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You've probably never hear of "EdgeRank." But if you're serious about online marketing, you need to get your mind around it quickly. It's more important than SEO and will make or break you on the most important place on the web: Facebook

SEO as a marketing strategy for Real Estate is dying.  Here's why:

#1) For the the vast majority of Real Estate agents and brokers it is already dead on arrival, and has been for several years.  

Let's face it, only 5-7 players consistently win on any local keyword string.  Are you one of those?  Long tail you tell me?  How much traffic is that really sending you?  And how much business is that traffic really turning into?  For the vast majority of agents, business is done the old fashioned way through networking.  Not through SEO optimization and lead generation.  How much mindshare have you put into SEO?  And what has your return really been?

#2) Google's only making it tougher.  

Have you done a search for CITY, Plumbers on Google lately?  Look at the results that get returned.  Google Local is taking over (those are the small results with phone numbers).  Can you get in Google local?  Sure.  How?  Who knows.  Checked out Google Maps lately?  It is already a robust place for consumers to search for listings.  Why do they need to go to your site?

#3) Google's losing its position as the gateway to the Internet...to Facebook.

Facebook has surpassed Google in traffic and crushes them in engagement and customer relationship.  Yes there is a lot of hooplah around privacy, etc.  But if you think Facebook's momentum is going anywhere but up...you're in for a surprise.

What is EdgeRank & why should I care? (skip this section if you don't care & just want a tip on how to optimize...)

EdgeRank is the algorithm that Facebook uses to decide what goes in the "Top News" feed.  You can learn more in this great write up by TechCrunch, but at a high level, Facebook provides its users two "streams" of information.  The default Top News Feed, and the Most Recent feed.  

It's easy to understand the Most Recent feed.  That's where all posts from your network go (friends' status updates, posts from pages you "like", etc).  Here's the problem with that feed - it's overwhelming (kind of like the Twitter feed IMO).  So Facebook created the Top News feed to attempt to filter content/posts in a way that they think will make them more meaningful to you.

The Top News feed is the default feed everyone sees and that's where you want your content posts to end up.  As an end user it's a subset of posts from your network - essentially it's what Facebook feels is going to be most interesting to you.  And so to determine what goes in that feed they created an algorithm called Edgerank.  

Before we get to the algorithm - what you need to understand is what an "Edge" is in Facebook parlance.  An Edge is what's created when anyone interacts with a piece of content ("Likes", Shares, Comments, etc).  Creating a content post itself the first time also creates an Edge.  

Let's pause there...

The fact that the algorithm is called EdgeRank, and that an Edge is all about interaction - tells you something very insightful about what Facebook thinks matters to users.  While Google cares about relevance of content and external popularity via links...Facebook cares about interaction and engagement.  This tells you a lot about how to leverage Facebook - create engagement and interaction.

Back to EdgeRank...

Now, remember that creating a piece of content in and of itself creates an Edge.  But how much more EdgeRank that content gets (and therefore how likely to make it into the Top News feed) depends on three things according to what Facebook shared at f8 - a) affinity between creator of the Edge and viewer b) some weighting by the type of Edge (like, share, comment) c) How long ago the Edge was created.

Any math guys out there?  Don't worry if not - you don't need to understand the equation below.  You just need to read the last part of this post).. 

If you're confused, TechCrunch did a great job of summing this up.."In other, hopefully less confusing words, an Object is more likely to show up in your News Feed if people you know have been interacting with it recently."

The good news - EdgeRank optimization appears to be an order of magnitude than search engine optimization...

Does this sound familiar?  To be good at SEO you need to do effective keyword research, optimize unique content for the keywords you're attacking, structure your pages and optimize them for google crawlers, avoid duplicate content, drive one way anchor text links, avoid obvious linkbait, and so on, and so on.  

Meanwhile, it appears that to be good at EdgeRank you need to create content that people want to engage with (by sharing, liking or commenting) and do it with some frequency.

Let's compare the pay off of SEO (assuming you're one of the few who actually get to the payoff) to that of Facebook EdgeRank optimization.  SEO is going to drive random eyeballs to your website/blog which you'll hope to create to a lead someday and eventually turn into a deal.  Facebook is going to create relationships with friends of friends, partners, previous clients, and so on.

Which would you prefer to spend your time on?

 

196 Comments on Get ready to care about "EdgeRank" more than SEO

MAY
21
2010

WOW - great post alex

Amit Kulkarni
4:12pm • #1
MAY
22
2010
865,393 Points 50 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp

Interesting.  I think that both ave a place, but the constant is creating quality content that people WANT to interact with. 

11:23pm • #2
307,274 Points 32 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

It always seems to start with good content. Edgerank adds a new level of face to face with friends and friends of friends. Makes sense to me.

11:37pm • #3
546,176 Points 11 Featured Posts

Hi Alex -- Interesting.  I think consumers or potential clients want to get to know someone and also WIIFM, regardless whether its SEO or EdgeRank.  In theory, it sounds good, but at any give point in time, there are few people who are actually in the market to buy/sell that run across one's site.

11:37pm • #4

I'm pretty up on this stuff but hadn't heard of EdgeRank yet...  It definitely makes sense and seems to mirror what I see in my Facebook Newsfeed...

Social Media engagement is definitely a different skill set...  SEO is straight forward...  Content, Keywords, Backlinks from related sites and eventually the site moves up.  EdgeRank is a moving target IMHO... 

11:54pm • #5
402,845 Points 1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor

Hmm- I noticed things are changing a bit on what shows up esp in the add section.  I looked for cars and next thing I know a car ad shows up on the right side ad.

11:59pm • #6
MAY
23
2010
224,448 Points 22 Featured Posts Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

That is very interesting.  Unfortunately, I haven't yet figured out how to post an awesome real estate status that causes many people to comment or like it.  I can, however, type a status about something embarassing my child has done and elicit 20 comments.  LOL  I'd rather be known for my real estate.  I think the bar has just been raised.

1:11am • #8
587,597 Points 2 Featured Posts Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

I haven't heard of EdgeRank but will start watching for it.  For now I am with SEO, long and short tail, etc...

1:15am • #9
Outside Blog

Thanks for the info. I guess the trick is figuring out how to engage facebook friends in real estate related posts.

1:32am • #10
Edgerank makes sense. But They each make sense in the different purpose they serve.
2:30am • #12

Very interesting post, I've never heard of it, I'm looking into it now!

Thanks

Tom

2:55am • #13
101,562 Points 2 Featured Posts

Wow, cool.  Thanks for the info, and the math is actually pretty easy.  But it does come back to content.

To some extent, I am perhaps more interested in Katerina's comment... now those sound like _results_!

3:14am • #14
1,007,109 Points 36 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

I think Google's still going to have a fair amount of influence for some time to come. 

 

Edge Rank sounds like more to learn and keep working on.

3:21am • #15
306,399 Points 17 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router Called Shot Master

Very interesting, Alex, I will think about this.

In the meantime, I am making a very good living using the SEO tools that I learned from Katerina Gasset - niche marketing is the key to success.

I don't want a whole bunch of general traffic - I want the smaller amount of focused buyers that longtail keyword content gets to me.

Sounds like I am one of the 5-7 people.  And there are a lot of us 5-7ers here on AR.

Did you know that you can put your listings on Google maps?

3:41am • #16
1 Featured Post Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp

Alex,

 

I appreciate the info on Facebook.  I am not a big fan of Facebook however I love to learn more about it.  Maybe it will be the next big then.  Maybe not.  I still love SEO and AR and what it has done for me.  Thanks for sharing and I will reblog to my readers.

 

Michael

6:28am • #17
395,027 Points 35 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp

Alex:

This is a bit over and beyond for me right now but it is always interesting to hear about the latest tools.  I am still working on the basics that I learned from Katerina and those are bringing results. Try as I may, I have not really gotten much from Facebook yet.

 

7:45am • #18
128,150 Points Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp

Hi Alex. Thank you for the well written post.
I seems to me that you're counting the SEO as already dying? I think both are useful to know about and both should be in my toolbox to serve different audiences.

Any which way - I've got lots ot learn!

7:58am • #19
103,303 Points

I am just starting to use facebook, so thanks for the post.  There is always constant change and it is nice to hear about new approaches.

8:01am • #20
141,517 Points 6 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Good info Alex, I plan on using both. I have had a little success from Facebook, however I am very new to both

8:36am • #21
210,217 Points 9 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Called Shot Master

My head was swimming already with all the facebook, twitter, linkedn, seo, etc, and now I have to learn about edgerank?

8:46am • #22
723,716 Points 223 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

To Lina @ #8: you are actually being successful- having people be aware of you is what it is all about.  

8:48am • #23

Great information!!  It is always hard to keep up with all the ongoing changes.  I like Katrina's  results!!

I do think at this time we probable need to do some of both to keep up with all the changes.

9:27am • #24
610,855 Points 11 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Wow ! This is why I love AR !!!!! I had no idea about this !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

9:28am • #25
122,654 Points Outside Blog Called Shot Master

Great information!!  It is always hard to keep up with all the ongoing changes.  I like Katrina's  results!!

I do think at this time we probably need to do some of both to keep up with all the changes.

9:30am • #26
229,867 Points 5 Featured Posts Hit Router Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

You do not know what you are writing about today Alex.  92% of our traffic is from longtail searches, and we rank for the most searched phrase in our area, 'kennewick wa homes.'  Puts into question the rest of your points.

Heck, but it got ya a featured spot on ActiveRain, eh!  :)

9:35am • #27
278,556 Points 15 Featured Posts

Thanks, I started creating multiple businesss pages, and working very hard at building up the number of local friends I have, then getting the likes from them. I use the personal touch of commenting on their updates and doing almost all non-real estate updates myself. Once i habe a comfort leel with them I get them to like the business pages which gives me permission to feed them real estate based content without it being like spam or push marketing. This is a brave new world and it is challenging the rules of real estate engagement that has been dominated by blog post and google ranking.

9:37am • #28

Good information.  But ugh now I have something else to try and stay on top of.  lol  

9:37am • #29
295,076 Points 5 Featured Posts Outside Blog Called Shot Master

I had to read your post a couple of times to wrap my head around exactly what EdgeRank is and what significance it may have. Once my half-dead brain cells processed that information and stored it in my "Seen on Active Rain, Must Be Important" file, I went over to Facebook and checked my Top News Feed.

I saw 2 posts about SuperPoke Pets, a cartoon that no one had liked or commented on, 3 posts by people commenting on their own status, a post about drafting a fantasy baseball team, an off-color joke, and 2 posts about real estate (one was mine, at the top of the pile).

