperature.
● Carbon dioxide is vital to all life on this planet. Over the long geological perspective, current concentrations of carbon dioxide are dangerously low. Plant life becomes more robust and more water efficient at higher concentrations. This has implications for our food supply.
2:28pm • #126

 i love the comments in #24, which i missed in the rush of the day.  My husband and I were one of those mom and pop stores forced to dig up the tanks, pay for an environmental audit, and it took us five more years to get them back in the ground, after fighting the County in court to allow replacement!  We sure saved the planet on that one!  The carbon emissions on all the excavating, drilling, construction work probably added more than letting the tank alone.  Two of our neighboring country stores were driven out of business, we were lucky that time, but if the energy bill goes through, everyone will be driving 13 miles to Wal Mart..wonder how much impact that will have as oposed to shopping in the community?

 

2:33pm • #127

Thank you for writing this blog.  You have put a lot of time and thought into writing it and it shows.

Jean

 

2:40pm • #128

Let me first say that I haven't read the bill- I plan to, now that I've read all the controversy.  My problem is that so many people, instead of reading and researching this information for themselves, choose to follow blindly what they read without confirming the facts for themselves.  I'm not saying that the posters of this article are incorrect in anything they state- I'm sure they have stated the facts AS THEY SEE THEM.  All I would suggest is that for each and every person to do their own 'due diligence' instead of just blindly following the OPINIONS of those that posted this (or any other) blog.  I say the same thing every time my sister sends me a forwarded email before checking the facts through Snopes.com (which usually turn out to be untrue). 

As to My OPINION, I think that massive change to our American lifestyles is needed.  My OPINION is that Global Warming is a real threat.  Deny it if you like, after you research THE FACTS for yourself.  My OPINION is that Americans need to stop the massive waste of natural resources and stop pretending that life as we know it can continue like this indefinitiely.  Oil is the basis of our economy.  Oil will not last forever. Try renting "The Crude Awakening: The Oil Crash". Yes, it's a documentary, and I'm sure a lot of it is OPINION, but there is a lot of fact and many well credentialed expert interviews in the movie. See how good our economy will be when there is no oil left to buy.  You may not like the Obama administration or their Green initiatives, but I agree that we need to start conserving our natural resources or we will have far worse problems than impending global warming- we will have no economy to speak of and we'll all be fighting over the last tank of gas.

For those that are concerned about the costs of energy efficiency upgrades to existing homes (should it come to pass), think about the cost savings of performing those same upgrades (visit energy.gov for energy saving tips, some very minor and inexpensive).  I don't think sellers should be made responsible for these upgrades- I agree that they should be negotiated between buyers and sellers.  But I still think they are a good idea.  Does everyone have to install solar panels to be more energy efficient?  Of course not- but even if everyone in the U.S. just caulked windows and doors and switched to compact flourescent light bulbs, that would be a huge energy savings and would directly result in less carbon emissions.  CFL's last up to 10 times longer than regular light bulbs, they produce 90% less heat while producing more light per watt , and they use only 1/4 the energy of incandescent bulbs. 

We can all agree to disagree whether global warming exists or not.  But can you really disagree that we WILL run out of oil at some point in the near future?  Can you really disagree that when we run out of oil it will be a GLOBAL crisis?  Federal intervention may not be the first choice for most of us free thinking, entitlement oriented Americans- but would you really do anything about this problem yourself if Uncle Sam wasn't holding your hand?  If we were taking care of the problem ourselves, Uncle Sam would probably be sitting back in his hammock with a smail on his face and sipping a margherita...

 

 

2:45pm • #129
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A great read about the VINDICATION OF CARBON and all the benefits of Carbon.

http://www.tech-know.eu/uploads/THE_VINDICATION_OF_CARBON.pdf

They are creating a COW FART CZAR. To mandate how much carbon the farts from cows are going to be allowed to make and what the farmers will be fined and taxed for letting their cows fart. OK< have we gone too far in micro managing carbons?

