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How Would you Answer This Question?

I was doing some research for a new listing this morning when I came across the following question. It was posted on www.city-data.com

"My family and I are relocating to the Tulsa area soon. We are searching for a home to buy in (names of communities). What neighborhoods do I need to avoid moving into in any of these places?"

How would you answer that question?
Think about it for a second...
Got your answer???

I counted at least four people who answered the question, including one appraiser. If you are a Realtor and you chose to answer that question, you would be in violation of the Fair Housing Laws. This person apparently had a pretty sharp Realtor. Here's what they said about what their Realtor told them...

"My Realtor keeps telling me that they legally
can not disclose or persuade clients in any direction..."

The Fair Housing Laws in our country were designed
to give everybody a fair chance by prohibiting discrimination.

Did you know that Fair Housing Laws were developed
as a part of the Civil Rights Act of 1968? Fair Housing Laws prohibit discrimination in the sale, rental, and financing of dwellings, and in other housing-related transactions, based on race, color, national origin, religion, sex, familial status.

For more information on the Fair Housing Law, click here.

The primary purpose of the Fair Housing Law is to protect buyers or renters from seller or landlord discrimination.

What this means for those of us who are Realtors is that we cannot discuss, talk about, point out or direct people to good or bad neighborhoods. We have to stay neutral when clients want to know if neighborhoods are good or bad. The reality is that this can be difficult because your client can feel as if you are protecting your own interests instead of working for them. But a clear explanation of how you would be violating the Fair Housing law usually satisfies most people.

So the next time you come across someone online asking about good and bad neighborhoods, or if you have a client who asks, just take a pass. It's better not to answer than to lose your license!

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Bob Haywood
Tulsa, OK Realtor®/ McGraw Realtors
Bob@BobHaywood.com
(918) 272-7272

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Serving the Greater Tulsa, Broken Arrow, Jenks, Glenpool, Bixby, Owasso, Sand Springs, Oologah, Coweta area communities and other surrounding areas.

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Information and content in this blog is original to Bob Haywood.

Click here to subscribe to my blog, My Owasso Home for more real estate information about the Greater Tulsa and Owasso areas.

Contact:

Bob Haywood
Owasso, Oklahoma Realtor
Tulsa, OK Realtor®/ McGraw Realtors
Bob@BobHaywood.com
(918) 272-7272

Click here to check out my Greater Tulsa and Owasso website. The premier greater Tulsa and Owasso, OK homes local informational website for your real estate needs. I also have a great blog filled with tons of information regarding Owasso Homes.

Search the Greater Tulsa MLS Listings with no registration required.
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Serving the Greater Tulsa, Broken Arrow, Jenks, Glenpool, Bixby, Owasso, Sand Springs, Oologah, Coweta area communities and other surrounding areas.

Copyright © 2010 by Bob Haywood

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Posted by Bob Haywood, www.BobHaywood.com on 02/01/2010 08:05 AM

Comments (84)

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84 Comments on How Would you Answer This Question?

FEB

2010

I would ask them a question back and ask what their top things they want in a neighborhood are? Then tell them the areas that match these criteria most closely. Don't actually answer the question.

Hi, Bob. I worked in a real estate office in Vermont and one day, a would-be buyer called and asked the Broker if there was "ethnic diversity" in South Woodstock, home of The Green Mountain Horse Association. The Broker put her hand over the phone and repeated the question to me.

I said, "Tell her "YES; people who have horses and people who don't!"

Jody, great answer!

Leslie - Again...great answer! I love it!

Bob, I've told them that everyone has a different idea of what's a good and bad neighborhood. I show them neighborhoods that meet the criteria for a home and give them info to research for themselves. I also suggest they drive the neighborhoods on the weekends and in the evenings.

Bob - I frequent city-data forums and do reply to many of them. However, I stay away from questions like this. For slightly more benign questions I do suggest checking various websites for demographic information, provide links to the local schools and suggest they ask the local law enforcement agencies about neighborhood statistics.

Bob, I know that you, as Realtors, cannot talk about this. There are websites you can direct them to. I once got blasted by a few people on AR because I was asked my opinion about a particular area a client of mine was thinking of moving to. I am not a real estate agent and I know Long Island well....so I was allowed to give her my personal opinion.