Huh? That doesn't exactly strike me as Top News, with the exception of the 2 RE comments. And facebook feels this is what's most interesting to me? I either need to rethink my interaction on Facebook or else I need new friends. Has anyone else checked their Top News Feed to see what's in there?

So, now a serious question: Since status updates originate from your personal profile, and most Facebook gurus say you shouldn't use your personal profile for business purposes, won't most of the Top News feed be personal rather than business? How then can we as Realtors expect our real estate-related content to end up in the Top News feed, unless we post that type of content on our personal profiles? Or am I way off base here?

Maybe my half-dead brain cells didn't process this info as well as I thought...

9:42am • #30
128,299 Points 1 Featured Post

OK, Alex, so my overuse of FB and liking everything is going to help me? WOO HOO! :-) Thanks!

9:51am • #31
1,016,767 Points 25 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Thanks for posting this. . very helpful for those of us who does marketing in the Internet 

10:03am • #32
716,289 Points 69 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Well, I suppose the day that people start using facebook for their general internet searches, then Edgerank will have more weight.

10:03am • #33
677,945 Points 5 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

This is interesting and your final point makes sense. I am going to my first Rain Camp to improve SEO so this puts a different spin on my main mission there in a couple of weeks!

10:29am • #34
661,788 Points 112 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Called Shot Master

I am sure there is quite a bit of merit to what you say here. I still search using Google, not Facebook. And here is the thing, the interactions I see on FB are more about silly stuff. The photos I post with the grandkids in it get more reactions, comments, likes than any real estate stuff I have out there. Perhaps I have not reached the right people, and I honestly don't know that I will.

In the meantime, I continue to use FB to the best of my ability, and working on SEO at the same time.

Thank you for this food for thought!

10:32am • #35
390,689 Points 3 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Called Shot Master

I cannot believe that even if this happens to the extreme you indicate that the likes of Google are just going to sit by and let it happen. They are too big and too powerful. I am a firm believer in spreading your efforts and not putting all eggs in one basket. Yes we need to be on FB but when I can get a number 2 position and hold it on Google for a short tail keyword there is no way FB can bring me the kind of visitors that G does.

10:38am • #36
734,546 Points 9 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Alex - thanks for the info ..... one has to assume that the boys in the back room here on AR put that Facebook like butto n on our public posts for a reason.

10:40am • #37
1 Featured Post

Damn--I just learned how to spell SEO and now I have to learn EdgeRank?!

11:04am • #38
3 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Great article Alex! Thanks! I love SEO work, Internet tech and web design. Terrific information and well written.

11:30am • #39
100,237 Points 1 Featured Post

Great post, I had no idea that Facebook had an algorithm to pick and choose what status updates your friends see on facebook. This post is invaluable. I think for me at this point, Facebook helps me stay top of mind with my friends. However, generating new contacts that are haven't mets and are motivated buyers/sellers, that is a little more challenging. To grow my haven't met database, I get the best results with long tailed keywords like many other people have already mentioned. I also think once you've generated those leads online from long tailed keywords, you should then go on to find your leads on Facebook. Just an additional avenue to cultivate a lead into a sale IMO.

11:32am • #40

Great post.  We live in a ever changing world and if you are not on top of your game, you will be left behind.

12:04pm • #41
6 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Great comments!  ActiveRain never ceases to amaze me as a place to get the dialogue going.  Rather than do too many individual responses, I think I'll just suggest a few thoughts.  Let me start by admitting that Facebook is a new paltform, evolving fast.  I don't have all the answers, but I certainly do have some opinions :)  Most important takeaway - if you want to try to tap into Facebook (and I strongly believe you should) it's about creating engaging content and building relationships.

- For those of you exasperated about having to care about something new, I empathize.  There's really only one thing you can count on in technology and that is that things change.  Where the right place is on the adoption curve for you?  Do you want to try to get an edge by being ahead of it?  Or do you want to wait till it matures?

- As far as the SEO success stories go (both Realtors and consultants/developers), congratulations!  There's no doubt people are successful with SEO today. More power to you and keep doing what you're doing!  But I'm suggesting a couple of things a) The fact that some people are successful with SEO by no means suggests that most are.  By definition, if one client ranks well - it comes at the expense of another.  b) Do we really believe the average agent who invests in SEO will drive a significant % of their business from there?  Even in the case of those who succeed, I am willing to bet SEO driven inbound leads make up significantly less of their business than networking and referrals.  Facebook is about networking and referrals.

- Lots of great comments about the type of conversation on FB mostly being personal/fun in nature.  Very valid point.  I think this is evolving, but make no mistake that Facebook wants business to happen there too.  Here's how I would think of it - Facebook is a place to build relationships (imagine a cocktail party or a block party).  Your primary objective there is to engage with people and build relationship.  Add some real estate insight and perspective in appropriate ways that people will appreciate.  Do not SPAM listings, etc.  This is a fine line I know and we all just have to feel our way through it.

- The personal vs business conundrum in Facebook is a really interesting one.  I wrote another post on this - but my two cents is if you are like me, the two are totally entwined.  I do not believe you can, nor should totally separate the two on Facebook in the same way that you can't at a cocktail party.  But the key is that you do not want to turn people off.  You wouldn't walk around that party handing out business cards & house flyers.  You would meet people and engage.  The rest will take care of itself.

- How to create engaging content?  My suggestions - ask questions, use humor, share some insight, and show a little personality...kind of sounds like real life no?

12:25pm • #42
1,254,459 Points 242 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Virginia and Corinne and Claudette- Thanks for the confirmation- it is results that count. 

12:47pm • #43
144,730 Points Outside Blog

Until facebook becomes a dominant "search engine" I will have to keep cracking the seo code. I'm sure sooner or later facebook will evolve intoi more of a combination social media / social search engine. Then we will have to worry about how to max out SSE instead of SEO or maybe I am just spinning in circles. :-) Regardless great information. Thanks!

1:49pm • #44

you completely lost me but I would like to know more...

2:00pm • #45
258,353 Points 5 Featured Posts Outside Blog Called Shot Master

Thanks for the post. Makes me wonder what else I don't know. Definately something i'm going to look in to.

2:04pm • #46
140,304 Points 5 Featured Posts

Thanks so much for this, Alex.  I had guessed that Facebook was doing something like this, but wasn't sure exactly what the criteria might be.  I have become a lot more selective on liking certain people that I really don't want to know that much about!!  And realized that I have to reach wider to find news of folks I don't often talk to.  MORE time, more time.... <sigh>

I love the Roost FB app, by the way.  Ve-ry nice.  Can you offer it for Myrtle Beach as well as North Myrtle Beach?  That would be terrific.  I'd love Carolina Forest (29579) while you're at it, too!

Personally, and privately, I do wish all this kind of fun technical stuff sounded and looked a lot less like Math.  I'm sure I'd be a lot less intimated and able to follow along faster.  LOL

2:07pm • #47
115,216 Points Outside Blog Called Shot Master

Nice post, Alex.  I especially like your follow up comments.  Facebook this last year quickly developed into my best business revenue source online, and I never once tried to "sell" anyone.  Just kept interesting comments and pictures (I own a home improvements/handyman company) of projects.  Everything else took care of itself!

3:20pm • #48
211,195 Points 5 Featured Posts Outside Blog

I wondered about the difference between Top News and Recent. Thanks for the explanation, Alex!

Cheers,

Robin

3:25pm • #49
1 Featured Post Outside Blog

I seriously disagree with you.  Yes, Edgerank is important and cool but it will never be as effective as strong SEO.  Think about it.  You have x amount of friends on facebook and no more than 5000, what % do think your post will show up on your friends edgefeed?  Not many, especially if you've got friends who aren't friends with each other and even if you do, those friends are most likely to be Realtors like yourself that you've networked with.  Also, lets say you do end up on the feed of all of your friends every single day.  That would mean that whatever you posted would have to be extremely valuable and that you're friends would have liked or commented on.  THIS CONTENT IS rarely listings, links  or posts that directly get to buyers and sellers.  It's usually questions, requests for feedback, etc, VALUABLE STUFF but not something that is going to generate business in itself.  If you've got counter examples, I'd love to hear them.  Now, I'm not saying you can't get business off of facebook, twitter and linkedin but putting more emphasis on Edgerank over SEO is absurd. Think about this also....why do you people go on google and why do they go on facebook?  People go to google to find stuff they need (houses included) and people go to facebook to SOCIALIZE!!!! This is why so many adword evangelists are struggling with the facebook ad platform, people are less likely to convert  simply for the fact 'they didn't search to find you, you just popped up on the side. 

Plus, though SEO is getting more competitive, it isn't impossible especially in those long tailed searches.  We've got some 2500 searches a month coming through our Seattle site on strictly long tail blog posts, many of which were written a couple of years ago. Long tails searches are excellent in that when you provide someone SPECIFICALLY what they're looking for, Conversion rates jump through the roof. Short tailed searches have become incredibly competitive again, but still there are ways to make rank if you develop a long term SEO strategy.  And I know this, we're ranked #1 for the keywords (Seattle Real Estate, Vancouver CA Real Estate, Nashville Real Estate) and ranked in the top 5 for countless others across the country.  It's difficult YES, but impossible NO.  And the ROI and time investment will be WAY more valuable than trying to get on all of your FRIENDS feeds everyday. 

In terms of Google Local Business listings, you're right they are becoming more prevalent but again, not impossible to rank for.  In fact, it's way easier to rank locally than it is organically!!! Because it's still more or less NEW, getting in the 7 pack is not 100s of hours of work.  In fact, I got my DAD at the top of the search term "Bellingham house painters"  in about 3 hours!

Though I think I think it's cool there's an algorithm to making edgerank, I feel a more effective way to got on peoples feeds is to provide value.  If you're engaging, fun, and can provide the most value to your facebook friends, you'll naturally end up on the top feed.  No need to beat the system...just bring the value!

So that's my little rant!

Cheers,

-Briddick 

3:41pm • #50
Attended Rain Camp

I hope E still equals MC squared!  Thanks for the update.  Facebook makes me feel like the old movie actors did when the Talkies came around.  We have a team here at KW Exton PA using Social Media to close 14 homes in April, so its time to learn it! 

3:42pm • #51
212,208 Points 16 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

It seems like SEO searches are the way to go . . . for now.  That is, until Facebook competes its goal of world domination!

3:45pm • #52
860,635 Points 76 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Result are all that matter. If SEO is working for you, keep it going! Perhaps I'll be able later to sit down and figure Edgerank out, but for now I am too busy and I also am one of the ones who ranks high on the search.

