Home : Blogs : Long Beach Ca Real Estate, Laurie Manny : Long Beach CA Real Estate Blog

Here we go again! DOM - CDOM - LEASED & ACTIVE? What the heck?!?!?!!!!!

It was tiresome enough dealing with agents who would place their unsold Long Beach properties as sold in the MLS in order to re-list them to appear as new listings. The sold status would be picked up by other agents as comps when pricing property for both listings and buyers comparables, wreaking havoc all over the place. Unreliable results - from the MLS, which is supposed to be a reliable source of information. Information placed by licensed Realtors with standards! Information that would not be missed by an appraiser! Information that could totally screw up a deal!

What fun it was to find that the comps you used to price a long beach property weren't really comps at all! It got so bad for a while I was checking title records for each comp to make certain they actually sold. I don't even want to go into how much of my time these idiots wasted. Our MLS sends an occasional minor violation to agents in the system but somehow never gets any of the major items corrected, no matter how many times they are pointed out, it is beyond annoying.

Today brought a whole new twist to this age old game.

While researching a few Long Beach homes for sale for one of my buyers I discovered that one of the listings had also been for lease on the MLS; for $1.00. Yep, I said one dollar. And, it showed that it had been leased, yet was still active on the MLS for sale. Ok, I had a few questions so I called the listing agent before I called to set up the appointment to show it to my buyer.

The listing agent assured me that it had not actually been leased and went on to explain to me that he didn't want to be responsible for screwing up another agents comps by placing it in sold so that he could make the listing appear to be new (how considerate). He went on to explain that he brainstormed this brilliant idea himself. By placing the listing as a lease, then indicating it as leased, he was able to re-list the property without the combined days on market (CDOM) showing. I am sitting listening to this on the phone and looking into the phone like I am speaking to an alien at this point.

WHAT THE HECK!!!!!!!!

Here I am representing the very buyer he was trying to hoodwink and he is telling me what he did. So what was the point? I figure that he only told me because I found the lease listing and was asking if the home had indeed been rented out. My buyer would not be interested in purchasing a home with a tenant in it, few buyers would. What the heck ever happened to just doing things the right way? Who does this clown think he is fooling?

Off my buyer and I go to see the home. Cute place, client liked it, so I started poking around. We found a new combo lock hidden on the side of the house, fairly obvious it belonged to the bank; the listing agent didn't disclose this little tidbit on the MLS either, or on the phone.

Cracks going in different directions on the ceilings in every single room. An apparent attempt at covering up the cracks in the kitchen/laundry room ceilings. The cracks sent me outside to do a perimeter check of the foundation and roof. Not a pretty site. A cinder-block foundation with cracks everywhere. Steps broken away from the building with major cracks, chimney with major cracks. Huge paint bubbles all around the exterior of the home, many freshly picked, large fresh paint chips all around the exterior of the home.

A room attached to the detached garage with a partially constructed kitchen and a bath that had been disassembled. Fairly obvious that it was not permitted and was being torn out. Probably the reason for the "as is" statement on the MLS.

Disclose! Disclose! Disclose!

And of course this cute little money pit was priced at full market value, has been on the market for about 6 months total with one minor price reduction and needed some very pricey repairs.

I really resent the bad rep Realtors are subject to, but understand that this is just the type of behavior that creates it.

So, would you report him?

Laurie Manny Long Beach Realtor (562) 212-5420
Main Street Realtors Belmont Heights 244 Redondo Avenue Long Beach California 90803
Long Beach Real Estate Blog Long Beach Real Estate Website

Posted by Long Beach Ca Real Estate, Laurie Manny on 01/08/2008 01:20 PM

Comments (64)

long beach, real estate, homes, properties, realtor, california

Originally posted at: Long Beach CA Real Estate: Here we go again! DOM - CDOM - LEASED & ACTIVE? What the heck?!?!?!!!!!

