Being a home inspector is more than a little like being a detective. Often clues present themselves, if you know how to recognize them, and a conclusion or more often a theory can be drawn.

stairsDuring a recent inspection I noticed that the home had a newer addition. The buyer said he was told it was built in 2006. The addition included a two car garage, large kitchen add on and master bedroom. It was built over a full basement. The original house has a partial or low basement.

Upon entering the garage I noticed the stairs didn't feel right. It turns out each stair was of very different heights. Stair height can not vary between stairs by more than 3/8 of an inch. Clue #1.

I next noticed there was an attic with a pull down stairway above the garage. Going into the attic I noted the garage and the interior living areas were all common to the space. Because of this there needs to atticbe fire separation walls. The placement of these walls depends on a few factors. In the case of this addition a fire rated pull down stairway would be required. Also all the walls inside the garage would have to be covered with gypsum board. The exterior walls in the garage were not covered. Clue #2.

Next onto the basement. The basement stairway lacks a handrail, lighting and light switches at the top and bottom of the stairs. Clue #3.

All these clues, and there were others, add up to one thing; an un-permitted or un-inspected addition.

I have found many people believe that a building permit is what is required when building an addition or deck for example. These people would only be half right. Pulling a building permit should be one of the first things that is done before starting a project.

don't tripAs the project progresses it also has to be inspected by the city building official. He signs off on the completed work as meeting code. His signature should be found on the permit which is supposed to be displayed in plain view.

My customer near the end of the inspection alerted me to a building permit he saw in the side window of the garage. I had walked by it earlier and not noticed the faded paper. Looking at the permit it lacks even one signature from the town building official. I was not surprised at all by the lack of sign offs.

What this all boils down to is the entire project was built without a single inspection from the town. Some of what was discussed here are fairly serious safety deficiencies. Additionally there were some structural issues uncovered.

So when you hear some say a permit was pulled for the work the next question should be; was it closed meaning inspected.useless paper

 

James Quarello
NRSB #8SS0022
JRV Home Inspection Services, LLC

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27 Comments on Permit! We Don't Need No Stinking Permit!

SEP
29
379,439 Points 23 Featured Posts Outside Blog

James was that a stick-built or did they cut a truss to put in the stairs?

8:35am • #1

I think that is the exception.  As a builder, we welcome the inspections.  We'd rather get it right now, not later.

8:50am • #2
128,864 Points 2 Featured Posts

Charlie, Stick built. The beams were LVLs. Btw I am not getting emails when you comment.

Jeff, You have the right attitude. I'm sure you do not want to waste time and money with call backs. Unfortunately I would have to disagree with your assessment. I believe this type of stuff is the rule, not the exception.

9:04am • #3
3 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Hit Router

Often it's the owners who don't way to pay the fees for building permits and will get someone to do the work without one.  It will come back to haunt them!

9:40am • #4
585,319 Points 18 Featured Posts Outside Blog

James,

I would say that, when major remodels are involved, at least 70 percent of the time no permits were involved anywhere.

10:34am • #5
115,232 Points 2 Featured Posts

Applying for permits without getting the final is like stopping after a preliminary pest inspection that indicates problems. I learned to say FINAL pest after someone argued that the UW only asked for a pest and the preliminary report was indeed a pest report even though pest involvement was never resolved.

Our daughter learned from friends who were told after remodeling without permits to tear down the addition. So when our kids remodeled, they followed through all the way to the final permit. Good job! :)

11:37am • #6
128,864 Points 2 Featured Posts

Margaret, I would agree with that statement. It does take two to make that work. The homeowner and a less than scrupulous contractor.

Steve, I'm quite certain that figure is fairly accurate.

Kate, I believe this house addition is going to cause the sellers big headaches now that the cats out of the bag. The buyer after leaving the inspection was heading to town hall to check on permits and inspections.

12:41pm • #7
210,809 Points 1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor

Hi James: Maybe when you retire from being a home inspector you can become mystery writer.
:)

1:09pm • #8
220,147 Points

If I had a dollar for everytime I had heard that statement we would all be rich.  Hope you have a great day.

shelton

1:28pm • #9
128,864 Points 2 Featured Posts

Matt, LOL Thanks. I hadn't thought of a writing career. Maybe I should :)

Shelton, Yes we would.

6:25pm • #10
SEP
30
529,854 Points 25 Featured Posts Outside Blog

James, So true of so many jobs that I have seen. I think they get the permit out of a Prince Albert tin or some place similar... 

Helping you live your American dream...

4:26am • #11
128,864 Points 2 Featured Posts

Michael, If they even bother to get a permit at all.

6:42am • #12
OCT
01
7 Featured Posts

James - another thing sellers, and buyers, don't understand are the insurance implications of unpermitted work.  It simply would not be covered in the event of a disaster.  That's a big deal!

6:11am • #13
585,319 Points 18 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Mr James,

So when you say permit, is that like a driver's license. I do not know about any such thing. Maybe this is over my head.

Nutsy

11:04am • #15
115,232 Points 2 Featured Posts

No Nutsy, when Mr. James says No STINKING Permit, he has you in mind. Ms. Kate

11:59am • #16
128,864 Points 2 Featured Posts

Nutsy, As is the case most of the time this post went zooming far over your head. Not even close enough to clip your ears. Zoom gone!

Kate, Vermin are always stinky.

3:10pm • #17
354,927 Points 11 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

James, I got the feeling that you just didn't like that house very much.  LOL

8:20pm • #18
OCT
02
128,864 Points 2 Featured Posts

Barbara, I had no feelings for the house one way or the other.

9:33am • #19
OCT
05
585,319 Points 18 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Mr James,

I think you need to harness and rope in that Mrs Kate. She is rude.

Nutsy

9:09am • #20
115,232 Points 2 Featured Posts

Nutsy, there you go with those big words again. Honestly, I had no idea you possessed such an extensive vocabulary. Non! Sei uno stupido scoiattolo. heheh

10:41am • #21
128,864 Points 2 Featured Posts

Nutsy, I think you need to be hog tied and put on spit.

Kate, It is a bit of a surprise when Nutsy goes beyond monosyllabic words.

3:50pm • #22
OCT
06
585,319 Points 18 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Mr James,

I am ready for the barbecue. If Mr Charles can keep his pants on this year, then perhaps we can do that big 4th of July barbecue where you promised to take care of my extended family too. I will help with the marinating.

Nutsy

9:14am • #23
115,232 Points 2 Featured Posts

Ew-weee, marinated squirrel. And me without my spoon... heheh

11:01am • #24
128,864 Points 2 Featured Posts

Nutsy, We will plan on your marinating before the next planned big Fourth of July barbecue.

Kate, A large stick will work.

2:08pm • #25
115,232 Points 2 Featured Posts

I'll sign up for tenderizing duty. Ice picks work well.

4:04pm • #26
128,864 Points 2 Featured Posts

Kate, You should not pierce the meat, pounding the heck out of it works much better. Go with the stick or a large club.

7:21pm • #27

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