4:14pm • #53
Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

You are so right when you said SEO is DOA for most of us.  And even when I have a blog post that does gain some traction, it's just a lot of pageviews with no return.

Maybe it's time to re-focus on the EdgeRanking.

Thanks,

John

4:16pm • #54

FB has its place but SEO is certainly not dead. I can't imagine anyone actually seriously seeking out a Realtor on it. I'm finding it to be overrated and am actually reducing my time on there. Sure, you might hire the Realtor that's already your friend from the real world and that's fine. But outside of that, I would love to hear some stories of Realtors that got real business from it.

Google Local is not that hard to navigate if you or your consultant knows what they are doing. More importantly, what is your prospect doing when they find you. Are you providing value and collecting emails for your newsletter, or adding them to your network? If not, shame on you!

Another site that I personally feel is even more valuable than FB is LinkedIn. I've gotten more quality leads from there than anywhere else. Get in LinkedIn's Service Provider directory and get some recommendations from your contacts. Personally would use that way before anything else if I needed to find a real estate professional.

 

4:22pm • #55
Outside Blog

Alex,

Great post and very interesting! I often wondered what it took to qualify as a "Top News" feed. Now I know, although I don't think we'll be seeing the end of SEO any time soon.

4:29pm • #56
1 Featured Post

Definitely have to look into this as I've been thinking about how to revise and ramp up my facebook presence.

4:29pm • #57
160,865 Points 1 Featured Post

 

Dave Keys likes this but also thinks #7 is right. Both platforms require thoughtful application of SEO 
as a sub-set of online marketing.

 

4:31pm • #58
391,486 Points 4 Featured Posts Called Shot Master

Blog posts live forever and capture anyone in the world, and FB goes out to a few hundred friends.  Yeah, not getting it. But I am one of those who has all the business I want right now. 

4:33pm • #59
749,658 Points 99 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

I think "content" is king no matter what approach one uses.  I get actual contacts my people doing google searches for specific things I have blogged about regardless of any attempt on my part to make those posts about particular key words.  I asked one client how they found me and they said, "Oh, I just googled, 'Seattle Home Inspector Foundation Cracks' and your blog post came up.  Time, consistency and content=phone calls.

4:34pm • #60
615,230 Points Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Always something new to think about and figure out -- thanks for sharing.

4:35pm • #61
1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor

Thanks for sharing Alex.  This was a well written summary.  My thoughts are that you will need to focus on both to survive and grow your business.  Facebook is a great place to interact and connect with friends, but I don't think many people go there looking for information.  Google is still the gateway to information.  Your post got me thinking, how do these companies market caps compare?  Since a lot of Internet companies are privately held, it is not easy to compare them.  Business Week had an articlethat makes a stab at putting a value on these privately held companies.  According to them:

  • Google - $150B
  • Yahoo - $21.4B
  • Facebook - $11.5B
  • MySpace - Part of News Corp
  • Twitter - $1.4B
  • LinkedIn - $1.3B

I think it will be interesting to see how Facebook closes the gap with Google.  Great post.  Very though provoking.

4:43pm • #62

A genuinely informative post... How refreshing (although i don't completely agree)... I really don't like facebook, but I am starting to force myself to consider more seriously. Generally, most of the people in my facebook are friends that would use me anyways, except for those friends who are also agents. I still think google is king, but things are definitely changing; I am getting increasing traffic from other search engines, which works for me, as I appear to rank higher in Bing and Yahoo for some reason.

My business direct from internet is not huge, considering the time i spend on this marketing effort, but it does lead to the ever important referrals, so I continue to plug away at it.

Jordy Brisbin
4:47pm • #63

Alex, excellent... so rare but i agree 100%!!!! Surprised there are so many doubters! Thank you very much for this article and follow up!

Debby Crawford
4:53pm • #64

Alex.....Very interesting. I would like know more.

 

 

Jerry Gray CRB,CRS,GRI,SFR / Allen Tate Realtors / Winston Salem, NC / 336-918-2433

4:56pm • #65
577,680 Points 15 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

This is a great piece of information to have, Alex.

But....

I'm not a techno, so forgive me if I sound a little out of my element...but doesn't EdgeRank only apply to those who are in the FaceBook system and are commenting, liking, and sharing their content with other Facebook users?

What about those who are not on FaceBook, and have no desire to join? If those people (and there are plenty, despite FB's growing popularity) need to look up something on the Internet, the most likely place they will go is...you guessed it, Google...so I'm not so sure that SEO is going to go the way of the dinosaurs quite yet....

5:05pm • #66
372,178 Points 43 Featured Posts Called Shot Master

This is depressing to me... because I haven't yet figured out what to do with Facebook. If I go there, I get lost. I didn't know you could put actual content there... Learn something every day.

Now, just to figure out how and where.

At the same time, I don't think the people I'm connected with there are copywriting prospects. There are a lot of people who want me to play games or send gifts or ...something.

So... why spend time adding content that wouldn't interest them?

5:06pm • #67
121,898 Points 1 Featured Post Attended Rain Camp

Fascinating really and it will take time to learn who, what & how but thanks to you I can get started.

5:06pm • #68
1 Featured Post

LIKE LIKE LIKE LIKE LIKE LIKE

I'm thinking this is a great post, it's keeping us on our toes, for that I thank you.

Next week I'm meeting with an IT friend who will help with SEO Opt. - for the first time.

Facebook newsfeed with thousands of realtor friends is like this: "First time potty for Johnny", 'Sarah is getting her hair cut", "I'm eating alone again" - not really 'Top News" in my book - check your news feed, pleeeeze.

SEO, EDGE, FACEBOOK, TWITTER - YIKES, DON'T SLEEP OR YOU COULD MISS SOMETHING NEW!

At the same time I'm at the IT Doctors for SEO Opt, I'll check out Edge and at the same time, kill two birds with one stone - oh, yea, I'll also keep putting my listings on Google maps....

Thanks,

Cindy Mustafa,  Remax Traditions, 216-408-1513

Portage County Realtor

OHIO

5:09pm • #69
140,287 Points Localism Sponsor

Thanks Alex--

I like the idea of optimizing this before "everyone" else is doing it.  Obviously, they both have a place, but as you mentioned, creating relationships with friends of friends is my idea of maximizing the time spent on the internet!  Thanks for all the info!

5:12pm • #70

This whole post and Alex's concept is a bit scammy.

I went to his (roost) web site (or FB page) and installed his 'real estate social media kit' - the only real estate listings search link took me to roost.com - exactly where I would not want to direct anyone from my FB page or site.

Hey Alex - at least you could have redirected me to your FB page - if we don't need google anymore, we probably don't need our web sites either!

Mitch Argon
5:16pm • #71
1,177,923 Points 133 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Well deserved feature!  I love networking and facebook is a multi faceted tool that I use with business AND for pleaesure.

5:18pm • #72
647,759 Points 5 Featured Posts Outside Blog Called Shot Master

Very interesting topic and comments too.  I'm going to keep this in mind when Facebooking and try to be more engaging!

5:24pm • #73
Attended Rain Camp

I've had some results on FB. The platform is wonderful for building relationships. I agree with your cocktail party analogy. I do a fair amount of sharing and linking and notice nice spikes in my traffic. I too did F8 and found it fascinating but a little over my head. If I understand it correctly something that I think is even bigger than edgerank that came out of F8 is Facebook now translates into 80 plus foreign languages. So that means someone in China or Panama can read my posts and vice versa. I also found it fascinating that there is a generation that does searches on FB as if it was google. That hadn't occured to me untill F8. (For those that don't know what F8 its. It was Facebooks conference when it unveiled its new platform and edgeranking optimization.) As for Google going away, beats me. 5 years ago I was using Alta Vista and posting on MySpace. Right now FB is the 800 lb gorilla.

5:25pm • #74
1 Featured Post Outside Blog

I see a parallel.... The important thing in surfing is to see the wave coming, and catch it beofe it crests too high.  Agreed?

5:32pm • #75

Great Information!  Thanks for the post! 

5:33pm • #76
Every time I get a longer pole, they raise the bar! Thank you for bringing us up-to-date on this new tool. Looks like I'll be doing some reading tonight.
5:37pm • #77
980,347 Points 81 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Alex,

Came from a reblog by Lisa, and Wow...In this endless change this is just another step. Incredible

5:38pm • #78

Sounds interesting and something we need to be aware of, especially if we want the best leads...hot and from people familiar with us!

I would like to learn more about it.

5:41pm • #79
7 Featured Posts

This is an interesting post but until people start using FB to search for information, I don't see EdgeRank having the same ROI as SEO.  I hear so many people doubting long-tail and that is okay.  Let them doubt it and the ones that "know" the value will continue to benefit.  Example - we run a site (not real estate) that is in a VERY competitive industry so we have focused on long-tail.  Each long-tail phrase only generates around 150 to 200 unique visits per month but we have achieved over 100 of these within a very short period of time (within 3 months) and the site is cash flow positive.

The topics that are usually in my top news feed are random and often silly, not news worthy.  Now our Facebook fan pages (business pages) generate a fair amount of traffic but we work at getting fans to those pages and the traffic, conversions, ROI don't even come close to our SEO efforts.  Actually we get a lot of our traffic to our niche Facebook business pages from Google searches :).  If FB focuses more on the FB business pages and can convince its users to search FB for information, then Google will have a run for their money. Until that happens, we will continue to use SEO as primary and Facebook and other social networks as a secondary avenue to generate additional traffic/leads.

 

5:49pm • #80
2 Featured Posts

BOTH factors are important, because if your site isn't FOUND then you won't be able to engage those folks searching because they are not part of your Facebook world. 

I truly believe in Social Media marketing, but to completely tune away from SEO, Banklinks, and your focus on Search Engine Ranking would be a HUGE mistake.  How can you create the relationship with people that are not in your friend network yet??

It takes a balance of both.

5:56pm • #82
269,417 Points 8 Featured Posts Attended Rain Camp

Cool post. Here's an idea for a follow up post: "How to get consumers to interact with you on Facebook."

I am one of the few who closes business from the internet thru SEO. For me it's way easier to selet and change keywords and publish fresh content than it is to get people to interact with me on Facebook.

5:56pm • #83
1,048,851 Points 177 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

I think you brought up some good exposure for EdgeRank and Facebook. While I'm not an expert in SEO, I continue to work on it everyday. Ask Katerina about my progress. By leaps and bounds.

Do I need 100 clients to put food on the table? Nope. I cant service them all. But like Corrine, all I need is 3-5 consistent strong leads and my leads actually are my clients when they call, it's not hard to know that SEO is where I need to concentrate.

