Ouch! We all get it sometimes - that "bite" and you know where!! I am just glad that you did let your feelings be heard to the agent - that is just so not right!! Something good will come of this I really believe so :)

Jennie

You said it-chalk it up to experience. It never feels good to do the work with little to no yield.  Realtors do CMA's all the time and then see someone else's sign hanging on the property they educated the seller on. It is the nature of the beast.Not a nice beast either.  Better luck on the next one!

Jeannie,

I certainly understand your frustration and agree with all of your points, save one:  Better not to burn bridges.  You probably could have made your point in a positive way and they might have come back to you when they were disappointed in the results.  It is so hard to always maintain our professionalism.  I know you are VERY professional.  This isn't a criticism--only an observation.

Live and learn!

Kim Dillon, Creative Eye Home Staging

Hi Jennie,

After experiencing what you did, and TOO MANY times, I am now charging for my proposals.  I always begin by explaining to the client what is involved in using rental furniture and the average cost according to the size and style of the house.  If, after knowing potential cost, the client is still willing to have me come out to see the house and work up a proposal, then I charge $250 for that service.  I explain that, should the client decide to go ahead with the staging, the fee will be deducted from the overall cost.  This way, if I don't get the job, I have at least been compensated for the time, effort and gas that was used.  My clients seem to understand this - and that includes realtors.

What you experienced with the job going to an 'inside' agent, is what, I fear, is going to become more the 'norm' due to the state of the real estate market today.  I am learning that more and more realtors are taking staging courses in order to 'stand apart' from their competition.  It is my belief that most, if not all, are including home staging as part of their 'service' and are not charging for it (other than the cost for rental furniture). Then, factor in that many of our furniture rental companies are also offering the service 'gratis' and it becomes obvious that we have a HUGE problem on our hands!

Now, I have a question for you, Jennie....who, besides Rent A Center (I wouldn't use their worn-out stuff in a million years!), is willing to give 30 day rentals?

VAL

Hi Jennie,

Been there...done that!  I had a similar experience (for details read AR Soap Opera) that was hard to swallow but allowed me to reevaluate the way I do bidding. 

It never gets easy to lose bids, especially when the bids aren't "apples to apples" staging.  Hopefully this will change as we educate more and more clients how they can better understand staging quotes and what to look for besides, but including, price! 

Glad your proposal template turned out well!  Maybe you can blog about it!

Hi Jennie,

I personally don't think much can be done about it until "Staging" is somehow regulated. You have, I think Craig found 26 different staging courses, in which some send the "certification or Accreditation with the video you watch to become a Stager.

My personal back ground was working for my families and friends Real Estate and Mortgage companies who had me and my partner go to their houses and get them in showing condition "Stage them" as it is known as now, for 3 years prior to us thinking we could start a business of our own.  Im sure other Real Estate companies knowing the importance of staging a house before you show it, and are hiring people on their payroll just to stage their listings and paying them by the hour, instead of hiring a professional Stager who has over head, and will need to charge more to pay the bills and make a profit. I will be the first one to tell you when we first started out over 3 years ago trying to stage the houses we were given, we made tons of mistakes, the first few houses I think it cost our family twice as much as it would if they had called in a professionally trained stager at the time. And if it wasn't for the family thing, we should have been fired, costing them all that money. But as I said the family gave us a chance because of the family, Most people don't have that advantage and if they do hire someone with little to no training, the company or person who hired you will just have to hope you don't cost them as much money as we did, not knowing all the things we know now. And why would you chance it in a market this bad, go with a trusted name stager that has testimonies and a portfolio to back it up. You will be getting a person who has made the dumb mistakes in the past and learned how to do it properly, it will cost you less in the end for a far superior product!

But as I read on AR how do you regulate someones opinion or eye for style (Staging) you can't really? I know Craig and Kate are putting together a statistics sheet showing the importance of Staging I haven't read through it completely yet, but I know it will show the importance of staging and who are top producers, But once again I think you have people out there no matter the statistics that will still go with cheapest price.

The old saying, you get what you pay for is the only answer to those people, and you just move on.

Jennie we proudly show our support to ASP by having it in our signatures, We do quality work for a reasonable price, and hire ASP members along with other quilty stagers every chance we get( we are working with 2 of them right now in Naperville). But what I think is it comes down to the power of the buck.  Some people don't care how many letters you have behind your name or what certifications you carry, Just give me a cheap price and you will get the job. no matter who you are affiliated with.  That is why you, me, and other stagers who offer Bids can get taken advantage of. SO now before we go to a bid house, we ask a series of questions to see if it is someone trying to get a free quote to compare it with their quote and under cut us. Or if they are serious clients who someone recommended us to them or they seen our website with testimonies from top Realtors, and Happy clients we work with everyday (our pics are a bit out dated, one is from the ASP class house sandy worked on, do to our first web designer we hired, but it should be fixed soon, we wrote about what happened in one of Jacksons post).