I wish her real estate agent had directed her to the information so she could have looked it up herself. I don't believe many consumers know about this law and I'm glad you called attention to it.

Wyw back when we were shopped once by 'undercover' folks - but we passed with flying colors! Thank goodness! AZ is big on making sure agents take a fair housing every couple of years. It's usually not their favorite class - but totally necessary.

So my real estate agent can't tell me what neighborhoods are the best......hmmmm.....how about......

How about when it comes to resale? Can you tell me that the average days on market in one neighborhood is much lower than in another neighborhood? Can you explain to me that a lower days on market could be indicative of a higher desire to live in one area versus another? If not, what does days on market represent as an average?

Can you tell me that homes in a certain neighborhood have appreciated at a greater pace than homes in another neighborhood? Would a greater appreciation rate in one neighborhood lead me to believe that neighborhood is 'more desirable'? Can you supply me with these facts?

Is it legal to have crime statistics on you and present them to a client? It would be the exact same as sending them to a website, right?
If one neighborhood has higher crime than another and all you do is present me the piece of paper that shows me what those stats are, is that alright?

Can you present me with data that shows me median income levels of different neighborhoods? I'll interpret it, I just want you to provide it to me, can you?

I see how saying 'you should avoid that neighborhood' is not right. I have a tough time understanding why giving your clients the cold hard data and allowing them to interpret it for themselves is somehow a violation.....

Ahhh, Mr. Stewart...you, my friend have delved right into the very issues I think we all struggle with. What can we and can we not do. I'm afraid, that due to uncertainty and lack of clarity, that many of us avoid providing some of the detailed information you mention. On the other hand, I know agents who speak openly about such things. To me, it is a leak in the space shuttle just waiting to explode in a lawsuite somewhere...

Sorry, I'm not as smart as Lenn Harley!

I wish we had an expert on this stuff around here somewhere. I need to find one.

So what do you say to me if I am your client and I ask the four questions I posed above? Are you saying you can't tell me which neighborhoods have the highest appreciation???

If you can tell me where online to find crime stats, why can't you have them on your and present them to me?

I answer bluntly and say it is illegal for me to steer poeple from neighborhoods, however, I can provide them with some tools that can help them make that decision, such as crime, demographics, and area info. Also, when telling me what they are looking for, I can make some suggestions that might match their needs.

I send them to websites to view demographics, and crime statistics. I can see the reasoning but I also think it is unfair to buyers from out of state.

Bob, I have come across these types of questions several times in the last year. I would never answer but I am amazed at how many people do.

Answer that one at your own risk and if you do you had better hope that the person on the other end of the line is not from your state's real estate board. They do it here in Florida to catch people who "steer" customers. I tell people that they need to come down and drive through the areas to see if what those zones have will meet their needs. When you start getting into answering this type of question, you are walking a tightrope over some very sharp spikes that could put an quick end to your license and your bank account. And in the end, who are we to determine what areas a stranger will like. I have seen people fall in love with home I would not want my worst enemy to move into. Go figure. Same is true of neighborhoods. Some of you may be comfortable answering this question, but I NEVER do. If the buyer cannot visit the area I direct them to the police, the Chamber of Commerce, tourist bureau, or see if they have some friends who can take a look for them. Not to mention the new sites that allow you to virtually drive down a street and take a look around you.

In the end, the buyer has to come here to see for him or herself what the homes are like. Even if you were foolish enough to tell them to avoid this or that area, let's face it, the pictures of the homes often do not give a true picture of the home. So even if it is a great neighborhood the house could be rotten.

So if you want that question answered, do not refer the buyers to me. I will avoid that tarpit, thank you very much.

I recommend people go to city-data.com and put up that question just like they did. I've read a lot in those forums and I think for the most part people there put up honest opinions and they are pretty right on target. People there cover things I could never go over as a realtor.

So if you don't have friends or relatives to give you the inside scoop in areas, city-data.com is the next best thing.

I would suggest that when they arrive to Tulsa that they drive around various neighborhoods on their own at different times of the day to see where they will feel the most comfortable in. Once the decide on the neighborhood, hook up with a local buyers agent to show them homes.

I don't touch those with a ten foot pole, but I DO tell them if they are concerned to always call the local police department and they will be more than happy to share crime statistics with them! I've been asked to do that for buyers and I have declined, telling them they need to gather that data themselves.

