Ar_home_b_search
 

Short Sales in Maryland and Northern Virginia are not the "bargain basement" buys that many home buyers and even investors expect.  

Short Sales, Foreclosures, Bank Owned homes, REO, all the new Buzz Words for consumers.  But, do the public really understand how they work and how to capitalize in this market?   So far, in Maryland and Virginia, the public is expecting a lot more than the banks are ready to deliver. 

                                       *  *  *  *  DANGER!  HARD CORE REAL ESTATE TALK  * * * *

A LITTLE BIT OF KNOWLEDGE CAN BE DANGEROUS to THE CONSUMER'S FINANCIAL HEALTH. 

EXAMPLE #1:

Today, about an hour ago, I received a telephone call from a consumer interested in buying a "short sale".  The home they inquired about is listed in Montgomery County MD in the high $200s range.  The comments in the listing report state that the house is a "short sale" and subject to "third party approval". 

I inquired about the prospective buyer's financing.  I like to ask about financing because, if the buyer has, in fact, made a loan application, they have usually at least had a credit review.  It appears that these buyers are awaiting a loan approval letter for $200,000.  This consumer apparently believes that "short sales" are selling for about 70% of list price

I'm not sure that this consumer understands the meaning of "third party approval" and that the bank will have to approve the sale price, terms and conditions.  The agent to whom I referred the buyers will handle their misconceptions with skill or he won't waste his valuable time with them. 

WHAT ARE SHORT SALES SELLING FOR?  My telephone survey this past week of listing and selling agents in my network is showing that short sales are being negotiated and approved for about 94% of list and that is net, after seller subsidy. 

FROM OUR MLS THIS A.M.

County City ListPrice Subsidy ClosePrice
FAIRFAX Falls Church $390,000 $ $370,000
FAIRFAX Herndon $699,900 $ $680,000
FAIRFAX Fairfax $898,500 $16,800 $850,000
LOUDOUN Lovettsville $325,000 $ $300,000
MONTGOMERY Silver Spring $309,999 $14,500 $309,000
MONTGOMERY Silver Spring $337,700 $10,000 $337,700
PRINCE WILLIAM Bristow $384,900 $5,125 $370,000
STAFFORD Stafford $290,000 $ $294,350

The listings above show a list/sold/subsidy average of 95.63% net to the seller.  That's what I'm hearing from agents queried and that's what the data are showing.

The sales above represent all closings for listings identified in the listing as a "short sale".  I'm sure that this listing information does not represent all short sale listings closed January 1, 2008 to date.  However, we can only deal with the information available.  These sold listing reports don't include listings that were not identified as "short sales" but could have been closed as a "short sale".  Nor does it include REO listings or foreclosure listings for bank owned properties. 

Buyers, Sellers, Buyers Agents and Listing Agents are better served if they have a realistic picture of the short sale market.  

EXAMPLE #2:  

I just listened to a telephone message from a consumer advising me that she "investigated" one of the homes advertised on my web site and the property had "a lien".  She thought I should know about that and spread the word.  She had a very smug tone of voice.  Like she had discovered the secret to permanent appetite control or something as important. 

A LITTLE BIT OF KNOWLEDGE CAN BE DANGEROUS IN THE HANDS OF THE CONSUMER.  My experience with the buyer's call last Thursday is EXAMPLE #3 (MEMBERS ONLY). 

 

Courtesy, Lenn Harley, Broker, Homefinders.com, 800-711-7988.

search listings      Lenn's BlogE-Mail Homefinders.comSend Us Your Needs
Map of area showing homes for
sale in Maryland and Virginia
covered by the Homefinders.com
search service.
Click image to search listings 


_______________________________________________________________________________________________________


Want to learn more about Loudoun County, VA? Join Loudoun County, VA on Facebook!

 

42 Comments on SHORT SALES in Maryland and Virginia. FORECLOSURES, BANK OWNED, REO?? WHAT ARE THE BUZZ WORDS? TRANSPARENCY? CONSUMER'S RIGHT TO KNOW? NONSENSE!

FEB
09
2008
Unfortunately many buyers don't understand everything they are hearing. The worst part is when you try to tell them they are wrong and they don't believe you. They think you are just trying to get a higher sales price to get a better commission.
1:34pm • #1
880,148 Points 210 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Called Shot Master

Quote: Like she had discovered the secret to permanent appetite control or something as important.

 

Funny, how they have those "types" over here too. The know it alls and the "I'm gonna catch you" and hey...better watch the spelling around that lady too. lol!

We don't have a hoard of short sales here (I've never done one) and the ones I do see.....well, the agent must not know too much because they list them at market or MORE!  I'm learning so much here about short sales that if I do happen to get one.... I'll have better info. Thanks Lenn! 

1:36pm • #2
394,997 Points Outside Blog
Out here Realtors have been pricing shorts too low at prices which will never get approval.
1:42pm • #3
136,653 Points 7 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor

It truly is amazing what the general "man/woman on the street" knows about real estate and the real estate market. Of course, professionals who do this all the time are certainly not up on things.