Anyway Im sorry for such a long comment, this is something that you see has obviously been bugging me, as well as many stagers I'm sure. I Posted one time on how we to got screwed by going out to a bid, and I remember one lady telling me STOP WORKING FOR FREE, I was a bit confused why she would say that, I was only doing what was taught to us about offering free bids. She said the moment you put the key in the ignition you are working.

I did get what she was saying after I thought about it that night! So that is why we are coming up with a new way to bid our jobs, we have a small business analyst looking at how we can streamline our productivity. (family friend)

Jennie, Im sure if you did the job, not only would it have looked and flowed better, but probably be under contract already.

Best Wishes,

Regards

Brian Bloom

Jennie, thats why they pay me for the consultation, before I walk out the door!  I've had my share of burns from realtors and homeowners.  I've also gotten the "we decided to take a different route" excuse.  And it always leaves me wondering, why did they even call me in the first place if they were not 100% on board with staging?  Well ya learned another lesson didn't ya?  And its always the hard way.

Thanks for sharing this story, Jennie.  It will help other stagers think about asking more questions during the bidding process, and what to charge for a consultation fee. Sorry you had this experience.

Kathy

Jennie, thank you for letting me and others know we are not alone. I have begun to charge for the consultation; no more look-sees. I will discount the price if they hire me, but with the price of gas these days, and wasted time a stager's gotta do what a stager's gotta do!

Thanks for your comments . . . and we do not charge for bids - but we do charge for consultation where we provide details in a report.  I agree that setting a fee to preview and prepare a proposal is a good idea and then crediting it back to them when they hire us . . . good idea.  To me the idea of being used - when the Realtor clearly had intention of using an outside Stager is frustrating.  Asking qualifying questions up front and finding out if they have worked with others, etc. is key.  This Realtor told us that she wanted to use a regional stager from our area because the ones in "her area" did not have good inventory . . . sure.  The Realtor/Stager may have talent, but it's misleading and I don't like being used - as any of you would not either.

So asking a lot of questions up front to qualify them - and adding the fee when it is "suspect" - would definitely reveal whether they are serious or not.

Thanks!

Jennie

Jennie, I appreciate you taking the time to post this.

Very frustrating. However, I have to comment on your "take-charge" attitude and getting down to the matter. I would have probably let it go. If I do not have success on a bid, I don't usually investigate. However, I think I may start!

Julia

Jennie, I feel for you.  No one likes to be taken advantage of in such an underhanded way.  But as you say, on the positive side, you do have a killer proposal to use on future bids.  I've noticed in our area lately that realtors are putting furniture into vacants with no accessories.  This saves them money but it certainly doesn't get the 'feel' of the home that stagers strive for.  Best of luck on your next bid.  After reading the comments here and on other posts, I am thinking of charging a consult fee too that can be deducted from the staging price is they go with us.  It makes a lot of sense to me.  Thanks for the post.  Betty

Whenever we don't win a bid - and sometimes we bat 1000 and other times we lose - usually when it is a client that is "shopping" - and low-ball leader wins. . . I do ask questions to find out the WHY of the decision.  It's good to know who else is out there - and if they are within range of our pricing, we can adjust things so that next time we win. 

Sometimes it is helpful to know for "next time" - as we need to keep a finger on the pulse of our market, trends, pricing, etc.  We want to be competitive and would rather have work than not, but there is a point where we will walk away from a job.  In this case, I felt something was not right - and confirmed my suspicions versus feeling like we had not bid it correctly.  Our pricing was right on - and a good deal for the term quoted - so it was not really price, it was that we had no real chance from the start.

And under what I consider "normal" circumstances I do not "burn a bridge" and  leave the door open for future business opportunities.  But I know with 100% certainty, we are not ever going to work with that Realtor, and rather than let them use me or someone else, I wanted her to know - in a professional way - that I did not appreciate the exercise in futility, and would not put myself in that position again.

- Jennie

Very interesting topic. I am a new ASP. Have a solid business and accounting backgroud.

When writing my plan....had already decided that I will charge for assesment visits. Deduct that fee from the service, Bid or Consult, if the client so decides to proceed. If  dismissed..at the very least I am compenstated for the work I completed.