Bob, this is such an interesting and important post. I take fair housing very seriously! I remember my pre-licensing teacher spending what she called an "inordinate amount of time" discussing fair housing rules because so many agents wiggle around them.

I think it's a darn slippery slope, one that I don't care to slide down. I remember one seller telling me that "I really don't want a XXXXX (insert religion) buying my house." I told her that everyone's money is the same, and that if she chose not to sell to a XXXXX, then I wasn't the Realtor for her."

I agree that there are tons of websites that you can direct buyers and sellers to, and it seems idiotic, as Bob points out above, that if a buyer can get the info off a website, a realtor might as well give it to them. Nope, not me!

Thanks for the thought-provoking post!

We have a great website here in the Indy area that when you put in the address, you get the crime statistics. I point people to the website whenever their question borders on these types of issues. I'm not sure if the website exists for other cities, but it is familywatchdog.us if anyone wants to try it.

Not me. I would not touch any of these questions with a ten foot pole.

Know your state laws. NH is very strict and getting stricter, if thats possible.

MLS even regulates and moniters all remarks etc. on listings. Key words and phases can't be used.

Good time to play ignorant to such questions. I like Leslie's horse comment.

Great blog post. I get that a lot as well. Always try to be really careful in responding...

I would send them a list of all the community names. It could be a test also.

I have answered such questions with, "Tell me how near you want to be to your work or a particular school and within your price range I will try and find some homes that meet your needs. We have a clause in the purchase and sale agreement that allows you up to three days to do a neighborhood review. Once you've selected a home you can go around the area and knock on doors and try to discover if that is a neighborhood that works for you."

They realize with that that I'm not about to anser the question they asked.

I had buyer clients in MD last summer that were looking for goodschools, and they were very interested in a diversified school district. I thought that it was great that they wanted their kids to experience a wide variety of ethnicitys, but I still had to explain fair housing to them. I sent the links, but they had to look into the schools themselves.

Can anyone answer my question?

Will you tell me what neighborhoods have the highest appreciation? We all agree, you can't tell someone what neighborhoods to stay away from. That's a no brainer. What can you do for me though? I see a bunch of you saying you will tell me where to go online to find info on crime. If you can tell me where to go, why can't you just print it out and hand it to me?

What I love, and no one touched on, is this is not just a question that you would violate the Fair Housing laws if you answered, but it is a question in writing - expecting an WRITTEN answer - just in case there is any doubt that you just violated the fair housing laws! Great - wriiten documentation - what more would they need!

Bob, I run into this stuff all the time on Trulia... I can't manage to get agents to understand Fair Housing, and they run their mouths breaking rules on Sherman Anti-Trust issues regarding commissions.

I've given up.. it's not my job to police the internet, and I simply stay out of it.

If asked the question directly, I tell them that I am legally precluded from discussing "good" and "bad" neighbourhoods, as my idea of what's a good neighbourhood, might not agree with what YOU consider a good neighbourhood. If they press the issue, I'll explain further that it's a Fair Housing Issue, and I cannot discuss it further.

If they continue, I assume they're testers.

Alan,

So you can't them what is a good neighborhood, but if they know the right questions to ask, you can answer those? Like 'which neighborhood has the highest appreciation?'

Can you answer that?

To Bob Stewart: You asked Is it legal to have crime statistics on you and present them to a client? It would be the exact same as sending them to a website, right?
If one neighborhood has higher crime than another and all you do is present me the piece of paper that shows me what those stats are, is that alright?

No we can NOT hand them a list.

We have to tell them to go the police of that municipality.

Bob I would NOT answer that on a forum, Trulia, AR or in person.

Hi Bob,

I do get this question sometimes & my best response is tell me what you like about where you live right now. Also, I always recommend my buyers to get a crime report from the local police dept. Also, check out the registered sex offenders website too. I never do that research for them. I also recommend for them to drive by at different times & different days during the week to check it out. Talk to neighbors. I really put the ball in their court for them to do the research. I give them the phone #'s or websites for them to check them out. If they want to know this before we see homes, I offer to drive them around town & have them talk to me about which neighborhoods we can peek at homes.

1. I direct them to the school ratings site. Then they can go to the local paper's crime site and look for concentrations of activity.