Part of this is fueled, I believe, by the so-called consumer advocates or champions out in the world who are constantly telling consumers that the professional (doctor, lawyer, real estate professional) is really incompetent or dishonest.  Don't believe anything and by all means beat down those fees.

There was the Ken Harney column in the Washington Post real estate section today talking about "junk fees".  While I'm certain there are fees that could be shaved, I am also certain that it isn't free to make sure real estate is transferred from a seller to a buyer in a way that keeps everybody happy (i.e., legal).

It is really starting to get to me that we should be providing our services for either free or dirt cheap.  Short sales are a great example.  Those things are complicated and time consuming. If a consumer really wants to be taken to the cleaners, go ahead and do it yourself!

Time for my chill pill! 

1:46pm • #4
543,237 Points 39 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Lenn,

A little learning is a dangerous thing for consumers...but what is worse is a real estate agent with a little learning...then you have the blind leading the blind!!! Thanks,   Fran

1:47pm • #5
188,613 Points 23 Featured Posts

Lenn - I just had a conversation with a young lady that really did not understand the term "short sale". I think that part of the problem comes from the sound bite information that is shared. We understand what is happening. We understand the nature of short sales. The general public is clueless. 

Once I had explained, in layman's terms, what constituted a short sale and the difference between a short sale, bank owned property and general resale, she was ready to proceed in her search.

Agents seem to enjoy castigating the media for presenting a bad picture of the market. It should be understood that the media is not offering a clear picture of anything and it is still our job to educate our clients. My level of frustration is greatly reduced when I remember that they are coming to me with insufficient evidence to support their suppositions. Patience works wonders.

Love the post.

1:50pm • #6
746,831 Points 72 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master
i agree with Mike...even with full disclosure some people just dont get it.  That's why patience will be a necessity always.
1:54pm • #7
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Mike.  I don't expect the consumer to know anything.  Understanding real estate brokerage is my job.  I just want them to do their job which is devote the time to look at homes carefully, keep their credit clean and look in realistic price ranges.  I'll take care of everything else.

Sally.  I doubt that you will have many short sales.  We don't have many either in the big picture.  There are more SS listings coming on though.

Adam.  The agents need to know how to price to sell because the next step is foreclosure.

Ken.  I agree 100%.  The consumer advoctes who want the consumer to have access to everything, including our agents produced listing and sold information are not doing the consumers any favors.  But, their nonsense sells. 

Fran.  You are right.  I've known a few of them.

1:56pm • #8
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

John.  You know, of course, that you are the star of the post. 

Don't get me wrong.  I adore our buyers.  I love helping them.  I love working with them, even if it's just a phone call.  However, when I get a call like the one today, it shows how little the consumer really understands.  I publish these stats for agents as much as for the consumer. 

Once the consumer gets realistic information, they usually come around.  It's the media, the public advocates that want to just dump information in front of the consumer that confuses them.  They do NOT know what to do with this information.  They are merely attracted by the buzz words. 

Of course, I'm not fool.  I advertise the buzz words.

 

2:01pm • #9
247,845 Points 20 Featured Posts Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master
With the term short sale flying all over the news and foreclosures, people are just thinking there are deals to be had.  I just had a lender decline a short sale, and I told the buyer we had a maybe 25% chance of having the lender accept the deal. It's hard for people to understand that lenders just don't roll over and take a 50% loss right now.
2:02pm • #10
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Larry.  Thanks.  It does take patience.  Patience with the consumer, the other agents, the media, etc. 

Unfortunately, I have little left. 

2:03pm • #11
225,623 Points Localism Sponsor Outside Blog
There is a huge misconception about what price and terms a lender assisting in the short sale will actually accept. The media has created a huge illusion that prices are dropping like snowflakes! Yes, there are great deals to be had, but certainly not 70% less than list!
2:14pm • #12
1,254,259 Points 242 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master
Lenn- What we tell buyers that call is that the list price is not what is being discounted more than 15% off of the BPO that the third party lender gets. The misunderstanding is that the big discount, the 50 cents on a dollar, 70 cents on the dollar is off of the what the seller owes the bank and this is highly likely and does happen in our market. It is driven by the markets, Florida being ground zero is going to have higher losses in value than where you are. This is because we are listing houses where the sellers owe $600,000 to $700,000 and the market value is only $365,000 which then becomes the list price. Then the BPO comes in at $369,000 and the deal goes through with an offer from a buyer at $330,000 but the third party lender must net $311,000 so now negotiations on closing costs take place, where can we shave some costs so the agents don't eat it. 
2:19pm • #13
447,718 Points 36 Featured Posts Outside Blog Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Lenn,

Well said!

The public has a sound byte eduction and those sound bytes are produces by reporters with a political agenda and less real knowledge than the average fifth grader.

God, help us.

Bill

2:32pm • #14
118,392 Points 9 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Adam's right...it's happening in my market, too. I don't understand why Realtors price a listing so low when they know the bank won't approve it. Is it just to drive traffic? Does that type of traffic even matter if they're just going to be dissapointed when the bank shuts it down?