This post has been included in California Information Los Angeles County, CA Information Long Beach, CA Information

64 Comments on Here we go again! DOM - CDOM - LEASED & ACTIVE? What the heck?!?!?!!!!!

JAN

2008

Absolutely report him. Our MRIS has huge fines in place and is looking for violations. If we as a dues paying members of our MLS systems don't report the abuse then it won't stop. We can't complain if we are part of the problem by not reporting it. We have a button on our system that says "feedback" which gives us the chance to include all the information they need to research the problem.

Laurie, I would sure report him. Our MLS has significant fines for these types of violations. It's hard enough to do our jobs and we don't need someone purposefully wrecking our reputation.

Laurie, we report and it does no good. Just a phone call... no fines. I don't even want to start on mls violations, they happen all the time. In our MLS we are not to have a for sale sign on the property, it was started because smaller companies knew everyone could recognize the national signs. Ok, so Mr. big shot listing agent with no name company has his sign in every photo.

I report... nothing. Many times I report his violation.

So I tell the board, which I am a director on, that I'm just going to put my signs in every photo because there is no enforcement.

The DOM is awful too, list, withdraw, re-list. You have to search the history to see what really has gone on.

You are correct the mls is for realtors and if we don't tell the truth to each other it is a mess.

Oh yea, go ahead and report, but do I dare say nothing will happen?

There, I said it.

This type of stuff (although this one is really clever, must admit) happens here ALL the time. I wouldn't report because I have reported till I was blue in the face and it is a waste of time. Especially with the agents who hold a ton of listings, they usually belong to some board committee.

Your perogative actually though :)

I would report him...We need to help ourselves with the unfair reputation we have gotten and we can't as long as we have unethical agents doing things like this. I, stupidly, expect others agents to do the right thing. Unless there are consequences, I think that certain people will try to get away with whatever they can--in any industry.

Yes you are right. We needaccurate reporting and stats. The Mls is a great plave to get them if it is not being mis-used

Sure report him. It's the least that can be done. Probably the most that will be done too. I'm very cynical about MLS abuses. I've reported so many that changed nothing, I pretty much gave up.

Laurie -- great post and a very timely topic. Especially when people are pulling together yearly statstical reports.

Laurie, This person needs to be reported at the least. We have no time for MLS abuses. It's just a simple waste of everyone's time. I guess that the listing agent feels differently about that. Our CDOM does not set unless you take the home off of the market for 60 days or if I'm not mistaken, it is relisted by a different agent and broker, but not really sure on that last point.

What good is the information if it is not accurate and what good is an agent they are not accurate we need to get rid of both. Thanks for the post.

Hey Laurie, I just wrote about a similar topic the other day. I'm getting so tired of agents not properly using the MLS and absolutely I would report him. Not only is it screwing up comps, but peoples future and mortgages. That is so insane.

As far as not advertising the home as a foreclosure...there is an agent in my office with a foreclosure listed and the bank will not allow her to advertise it as a foreclosure????? That just seems wrong to me. Don't they realize we have standards and guidelines to follow? I personally would not have taken the listing under those terms.

Good luck with the crazy guy.

Laurie - I am surprised to here you are able to manipulate your MLS listing so easily out in CA. MLS in Mass was changed a few years ago to prevent this type of manipulation. I think I would report him if he did not change his deception.

In a heart beat. I then would begin looking at what must be done to revise your MLS rules and administration. Perhaps it can be done by building a coalition of other like minded individuals. Our MLS has very distinct rules and Monetary punishments for offenders. There is also an avenue for reporting offenders and a fairly agressive group that enforces the rules. Still could be better but works fairly well.

Hi Laurie,

OMG! That is really sad and we must live in a cave because we do things so ethically and yet still there are those who get away with alot. We would definitely report this person but like others have said and as we have seen, it probably won't do enough good to count for anything. That's the really sad part. Thanks for sharing your experience.

Laurie, yes, turn the dude in. We have a problem with agents withdrawing listings before they expire, not a violation. I have never seen the scenario you encountered. That's ridiculous!