2. If they want to know about a particular neighborhood, I let them know that they can email or contact our local police department and ask about police activity in the area around the address. The local PD is more than happy to give out the information.

Regardless of Race, Creed, Color, or Religion, I want all my clients in the best neighborhood. That is treating all my clients with the best service. We usually look at price ranges, and let the clients decide for themselves what neighborhood best suits them.

So are you saying I cannot tell the prosepective buyers that the homes they like are in a flood zone?

Missy,

I see others who have said they 'send them a link'. Is that illegal as well? The only legal way is to have them go to the police department in person???

What about telling them which neighborhood has the highest appreciation. I notice you skipped that question. Can you answer it???

Steering is as steering does. If you do or say anything to influence a person to choose one community over another, a case can be made for steering. Fair? Probably not. But it doesn't matter. If you need a sale so badly that you are tempted to roll around in the mud with the person who asked this question you have one foot out the door in this business. I wouldn't touch it.

I have been baited before. The thing is "good" is relative and I tell them that what is good for me may not be what the mean. Many times they are seeking high appreciation areas (as Bob mentioned.) I do have the resources (schools, crime, etc) where they can do the research for themselves.

If they ask me about the highest appreciation potential, they will get my opinion and they know it is my opinion when I give it to them because it is a well thought out opinion that has NOTHING to do with fair housing. Investors NEED to know what Bob asked above: where are the lowest rental vacancies with the highest rental rates? Where is the highest price per square foot with the lowest DOM?

I have all the links in delicious for buyers to reference. I am a resource of the resource but I do not steer or violate fair housing.

Renee,

You can't tell someone which neighborhood has had the highest appreciation over the last five years? You have to send them somewhere to find that info? You must be joking.......

Sounds like a great time to refer them to the local police department for statical information.

Bob: I will give them concrete data like that but past performance does not guarantee future results. ESPECIALLY in the area I sell real estate.

Investors look at growth potential and proximity to amenities along with low vacancies and highest rents for long term holds. I give it to them. I won't go down roads that violate fair housing and I believe concrete data with what I said above in regards to investors is fair game. It's not like they are asking me to tell them where all the purple people live because they only want to rent to purple people.

Commercial sales and leasing involves demographics big time. I think they get away with more than us.

That is a no brainer- any realtor that would answer that question should not have their license...

Bob, we're not really supposed to discuss "neighbourhood"...we're supposed to discuss "property".

When asked about neighbourhoods, and crime we're supposed to direct them to city government websites for their crime statistics.. independent third party information. It's better if the client finds the information themselves, rather than being directed by us. We are "allowed" to give them websites and links... but you never know if a Realtor is only sending sites that support his viewpoint... so it's better if they arrive at them on their own.

We can answer specific questions like "how much appreciation did Evanston show in 2005?" vs... "how much appreciation did Skokie show in the same time frame."... yes, we can answer questions like that... although, again, it's better if they arrive at those themselves.

It's a shame, by the way... that Fair Housing laws prevent us from discussing neghbourhood... one of the things that buyers really, really want us to discuss... because of a few bad apples (okay, maybe MORE than a few bad apples) we are legally not allowed to discuss people, or neighbourhood... just property.

And the general public does not understand it.. it often becomes a bone of contention between consumer and Realtor... and believe me... we would like nothing better than to be able to talk neighbourhood... but we can't.

Alan,

I have been digging into fair housing laws over the last week as they relate to people posting religious posts on ActiveRain and the implications of such. I have yet to come across the parts that prevent someone from discussing neighborhoods. Could you point me documentation regarding this?

Bob... I'll have to do some "digging" myself (as I don't keep the rules for Fair Housing at my fingertips)... but I'll see what I can do. But everyone is told (it's hammered into us as Realtors) during our initial real estate courses... to stay away from discussing people or neighbourhood...

I can't talk about the demographics of the neighbourhood... (for example, "yes, you'll like this neighbourhood, there are lots of [fill in the client's ethnicity] in the area"... or "there are plenty of [fill in the religious temple or church of the client's choice] nearby."

In fact we can't put that sort of thing in our listing descriptions either... "walking distance to St. Peter's Church". (although plenty of agents do it).

Mr Stewart, I see where you are going with this now! I have had a most gorgeous photo of the Las Vegas Mormon Temple sitting in my archives for two years and would love to post it but am afraid to for that reason. I am not Mormon but I do admire the architecture.