In fact, carbons are so low, plant life is actually in danger on Earth. It is really the opposite of what those that stand to make billions are telling you.

Remember this when the food supply goes down. Of course, the fastest way to change the form of government in a country is through hunger and unemployment. If food supply dwindles, find out who prospers from that. Follow the money.

2:46pm • #130
6 Featured Posts

The biggest issue I have with this and many of the other bills being passed is "choice".  We as Americans should be able to "choose" to make our homes or businesses green.  We should not be forced to comply to govt. green standards before we can even sell our homes.  Homebuyers should be responsible for "choosing" whether they want to purchase your home because it is green or not.  This should be a homeowners and homebuyers choice not the governments.  I am all for making things efficient but it should be my choice.  It should not be forced on me at my expense and my family's expense.  The govt. should not be making our choices for us with "our" money.

Katerina - outstanding discussion you have going here.

2:48pm • #131
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Here is an excerpt from the above article and link:

"The only gateway through which carbon can enter the food chain to enable the biosphere to exist is
through the carbon dioxide in the atmosphere. There is no other way. It all starts with CO2 in the
atmosphere. The entire chain of life starts with plants absorbing this entirely natural, colorless,
odorless, absolutely non-toxic aerial gas called CO2.


They used to teach these simple facts to primary school kids, but nowadays teachers who are way off
with the environmental fairies are scaring the daylights out of our children with hobgoblin stories
about the evils of CO2.


This insanity must stop. It's time to teach the kids again and to remind the adults of this world that
CO2 is the primary plant food that ends up feeding them too. They need to be told again the simple
fact that the leaves on a plants have stomata through which they absorb or breathe in C02, and by a
process of photosynthesis, the plants turn this CO2 into carbo(n)hydrate food for animals and man.
They need reminding that more than 90% of the dry matter of plants is simply processed C02.
Whether it is a cow eating the grass or humans eating the cow, all are eating -and being fuelled - by
processed CO2.


CO2 is as natural and as necessary to life as water and oxygen. It is not a poison. It is not a
pollutant. It feeds the whole world! "

2:51pm • #132

Ted try reading a TON of articles instead of taking dear old uncles word for it.  Tell me when you've read these.  I have many, many more.  I've been reading articles on Global Warming (both sides of the debate) for about 2 years now.  How many have you read?

Here's a great video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Io-Tb7vTamY

"The prospect of domination of the nation's scholars by Federal employment, project allocations, and the power of money is ever present and is gravely to be regarded.

Yet, in holding scientific research and discovery in respect, as we should, we must also be alert to the equal and opposite danger that public policy could itself become the captive of a scientific technological elite."

-- Dwight Eisenhower speech, 1961

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=64734

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,333328,00.html

http://www.nipccreport.org/index.html

http://www.infowars.com/cooling-trend-puts-global-warming-theory-in-doubt/

 

The purpose of the event is to expose Congressional staff and journalists to leading scientists and economists in the nation's capital. Senators and Representatives will be invited to speak side-by-side with leading scientists and economists. Allied organizations have been invited to be cosponsors, to help supply speakers and promote the event to their members and supporters.

The conference's theme will be "Climate Change: Scientific Debate and Economic Analysis." The theme reflects the fact that the scientific debate is not over and that economic analysis is more important than ever, now that legislation is being seriously considered. The real science and economics of climate change support the view that global warming is not a crisis and that immediate action to reduce emissions is not necessary. This is, in fact, the emerging consensus view of scientists outside the IPCC and most economists outside environmental advocacy groups.

-The Heartland Institute  6/2009

 

"On June 2, as Congress debated global warming legislation that would raise energy costs to consumers by hundreds of billions of dollars, the Nongovernmental International Panel on Climate Change (NIPCC) released an 880-page book challenging the scientific basis of concerns that global warming is either man-made or would have harmful effects

The scholarship in this book demonstrates overwhelming scientific support for the position that the warming of the twentieth century was moderate and not unprecedented, that its impact on human health and wildlife was positive, and that carbon dioxide probably is not the driving factor behind climate change

The Nongovernmental International Panel on Climate Change (NIPCC) is an international panel of nongovernment scientists and scholars who have come together to understand the causes and consequences of climate change.