But in the meantime, I will keep an eye out on Edgerank and Facebook.

6:03pm • #84

I've bookmarked your post to read later when I have more time to digest it.  Thanks for getting the word out.

6:15pm • #85

Great Stuff. Very generous of you to share.

Steve

6:20pm • #86
687,078 Points 83 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Oh yeah, sounds likes another of the edge companies that make a living off the IDX "Search Listings" without actually representing one real client, ever, in a fiduciary capacity.  But let's make up some new "gots to have" -- today EdgeRank.  Wonder what the new gimmicky name will be tomorrow?

6:41pm • #88
743,466 Points 3 Featured Posts

Alex,

Very interesting. Obviously, this is the way to go. I have bookmarked this so I can come back.

Brian

6:55pm • #89

wow, first time i have heard of this....thanks.  What role does using a fan page veruses a friend page in the whole EdgeRank algorithm 

7:30pm • #90
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Back in 1994, my then broker said "What's new Lenn?" 

 I said "I'm thinking of going on the Internet." 

"What's the Internet?  he said.

7:37pm • #91

Please don't spread false information like this. Saying SEO is dead and "SEO is going to drive random eyeballs to your website/blog which you'll hope to create to a lead someday and eventually turn into a deal." is nonsense. I've worked in internet marketing for years and seo is definitly not dead and it is the farthest thing from "random traffic". It sounds like if you are getting random people to your website then you are not doing your keyword research correctly.

Sure Facebook is great for building relationships with clients but you can reach far more potential cients with SEO, if don correctly... The problem is most people just dont take the time to figure out how to do it the right way.

Rick
7:42pm • #92

The fact of the matter is nobody should rely on one source of traffic for anything online. Remember Alta Vista? You should be building one asset and one asset only: your database. Everything else is simply a means to an end.

 

7:48pm • #93
Outside Blog

This is absolutely wonderful ... and it makes a whole lot sense.

Is facebook publicly traded? What's the ticker name?

7:50pm • #94

If your privacy settings are turned on no info goes public or indexed.. just a thought

8:15pm • #95

What a wonderful post! I feel that response #27 missed your entire post.  It is simply another example of the basic framework that has always worked in real estate: personal relationships and community building.

8:17pm • #96

Alex, that is absolutely great information! Thanks for bringing this to light.

Stephanie Hofman
8:23pm • #97
114,218 Points Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

I live in a very small, relationship-driven market. This makes lots of sense!

8:31pm • #98
107,206 Points 6 Featured Posts Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Thanks for the great information, Alex.  I don't know a thing about "EdgeRank," but I do know that change is inevitable.  Thanks for bringing us the next wave.

8:35pm • #99

Excellent post!!  Social media gurus have been predicting the end of websites, and I am starting to agree with them.  Thank you very much for informing us on this new opportunity!!

8:37pm • #100
550,493 Points 22 Featured Posts Outside Blog Called Shot Master

Nope, I ain't buyin it.  Lots of words like 'interesting' from the comments which is a polite way of saying I don't agree in a polite Midwestern way.

8:43pm • #101
374,754 Points 4 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp

For what it's worth, the E-ish symbol is a sigma and is the summation of uwd....

Maybe the verbal description is better :).

8:47pm • #102
217,158 Points 2 Featured Posts

Great information Alex.  I hope you don't mind a FaceBook link to it for our tech group.  Every time I come close to thinking I figured something out, the game seems to change.  This will be part of our Tuesday tech review.

9:03pm • #103
Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

I concur . . . great post Alex.  There is so much to keep up with in today's world.  It's overwhelming!

9:07pm • #104
109,464 Points Outside Blog

Very Edgy Topic.  Will be interesting to see if it takes hold.

9:10pm • #105
112,047 Points 2 Featured Posts

Sorry Alex. I have to agree with Joe Lane and Briddick Webb. Your statement "SEO as a marketing strategy for Real Estate is dying." is outright false.

9:28pm • #106

Read your post and all the comments.  Seems to be some respondents that are confused as I am but I continue to try to understand all these new marketing technologies.  However, good old fashioned face to face is still how I make my living!!

9:33pm • #107
381,835 Points 19 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

I try to keep an open mind about new stuff although I am on facebook doing what you suggest.

9:50pm • #108
1,007,446 Points 208 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Hi Alex!  When I start doing my search engine searches on Facebook, I'll delve into EdgeRank! 

I'm a face-to-face FIRST, then use my longtail keywords to share my knowledge of the area with the consumer who is using search engines to find their home in Charlotte NC NEXT.  I also use fan pages on FB to do that same thing and I believe that it's working but, as with everyone else, it's not working for those who do not know me.  For those who so, I take care of with the face-to-face and the 'fun' on FB.  If that's the way things are going (EdgeRank), then I'm covered there as well as from all avenues of my business. 

I do not believe, however, that FB searches will ever outrank the combined total of the search engines (Google, Yahoo, MSN, AOL, Bing, etc.)--ever.  As a matter of fact, my business is growing by leaps and bounds on a monthly basis as a direct result of the search engines--not FB.

9:58pm • #109
727,633 Points 1 Featured Post Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Hi Alex - I just posted the comment below on Lenn's reblog of your post before visiting your post.

Until I got my ActiveRain Daily earlier this afternoon, I had never heard of EdgeRank. However, I have been reading recently that Facebook as well as Twitter are becoming more important in search results.

Although it appears that Alex is indicating that Facebook will base its rankings on likes, shares, comments and other criteria, Google does use many other criteria.

As a test, I did a search for "HST" in Google and in Facebook. HST is the harmonized sales tax that has been in three Canadian provinces since 1997 and is being introduced in two of Canada's largest provinces (Ontario and British Columbia) on July 1, 2010. Facebook's search on the first page shows two fan groups with a petition against the HST in British Columbia, another fan page called HST with two fans and three web results that have nothing to do with my search topic. On the other hand, Google's first page has 9 out of 10 items that relate to the HST (the 8th item is the Hubble Space Telescope).

That is why Google and search engine optimization will remain important for a long time. Technical topics can be easily found in Google but not in Facebook.

10:20pm • #110
7 Featured Posts

The comment that states, "Social media gurus have been predicting the end of websites, and I am starting to agree with them".

I really don't want to sound negative here but many of those "social media gurus" are depending on it. Personally anytime I see/hear someone calling themselves a Social Media Guru" I automatically tune out. I could be wrong here but I highly doubt social media is going to replace websites or SEO. Social media could be an additional platform but you don't have complete control over your marketing, messaging, lead capture, etc. on social networks. Don't get me wrong, I think they are GREAT for building relationships.  They are also great for staying in touch with customers, friends, family but they have a completely different purpose over websites, which imo should be used to capture sales/leads.

I guess I just don't get why people think they have to choose one or the other. Why would you want to ONLY do SEO or ONLY participate in social networks?? Why would you want to ONLY have a website?? Why not marry them all and place the most focus on the things that generate the most business?

I can only speak for myself and my business but the leads and sales we get from SEO are far greater than social networks and we use them all (FB, Twitter, YouTube, etc.).  We do get business from social networks but if they all disappeared tomorrow, we would still be a-okay because over the years we have built up our websites and focused on SEO and our customers.

10:23pm • #111
497,655 Points 103 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Alex, i think you make some good points, there are over 400 million people there spending on average 50 minutes at a time on Facebook.  However, I don't know that many are using it to search for things.  I know I use it to search for my friends, to connect with local businesses, but I am not sure how the edgerank is going to make me become a greater consumer because of it.  I think as it continues to evolve, this could turn into something big.  We will just have to wait & see I guess.

10:29pm • #112
497,655 Points 103 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Misty- I would have to agree with you.... I teach social media daily, but believe you need to have SEO and SM to be totally effective.  Yes, SM is more popular right now, but it still isn't producing the numbers of business as a fully optimized site.

10:32pm • #113
7 Featured Posts

Thanks Jeremy!  It is great to see people teaching how to use both SEO and SM.

10:41pm • #114

My head is spinning out of control. Just about the time I settle on a strategy something new pops up. I was sure SEO was the way to go until I listened to an Active Rain online class with a realtor from Alaska who was relying heavily on Facebook and seeing great results after 5 months.

10:44pm • #115
497,655 Points 103 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Tom- Unfortunately settling is something that may never happen. It is imperative to embrace change constantly.

10:51pm • #116
577,680 Points 15 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Now that I've actually read most of the 100+ comments, it seems to me that many have the same idea that I had - that while EdgeRank may be important, it will not replace SEO as a business necessity for those of us utilizing the internet. We'll see...

10:57pm • #117
679,738 Points 18 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

What an interesting conversation.  I do think a lot of the social media is just that social... and it is about networking and building relationships.  I am gald you explained Edgerank and its importance. 

11:31pm • #118
837,443 Points 163 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

I don't see SEO as DOA as you mentioned, but then again, I am in the top 3 or 4 on Google for all of the keywords I care about.  EdgeRank could be more important in the future, but I don't think anyone is thinking of Facebook as a search engine yet.

11:32pm • #119

What an insightful and informative post.

I am a fairly new realtor and in the process of testing 3 different websites, all geared to lead generation/dripmarketing  etc. It's a slow process to optimize a website.  Still learning.  - Ah...... and so many......dead leads.......

However, I recently joined Facebook and my realtor network is expanding quickly thru "friends of friends" .The feeds somtimes feel like real person interaction. Yes there is some concern with privacy. 

In a recent Marketing & Technology Seminar by Realtor.com, the importance of Facebook as a business tool for marketing and networking was highly emphasized.

There is a more personal feel to facebook and associating the comments/likes etc with a photo give the impression of live communication (chat), i.e. building a real people network.

 

 

Renata Klaiber
11:39pm • #120
MAY
24
2010
1,303,417 Points 313 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Well it's clear more and more folks are spending time on FB and there is business to be had through engagement adn intereaction, as well as via FB ads and searching. It would seem to me that fo rnow, both are important. I can't see SEO becoming a non-issue, but I'm sure no expert.

Great food for thought. And the conversation has been enlightening.

Jeff

12:04am • #121
124,162 Points

Great blog.  It's making me rethink how I approach facebook marketing.  I'm wondering how this affects fan pages.

12:13am • #122
4 Featured Posts Hit Router Attended Rain Camp

Alex, thanks for the great post.  You got a lot of good discussion here too!  I wish I could write to get this kind of discussion, whether it's on AR or FB!  Where is the expert to teach me that?  :-)

12:17am • #123
268,741 Points 2 Featured Posts Called Shot Master

Very well written and insightful post, but I disagree that seo is dead. I think that the key to any good marketing effort online is to drive traffic.