Laurie -- I would report him and I would place a call to him broker. It is amazing the levels people will stoop to. . .agents are beginning to make used car salesmen look good.

YES, YES, YES, Report him. If we don't Clean up our act, who will? I am just tired of a lot of the nonsense that goes on behind the guise of "card carrying" members of the real estate community.

Report Him and every other one you can find! If we don't stand up and make alot of noise nothing will ever change. I am sick of agents misrepresenting properties which leads to problems for other agents and for the appraisers.

I agree with the others about reporting him. On another note, although I track DOM, I really don't put much emphasis on it as a reliable indicator. There are so many potentially unknown factors that can influence it that it really becomes an ambiguous number.

Not my area of expertise by a long shot, but I am curious as to the opinions on this. Consider me parked....

Report him...absolutly!!! In NH our MLS is pretty strict and they love to fine agents and don't hesitate to do so. I can't believe that agents can get away with that type of stuff in your area! Yuck!

Yup...what's another phone call? At least you know you did your part. The nerve that some think they are just soooo sneaky and that telling the truth about the sneakiness is better? YUK.

I would report him. I have not noticed this happening around here. I don't see how it cannot be a rules violation. We need to police our own and at the very least, this guy has elastic ethics.

Does your area MLS have the ability to cancel listings? If you leave a home off the market for a short while it will come up as New. The DOM are cumulative and can't be changed no matter what.

It sounds like a nightmare to comp listings with people playing such games. This sounds more like a trip to the MLS board members than a phone call to the help line.

Absolutely report! This is the type of action that makes the rest of us look bad. Unbelievable! Doesn't that goe against the code of ethics- honesty, fairness, etc. etc. I think so!

Laurie,

I have never reported anyone.

But.... I could be persuaded to start.

I am starting to believe that we allow too much and might do better to police ourselves to protect ourselves.

How the heck can you put in a house as sold when it is not? We have had many an agent withdraw a listing and put it back in as new or when it expires put it back in, but I have NEVER heard of anywone putting a property as sold. Talk about messing up the comps. Wow

Wow, touchy subject huh?

It is out of character for me to report agents, I usually steer clear, maybe its just a karma thing. We now have a button on each MLS listing to make it really easy to report. However, this taking a listing out by reporting it as sold is a hot button of mine. Having been screwed by somebody having done that leaves a really bad taste.

Realizing that another agent has found a new and creative way to achieve the same results just makes me sad.

Like John Novak, I generally don't worry about the DOM/CDOM when I am showing property, the only time I consider it is when a client wants to make an offer. I will weigh time on market heavily when considering what the offering price will be.

Because of this and the games some agents play I always do deeper research into the listings and the comps.

While I understand the agent is trying to represent the seller in the best possible way and get them the best possible price, when representing the buyer, agents need to be aware of the unreliability of some of the comps. They need to understand that there is more to pulling comps than just pulling the comps.

I probably will report this agent. Quite frankly I first wanted to make certain that my buyer was not interested in the property. If he was, I wouldn't report the agent until the deal closed. Why create a bad situation?

I would report him Laurie. Even if it's a small hit, it is a hit. That is a completely ridiculous way to do business. Sounds like you've decided to do just that. On each listing in our MLS, there's a little button that says "Report a Violation". It's anonymous, which is good. It encourages those that notice a violation to click and report.

I would absolutely report him. I'm so irritated by the folks here to change the tax information so that they can manipulate the DOM and have it come up as a new listing. We have to wait 180 days in between listings unless of course you wipe out the tax info and then Voila a new listing.

Hi Laurie - you know, if agents like that guy would just play fairly, they could take all the time they spend tyring to find ways to beat the rules doing better marketing for their clients. Jeez, what a novel idea, huh?

I say report him! If he's doing this, you wonder what else he's doing that's not fair or ethical. Our MLS has signficant fines in place, so they pack a punch when we get fined for something.