Because it is not a government agency, and because its members are not predisposed to believe climate change is caused by human greenhouse gas emissions, NIPCC is able to offer an independent "second opinion" of the evidence reviewed by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC)."

 

 

Georgia
2:52pm • #133
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Darin - I think that was Jim's featured post but it is against AR community guidelines to add links in comments without permission from the owner of the blog. I will ask Jim if he minds if I put this link there. I am sure he won't mind. I commented on his post. Thanks for the heads up! It will effect your mortgage clients because it will raise their ratios. Their utility bills will skyrocket, even the President says so.

2:56pm • #134
360,111 Points 23 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Man I feel like Don Quixote----but here goes.  I have read through much of the bill and have re-read and re-read the sections that seem more applicable to residential real estate and fail to understand the serious heartburn that is evident in many of the comments.  I have to wonder how many that are commenting are echoing other commenters or posters regarding the bill as opposed to actually reading the bill themselves (much like the congress men and women that supposedly have not).  Are we willing to think outside the box of our own little lives and see that there might be a bigger picture?  I see some riding horses into battle that may not be the best choice in terms of who's stables the horses have been in (IE scientists being paid by big oil etc).  We all must be very careful to not believe in things we don't understand.  It is possible to stay objective---but if we let our belief systems get in the way----there is NO chance.  It is easy to throw around terms like "big government," "states rights," "freedom," etc but much more difficult to see a bigger picture where "ALL" of us are the center of the universe instead of "I" am the center of the universe.

2:57pm • #135
9 Featured Posts

Katerina-I WAS HOPING you would get to me!!! LOL...Thanks!   Yes, and in a followup...I spoke to the folks at WELLS FARGO..and noone there knows ANYTHING about this...which means that it more than likely will not be a loan requirement!  sooo...yes, It WILL affect lock times and costs though for sure!!

Thanks again, and yes, I realize it is against guidelines without their permission...Like I said in my blog the otherday..it is kind of an automatic for ME to include people and email them as part of that automatic feeling!  ..hence, I dont worry about that guideline! 

Lastly, the people arguing over who is smarter here, is giving me a good laugh!  Deb miriam, I googled her...interesting what you find..As far as Georgia goes, you started losing people here, when you blasted a particular Politician.  I dont like al gore, but I dont say that...woopps...I just did! LOL   Ted, back off just a little bit dude!  YOU are passionate, but it is okay to disagree..and< one of the points of the blog as I SEE it...is the fact that there are MORE requirements that COULD BE, and I stress, COULD be thrown at us before we could sell or finance a home.  Pretty soon, noone will be able to!  Here in Wisconsin for example, we have MANY older bedroom communities...and I dont know what the energy efficiency ratings will be...but I am confident MANY OLDER VICTORIAN homes are going to struggle with this!  The relevance to people thinking that we have Global Warming OR not, to buying/selling/& financing homes...is truly yet to be seen!  I would love to see the page out of the bill that states what the WINDOWS will have to meet, attic insulation, etc...IF THIS IS THE CASE>.I am quitting the mortgage business, and going into Enviromental inspections and becoming Federally approved! This will defintiely create more jobs...and too much work, and slower process, and bla blah blah..

Currently, gas, & electric bills are not considered into the debt ratios.  HOWEVER, it would not surprise me if that comes next!  :)

Thanks guys!
D

 

3:05pm • #136

Katerina, great information on your posts!  I enjoyed reading them immensely!

Why is it that the advocates for this disastrous bill are so bipolar about this issue?  NO ONE is denying we use too much energy!  NO ONE is denying we need to clean up the environment!  NO ONE is saying we don't need to get off the oil standard!!! 

Let's address the REAL problems instead of made up ones!!  There are MANY to choose from.  Our water is getting more and more polluted every year.  We buy and toss far to much "stuff"!!  We don't recycle nearly as much as we need to.  I could go on and on.  This bill that RAPES the public in the farce of "Global Warming" is disgraceful!!!