I do recommend people to look at City-Data.com BUT they need to take the comments on there with a grain of salt! I have seen absolutely UNTRUE items posted by "Doomsday Debbies" who pick apart every little thing in an area as if it's a fatal flaw and we're all doomed if we live there. There are people who have an axe to grind because of a personal issue they had with a particular HOA or because they themselves acted like skanks and brought trouble upon themselves....

I prefer the statistics like were mentioned above, and I direct people to call the state police and inquire about particular neighborhoods. But first I try to diffuse it by asking what things they need in a community and find stuff that meets that need. Though one guy just basically told me that he didn't want to live in an area with the "wrong kind of people." I played dumb and said "Well unfortunately, there are jerks everywhere!" LOL

I think if somebody asks this question it will give you the opportunity to really tune into what they are looking for. They must have some type of definiton of what a good or bad neighborhood is and you should be able to figure this out pretty quickly after they say this to you.

Hi Bob ~ Great discussion. I'm often amazed when I see agents answering questions like these on the forums. I'm not sure I would direct somebody to them for info since I've seen many posted opinions that tend to reinforce stereotypes that aren't necessarily true.

Re the appreciation question - that's absolutely not easy to answer. In my area we don't have much cookie cutter real estate. Appreciation is much more difficult to evaluate than many think. You have to be able to compare an apple to an apple to an apple - and it's got to be the same kind of apple. That's one reason Case and Shiller devised their methods - they knew how difficult it was to track real estate prices over time.

I also am not convinced that the rate of appreciation is a good indication of "quality" of neighborhood. In some periods more established neighborhoods' prices will show a smaller increase since values were high to begin with, while more "frontier" neighborhoods with lower initial prices will rise more dramatically (and tend to fall more dramatically when things sour).

Liz

Alan,

Thank you. I will start to look more closely for it as well. I know there are certain things that are completely off limits, as you mentioned in your last comment.

I just get the feeling that no one knows exactly where the line is.

If no one knows exactly where the line is, and some are willing to press it a little more than others, does that put you at a disadvantage if you don't know where the line is. I say yes.

If I am a consumer moving to a new city, I want the agent who will give me the most information. If I have one agent saying 'I can't tell you ANYTHING about the neighborhood' and another saying 'ask me questions and I'll tell you what I can', then I am going to ask questions. My first one would be 'what neighborhood has the best apprecation over the last five years'. If one agent will tell me because they believe it's alright and another will not because it was drilled into them to not discuss neighborhoods.........well then I just want to know, was it alright for the one agent to answer that question? They didn't steer me into a neighborhood, they simply answered a question I wanted answered. Maybe I have to frame the question by saying 'between neighborhood x and neighborhood y, which had the highest apprecation?'

If that is the case, then agents should know, 'I can't answer that question in general, but I can answer it if you ask me to compare appreciation between x neighborhood and y neighborhood'. That way, an agent can help their client ask questions that are able to be answered......

To Bob Stewart,

I haven't found any reference in the Federal Fair Housing Act of 1968 (as amended in 1988) that would prevent an agent from divulging statistics on neighborhood appreciation over time. The Fair Housing Act prohibits discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex, handicap, familial status and national origin.

If asked, I would show a buyer the sales statistics for a neighborhood. I see nothing discriminatory about that. However I would never discuss any of these protected classes as they relate to particular neighborhoods. I would not steer them here or there, I would not steer them ANYWHERE!!!

Thank you Liz, that's a great point. I guess I am hanging my hat on that question as an example that many (including me) don't know exactly where the line is and what can and can not be discussed.

Can anyone point us to the place in the Fair Housing laws that say 'you can't discuss neighborhoods'? Just because it was beat in during licensing doesn't mean that there are not acceptable ways to discuss it. We know there are unacceptable ways to speak about neighborhoods. Those seem more obvious.........

But there has to be acceptable ways, otherwise writing a blog post about a neighborhood would be a violation, right?

Bob Stewart hit upon something very important. There ARE reason that we can tell people to avoid areas or neighborhoods. We can't base that on any of the "protected class" data, but we can tell people that someneighborhoods have poor appreciation history or strong market momentum.

Melissa,

You rock!!

I don't see 'criminals' as a protected class, so why can't I show someone crime statistics???