Why couldn't you work on your seo while interacting with clients, referral partners, etc through facebook?

12:23am • #124
105,233 Points 12 Featured Posts

Nice Write Up Alex,

The amount of time for SEO on Google has generated a ROI that has become less and less effective... Quite honestly... the leads coming in from Google as compared to five years ago are weak... certainly a lower quality as the sea has become saturated with more fisherman then fish.

Due to Google's Algorithm, Personally... I find the searches for local information dominated by Big National sources with poor and irrelevant information compared to finding information on Facebook.

My connections have connections and so forth... If I want real Vegas information... chances are the most relevant and current information I'm going to find is on Facebook. When we want to go out and find out where to go tonight... I jump on Facebook for the real info. and not the paid info.

Google downplayed and penalized Realtor to Realtor links / connections several years ago... Big mistake.

My opinion... but Google is becoming the next AOL...

Nice Write Up.

 

 

12:46am • #125

Great post!  Awesome information and very informative.

Thanks so much.

Gena Z.
1:23am • #126
608,292 Points 26 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

This has been a great discussion and thanks for bringing us this topic, Alex. How can we stay on the cutting edge without posts like this? I think you are speaking in visionary terms of the future is now. And although Google is big and SEO is important, Facebook is in its infancy and has already surpassed Google in popularity. What's to stop FB from amassing search engine capabiity? My 20--year old daughter went to her Baby Ga-Ga forum for advice when she had questions about her baby - not to Google. I questioned her about why she wasn't going to the book on childcare that we had bought. I think it speaks of the mindset of younger generations, and they will be the tipping point for this sort of technology, don't you think? Older people are more set in their ways - if we want to keep up, we'd best NOT be set in our ways but always be looking forward to the next change.

1:27am • #127
161,132 Points 13 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

This just reminds me that I have to beef up my fan page on FB.  I have been ignoring it.  Time ti get serious!

7:08am • #128
781,245 Points 71 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

"SEO as a marketing strategy for Real Estate is dying."

Are you kidding??? Honestly that is a ridiculous statement. If anything SEO is at an all time high and is only going up from here.

I am not disputing the importance of Facebook either. They are both an important part of anyone's visability.

7:50am • #129

Thanks Alex, very interesting!  FB is growing and evolving on a daily basis.  I can see this importance because we really don't know how big and how all encompassing FB's future will be.  So is the Edgerank algorithym yet complete though...more tests/changes on the way?!  I still believe SEO to be huge...because that has been the staple.  Yes social media is becoming more and more important to engage future prospects/clients, but still SEO brings much more qualified people to your front business door. FB seems to be much more of a drip campaign, at least right now anyway; SEO giving much more ROI (time included of course).

But please keep us updated on the Edgerank alorithm!  FB is definitely becoming a monster...

Thanks!

Dan Biro
8:04am • #130

Thanks Alex, very interesting! FB is growing and evolving on a daily basis. I can see this importance because we really don't know how big and how all encompassing FB's future will be. So is the Edgerank algorithym yet complete though...more tests/changes on the way?! I still believe SEO to be huge...because that has been the staple. Yes social media is becoming more and more important to engage future prospects/clients, but still SEO brings much more qualified people to your front business door. FB seems to be much more of a drip campaign, at least right now anyway; SEO giving much more ROI (time included of course).

But please keep us updated on the Edgerank alorithm! FB is definitely becoming a monster...

Thanks!

Dan Biro - http://www.your-castle.biz
8:07am • #131

what happen to twitter, blogging for points, link stuffing, viral videos and etc?? FaceBook makes you feel good when you get rewarded for likes and fans and what ever else SELF REWARD system they call it.. FB wants you thinking they are going to make you SEO famous and take AD revenue away from google by having google push FB... uh yea..

Besides goog can not and will not rank or index pages with privacy settings wound so tight.. or will they?? no liability there..

Looking into my crystal ball: The herd will be on move to the next latest and greatest must have time consuming "hot" venue soon..

9:04am • #132
105,034 Points

Well, after reading most of the comments I've decided.

I want them all.

9:45am • #133
Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Alex:

I am going to continuing pursuing SEO rankings on Google.  I have several websites and shall be creating more landing pages.  My goal is to have everything above the fold in my niche market. 

One thing I have noticed lately is that the Google algorithm is using relational tags as part of their algorithm. They are scanning Twitter and Facebook for who you connect with and then posting those people when their content is relavent for content searches on Google.

For example, a month ago when I put in T---  Realtors Google put (below the fold -- but on the first page)  L--- C--- and P-- D--- with their Active Rain profile photos.  Both are in Active Rain and sell real estate in T---.  L--- is a friend and blogs daily on Active Rain, and sends me direct messages on Twitter.  P--- is a friend of mine on Facebook who never blogs -- but is in Active Rain.  

Under the old algorithm of Google, neither one of them would have shown up on the first page of that search.  Then I put in Coldwell Banker and some other key words for T--- realtors in midtown -- and L--- C--- came up.  This was really fun because she deserved to come up.  The only thing is that she doesn't sell for Coldwell Banker.  Now that search result comes from her and I being connected on Twitter.  Perhaps I should recruit her.  (L--- C---, I know you're reading this, so let's get together after I get back from Cancun next week.)

The point is that you need both -- SEO and a strong relational presence, calling it EdgeRank, Klout, or whatever.

Great post.

9:59am • #134

very well written post.  I will have to see if I can get more engagement from my facebook.

10:11am • #135

lets see is in time fb will lose its appeal as it did with myspace, interesting info though...thx!

10:21am • #136
3 Featured Posts

Please read how inaccurate this post is:

http://activerain.com/blogsview/1659121/an-expert-response-to-the-edgerank-post

10:35am • #137

Sorry Alex, your first several comments on SEO were some of the dumbest I've ever read. I almost never post here but I had to..

http://activerain.com/blogsview/1649944/a-few-of-the-dumbest-comments-on-seo-ever

You didn't have to make those to present your points on facebook.

 

10:42am • #138

Good Post!

Facebook, is still the new kid on the block and Edgerank, is just one of the things they are trying to figure out, so they can best monetize their advertising potential.

The bottom line is that Facebook is just another vehicle on the Internet to advertise on. Unfortunately you need to use everything that is available- an leverage these off each other the best you can.

I.e. Google; Yahoo; Bing; YouTube; Facebook; Twiitter; Web 2.0 Articles ect.. If you can intertwine them together the better off you will be.

Concentrate on the ones you feel most comfortable with and go from there.

 

10:52am • #139
813,393 Points 7 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Called Shot Master

Interesting Post, Let us see how it plays out.  I am on Facebook, but cannot get a handle on it completely.

11:06am • #140
1 Featured Post Outside Blog

stirring the pot - great info to think on -

11:17am • #141
453,374 Points 15 Featured Posts Outside Blog Called Shot Master

This is one of the few posts that I've read every comment on.  Thank you for creating this discussion - I learned a lot and feel much better now about my current positions on Facebook and SEO. 

11:34am • #142
2 Featured Posts

I'm going to respectfully disagree with your argument. Just because you may not get a call but from 1 of every 100 to 1000 visitors from google does not mean that it is not the most effective marketing approach.  If most people apply your sound advice of producing good content than they'd see results in the search engines.  The problem that I see lies with agents.  The first problem is that most agents lack the patience to write consistently on a topic to rank highly.  They want immediate and measurable goals and the search engines are not that immediate.  Facebook is, but agents delude themselves that their 500 fans are all buyers when typically a 1/3 or more are friends and family and another 1/3 or more are other agents or vendors a lot of the time.  I don't know anyone that is generating more business through social media than with blogging unless they happen to be using facebook as their main dispersal method of their content and in that case it's still the blog that is closing the deal.  

The other major problem that most agents cause themselves is that they try to be a jack-of-all trades wanting business for everyone and trying to rank for "San Diego Real Estate" instead of attacking an attainable niche of a neighborhood, property type, specializing in a type of sale or client.  If they did that then they would see legitimate long tail search engine results and eventually make ground on major search engine results.  

You have to treat SEO, like the science that it is and not something that you can from some bozo on Active Rain thats been blogging 6 months longer than you and got results from their random approach.  Take classes, study trusted SEO sites, and learn the fundamentals and you can see great results. 

Facebook captures more and more of the market each day and works well for word-of-mouth type marketing, but when people want to search they still turn to google and simply saying that you'll never bounce the top guy from his position is a pretty pathetic excuse.  If that's your attitude, than why not just say, well X has more clients than me, so I'm going to find another job.  

11:57am • #143
6 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Wow.   You know you've hit a good subject when there's this level of reaction!  

Here's my take on that again - if SEO is working well for you, terrific.  You should obviously keep doing things that work for you.  But I fear in much of that discussion, my larger point is getting lost.  So here are a couple questions to try to help me illustrate it better...

- Do the Realtors reading this thread get more deals sourced from SEO or word of mouth referral?

- What % of your deals would you say come from each?

- And what do you think that % is for the average Realtor in the US?

Facebook is fundamentally a platform (evolving but also growing more powerful every day) for growing your network and facilitating introductions & referrals to friends of clients/partners/friends/etc.

I stand by my read that the average Realtor's efforts on SEO are already ROI negative, and worsening go forward.  Is that true of every Realtor?  Obviously no.  But SEO is getting harder, not easier as more content gets indexed every day, more players figure it out, Google's own stuff takes more of the page, and Google loses share.  

Do you want to skate to where the puck was or where it's headed?  EdgeRank is where it's headed.

12:42pm • #144
118,799 Points 2 Featured Posts Attended Rain Camp

I've read this blog and re-read this blog and I'm still confused!  This might just be one of those "things" that I need to see developed before I can get on it's bandwagon!

12:53pm • #145

As a guy who grew up playing ice hockey, I love the puck analogy.  I would say it this way.  Do you want to skate to where the puck IS (not was) or where it is headed?  SEO on google is king but as Facebook evolves and social media habits change, I think people will want to start doing searches with-in FB and if they can find a service that is somehow related or connected to a friends relationship (or even there own but they have forgotten about), FB could blow google out of the water 4-5 years from now. 

I think it would be wise to play in both sand boxes.  It's not that difficult to do both.  And don't give up on the whole face to face networking referral type approach either.  We need to be where the buyers/selers eyeballs are and that is google and FB. 