As I said before, NATURAL GAS is the answer.  Drilling for our own oil for an interrum is also part of the answer.

How many of you who are agast at those of us who see this bill for the hoax it is are ACTIVELY participating in groups that do have solutions?  Do you belong to the Pickens group or any like it that have REAL WORLD solutions to this problem?

What about the rest of the world...who is polluting far more than we are? 

 

Georgia
3:07pm • #137
306,853 Points 8 Featured Posts Outside Blog Hit Router

I'm in the heart of coal country and we're braced for HUGE increases in 2010. We already know it's coming.

3:16pm • #138
Outside Blog

Georgia,

Your sources are laughable at best.  They are groups formed by the conservatice lobby and are also in the business of selling books.  I have no doubt there are thousands of sources stating this.  The fact is they remain biased.   They have not even had the resources to make their evidence sound.  It is nothing but a consortium of scientists expressing their opinions based on evidence they choose to acknowledge or not acknowledge. 

It is really foolish to think that pollution is not real.  In fact, in makes and has no sense. 

 

3:24pm • #139
Outside Blog

Hi Gloria,

By the way try using more recent information.  Like 2009!!  Here is one for you: 

Study: Antarctic glaciers melting faster than thought:

http://www.usatoday.com/weather/climate/globalwarming/2009-02-25-warming_N.htm

3:29pm • #140

  • The post and a lot of the comments are nothing but  scare tactics, even quoting the Heritage foundation. Come on people, you are all so afraid of everything except destroying the planet. That seems OK. Do you actually believe that everything is OK? That we can just go on business as usual? What you are afraid of, is change. But guess what we're either going to change and do it quickly or we are all going to have massive amounts of pain. The reason the bill sucks is because it tries to please everyone instead of doing the right thing. That's how everything is managed in this country lately. It started out as a good idea but got watered down. The polluters who should be buying the tax credits are getting them for free. What kind of crap is that? That's not going to cut it. You can argue about whether global warming is caused by CO2 emissions in the last 100 years and keep doing nothing and things could approach a point of no return. If you believe the bought scientists who are saying that global warming is a hoax, you are a fool. There is so much evidence out there, I would be embrarassed to follow the wrong side. You have to start somewhere even if it's not perfect. What are you doing?

  • Time to muster up some courage and really go for it. Your children and grand-children will either thank you or curse you. Are you not capable of reading both sides of a story and understanding the facts and getting to the truth? Greed and love of money seem more important than protecting our planet, our home, the sacred vessel that sustains all life. A planet that is in deep trouble. One that has been abused, polluted, destroyed. The forest, being the lungs of the planet have been cut to make hamburger and paper. We need to raise our sights. The oceans have been acting as a sync for temperature changes but they are approaching a tipping point and I am afaraid you won't like it when that happens. Time to eat higher up the food chain and consume energy higher up as well. Meat is at the bottom, vegetables are at the top. Coal is at the bottom. the sun is the ultimate.

  • This group should be talking about how to improve the value of the product by making the homes more healthy, sustainable, ecological. You should be driving the changes in local building codes. You should organize and get local governments to rush to help facilitate the installation of alternative energy in their communities. You should be talking about conservation. Some of you are worried about not being able to burn and pollute and then you talk about indoor air pollution. Make up your mind. By the way there are simple proven solutions to deal with indoor pollution. Air exchanges and plants. There are alternatives aand solutions for all of the problems we are facing today.

  • And guess what if the product is no good and no one wants to buy it, that's capitalism and the free market system. But there will be homes on the market that have anticipated, retrofitted, upgraded. They will be the new stars in demand. You may not like to hear it but building stick houses with improper orientation in further and further away suburbias has turned out to have gone on too long and it's a big mistake now that we are still running our society on oil.

  • So cap & trade is not perfect but it's a start, and whether you like it or not, we need to start doing some thing before it's too late.