Bob,

My answer would be...there are great areas in every community! You have to explore areas that you are curious about to see what will work for you and what won't. I am happy to show you those areas so that you can narrow in on where you truly would like to purchase.

Wendy

My NC Real Estate manual states that agents are obligated under the common law of agency to act with the "utmost good faith toward his or her principal." There fore "a real estate agent has a duty to make a full and prompt disclosure to the principal of all facts that are material to the transaction in question which includes all facts that may affect the principal's rights and interests or influence the principals' decisions in the transaction. The agent must not only disclose all "material facts" known to the agent, but also must discover and disclose the the principal all material facts about which the agent should reasonably have known."

Obviously, this mandate clearly applies to disclosures about underground oil tanks, and new zoning laws for the highway planned for a backyard and other easily identifiable material facts.

How would you respond to a buyer who's main search criteria for a house is safety? You would definitely send them to crime statistics websites, and have them talk to the police. But if the agent knows that safety and crime are the buyer's hot buttons, do you disclose the fact that a certain neighborhood had 3 murders in it last year?

In NC, the General Statutes say that it shall NOT be deemed a material fact that a sex offender lives near the property....HOWEVER, "no seller or landlord may knowingly make a false statement regarding such fact."

Is anyone dizzy yet?

When you have been the victim of discrimination, like I have (and many others here perhaps) then you can see how serious this matter is. And to try to skirt around a law that is not all that vague is disingenuous to say the least.

A buyer that is not willing to explore an area to see where they would like to live is not worth my time. I refuse to steer and want nothing to do with those that do. When I was still a teacher I was looking for homes all over Tampa. One agent showed me some in areas that did not please me and some in areas I like, for a vast variety of reasons. Nothing to do with a protected class of any kind.

However, I went out with another agent and when I said I wanted to see "that home" she and her partner literally winked and said "oh, you would not be happy there" wink, wink. The message was very clear. VERY CLEAR. So go ahead, walk into this quicksand if you like. But do not cry if you get caught by testers from your state. It happens here and it could happen in your area as well.

As I said earlier, who are we to make judgments for our customers. If they pick an area they want to live in, fine. But to ask you to choose one with a (wink, wink) good reputation, is not fair and if you go along, in my book you are not a very good example of what a REALTOR should be.

There is enough bigotry and discrimination to go around today. We do not need more and should not encourage it.

John,

Are criminals a protected class for fair housing? If they are not, then why can't a realtor disclose crime statistics to their clients?

Hi Bob -- I get asked this question a lot and you are spot on. Answering Bob's question: A REALTOR should never be the source of data, but refer a client to the source. If the statement is incorrect, then the REALTOR could be liable.

Hey, great article I actually just blogged about the topic in response at www.dixonteamoc.com. I read the fair housing act page you linked to but wasn't able to find anything specifically regarding taking the clients preferences and showing them units in areas like that. If someone asks for a clean quiet neighborhood wouldn't it be fair to not show them places full of graffiti or unmaintained yards?

Wow - Looks like this really got Bob started with a lot of great questions.

FEB

2010

My response to:

"My family and I are relocating to the Tulsa area soon. We are searching for a home to buy in (names of communities). What neighborhoods do I need to avoid moving into in any of these places?"

would be:

What specifically are you looking to avoid?

I think Real estate agents over react. In regards to fair housing, it's one thing to give factual information about the demographics of a particular area, it's another to state that you would avoid that neighborhood because purple people live there.

Carla says, "And this neighborhood . . . we call it Felony Flats."

We have a "China Town" in Portland. That's a neighborhood too! They have "Little Italy" in New York . . .

So John Ewell, you are assuming that if there is a "particular neighborhood" then it is "particular" because of minorities living there? Or because the client is a minority and the neighborhood is all WASPS?

That's nice.

My real estate teacher told us a story (not sure if it is true or a made up scenairo for class) about how he sold a house to a young professional guy - he was a teacher, I think. Had money for downpayment & closing costs, great buyer, dream buyer. Only problem was the neighbors did not like that the buyer was black. So the neighbors started sending threats to his office, telling him they'd never use him, he'd never sell another house in the town, etc. He ignored these and proceeded with the transaction. After the guy moved in, rocks landed on his porch, windows were mysteriously broken, mailbox was knocked over, eggs thrown on his house and nobody else's. The guy has enough after almost a year of this and sells the house.

