(Warning: Not for babies or whiners :) [Unless you read it as it was written: the vent, the whole vent and nothing but the vent] If you plant your tongue firmly in your cheek while you are reading and go ahead and hit a great big old Cheshire Cat smile right now you will probably make it through this ... erm ... post.
Last week I closed an FHA purchase in 8 days from application to the closing table. It was a miracle. It happens. Last month I closed an FHA streamline refinance in 5 days. No joke. 5 days. It happens. Yesterday I had a call from a client wanting to know if we could close a Fannie Mae purchase by the end of this month - it's the 22nd. Uhm, no.
First of all it's the end of the month and the 11,000 people who had their application, appraisal and documents in underwriting last week also want to close "by the end of this month". So the agent called me. Why? No idea - boy did he ever tell me a few things about my business and what a tool I am if I can't get a loan closed in 7 business days because HIS lender certainly could do it.
Why, then were they wasting time on the phone with me?
Ah, the buyer is self employed, has two other streams of income, owns 16 homes, is moving from a bigger house to a smaller one and the old one isn't sold and it's just down the street. Hmmmm ....
Let me state this for the record: Loan officers ocassionally lie. One of the things they lie about is their turn times. They like to say, "Our turn times are 48 hours". That may well be true - with absolutely no hiccups and a perfectly clean file submitted and an acceptable HVCC appraisal which will take a MINIMUM of 10 days to get back. Then there's the issue of middle lenders are sitting on files for days AFTER the approval because the secondary market won't purchase loans fast enough BECAUSE THERE IS A MONEY SHORTAGE. There, I said it.
There is a money shortage even with all the TARP money that went mostly to big banks. Guess what they did with it? THEY SAT ON IT AND GAVE EACH OTHER BONE BONE BONUSES. Okay, I know, I'm typing a lot in caps. You'll get that with people who have a long fuse when it gets down to the nib. And if I hear that snivelling weenie Barney Frank say one more time this is not his fault I'll fax him a picture of my bootie. No wait, better not.
One problem is with people, like Bozo the Barfly agent who obviously called me from the local watering hole, thinking they know how to qualify a borrower. "Man, Ken, I've known this guy for umpteen-eleven years. He took my baby sister to the prom back in 1988. He's a big time developer with a bazigillion jillion dollars. In 2006 he sent my whole family to Hawaii for a week. He owns a 36' SeaRay up on the lake. What's the problem?"
Pretty much everything you have told me is the problem. At best this is going to take 30 days because, believe it or not, people who can fog a mirror and have nothing more than a good story can no longer borrower money BECAUSE THEY DON'T PAY IT BACK! As I have written at least once before during the last 4 years just here on AR - the stupid loans for stupid people are going, going, GONE! Now it is an across the board requirement to PROVE everything. Regardless of what "your lender" says. (Especially that lender - rhymes with GunRust.)
Then there's this little thing called "buy and bail". Haven't heard of it? It's where people buy a smaller house they can afford, move out of their bigger house they cannot afford and let the bigger house go or file bankruptcy! Then there is the very high likelhood that Mr. Country Club the mega-developer took about the same amount of a paycut over the last 24 months as yours truly - making us both suitable for the soup line.
So STOP GIVING ME CRAP about how long it takes to close a loan and for PETE'S SAKE SHUTUP ABOUT "YOUR LENDER"!!!! I know you called me last even though I can do things that make Countrywide, Ditech, Wells Fargo and Chase spit burning nails. I even do it faster and less costly - always could, still do.
If you have any issues with my comment please see my manager, Lenn Harley. Thanks, bye.
Ken Cook - Georgia - FHA, USDA, VA and Conventional Home Loans (678) 439-8683
75 Comments on What do you mean "why is it taking so long?" You're lucky it's closing!
JUL
23
2009
I HEARD MY NAME!
The proof of what a lender can do is in what he had done, not what he claims he can do.
My experience is that a loan will close not necessarily based on what the lender can do or claim to be able to do but rather it is based on WHAT THEY GET FROM THE BORROWER AND WHEN.
Ken, it is amazing how some people think that things just happen! Yes you have the ones that go smooth and others that take longer, even though they are just as important as any of your clients. And from what you mentioned that particular one had a lot of things going on in it.
Some people will tell you anything just to get your business. Once you are into the whole process with them, you end up getting stuck with them. However if they don't come through as promised don't expect any repeat business or referrals.
We had a closing, or should I say were supposed to have a closing last Friday- lender said it was delayed due to the appraisal report not coming back in time. Then on Tuesday, two days after the scheduled closing (and after 35 days under contract) the lender says- "oops we can't approve the buyer so can't close". NEVER will this person get any business from me!