3:29pm • #141

Thanks Ted, but I will believe the 31,000 Scientists who the refute Global Warming Theory!  You can believe dear old uncle if you like. 

Georgia
3:34pm • #142

Duhhh dumb. I think about a dozen people out of the 31000 were actually climatologists. You see that's what I mean. You just can't tell the difference between shit and shinola.

3:39pm • #143
232,550 Points 5 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Senate will kill this but we will still get some form of it because of the supreme court decision. Proud of my representatives in my part of Tennessee.

3:49pm • #144
Outside Blog

Cap and Trade is all about taxation. How can a country survive when we are penalized for using one of our greatest resources coal, and can't drill for the other oil. India and China are out producing us and the gap will continue to widen while our liberal government continues to tax us and take aweay our freedom to use our resourses.

I am realy glad to see that most of the comments support common sense in using our resources as a country. Let us hope the polititians get it. 

4:27pm • #145

Awesome blog post!  Thanks for summarizing the stunning ramifications of such an amazing influx of more government in our lives.  Please, everyone!  Write your senator and urge them to vote NO on this ridiculous bill!

4:32pm • #146

P.S.  I'm also amazed at how much many of the respondants here have been completely BRAINWASHED by the global warming fearmongers.  But, if you can't believe ABC, NBC, CBS, and CNN, who can you trust?

4:34pm • #147

Interesting article from the WSJ - June 29th 2009

"Among the many reasons President Barack Obama and the Democratic majority are so intent on quickly jamming a cap-and-trade system through Congress is because the global warming tide is again shifting. It turns out Al Gore and the United Nations (with an assist from the media), did a little too vociferous a job smearing anyone who disagreed with them as "deniers." The backlash has brought the scientific debate roaring back to life in Australia, Europe, Japan and even, if less reported, the U.S.

In April, the Polish Academy of Sciences published a document challenging man-made global warming. In the Czech Republic, where President Vaclav Klaus remains a leading skeptic, today only 11% of the population believes humans play a role. In France, President Nicolas Sarkozy wants to tap Claude Allegre to lead the country's new ministry of industry and innovation. Twenty years ago Mr. Allegre was among the first to trill about man-made global warming, but the geochemist has since recanted. New Zealand last year elected a new government, which immediately suspended the country's weeks-old cap-and-trade program.

The number of skeptics, far from shrinking, is swelling. Oklahoma Sen. Jim Inhofe now counts more than 700 scientists who disagree with the U.N. -- 13 times the number who authored the U.N.'s 2007 climate summary for policymakers. Joanne Simpson, the world's first woman to receive a Ph.D. in meteorology, expressed relief upon her retirement last year that she was finally free to speak "frankly" of her nonbelief. Dr. Kiminori Itoh, a Japanese environmental physical chemist who contributed to a U.N. climate report, dubs man-made warming "the worst scientific scandal in history." Norway's Ivar Giaever, Nobel Prize winner for physics, decries it as the "new religion." A group of 54 noted physicists, led by Princeton's Will Happer, is demanding the American Physical Society revise its position that the science is settled. (Both Nature and Science magazines have refused to run the physicists' open letter.)

The collapse of the "consensus" has been driven by reality. The inconvenient truth is that the earth's temperatures have flat-lined since 2001, despite growing concentrations of C02. Peer-reviewed research has debunked doomsday scenarios about the polar ice caps, hurricanes, malaria, extinctions, rising oceans. A global financial crisis has politicians taking a harder look at the science that would require them to hamstring their economies to rein in carbon.

 

Georgia
4:54pm • #148

Fantastic Post. This is not a matter of R's and D's, it is a matter of accepting socialism or rejecting it.

This is very simply a ship jobs over seas and tax those left holding the bag program.  Isn't it interesting that Global warming has produced 6 years of steadily declining temps -oops I forgot, it is now climate change.

National building codes, increased cost for natural resources, just what we need in a recession. Fact is no one voting for or against the bill read it, which would lead one to conclude that they all should be out looking for work.