The teacher's next question was: "What if my next buyers were a black family with kids? What would you say?"

Tough question, because it's like reverse racism - you'd be trying to protect a protected class from persecution if you told them what happened before. If you don't tell them what happened before they'll consider you a low down lying skank who didn't have their best interest at heart, when they learn the previous owner was driven out by racists...

Rock and hard place, indeed.

I'll inform someone of the facts, like the cooling tower for the nuclear reactor that's a quarter of a mile away, or the location of the junkyard, but that's about it. I always recommend people drive through neighborhoods they have an interest in, and even get out and knock on doors and meet people. There is nothing I can do that will give them this level of information.

That's fine unless you live in an area dominated by gated communities, or HOA's that won't let you drive around unless you have a visitor's pass. Knock on doors? Wow, I've lived here all my life and still wouldn't do that...lol. Nor would I suggest it.

It is nice - sometimes - when neighbors come out to say hi when you're looking around the yard and chit chat.

Though I had one guy blow a deal for my seller because he came out and told the buyers & buyers agent that there were several HOME INVASIONS over the past few months. Buyers naturally freaked, buyers agents told me about it - we contacted the state police who said that no such thing had EVER happened in that community...and the oddest thing was when I told the seller about it, he could not indentify who this mysterious neighbor was or where he came from! Regardless, the buyers were NOT interested in that house. :(

So tell people to knock on doors - but what happens if the neighbors either don't like the seller or don't want new people moving in?

I love it when a post can generate this kind of indepth discusson and yes to Bob S.

Can anyone answer my question?

Will you tell me what neighborhoods have the highest appreciation? We all agree, you can't tell someone what neighborhoods to stay away from. That's a no brainer.

I can ccommunicate with a person and show statistical market data where a neighborhood may be increasing in value bet even that is going to vary by both location AND price range. There is nothing in the Fair Housing statutes that forbids sharing this kind of information.

Thanks to BOTH Bob's for generating and expanding this conversation.

Bob:

When people are relocating to my area they want to know which towns (not neighborhoods) are better - but by certain criteria. It is usually about the school system, resale and tax rates. Those facts are available and important in their decision making process. I don't' think anyone would consider that a violation of fair housing.

Hey Everyone, today is my wife's birthday. We spent last night with friends celebrating so I missed most of this disuccsion. However, I wanted to say that this is the Active Rain at it's best - good discussion and debate over the issues. I know that Fair Housing is a concern (hot button) for Bob S right now. And it should be for us as well. Providing top notch services for our clients means understanding and untangling issues such as these.

We were discussing this in law in our office the other day. It seems like this is antiquated rule that needs to be updated. It should be the job of a good realtor to help find the right fit for their client, which would include having knowledge about different neighborhoods in their market. Explaining to a client that one neigborhood is better than another (say because it will hold value in down turns), should not be a violation of Fair Housing laws if my intent was not to red line or block bust etc.

Bob, WOW what a hot topic and the comments are great too! I adhere to the fair housing law and do not steer. With that being said and even stepping aside from fair housing for a minute.....whats good for the goose, isn't always good for the gander. Lets talk about neighborhoods for a second, I may not want to live in a certain neighborhood due to crime, pollution, etc. but that doesn't mean you wouldn't want to live there. I may think one town is a dump but yet I have three buyers who are looking to buy a home there before the tax credit expires.

Again, we are prohibited from steering by law, but who are we really to tell someone where to live? To each their own....

When asked a direct question, I do not steer or give an opinion but provide them with the source so that they can make an educated decision on where they want to live. That source may include demographics, crime stats, school information, household median income, etc. Suggesting buyers drive past schools, visit the local police department, drive around the neighborhood, visit the local supermarket wouldn't be grounds for steering or would it?

I've really enjoyed reading the post and comments. I've worked with some in the industry that will shyaway at anything that remotely looks like it could be a violation and I've also worked with others that figure out how to answer them in a way that isn't a violation. It really depends on your personal preference.

Okay... this is NOT an antiquated rule that needs to be updated... it's simply a rule that many (Realtors included) don't fully understand. Bob said "I just get the feeling that no one knows exactly where the line is", and he's right (proof offered daily on websites like Trulia and Zillow).