Ken: Thanks for the post. I appreciate your honesty. I must work with nicer, more educated people than you. Every once in a while we run into a bozo but, for the most part, they're pretty understanding and in many cases just happy to get the deal closed! Thanks.
7 days WOW! You are a magician! I generally find that the loan process is as efficient as the borrowers are timely and truthful. I think Lenn said about the same thing. Vent on, I enjoyed it.
the stupid loans for stupid people are going, going, GONE! hahaha! Ok - I am so laughing - I so could see everything you were explaining. I had a deal this year that my lender worked her butt off - this person was lucky to get a loan! They had the nerve to get ticked close to closing because it was going to be on extra day. I wanted to use your SHUTUP! right then!
Thank you for the vent (post) I respect lenders who are realistic about what they can and cannot do. It is always crazy what people expect a lender to be able to do in short short time and all the while while they are not even getting all the things to the lender that the poor lender needs.
Dennis - what? They didn't issue you a magic wand?
Cheryl - I always appreciate good government. Maybe we'll get some soon.
Denese - everyone should know mortgage bankers do talk about this stuff when we get off the phone.
Rob - the obverse of that is some people will tell you anything to get you to "try" for them. I always warn EVERYBODY in one email so there are no secrets. Listing agent, attornees, buyer's agent, buyer's parents - whomever has a stake in the outcome. Sometimes we try things that are longshots and they just don't work but can keep a deal tied up. I figure if everyone knows and agrees and I'm giving them the opportunity to back out I'll go for it even though it could cost me a few hundred bucks - not in lost commission - a few hundred bucks spent because loans don't get denied for free!
Christine and Jennifer - I hear what you are saying but why are you certain it's the lender's/broker's fault? That's what this whole article was about after all.
"what a tool I am if I can't get a loan closed in 7 business days because HIS lender certainly could do it." Tell me you asked why not use HIS lender!!! Oh, and don't let Barney find out what a tool you are. Good decision on the Booty photos!
Cat - anything under about 15 really is rare. But it does happen.
Jo - I have to admit that last year I actually did sell someone to hold their tongue ... it was a tense moment.
Anna - I have found that continually telling eveyone involved, in writing (email) what the status is, may not make any friends but it sure does prevent nasty lies and rumors!
Ken, After four hours in a CE class today about the new Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac guidelines, I have no faith at all in the process. Talk about restrictions and hoops to jump and fires to put out and...oh my!
Ken- WOW I am impressed with your quick closing prowess. That is awesome.
I was surprised that you couldn't get this one done by the end of the month. I guess taking someones baby sister to the prom in 1988 just doesn't carry the same weight it used to!!!
I enjoyed your post and I think you should send something to Barney Frank.
Ouch, I am glad I am not on the end of that call. Who thinks they can close a loan in 7 days these days ayways? I commend you for getting a loan to close that fast, they must have been perfect borrowers, which aren't very common. This rant was funny, and I enjoyed it thanks! :)
Ken: Congrats! on getting those loans closed! As another loan officer, I appreciate the effort and expertise it took to get those to the table in that amount of time.
I'm always surprised tho at the number of people that will sing your praises right up until you have to tell THEM something they don't want to hear. The successful closings you've shared with them in the past???? All gone like they never happened. You are officially a "tool" and dirty dog now. Nevermind the fact that God couldn't have closed the present file successfully for their "sterling" clients. (Obviously the ever-elusive "other lender" always can!)
I can't tell you how many times I have supposedly lost a deal, only to have it re-appear down the line when that "other lender" didn't quite come through with all they promised. I hate to say "I told you so" but .... All you can do is your best each day, conduct yourself as a professional, and hope for the best outcome.
Congrats again ... and best of luck in all your future deals!
Ken, This is the best rant yio have written in quite a while. What took you so long? And using Lenn as your buffer is chicken shit brilliant!! Ok I'm done. She ya at the soup kitchen. I hear they are having Franks with Mozillo chesse.
"Ah, the buyer is self employed, has two other streams of income, owns 16 homes, is moving from a bigger house to a smaller one and the old one isn't sold and it's just down the street. Hmmmm ...." That is typical. I had a guy with a 72% DTI, and he didn't understand how I couldn't write the loan.
And Lenn is RIGHT ON. Clients make 75% of the quick turn time. I am closind on tomorrow that was two weeks start to finish, and frankly we had it done a few days ahead of time. But the
Ken, part of the problem is that even though money is out there they are lending it slower, plus everything else you mentioned, and bottom line nowadays, it all just takes longer than you think.
Right! His lender could close it, no problem. And his call to you was what -- entertainment? All these people should come to New York and see what it's like to wait 60 - 90 days to close -- or more. Here 30 days is a miracle.