If we are trying to become greener why aren't we building nuclear power plants. Imagine we could increase our availability without economically devastating those on fixed incomes. Meanwhile, China is opening 2 coal fired power plants a week. They will be increasing that terrible CO2 at a rate faster than we can reduce ours. Guess who will be a a better position ot sell products and improve their economy? It certainly won't be the US. We will be importing refined petroleum because it will be to expensive to refine it here.

Cap and Trade is  simply a shift of control from local to national control. Once we give up that control what is the chance we will ever get it back. Kind of like imagining the federal government shrinking.

Once again, great post. YOu know it was good when you stir up the Kool-Aid drinkers.  To Hell with Freedom and the Constitution, the government will protect us.

Steve Cramer, Exit One Realty - Denver
4:54pm • #149

Great post.  This comes at the same time that the EPA cover-up of the research that disputes that an increase in CO2 causes global warming.  More proof that the whole global warming issue is a hoax. 

A senior Operations analyst for the EPA, Alan Carlin, wrote a 98 page report that will invalidate the Tax and Trade energy bill just passed by the House. 

"Mr. Carlin, an environmental and transportation economist, analyzed the information that the EPA used in order to claim global warming was in fact going to bring about the end of the earth as we know it, however, Mr. Carlin urged the EPA to look at the science behind global warming.  He suggested that using the UN data was not a good idea and in fact out of date.  He also states that the earth has been in a cooling trend, where temperatures have been declining.  He also suggests several other reasons that may contribute to the cooling trend, and even why temperatures have increased in the years past.

The controversy begins as Mr. Carlin's report was refused by the EPA that could have presented this information to lawmakers before passing the energy bill.  Mr. Carlin was then removed from handling climate change issues....." by Melissa Ligon   For the rest of the article go to http://www.examiner.com/x-10091-Madison-County-Conservative-Examiner~y2009m7d1-EPA-analyst-report-not-provided-before-House-passes-energy-bill

I always thought it seemed ridiculous that the air we exhale is poisanous to the planet.  One valcanic eruption can cause a whole lot more greenhouse gas than humans can in a year and we are in a period of relatively few eruptions compared to periods in the past.

 

 

 

 

Jeff
5:03pm • #150

Thank you for taking the time to put this info out there.

Do you mind if I twitter your column?

Gary
5:14pm • #151
Outside Blog

Eric has said it best!!  Great job!!  You are right on!  ALL POLITICIANS are constantly pandering to what the lobby says and always rises to the occassion of messing things up even more.   Change is a must as well as a fabric in what makes this country AWESOME!!  In is strange that citizens that are suppose to be for growth, prosperity, and ingenuity are so scared and opposed to change.  Change won't come in the form of a pretty basket.  Unfortunately, there will be the need to pay people off in the process.  That is right, PAID OFF!!  And if you think your Replublican Representative & Democratic Representative will not have his pocket and hand out, then you surely have a narrow way of looking at the world.  These are the ways of our world and have been since Julius Cesar.  However, "CHANGE" in whatever color or stench it comes in, has always been a good thing.

Oh by the way Gloria, the same organization that said Global Warming is not real (IN YOUR REFERENCES) is the same organization saying that the Glaciers are melting at an alarming rate!! 

You are an alarmist and over exagerrator of sorts.  You are more worried about "CHANGE".  Thank all the Presidents in our country's history who did not listern to people like you.  Change is a coming and either you make lemonade or get stuck wondering what to do with the lemon.  

I am sick and tired of the lobby destroying everything but their self interests.   There is too much of right slant on this discussion and people have stopped thinking rationally.  I haven't heard many people providing solutions other than complaining, complaining, complaining.  That is what has been done in the last 8 years and nothing has been done.   In fact, things went down the toilet. 

Now watch someone reply to this with something negative and with not an inkling to a solution.

5:17pm • #152
115,853 Points

Nestor ... Thanks for your good post and excellent questions about possible effects of the proposed US Tax on Electricity bill.  Whether others agree about anticipated consequences, these should at least be considered.  That is a taxation bill.