Noted a comment above regarding collecting full payment for the consults before leaving. Can you tell me how this works if you will not be delivering the written report on the spot? Or are you? My thought was to take it back to the office for processing.

It obvious that we can get used if not cautious! I am in the Chicago area. Looking to newtwork with other ASP's. Also available to assit with Staging projects. Hoping to gain knowledge from seasoned ASP's!

This group is a godsend! Wealth of information. 

Post above was from Gina Metzger email: gina@homestagingil.com

Hi Gina,

Some ASPs write the report at the client's house and leave the "product" when they are done - and collect their fees BEFORE giving the product.  If a Stager goes back to deliver the product after completing the report at home, they still need to collect payment BEFORE delivering the report.  I have always written the report by hand and in triplicate - so the client can begin working on it right away.  IF you plan on typing it up at work, be mindful of your time and do not linger at the house on the initial appt as most of your time will be taken with typing up the recommendations.  Then going over it IN PERSON with the client has to happen so you can review the reasons behind your suggestions, and make sure they on on board.

Remember - a bid proposal is DIFFERENT than a written consultation report - and one we always get paid for (when we share our ideas) and the other is a pricing proposal that lets the client know how much it is to hire me (or you) to do the work.  Normally we do not charge for a bid proposal, but this blog post was an illustration about when it might be good to charge so that we do not end up in a futile exercise.

- Jennie

Hi Jennie,

Thank you very much for the insightful information! Will consider your recommendations. Did you have a custom form for the consutls?

Best regards,

Gina Metzger

gina@homestagingil.com

Terrible this happened to you or anyone.

It gets me thinking though, following a conversation I had on the phone today about stagers then reading of your experience being duped....

Being an ASP...I do take zero offense to your post Dane. People will be people.  Actions beyond our control!

I do reference my designation when speaking to potential clients. Right or wrong....there are other avenues in which one can become educated in the industry.  We should all support each other. I for one.....not interested in the cut throat approach! Plenty of work to spread around!

Gina Metzger, ASP, IAHSP

Thanks Gina, it really was not written with any intent to offend only to pass on the experience of a consumer.

We should all support each other and knowing people will be people...hold a hand out to consumers who get burned.

I'd actually be interested in taking some of these courses. Ongoing education can only be a good thing. It doens't matter how old one is or how long they've been doing their job, there is always something to be learned if one listens.

Hi Dane, I read the blog you linked in your blog above and it did flog the ASPs and CSPs and I don't really get the whole angry client thing.  She was upset because they had training? No one misrepresented unless you believe that training of any kind means squat and therefore are, using your words, superior to those that have gotten training.  Having never gone to a class, you would not know what is taught.  From my perspective, we are not teaching people to "Be" stagers - we teach them how to be "successful" stagers, and with real code of ethics and accountability behind the initials.  With a long history behind the training as well, training counts for something - but of course it depends on who you talk to.

You may not have been aware of that but before barking up that tree, think about what others have shared on your other blog.  For THIS blog post focused on dealing wiith not being taken advantage of by a Realtor, I did not find any relevance between this and your post.  I am not unethical, nor do I misinform people - and just because this Realtor did not tell me the up-and-up, does not mean ALL realtors are bad people and we should throw out the training they receive.  It's too broad stroke, as someone else wrote, although I see your point in this very limiited example of a client that was upset.  Believe, the shoe has been on the other foot many times in my Staging career when I pick up the pieces from someone that did not know how to properly handle a client - due to lack of training.

- Jennie

Hi Dane, I read the blog you linked in your blog above and it did flog the ASPs and CSPs and I don't really get the whole angry client thing.  She was upset because they had training? No one misrepresented unless you believe that training of any kind means squat and therefore are, using your words, superior to those that have gotten training.  Having never gone to a class, you would not know what is taught.  From my perspective, we are not teaching people to "Be" stagers - we teach them how to be "successful" stagers, and with real code of ethics and accountability behind the initials.  With a long history behind the training as well, training counts for something - but of course it depends on who you talk to.

You may not have been aware of that but before barking up that tree, think about what others have shared on your other blog.  For THIS blog post focused on dealing wiith not being taken advantage of by a Realtor, I did not find any relevance between this and your post.  I am not unethical, nor do I misinform people - and just because this Realtor did not tell me the up-and-up, does not mean ALL realtors are bad people and we should throw out the training they receive.  It's too broad stroke, as someone else wrote, although I see your point in this very limiited example of a client that was upset.  Believe, the shoe has been on the other foot many times in my Staging career when I pick up the pieces from someone that did not know how to properly handle a client - due to lack of training.

- Jennie