Ann

Laurie - Please report him. Filing a grievance is the best way we can clean up our industry. The forms are online.

I just did my Professional Standards update class at my local Board...According to the class, you just mentioned any number of Code violations by that other agent. Is he a REALTOR???

Creative is great- but don't do Dodgy! LOL People just don't think sometimes.

Laurie, amazing the difference in what some MLS's seem to allow and others don't. Thank heavens this does not gone up here. I feel for ya.

And in answer to your question...YOU'RE DARN RIGHT I'D REPORT THIS AND DEMAND THAT THE MLS CLEAN UP THIS MESS AND CALL FOR APPROPRIATE ACTION.

Wow, I'm glad we don't really have that problem here with agents listing sold properties that haven't really sold. My MLS really comes down on those with inaccurate data and levy's some pretty incredible fines too!

I can't believe he told you what he did. That is crazy. I don't know, I think it might be best to say something to someone about this. I didn't know about listing it as sold just to make a new listing. That's so wrong!

great post! thanks!

As we often find ourselves saying in my office "unbelievable"!!!! That's the worst I've heard.

great post!!

Scandalous agent....damn right I'd report him.

On another note, so nice to see a friendly face. I see you haven't lost your passion for writing informative and incredibly useful posts. Congratulations on the star ! Looking fwd. to doing a little catch up in the rain : )

Laurie- Didn't know you could play those types of games with SoCalMls.... Hmmmm. Definitely report the bum.. I'm so tired of these guys. While I don't think DOM is a big deal consumers do so bearing that in mind we need to be as honest as possible in what we put out to the consumer..

I would report this, In my neck of the woods, we have what We call the MLS police. It's a tab on top of the MLS site, If I do not have a photo with in 7 days(rarely ever happens)- I get a non compliance email and threat of a $25.00 dollar fine.

Sounds like a real winner. I hope you reported that agent to the local Realtor Association. I assume there are fines for lying and/or improperly categorizing a listing?

Some people call it creative marketing, I call it deception. Not to mention it makes our job a lot more difficult by having to track the history of every single property. I say report it. We just recently had the CDOM rule go into effect, and while I will admit to "re-listing", I'm rather happy that it shows the truth!

JAN

2008

Wow. That's so wrong on so many levels it's hard to know where to start!

Question for Marlene Bridges:

I believe you mentioned that you are either on or the committee chair of the ethics committee for one of the local boards here in Southern California. Have any cases similar to this come in? How have they been dealt with? No details necessary, don't want to compromise any confidentiality just curious if anything substantial is done as a result of the complaints to the board.

Do you only get ethics violations that involve 2 parties or do repeat MLS offenders get to make an appearance in front of the committee as well?

Anything you CAN say would be appreciated.

Thanks.

Kelli Fronabarger, so nice to see you playing in the rain once again. Is all well?

Everybody, sorry I have not addressed each of your responses individually. I slept 4 hours last night and have been triple fisting phones and clients all day. it is about 11 PM, I just got home and am quite tired. I get that most of you think it is a good idea to report him. I also get that most of us would like to cleanse the industry of the many like him and I agree, that would be lovely.

I have a question for you all.

When it is well known and well liked agents that do this sort of thing, you know the ones I am talking about - the ones everybody swears are great and ethical - and you run the risk of pissing them off to the point that they can put the word out to not show any of your listings; would you really still report them?

Do many of you find that the agents in your areas have a little mafia thing going on? Are you part of the in crowd in your real estate community?

Does the high school stuff ever actually stop?

YES, use that little "report a violation" button and report him!

Is this how we say it Laurie, in a heartbeat? Clowns like that hurt all of us,and they should be doing anything else than practicing a profession. There is a word for what this excuse for an agent is doing, think is called fraud.

cheers

Laurie - how quickly can you hit those buttons on your phone? What an idiot!! This sort of story makes it clear how the public can get such a negative impression of folks in our industry.