5:57pm • #153

Hey Gasset Team!  Great article, very well put and very well resourced!!  As an eco-friendly Realtor, this one was a tough one for me.  But I truly could not and did not support this.  I belong to several green organizations and although I understand and support the efforts to go green, it couldn't be at the extreme cost to the American people this bill proposed - which of course.....not many who approved it cared or understood - or maybe they did - they got their raise anyway. 

The American people are already paying for the bank bailout while government is giving themselves raises, not paying SS & healthcare along with all kinds of fringe benefits that you and I pay in our taxes.  What happened to the basis of why a government was created:  For the People.  They all need to be voted out of office.  It should be an honor to serve and represent the people of this country.  Just ask the military how much they've sacrificed for us. 

I'm not sure who wrote the following e-mail I received, but thought it was worth sharing. 

Just after 7:15pm Friday, the House voted 219-to-212 to pass Barack Obama's "cap and trade" bill. Cap and trade is another attempt by Big Government to manipulate the free market. Liberal politicians think that they know better than consumers and business owners, and they intend to force you to use products (alternative sources of energy) that are not economically viable. It's another example of government picking winners and losers.

The losers under this bill are fossil fuels - coal, oil and natural gas. The winners are solar, wind and other alternative fuels, which you will end up subsidizing under this bill. To give you an idea of how inefficient and expensive the alternatives are, consider this analysis from the Manhattan Institute's Center for Energy Policy and the Environment:

"There's an unavoidable problem with renewable-energy technologies: From an economic standpoint, they're big losers. .The U.S. Energy Information Administration reported in early 2008 that the government subsidizes solar energy at $24.34 per megawatt-hour (MWh) and wind power at $23.37 per MWh. Yet even with decades of these massive handouts, as well as numerous state-level mandates for utilities to use green power, wind and solar energy contribute less than 1% of our nation's electricity.

"Compare the subsidies to renewables with those extended to natural gas (25 cents per MWh in subsidies), coal (44 cents), hydroelectricity (67 cents), and nuclear power ($1.59). These are the energy sources (along with oil, which undergirds transportation) that do the heavy lifting in our energy economy.

"The alternative technologies at the heart of Mr. Obama's plan, relying on mandates and far greater handouts, will inevitably raise energy prices -- and high power prices are job killers."

Cap and trade has been described by Michigan Democrat John Dingell, who voted for the bill, as "a great big tax." Billionaire investor Warren Buffett, who opposes cap and trade, called it "a huge tax . and a fairly regressive one." So, supporters and opponents agree: It is a big tax and likely one of the largest in American history since it will tax energy - the lifeblood of our economy.

Dena Calivas
6:18pm • #154
1 Featured Post Outside Blog Hit Router

Katerina - Honestly to say, that I had no clue that the house passed such a bill. What is more disturbing to me is that most politicians that voters put there did not read the bill nor did they researched diligently what is at stake here. As always you put this great article together and it deserves all the reblog already taken place and many more to bring awareness to the folks, like me that really had no idea.

6:44pm • #155
2 Featured Posts Outside Blog

What a controversial issue. That's a shame that such an important issue which will touch every single family in America has not been broadcasted and discussed widely. I hope, Senators will pay some attention to what people say. Katerina, your post is awesome. I re-blog it and hope that more people will pay attention to this matter.

7:19pm • #156

Katerina - This evening I hear Obama speaking about how California raised taxes on energy in the 1980's.  He went on to say how many jobs and an increase in economic activity this created.

 

I can't believe he would use this as logic, for we all know how California is issuing IOU's for services that they can not afford, and are constantly proposing state bankruptcy.

 

Really America its time to wake up and realize what is going on in Washington.  It's time for conservatives to unite and take back the White House, Senate, and House.  

 

7:28pm • #157

Just came back on line after working with some unemployed people who need to leave town for a new job out of state.  They are on the brink, need to rent and sell their home.  These people are already affected by the economy, what would the need to upgrade their home do to them? 