I have no problem with a lender closing a loan in 7 days or 7 weeks.....if they tell me how long it will take and then perform accordingly. My current loan nightmare was promised to close the first week of July........I am betting August now....not acceptable. All I want from any lender is an honest answer. I can work with anything as long as it is accurate.
Quick turnaround times, wow. The overwhelming majority of lenders I work with cannot even have a full loan commitment letter by the date in the purchase agreement even when the buyer does everything on time as requested.
It sounds like you have created some miracles lately for some of your clients. Things are taking longer, and it's harder to get a loan. It's a fact of life and needs to be built into the offers and time periods.
Didn't you know that saying Lenn's name is like rubbing a genie lamp? LOL. It seems that even if all of the documentation is in place on time, that some piece of the puzzle will find a way to hinder the process from being completed in a timely fashion...
Our sales agreement/contract used to carry wording that closing would occur when loan funds were available, or something like that. Then they pulled that wording because lenders were using it to stall, and delay. And even w/o that wording, they're still stalling. . . .
What a way to close my day....that was pure unabashed truth....which clearly will annoy many...I will be back tomorrow to read through the comments. I'm zonked...time to get some rest.
The main problem I see is that brokers are not keeping in contact with the agents or not being truthful. I understand it takes time but don't blow smoke. If you would ever tell me I'm lucky to be closing that would be the last words you ever spoke to me.
Amazing! I feel the same way about people who "shop" lenders as I do people who "shop" realtors! That might work if we were SOCKS...where a particular brand, style, lot, color, etc., could be found at any one of thousands of stores. Then "shopping" for the best deal might make sense. But in our businesses, they don't have a CLUE about what they're REALLY getting for $$XXXX, let alone how to shop intelligently for it! It ain't what you pay that matters...it's what you GET for what you pay.
....and SOMETIMES what you GET is "s.....d" (but hey, you got it cheap, right?????)
Ok, I spit my coffee out when I read the part about faxing a picture of your bootie. Actually, it might have been the "stupid loans for stupid people" part. Not sure.
Funny stuff, but so true! Thanks for lightening up the day seems like we forget that having fun is, and not taking ourselves so seriously has been lost in all the reg changes.
Another great post... and something I see everyday that usually goes like this:
REALTOR: "Hi Joe, say can you close this deal by next Friday?" The customer was over at "FILL IN BIG BANK WITH INEXPERIENCED APPLICATION TAKER FOR LOAN OFFICERS HERE" for the past three months. They approved him back then and we were supposed to close today. They are a great couple, and this three bedroon two bath house fits them so nice.
Joe/LO: Thank you for giving me the opportunity to earn their business, I'll give it my best shot. But let me ask, why can't [BIG BANK WITH INEXPERIENCED APPLICATION TAKERS FOR LOAN OFFICERS] close today?
REALTOR: I guess [BIG BANK WITH INEXPERIENCED APPLICATION TAKERS FOR LOAN OFFICERS] just figured out the customers don't qualify because [FILL IN ANY ONE OF HUNDREDS OF REASONS].
Joe/LO: Well Mr/Mrs Realtor, that [fill in the guideline] rule has existed for the past 6 YEARS. I could have told you they don't qualify three months ago.
REALTOR: Really, but they have been promising me they could get it done, and the buyers really like the house.
Joe/LO: I understand, but we don't offer the "they really like the house" program. We only offer the "you prove everything with good credit and skin in the game programs"
REALTOR: But they really like the house
Joe/LO: Sorry
REALTOR: But they really like the house, I guess I'll call another lender.
Joe/LO: Call another lender? Oh, that makes sense, because somehow my Fannie, Freddie, or FHA rules are apparently different then everyone elses Fannie, Freddie, or FHA rules???
and so on and so on and so on....
----------------------------
LESSON?: The COMPANY NAME of the lender is meaningless. Make sure your clients are working with EXPERIENCED DEDICATED PROFESSIONAL Loan Officers.
As a general rule:
If you want a crook: Use an outstate 800# lender
If you want incompetence: Use the big bank (and especially the big bank 800# application taker)
If you want successful on time no surprises closings: Use a seasoned dedicated professional
Oh, and one other thing. As a seasoned dedicated professional, I constantly give the agents I work with on a regular basis fully pre-approved and ready to buy customers I get first through my marketing efforts effectively doubling or tripling their business.
Funny post and full of animation!!! However, it's not funny when mortgage lenders lie about turnaround times and it costs the buyers money in per diem charges....a dose of honesty is really what we need...
Great Post (nearly busted a gut about the Barney Frank joke)!