Yes, we are allowed to answer the question "what are the crime statistics in Evanston" by providing the printout from the Evanston Police Department, or directing them to the Evanston Police Dept's website. Yes, we are allowed to respond to a direct question like that. We can also respond directly to the question "what was Evanston's housing appreciation between 2005 and 2006. Or what was their DEpreciation in 2008-09... and how does it compare to the depreciation in Wilmette for the same time period? We are allowed to answer those questions.

What we are NOT allowed to do, is provide all of those statistics without having been asked, because that could be construed as "steering"... (meaning I show you the local crime stats for 3 communities, and I may be trying to tell you that the one with the worst stats, you shouldn't be viewing... trying to steer you away).

Alan May - well said.

What kind of people live in this neighborhood? Answer: People who can afford to live here, JUST LIKE YOU.

Any more questions?

Bob S., here's an interesting article that addresses the concerns of buyers... as to why their Realtors cannot answer questions that buyers feel should be answerable.

Questions your broker (agent) can't answer.

So many good answers to your post. Thanks everyone for giving some thoughts to add to my toolbox of experience.

To Both Bob's - Recently this has come up to me as well. A client saw online, I wont say where, that a certain town has a higher crime rate than others. They then called the local police dept. and they told them it was a typo.. Best to just answer them with another question like Jody up top. Just my two cents

"Best to just answer them with another question"

The problem with that approach, Robert, is that the general public gets irritated with us, as they feel we're being evasive when we "dance around the question". i'd prefer to reply (when appropriate) that "fair housing laws prevent me from directly answering your question. But here are some resources that you can use to determine the answer to your questions".

At least that way, I've done something to answer their question, and explained, clearly and honestly, why I can't.

Those kinds of questions appear ALL THE TIME on Trulia.com and zillow. And I just laugh when agents actually answer them!

I am always shocked by the ways that agents will answer on public forums regarding questions of this sort. As an agent who was visited by a tester at closing time at my office the first year I was licensed, I am careful about how I present things and answer questions. I utilized all the knowledge I had gained in classes, by reading and from my mentors to pass the tester's questions with flying colors, I never worry about what I am saying, because I know the rules and how to present them. Every agent should! Good post!

Bob H and Bob S - What a great dialogue going on here today on this post. Here in Nevada, we don't have a Megan's Law on the books but you can be darn sure I check it for my own edification every time I sell a house just to see what's going on nearby. I would not be afraid to share appreciation statistics on any particular neighborhood - I just wouldn't describe the social demographic while I did so. With regard to crime, my husband is a member of local law enforcement and I often recommend they as him! That way it didn't come from me.

oops, that last one was me, I was logged in helping Robin get her photo updated:

If someone asks you for crime stats for a neighborhood, where in the Fair Housing guidelines does it say you have to send them to a local police station?

I can't seem to find anything in the fair housing guidelines that says criminals are a protected class.....

Well, I had a bit of the opposite problem...a white woman buyer that wants to buy a lot to build on in a very old black community. Those folk HATE it when "whitey" moves in there...it really might be a dangerous situation for my buyer. I DID NOTHAVE NOT said a word. I REALLY wanted to...her friend that was with her pointed out about how bad the neighborhood is and really tried to talk her out of it. She is going ahead with the purchase anyway. I really wish she would not...but I really can not and should not say one word because of this rule. The problem runs in all different directions.

Bob, as I mentioned before... if someone asks for crime stats, you are allowed to direct them to where they can find them. You COULD just print them out for them... but it's better if you allow them to find them.

Criminals are not a protected class (although it sometimes feels that way), but it's not about protecting the criminals... you can certainly send them to a website that shows if any sex offenders live in the neighbourhood... but the key is.. "answer questions"... don't suggest that if they're going to look in the Statesville neighbourhood, they might want to check the sexoffender hotline first.

It's not about protecting the criminals.. it's about being neutral about neighbourhoods... and it's better to err on the side of caution, and allow the buyer to do their own due diligence.

Ooooh...I'm not too comfortable with the conversation above in #84. I don't care which direction the problem runs in.

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Bob Haywood, www.BobHaywood.com

Owasso, OK

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McGraw Realtors

Address: 12620 East 86th Street North, Owasso, OK, 74055

Office Phone: (918) 592-6000

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