Most of this dialogue has been respectful and well thought out, questioning  and honest interaction.  When you need to call names and accuse people of ignorance, you are not a part of anyones solution.  When accusing people of slanted opinions, maybe you shoud look over all of the pictures, and take stock.

7:51pm • #158
1 Featured Post Outside Blog

Katerina - Just a couple days ago I wrote a  post about this monstrosity and Energy Tax Facts from Heritage Foundation.

Just a few interesting reminders about the totally absurd and fabricated global warming. It needs to be stated that people who oppose this hoax are not against protecting an environment - like having clean water, using less fertilizers and pollutants directly dumped into our river streams, etc, etc...

In 1998, with Bill Clinton in the White House, Sen. Larry Craig said, "As more and more American scientists review the available data on global warming, it is becoming increasingly clear that the vast majority believe the commitments for reduction of greenhouse gas emissions made by the administration in the Kyoto Protocol are an unnecessary response to an exaggerated threat the vice president himself [i.e., Al Gore] is caught up in making."

In 2005 US Sen Inhofe's (R-OK) speach about global warming  where he said that the "greatest hoax ever perpetrated on the American people"

In 2008 Does anyone remember the recent rebuke of Lord Mongton, a well known and respected scientist on the subject of Global Warming, who had flown here from England recently to go before Congress at the request of the Republicans to give the opposing argument against Al Gore when before the Waxman committee?

They actually denied him the opportunity and told him that it would embarrass Gore.

Mongton was going to explain to the committee that before the industrial revolution 1700-1735 temperatures rose 4 degrees in 35 years. Temperatures rose 1.3 degrees in the whole 20th century and actually the evidence is that there is global cooling! Sea levels he said, have risen 8 inches over 100 years. The last 3 years sea levels have not risen AT ALL!

This climate agenda is nothing more the a new world order for control of peoples lives and a way for elites to profit at the expense of the tax payers.

Keep the earth clean. We are all for that but don't fall for the biggest hoax ever perpetrated in our schools, on our kids and on the people at large!!

Good for Inhofe! He always seems to be the only one that seems to cry out for justice time after time. I really like this man.

In 2009 Sen. Inhofe Calls for Inquiry Into 'Suppressed' Climate Change Report - Sen. Inhofe Calls for Inquiry Into 'Suppressed' Climate Change Report

Republicans are raising questions about why the EPA apparently dismissed an analyst's report questioning the science behind global warming.

By Judson Berger, FOXNews.com

A top Republican senator has ordered an investigation into the Environmental Protection Agency's alleged suppression of a report that questioned the science behind global warming.

The 98-page report, co-authored by EPA analyst Alan Carlin, pushed back on the prospect of regulating gases like carbon dioxide as a way to reduce global warming. Carlin's report argued that the information the EPA was using was out of date, and that even as atmospheric carbon dioxide levels have increased, global temperatures have declined.

"He came out with the truth. They don't want the truth at the EPA," Sen. James Inhofe, R-Okla, a global warming skeptic, told FOX News, saying he's ordered an investigation. "We're going to expose it."

And just few hours ago I rec'd an email from Oklahoma City Metropolitan Assn of Realtors "Realtors - your RPAC dollars are working!"

All about power, special interests, money and most of all - CONTROL!

All of us need to vote and then vote in 2010 and 2012!!!

POWER TO THE PEOPLE! WE WANT OUR COUNTRY BACK!

With smiles,

Bo in Yukon

8:12pm • #159
Outside Blog Hit Router

Over 31,000 Scientists have signed off that man-made climate change is a bunch of crap. Al Gore and friends make PLENTY of money off of ventures such as this, and the consumer always, ALWAYS pays in the end. Please don't let your Senator/Representative get away with this, this is a HUGE MoneyGrab.

8:24pm • #160
548,376 Points 95 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

Please make sure you click on Katerina's link and contact your Senators. It is not too late to see this bill changed. It takes 5 minutes, so get off Activerain and go email your Senators.

The link takes you right to their page and there is only 2 of them to contact.

 

9:10pm • #161