12:59pm • #146
3 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor

"EdgeRank" is one more tool in the arsenal of online real estate agents looking to capture leads.  The way I see it, it's not a matter of SEO being more or less important than EdgeRank.  However, it is about being prepared as Realtors to stay ahead of the lead generation curve.  I for one will continue to create SEO presence through blogging, keywords, geo-tagging, adwords and now embrace EdgeRank as well.  Exciting time to be in the real estate industry indeed!

12:59pm • #147
119,767 Points Localism Sponsor

Fascinating post.  This is the first place I've seen anything about this, and it something I'll certainly be looking into more.

1:00pm • #148
164,227 Points

People really love their facebook. At the very least, you've encouraged me to take a closer look at how I should be using it.

1:05pm • #149
580,879 Points 11 Featured Posts Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Hi Alex...Congratulations on your feature post, try this on Facebook.

I've been on Facebook, Twitter, LikedIn and many others for over a year, I have lots of great friends, but no direct Business. Sure my AR posts go to these Social Media sites however...

Buyers are specific with their Real Estate needs and search with a descriptive search such as two bed two bath top floor condo in Victoria BC...for instant results...Try that on Facebook..sure you can list listings with a business Page etc. However Show me the money Facebook.

Just last month I made $35,000 from SEO...zero nadda from social media sites like Facebook, that may change, but until it does blogging in Active Rain shows me the Money :O))

1:23pm • #150

Alex: Lead Gen...SEO=99.9% FB=0%

Lenn Harley: I'm surprised! I searched (didn't say 'read') all comments, looking for a response from you. It was expected you'd have more to say on this subject...I'm bumbed! :)

Carlos Scarpero: Out of all the comments I did read, I tend to agree more with you...at least for now. Thanks for your sensible answer!

To all (or, at least, those who haven't made a FB biz 'Fan Page': How can you be so sure you can't expect more business from FB...sooner, or later? 

Renee Drumm, e-PRO(R), REALTOR(R)
2:23pm • #151
223,031 Points 2 Featured Posts Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

I have had a FB biz page for a month and got nothing out of it LOL

seriously though, the agenda of the post is clear.  Roost has a great Real Estate App for you biz page.  And they are preaching the importance of what is an emerging engaging platform.  He strongly points out how this could change the game.   When it comes to the internet, by the time you read a story it is obsolete information.  World is changing.  I plan on continuing on with my Blog & SEOing.

But I also have 12+ city/subdivision FB pages.  And I put the Roost app on every single one of them.  Not a single lead yet, that I am aware of, but looks good, has strong potential

3:01pm • #153
136,373 Points

Great post Alex! Thank you for the heads and clarity in the explanation!

3:19pm • #154
3 Featured Posts

"I stand by my read that the average Realtor's efforts on SEO are already ROI negative, and worsening go forward. Is that true of every Realtor? Obviously no. But SEO is getting harder, not easier as more content gets indexed every day, more players figure it out, Google's own stuff takes more of the page, and Google loses share.

Do you want to skate to where the puck was or where it's headed? EdgeRank is where it's headed."

Alex - I still have a major problem with your "give up" attitude.

I realize I'm not exactly a saint when it comes to how I conduct myself online but I never tell people to give up on something especially when telling them to essentially give up on SEO can cost them business.

SEO requires work just like anything else and sadly there are no shortcuts or quick solutions to getting your site ranked #1 for a specific keyword. But that doesn't mean you should give up on it because someone else's site is ahead of your own, in fact that should motivate you to work harder to by improving your site, building links and being social (the trinity to ranking success BTW).

You're post is basically saying "You're not going to be successful with one thing so give up and try to be successful with something else"

... and that something else is Facebook, a site where 60 percent of users are considering deleting their accounts and 95 percent of my biz pages "fans" are friends, family and colleagues (not prospects).

I realize this comes off as being very negative but your post doesn't present a single compelling reason for concentrating on Facebook over SEO or other mediums.

3:22pm • #155
6 Featured Posts Outside Blog

William - I led the comment you quoted with  "...if SEO is working well for you, terrific.  You should obviously keep doing things that work for you."

3:40pm • #156

thanks for keeping us on the Edge ! 

3:50pm • #157
Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp

Whoa -- where do I go -- webinar preferably -- to better understand.  Your post makes great sense, but difficult for me to apply.  Help!

Anne in Austin

www.hookemhomes.com

 

3:50pm • #158

Great information!  I think it is going to be so interesting to see how Facebook plays out in the next 10 years as a resource and tool in business.  We are all learning as we go right now! 

4:11pm • #160
107,693 Points Called Shot Master

Thanks so much for this post. I really has stirred a great debate. I have read about half the comments and will read them all before making a judgment.

4:32pm • #161

today's Aha! moment.  thank you for posting!

crystal
4:44pm • #162

Alex, Thanks for the insight.  I would love a video ; )  Also I would love to subscribe to any further information you post on this topic.  ~ JC

4:58pm • #163

Hate to be a WTF? but I fail to udnerstand how or why anyone would use Facebook to find out either how to search a property or to find a realtor.  With all of the "buzz" about social media the stark reality is that the prospect wants to buy or sell a HOUSE not find a soul mate or an understanding ear.  yes some of the "whatever" generation will use the facebook approach and yes you can generate good leads by coming up with good content BUT at what tradeoff?  Blogging about real estate is blogging to other realtors (and maybe mortgage professionals, appraisers, and title companies).  It is NOT about buyers or sellers -- the truth is that 99% of them DO NOT CARE what you have to say in a broadcast medium and blogging, facebook posts, tweets, rss feeds etc are a form of broadcasting.  Buyers care about prices, location, and features.  Sellers care about how you are going to find buyers.  To ignore that set of fundementals is to ignore EVERYTHING THAT IS TRULY IMPORTANT.

We all have limited time and resources.  If you are really good at social media broadcasting then go into the social media business.  Its sovcial media and not real estate.

And before people say "who the *** are you"  Homegain last week announced that I was the most productive buy side advertier in their network with a 2256% ROI on my advertising dollars.

If you can demonstrate a 1000% ROI and disagree with my post above -- please answer back.

 

Michael Lissack
6:01pm • #164
223,031 Points 2 Featured Posts Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

why would anyone be upset that 'activerain is promoting' this post

how many blogs generate 165 comments?  there seems to be people on both sides, most leaning more centrally.

its a hot topic that got hotter

You many not like what he said, or maybe you do not like how he said it.  but guess what?  he got you to read it and comment on it!  How many of you can claim a blog with this many comments?

 

I remember a day when americans said:

"I may disagree with what you say, but I will defend your right to say it with my life."

The OP stated his opinion, based upon the fact I am assuming, that his company is leveraged on the success of Facebook.

Before this blog  I NEVER HEARD of EDGERANK

now we all have.  once upon a time google was just like FB, the new kid on the block  who knows what is going to be the next big thing.  If you do maybe you should get into venture capital to help it get off the ground

7:40pm • #166
3 Featured Posts

"You many not like what he said, or maybe you do not like how he said it. but guess what? he got you to read it and comment on it! How many of you can claim a blog with this many comments?"

-In that case I'm going to write a new post each day like "Real Estate is Dead" or "North Korea is the Best Country Ever" or "Lance Armstrong cheated to win" or "Your mom is so fat that she ..."

Its one thing if he introduced Edgerank and ways to use it to market your services but to put out a post that says "SEO is going to die, Edgerank is what you need to focus on" without a SINGLE factual claim to back it up (his assertion that Facebook has beaten Google in traffic is completely untrue), its basically on the same level as the examples I listed above.

 

7:58pm • #167
223,031 Points 2 Featured Posts Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

and yet William, you are here, debating the topic adding to the comment count

he stirred the pot and you contribute

8:10pm • #168
144,228 Points Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp

Excellent dialog on both sides of the argument, who knows, in a year or more Fb may be dead and the next "greatest" whatever will be taking over!

9:17pm • #169
6 Featured Posts Outside Blog

 

William - in my experience blogs are often (if not usually) primarily opinion pieces.  My suspicion is that if your posts on North Korea or My Mom were engaging and fostered some dialogue they would get read and commented on as well.

As to my assertions being "completely untrue" - please see attached articles:

- "Facebook Reaches Top Ranking in US" - http://weblogs.hitwise.com/heather-dougherty/2010/03/facebook_reaches_top_ranking_i.html

- "Facebook surpasses Google in weekly traffic" - http://www.mercurynews.com/business/ci_14698296?nclick_check=1

- "Facebook beats Google as " the most visited site in the US" - http://www.nydailynews.com/money/2010/03/17/2010-03-17_facebook_beats_google_as_the_most_visited_site_in_the_us.html

Granted these were for a single period in March, but given that FB recently announced its visitor count is up to 500 million (25% growth in the 2 months since these numbers were released and 100%+ growth year over year vs Google which I think was basically flat y/o/y)...I imagine we'll see more news like this than less in the coming months.

9:28pm • #171
1 Featured Post

Although I appreciate how much of the world Facebook has captured I am not sure that professionally it is what will make or break a business, broker or agent. I think there will continue to be success stories. Right now there is probably credence to what you are saying but I questions its staying power. As with everything in this interactive world Facebook is going to have its peaks and valleys. When it gets to its valley someone/something will be there taking us to a new peak. As an early Facebook user I find myself no longer a fan. I maintain my business page and that is about it. 

9:47pm • #172
168,217 Points 2 Featured Posts

I haven't had much success with SEO, and probably won't with EdgeRank.  I'm looking for something that specializes in my local area, so I can connect with local home buyers and sellers.  When they develop a social network for that, I am sure it will benefit me.

10:08pm • #173
149,897 Points Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp

Makes you wonder what's coming next.  One must stay current.  Thanks for the explanation.  It at least gives me an idea of what I might be working towards in the future.

11:14pm • #174
MAY
25
2010
3 Featured Posts

Alex

- Still no white papers? Case studies? Anything to backup your claims that edgerank has a better ROI than SEO?

The big difference between Facebook and Google is that Google is a search engine, Facebook is where you go to look at pictures, talk to friends and for some of you play Farmville. People go to Google to find information, people go to Facebook to chat and make friends. 

If you want to talk about graphs and visit data let's talk about the fact that Facebook.com might have beat Google but that doesn't give credit for other Google properties with web search functions or abilities to advertise with both paid and unpaid content (Gmail, Youtube, Google Maps if they weren't counting subdomains). 

Also just because traffic is up at Facebook doesn't mean traffic is down at Google (9 percent increase year-over-year). Just because email became popular doesn't mean people stopped using phones if that analogy works. Also don't forget Firefox and Chrome have Google search (not Facebook search) built right into their browsers. 