Jeff

Yep! I agree with Herb in Portland. I have reported violations and they have gotten dealt with very quickly. Maybe your MLS needs a new board who is willing to enforce the rules...

Laurie - I was blessed with six hours of sleep but fell asleep thinking about this.

First of all, he's not stupid. You have to give him a little credit. Plus I got to thinking about violations of MLS rules in my own market and I hate to say this, but a few managing brokers are the worst offenders.

Is it at all possible he just had bad training?

I serve on the Education committee for my board, and through AR I've been making a list of little tidbits, no-no's and standard practices from other areas we should consider. This will certainly be added to the list.

Laurie, there are bad apples in all areas of this industry. I wonder if they realize that this equally hurts them when they in turn have to rely on date that someone else has also manipulated.

These people need to lose their license when they are caught, and if others see this, maybe just maybe they would consider the risks a little more, before doing them.

Yes.

Something I find irritating in our neck of the woods is that when a property sells our MLS shows what percentage of the selling price was to the list price. Unfortunately, they use the final listing price, rather than the original listing price. Some agents will, at the very last minute, change the final listing price to a number that is lower than the selling price so they can show potential sellers that their listings sell for more than listed.

What about the truth?

I have reported several listings in our MLS in the past that were fouling our statistics. If the MLS is not policed our data can not be trusted.

Sigh. Dishonesty, deception, opacity. These are the tools of the disreputable realtor. The realtor who besmirches the reputations of all other realtors.

Should you report it?

YES.

But good luck getting anyone to care. The officials who claim to care about this will feign interest, but the punishment will be nothing more than a phone call, a letter or, worst case, a 2-figure fine, no more than the cost of a single business lunch.

Robert,

And therein lies the problem!

JAN

2008

Our MLS is really good about going after people for this type of thing and the fine is $100. So I would report him, if I were you. The sad part is that it really does mess up the comps, and we depend on them so much, especially in a down market where they are fewer and farther between. In any profession there are always "bad apples", the ones who give us a black eye, and if the regulatory bodies that are supposed to police this sort of thing don't really care, then there is not much that can be done. Sad but true.

Hi Laurie,

I have never actually heard of that here, but I'm sure it happens. Agents used to manipulate the days by withdrawing the listing and putting it back on without the tax record. The mls wouldn't connect it with the previous listing, so the dom would start over. They did crack down on that, however. Any one caught doing it now gets a penalty. Some are still doing it, but it is not happening a frequently. Something must be working.

Sheri

Laurie: Crazy story and I am anxious to hear your decision. You should report him, in my opinion, but I don't know that it will do any good.

Laurie, I'm a bit late on this one but I would report him. These two examples simply astound me! I haven't run across this type of thing here plus we have an archive search so I can see exactly what has happened to every listing. Yikes!

JAN

2008

Heck yes. Report the moron! In fact, send me the MLS agent view and I'll report him too! An agent up the street from me put the square footage on a home as 1433 when in fact, according to the builder who I spoke to in person says it is only 1240. That makes the closed price per square foot according to the MLS as $768 when in fact it was $887. That's a difference of $119 per square foot. Talk about screwing the next seller!

She happens to be one of my competitors and you can bet that every listing appointment that I go on will see it!

Laurie- I cannot imagine anyone manipulating our MLS system the way you describe - or am I unaware? What you describe boggle the mind. Our MLS systemactually imposes fines for violations. Perhaps your system needs to get tough. And what about ethics?

FEB

2008

Laurie - there is no question in my mind to report this agent! This kind of deceit is not good for the market, compatibles and time invested with working with your clients. What a inconsiderate thing for him to do, I would be surprised to see this young thing in business much longer if he keeps up these kind of tactics...sheeesh it's bad enough when those try to fool the MLS and DOM/CDOM... you will always get caught... oh brother!

Leave a response…

Name:

Email:
(optional)

Comment:

What does the graphic say?