Lenn, I love your comment about what and when we receive documents from the borrowers. How true that is. I started two similar loans recently on the same day. Customer 1 provided me with clear, clean copies of all the documents I requested the day after I requested them. Customer 1's loan is already approved. Customer 2 has provided a portion of what I asked for, documents I didn't ask for and in such a condition some of them I need them to provide several again where I can read them. In fact a couple of the pages of their tax return look like they may have tried to copy it crumpled up into a ball without opening it. Interestingly I have not yet been even able to complete the application on their loan from the lack of information let alone submit it for approval.
After waiting 5 months for approval on a short sale, we were told by Countrywide to close in 2-1/2 weeks. So, Countrywide doesn't know how long it takes to get these things done! If you have any contacts there - please forward your post to them!
And another thing. Agents need to be on top of the loan processing too. In most cases, at least in my market area, the buyer must "cooperate with the mortgage process" or they can lose their earnest money.
A loan rejection because the borrower hasn't cooperated with the lender is grounds for the seller to void the contract. However, it is also grounds for the seller to refuse to release the buyers earnest money.
Agents need to explain these conditions of the Contract of Sale to the buyers and the lenders will get much better cooperation.
If we work as a team, we sell more real estate and collect more commission checks, or am I allowed to mention that?
I hate people that over promise and under deliver. Just tell me the truth up front and I will live with it. I would rather tell a client one time it is going to take another month, than tell him 10 times it is going to take 3 more days.
I've been getting a lot of good information from these blogs as I'm just getting into the realestat field. It helps me to prepare for what is to come. I never knew what "active rain" meant still dont but I don't care. There is a lot of information from seasoned professionals for use babe in the woods newbies. Thanks.
I have a closing delayed now by 7 days becuse the lender(Citibank) is having a technical glitch and loan docs can't be drawn up. I'm sorry, a week, really? You can't have this glitch worked out quicker than that? Other than that, i tell people no longer expect a 30 day closing unless you're paying cash.
Don't hold your breath on the good Government and I love the Barney Frank reference. Not that I love barney Frank, I mean, I don't, uh what I meant to say w..., uh, oh never-mind.
That's hysterical, Ken. I am faxing a coy of my bootie to Barney Frank just for the hell of it.
In all seriousness, does anyone else remember last year when lending froze up? Remember how we prayed to God and said we would do anything if he'd just help the FED figure out where to find more ink to print money so the banks could loan again?
Okay, so it wasn't exactly like that.
Still, if there were NO loans at all, we'd be happy with 30-day delayed closings is my point.
Whether I am right or wrong to think that way, it makes me feel better.
Here we are waiting 45-90 (yes 90 days) to close. Conventional is the only thing that seems to be going through in a timely manner. I've had 3 lenders tell me to not to expect to close for at least 6-8 weeks on any new contracts I may write in the near future. Crazy-now if I can find a good lender here that will be honest and respond to emails with something other than-"hey babe, it's under control!"
I don't know how even the best lender can promise anything in this climate...
The new appraisal rules / system on top of underwriting taking their sweet time make it impossible for you to give a time estimate. You can do your part quickly, but then... You can wait.
I applaud you for coming right out and saying that money is in short supply. The big banks were happy to take it "in order to keep the country running" but then laid off thousands of employees and paid huge bonuses to key people - all while making it tough for even the most credit-worthy buyers to own a home.
I don't travel in the right circles, so don't know anyone who benefited from the bail outs - just a lot of people who got hurt.
Ken... I can close a loan in 1 day... that's right... 90% down and fico scores of 700... lol I am so tired of hearing this, even from loan officers that I work with. So many can say what they want, but I want to see the proof... end of story. I closed a loan in Florida, an investment property with the buyer being in NYC... and it was a short sale... from start to finish... 12 days... but as you stated and I have said this 1000's of times, each borrower and each loan is different, period... end of story. And yes, some loan officers do lie.
Your post points out what reality is in the mortgage business currently, for those who are left! It also presents opportunity for ethical and honest loan officers to hook up with real estate agents looking for this kind of service.
Isn't a photcopy of your bumm considered 'porno' over the internet if you send it to good old Barney? I think you should print is fax # just so that we all can! Good rant post. 7 days on that loan to close is sure a miracle! Wow, who wooda' thought that the bailout money went for bonuses?????
I appreciate your sense of humor, great post. I'm also impressed with your ability to close loans in less than a week, that's unheard of where I come from.
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I HEARD MY NAME!
The proof of what a lender can do is in what he had done, not what he claims he can do.
My experience is that a loan will close not necessarily based on what the lender can do or claim to be able to do but rather it is based on WHAT THEY GET FROM THE BORROWER AND WHEN.
7 days is fast Miracle Man.