I'm still waiting for a business case that can conclusively say "1 hour of edgerank optimization has a better ROI than 1 hour of SEO" 

 

1:02am • #175
3 Featured Posts

I'm willing to bet that if you take 1 million random Facebook pageviews and 1 million random Google pageviews, the Facebook views are most likely people looking at pictures, sending messages, playing games, looking at friends profiles, checking out events, etc... but 1 million Google pageviews are going to be people looking at search results. 

1:08am • #176
210,254 Points 1 Featured Post Outside Blog

Alex -

You know I have mad respect for you, and Roost. But I think you're missing something vital in your post.

There is no question that Facebook is a site to be acknowledged. Their growth has been impressive, and their reach indisputable.

But seriously, comparing the Facebook Top News feed to search engine results? Really?

I just looked at my FB "top news feed". You know what I see? Photos of peoples kids at graduation, multiple references to Farmville, a picture of a cat, some links to funny YouTube videos, FourSquare checkins, and three discussions on the weather. Yes, there are some links to real estate related info -- ironically leading to real estate blogs -- you know, those things that get indexed, and found, in Google.

If I "search" Facebook for "Phoenix Real Estate" I get 77 FB page results. So sure, I could find a realtor there if I was looking. Of course if I Google "Phoenix Real Estate", I get 63,100,000 results. I suppose one could argue that is overkill, But it is MUCH easier to find what most real estate consumers are looking for -- listings -- on page 1 (or 100) of Google than it is digging through Facebook page results.

What I really don't understand is comparing Facebook traffic to Google traffic. They are two completely different sites designed for two completely different purposes. You're not comparing apples to apples. You're not even comparing fruits to vegetables.

ESPN.com gets a bazillion times more traffic than PhoenixRealEstateGuy.com. So does that mean I should start writing about sports? I mean ESPN is kicking my ass, so if I can't beat them, I may as well join them, right?

Of course comparing ESPN.com to my blog is silly. So is comparing Facebook to Google. Just because they are both web sites and you get to them via a browser doesn't mean they serve the same purpose.

Don't get me wrong, Facebook has it's place, and that place will most definitely grow and morph (as will Google -- they aren't standing still either).

EdgeRank is interesting. Last week, I wrote a blog post and mentioned the post on my wall and that got over 200 "likes" on FB, and dozens of FB comments. Where is it on the FB News Page? Nowhere to be seen. Why? I'm guessing it's because of the "d-sub e" factor in the EdgeRank algorythm -- the time decay factor. The Facebook News Feed seems very transient. The oldest item currently on my News feed is 14 hours old, an incredibly helpful status update that states, in its entirety, "new week! HIT ME!".  I've got blog posts that, via long tail SEO, were written *four years* ago that still generate prospects. And closings. I'd love to see one, just one thing posted to Facebook four years ago that makes the phone ring today.... Heck, I challenge you to find something posted to Facebook 4 weeks ago...

Facebook may be coming on strong, and it is a great place to network and build relationships. But to claim, "SEO as a marketing strategy for Real Estate is dying"?

I don't buy that for a second.

1:36am • #177
210,254 Points 1 Featured Post Outside Blog

Sorry, forgot one thing...

You said, "Can you get in Google local? Sure. How? Who knows.

Well, Google knows. It takes all of 30 seconds. Instructions are below. Try finding this on Facebook....

How to Get in Google Local

Check to see if you are already listed (simply search for your services using your location – e.g. “new haven real estate” and follow the results (listed first) for Local Results)).

A. If already listed, check the accuracy of your listing. If the listing is inaccurate, proceed to 2 below.

B. If not listed, go to 2 below for instructions on getting added to the Google Local results.

2. Go to https://www.google.com/local/add/login and follow the online instructions to set up a Google account (free) and submit your listing.

1:47am • #178
140,304 Points 5 Featured Posts

And here we have the magic that is Active Rain.  A learned and trusted friend takes a position - a controversial position and along comes another learned and trusted friend who debunks the whole thing!  If only I could make a living just appreciating you two... and all the other great minds we have in our community here!

9:37am • #179
1 Featured Post

The edge rank is all well and fine... til you tell it to sort by most recent, and that only goes to your friends or followers so is it as big as you say? I am a facebook junkie (well past adict stage!) and I think people are putting alot of time & effort into what maybe the biggest fad of all times. Of course only time will tell. That being said I do have a business fan page. Feel free to find me :) !

 

10:48am • #180
1 Featured Post

After paying for a web site for several years and trying out several SEO guys who promised I would have more leads than I had time for.........not !....I have shut the web site down.

I finally realized my check book isn't big enought to compete with companies who enploy a team to keep their site in the top ranking. 

I still wonder at times why in our profession we would think the bulk of our business could come from the internet/blog.  Not the way I find a doctor, dentist for example.  As hard as we try to find the magic on line solution to getting buyers and sellers, I believe you end up coming back around to realizing that friends, family and getting out there are the best source of business and the best part is you aren't hooked into a growing monthly bill and empty promises.

Yes you can get business from the internet but if you log where your business is coming from, I would bet it falls into the catagory of networking.  This the best way to grow your business.  So if you are in the office and always on the internet, take time to get on the phone and call your past clients and friends, start working the FSBO's, do the Sunday opens to meet buyers and sellers.  Your odds are better than that for converting internet leads.

12:21pm • #181
Outside Blog Hit Router

Juliet, I agree with you! What I also find interesting is that if I hadn't scrolled all the way to the bottom of the page (even though it is all one long page Jay's posts are 177 and 178, clearly farther along than most people will venture), I would have never found Jay Thompson's blog! Learned something new today and it's only 9:30. Thanks you Alez and Jay.

12:26pm • #182
306,399 Points 17 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router Called Shot Master

@Billie - I pay a small amount of money for my internet marketing - less than I used to pay for a print ad in the newspaper. 

80% of my business now comes from my AR blog which links to my website for lead conversion.

You have to learn how to blog properly to make it work - I don't have to do open houses, work FSBOs, do floor time, etc.

Buyers and sellers call or email when they are ready.

Internet marketing is networking - online.  The best way to get new business.

12:41pm • #183
6 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Jay, thanks for weighing in.  I respect your opinion a lot, and at the highest level, I agree with you - they are totally different animals and it is a bit of apples to oranges.  But I think a useful discussion.

So let me clarify, I'm by no means suggesting that Facebook optimization is going to drive you more website visitors who then turn into deals..then SEO optimization could.  Especially for someone like you who is at the top of the game for quality content and SEO.   And in your case I suspect it will be a long time before you should deviate because you have a system that works.

My point is that Facebook is going to quickly prove to be an order of magnitude more meaningful and effective marketing vehicle than SEO for the average Realtor precisely because it's not all about driving website traffic.  

In my experience of pounding the streets, the average realtor does not get meaningful business from SEO (or SEM, cpc, leadgen programs) compared to the business they get from word of mouth/referral.  Because frankly - it's competitive, resource intensive, and way outside their skillset.   And to be good at it, not only do you have to crack the SEO nut consistently to acquire the visitors, but you then have to turn those visitors into relationships and then into deals.  Compound risk.

Even for those who are good at it - it typically represents a small percent of their deals each year compared to word of mouth referral business.

Facebook is a platform (admittedly a new one) for driving more word of mouth business.  E.g. it is a platform for getting a friend of your friend to see something insightful you post and then ask your friend if they had a good experience working with you.  This is right down the power alley.

There's no question that it's still early with Facebook and clearly the tools aren't clearly defined yet.  So I recognize I'm preaching hypotheticals here a bit - but hopefully that's what makes it interesting to consider. 

Two last thoughts for why I believe agents & brokers would be well served to start paying attention to Facebook now:

a) Facebook is only going to become more important/powerful at Google's expense.  Think back to Google pre adwords/adsense.  Facebook is in a similar position in that they haven't tapped into their true ad platform/syndication power yet and it should be way bigger given that they know about you the individual rather than just trying to extrapolate from what's on the page.  This unlocks a much bigger $ opportunity

b) Yes, it's an unpopular stance on ActiveRain but I do believe SEO as we know it is dying.  That is not to say that many people won't continue to have success with it (the VHS business was hugely profitable for Wal-Mart for many years after DVD's became prevalent). It is also not to say that everyone reading this should give up on SEO.  But it is to say that it is becoming harder, not easier and more competitive, not less.

- Google's share is decreasing and I wouldn't be surprised to see actual traffic declines in next year (they are basically flat now y/o/y) which means the pie is getting smaller

- Core search results are getting displaced with Local, Maps, etc and, auto complete in the one box is severely impacting the long tail which also means the pie is getting smaller

- SEO is very very well documented and understood now.  There are wholesale companies that allow you to auto gen and publish SEO pages which means the barriers to new competition on those keywords are very low

 

12:52pm • #184
1 Featured Post

Jay: 

You said what I was thinking but as always, so much better

1:02pm • #185
6 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Billie A - thank you for that comment #181.  That is exactly the dynamic I'm talking about.  And IMO Facebook is going to be an incredibly powerful platform to help you do more of that client/friend networking.

1:16pm • #186

Ironically, though the Internet is a great place to learn things (one of the top two priorities for its creation), and share ideas (its primary use when it was still DARPANET), what rally makes my business work is that people refer me to others with sticky real estate needs. Whether I am doing a short sale, or preserving a legacy in a sale for a client, the real marketing is done from my sphere. Even people who have never bought or sold with me have referred others to me, becasue they know my work ethic, my dedicationg to completing what I start, and that will not stop until the deal is closed. 

They like my sites, and joke with me about some sometimes humorous quips on Facebook or tiwwer. What actually sels them is me. They kno we to be somone who will do the uncommon to produce positive results. People know I care about them, and that I care about meeting their needs. It is a part of who I am as a person, and not some skill set, or marketing bullet. I care deeply about clients and customers, and want the best for them. THey see it, and watch it work in action for them.

It works a lot better than SEO, and Edge whatever. I blog and network to have fun with others in my profession, or friends, family, and people who may want to get to know me. Still, i am not someone who is going to live or die by the Internet or a blog or website. 

I could care less how many hits my sites get. I care a lot more about how many helps I get to offer, and that is what makes it work for me.

 

 

Lou "That Realtor Guy in Shorts" Farris
2:54pm • #188
4 Featured Posts

I think, Alex, you're jumping a little bit too far ahead of where social media, search and real estate business is. And I doubt we'll get there any time soon when agents will be generating substantial business from online social networking. And if there is a person to ask, Jay Thompson would probably have the best answer, since he has one of the most prominent presence in SM.

First of all social media channels like Twitter and Facebook are not looked at by consumer in the same way agents look at it. From the business stand point we're trying to cater our services to the masses that  interested in discovering things shared by their friends and like-minded people they follow. Most of them will find real estate irrelevant. That's one of the reasons agents don't have masses of home buyers following them, but rather other realtors and businesses in the industry + friends and family.

Personally, I think, social media is a great channel for larger businesses and brands who can create a real following of their customers and people that care. For a single agent it's almost impossible. Yes you can create a substantial following of like-minded people, but not a mob of raving fans and former customers that will help you to generate new business. Plus a single agent would never be able to handle this kind of volume by him/herself.

Be realistic, if you outline a specific strategy to stay connected with your past clients and commit to it, then yes - you can have referral business generated that way. It doesn't matter which tools you're using - letters, cards, phone calls or Facebook. But again, I doubt you can make a leaving from the volume of this referral business - it's just a part of the bigger strategy.

Social Media became and overwhelming distraction filled with noise. And when it comes to finding the right tools for the job - we're turning to specialized channels that provide highly targeted and quality content. You could shop on Facebook, but would you? You can search for real estate on Facebook and Twitter, but do you? To find something worth your while, you'd have to filter out a lot of noise, and rather use ebay, Amazon etc.

Social media is good for distributing ideas and discovering something new - social media is an opportunity channel if it's used right, but in no way Facebook will substitute specialized tools like search engines i.e. Google.

I totally agree with Jay that comparing Google and Facebook is silly. Since you compare traffic, why not compare the time spent on Facebook and Google as well? Would that be relevant? If people spent as much time on Google searching for something they really need, as they spent on Facebook posting photos of their cats and venting, I'd be concerned, because I expect to find what I need in Google in seconds and be on my way. Social media tools are time hogs on the other hand.

You're saying "Facebook has surpassed Google in traffic and crushes them in engagement and customer relationship." What if Farmville will have more traffic than Google or Facebook? It probably has quite an engagement rate already. There is a difference between traffic and targeted traffic.

You say "Let's face it, only 5-7 players consistently win on any local keyword string. Are you one of those?" In business school they teach that only 5% of their graduates will become successful - are all realtors among of them? No one says it's easy - the "idea of easy" is what screws real estate industry in the first place. Nonetheless, there is approx. 1 Realtor per every 275 people in the US, not counting non-NAR members. Success demands diversity and ability to adjust. VHS rental/sales businesses didn't fold, CDs/DVDs and now Blue-Rays are just next generation of the same product and many of the same businesses come up with new strategies like online rentals and rentals on demand. Agents shouldn't look for an easy way - they should look for a way that works and figure out how it can work for them.

You say "For the vast majority of agents, business is done the old fashioned way through networking." I'm must be too young, since all I can remember - agents soliciting their family, friends, neighbors, cold-calling, door knocking and farming - in the old days. Today, we have a great advantage of not sifting through the masses, but delivering our messages directly to those who are in the market. Yes there is a competition and it will probably grow, since technology give more opportunities to those who can take advantage if it.

I agree that Facebook has too much of personal information from their users, which definitely can give them selling power, but again, we have to see that working for the real estate industry yet.

As far as SEO being dead... just because "SEO is very very well documented and understood now" - it doesn't mean that it doesn't apply anymore. Optimization techniques are quite simple and being implemented via plugins and directly into the systems, which makes things much simpler to maintain, but it doesn't mean it's dead. Producing quality content is what most important - giving people what they are looking for is the most important.

You say - "Long tail you tell me? How much traffic is that really sending you? And how much business is that traffic really turning into?" You're in business of referring business - volume is important to you, because that's what you sell. Agents, on the other hand, want to cut down the unnecessary volume and produce more sales. I've seen long tail brining real estate sales within weeks from site lunch. If long tail didn't pay off, search engines and e-commerce sites would never target (and especially didn't buy ads for) book names, ISBN numbers, model numbers and other detail oriented searches.

Last, but not least - how creating relationships via social networking, that later lead into business transaction can be less time consuming and result in more business than converting targeted traffic from search engines?

I think that SM is a huge misconception by many real estate agents. You guys are following and listening to companies whose targeted audience you're. They like it and it works for them because you're their buyers and you follow them... Until realtors can generate as much business as Real Estate Connect, by organizing their open houses via Facebook and Twitter - SM will be outplayed by targeted search in generating direct sales.

3:33pm • #189
210,254 Points 1 Featured Post Outside Blog

Alex -

To be blunt, I'm not overly concenred with the "average agent". We hire great, well above averge agents. Those, and our clients, are who concerns me. You, as a real estate vendor, have different concerns.

Personally, I think "owning the SERPs" is over-rated. Yeah, it's a matter of personal pride for me that I've managed to get my blog to Page 1 of Google for the search term "Phoenix Real Estate". And that does indeed drive a significant amount of traffic. But you know what? It's terms like "Power ranch homes for sale", "MLS #xxxxxxx", and "I want to sell my Phoenix home" that really make the email and phone light up.

Those search terms are not all that difficult to rank for. SEO mastery, link backs, meta-whatever tags are not needed.

I built a highly local WordPress based neighborhood site about a year ago. Within a week, I had a contact from it. It only gets about 15 unique visits a day (compared to 2000 - 3000 a day on TPREG). But it makes the phone ring. 

THAT is the power of "SEO". Find a term a few, serious, buyers and sellers search for, and build a site - or a series of posts -- around it. I think I could Facebook that term to death and get nowhere. Google on the other hand, loves it.

Traffic is nice, and there is a "numbers game" to this Internet thing. But **focused** traffic is far more important.

Facebook isn't going away, Google isn't going away, and who knows what some 20 year old kid in a dorm room is cooking up as we type. It's a never ending battle to stay on top of these things.

The interesting thing to me, is it is entirely possible to be wildly successful in real estate doing NONE of the internet/social media/blogging/next big tech thing. There are people out there who geo-farm by postal mail, door knock, and attend the Rotary Club and are insanely successful too....

There is almost an infinite number of ways to skin the real estate cat.

Max - *great* comment!!

 

 

5:42pm • #190

Thank you Alex, this is great info whether others use or not.  I am hooked on both.  You gotta love America, still the land of the free to each agree to disagree.

Thanks again until next great blog, take care.

Brenda Singletary
7:02pm • #191
2 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp

Interesting. Have not been using Facebook to any degree for business. Got a Blackberry though so I can more easily access Facebook. (One reason). Will start thinking about facebook more and take a closer look.

7:09pm • #192
6 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Makes sense Jay.  And again, for someone who has succeeded on the short tail or long tail, I get it.  You come up first for that "I want to sell my phoenix home" search so you're going to kill it.

And you're right Google certainly not going away.  

But I truly wonder if most agents out there would see any material difference in their business if they just stopped worrying about SEO entirely.  For every Jay Thompson, I suggest that there are 100 folks who "paid a guy to help me, got zero good leads, not even sure I need a website any more"...all my business comes through word of mouth.

Granted you don't concern yourself about those agents for good reasons (and ActiveRain is a more sophisticated community than that) - but that's the 90% I'm trying to talk to.

And is Facebook potentially more snake oil?  Sure, but the difference I'm trying to call out is that Facebook is a networking tool and a referral tool.  Very very different from SEO and I like the average agent's chances for success with it much more.

Great topic!  Thanks for spending cycles on it. Should be interesting to see how it evolves.

7:09pm • #193
MAY
26
2010
133,539 Points 2 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp

Ok, It is amazing that everybody is so upset about this.  SEO is not and will not be dead for a long time if ever.  Facebook is growing like mad and is the future we are going in.  15-20 years ago who knew what the internet was?  7 years ago, who cared about Google rankings?  Today, most professionals are ignoring Facebook & Twitter.  In 4 years, it will be as important, or more so then SEO.  I am spending more time on Facebook now then doing blogs.  The switch is important, but it would not make sense to drop SEO.

8:37pm • #194
MAY
27
2010
101,562 Points 2 Featured Posts

Yes, but should I be doing this on a Mac or PC?

Unix or VMS ?

emacs or vi ?

firefox or IE ?

iphone or laptop?

4:14am • #195
4 Featured Posts

Please take this man's advice and stop partaking in SEO.  You will leave less competition for the guys who know better, and we will enjoy our new found wealth in the real estate sector.

Google will be used for a long time to come.  It was the first most intelligent and still is the ultimate "magic mirror", one which you can ask any question in to and probably find an answer within seconds.   Google maps connections made between websites, creating a sort of social network similar to Facebook's social networks.  That's SEO in a nutsell. 

Facebook is a social network for people, not a search engine to find topics on web pages... two very different services to be comparing. Yet still you submit to ActiveRainers advice that they should ignore SEO?  Alex, you lost me at... "Google Local, how to register? WHO KNOWS?!?"

GOOGLE SEARCH KEYWORDS "REGISTER GOOGLE LOCAL" REVEALS THIS:

http://www.google.com/local/add

Er... I mean "ignore Google it's worthless".  Doubt you could have found ths information on Facebook.  Edgerank information is great, but telling folks here to ignore SEO is wrong in my opinion.

12:04pm • #196
Outside Blog Hit Router

Billie, #181 I agree with your accessment that we should never give up on walking and knocking, reaching out to our COI's and networking where ever we can. But, I also (at least for now) think that social media is here and its here to stay. I have found that it allows me to keep in contact with my COI in an ADDITIONAL way beyond the calls and email. I was surprised how many of them were willing to "friend" me for example. I will never give up the aforementioned ways of maintaining my customer base but will and have added social media as an addition to and not a replacement for.

2:41pm • #197
MAY
29
2010

I always wondered what the difference was between the Top News vs. Most Recent. Thanks for enlightening me!

Mary Davidson
8:02pm • #198
JUN
02
2010
1 Featured Post Outside Blog

Great Post, I think I have a grasp on it now that I have read it about 5 times.  I am putting together my plan to take advantage of it.

10:25am • #199
JUN
08
2010

Very nice...I think we all need to re-evaluate our time spent advertising on the internet and possibly shift to creating relationship instead...keep it up!

1:05pm • #200
JUL
21
2010
733,377 Points 136 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Thank you for this information... I've been doing Facebook, but don't remember ever hearing the term Edge Rank. 

9:37am • #202
MAR
18
I am with chris brunner on this. Just like SEO delivers the highest quality of website traffic and hence more cost effective conversions, Edgerank will also bring abt genuine Optimisation in Social Media Marketing and lessen the junk on FB.
Nelson fernandes
2:51pm • #203

What does the graphic say?

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