These days, it's not information you need, but wisdom. Thanks, Lenn, for helping the rest of us interpret the info.

2:35pm • #15
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Joey.  Thanks.  The short sale market takes experience, experience, experience. Not necessarily short sale experience as much as a clear grasp of the market and how it works for buyers, sellers, agents, brokers, lenders and all.

William.  Right you are.  Right you are.

Mott.  The advertising of short sale opportunities contributes to the public's misunderstanding.

Katerina.  I thought of the Florida market when I wrote the post.  That's why I pulled the SOLD data and posted it too so no one would think I meant nationwide.  My information is limited to MD and VA area. 

Melina.  Banks will only be pushed so far.  All these short sales are giving the is a little liquidity, some write offs and a lot of headaches.  But, I don't have any sympathy for the banks.  They're the ones that made the loans in the first place.

 

2:59pm • #16
320,906 Points 52 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Something I find often repeating to my buyer clients is this: "There is a price to pay for getting a good deal".  That price is sometimes "asking price" if it's a good deal already.   With patience and armed with facts and data I usually can get the information across to them so that they understand.

Like others here "short sale" is so misleading to consumers.  It's up to us to educate them on what it really means.

3:34pm • #17
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Kris.  You're right. 

One thing I can't deal with for too long is buyers to whom the price and negotiating is more important that getting a good house.

I just gave up on a buyer who offered $770,000 on a $1,200,000 home.  I could see I was wasting my time.

 

3:37pm • #18
106,120 Points 5 Featured Posts

Lenn, long time eh?

I have to agree that this "buyers market" is severely populated with greedy and predatory people, people who are buying merely so they can hurt someone.  That's not the business I signed up for.

Good news on your market by the way, we too are experiencing a surge in activity and the recent refi boomlet pulled some inventory out of the market to everyone's gain.

4:08pm • #19
208,442 Points 6 Featured Posts Outside Blog
Lenn,  So damn true.  And that's the problem with the media as well.  A little bit of information becomes misinformation.  Leave it to the knowledgeable professionals.  And if they don't wish to be such, then move the heck on!
4:10pm • #20
320,906 Points 52 Featured Posts Outside Blog
Lenn, I would have given up on them also.  I prefer to work with those that put "home" first, before investment. Don't take me wrong, I have good investors that I work with yearly, but they also know how to make good offers to begin with.  They take their investing seriously. 
4:14pm • #21
679,388 Points 18 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master
Lenn -- I have gone to various classes on these topics - I have a "dumb" question I am trying to understand.  What is meant by net, after seller subsidy ???  I am not sure what the seller subsidy means.  I'll check back.  Thanks
4:20pm • #22
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Steve.  Nice to hear from you.  Buyers who are looking for a home can get a good buy now.  But, sellers aren't bringing large checks to settlement yet.

Marc.  Every market has a certain "center of gravity".  Our market is just about 10% below where it was a year ago.  But, buyers seem to think that they can buy at 30-40-50% of market.  Not going to happen.

Kris.  That buyer had to go.  Totally unrealistic.  I don't deal with buyers for whom the negotiation is more important than the house they wish to buy. 

Joan.  The SOLD price minus any closing help/credit to the buyer gives us the "net".  The SOLD price doesn't really reflect the market for that house.  It's the net proceeds that's important.  Depending on the type of financing a buyer has, the seller can credit the buyer with up to 10% of the purchase price at settlement.  The buyer can use the money for non-recurring closing costs, lender fees, points, origination, etc.  The buyer has to pay the pre-paids, but we often get the pre-paids paid by lender credits. 

Such a deal. 

I've seen SOLD stats where the buyer may pay $400,000 for a house, but the seller credits the buyer with $25,000 at closing, the seller is only netting $375,000, but the comps will still show a $400,000 sale. 

6:39pm • #23
4 Featured Posts

Your story that talks about 'net' to the bank, or even the owner, is the most important piece of the puzzle.

I love my clients but I love the look on their faces, or the sound in their voice when I ask them if it makes more sense to offer $400K with $10K in closing cost assistance, or $390K with no assistance at all. 95% of the time, they pick the higher price thinking that the bank or the seller somehow benefits by doing this.....

today, I spoke with an 'expert' first time buyer who felt that the market in Long Beach would drop by at least 30-50% more in value.....if you're such an expert, you genius, why aren't you aggressively investing....oh, yea, you're waiting for the bottom. Woops, silly me, I forget.

Lest I say....he will not waste my time. I referred him to someone he'll get along with. another 'expert' who has been in the business for a couple of years.

6:56pm • #24
274,634 Points 41 Featured Posts Outside Blog
LENN - I am constantly warning buyers about what it takes to buy a short sale.  For some reason, I have finally started seeing a lot of renters that are getting eager to buy coming out of the woodworks.  This is great news, as many have just been sitting on the sidelines for a long time now.  Those that are motivated to buy need to know that buying a short sale is no guarantee, and that they can be tied up for a long time when they could have been looking at other homes that have the potential for a quick sale.  Good post, Lenn.
7:40pm • #25
175,854 Points 14 Featured Posts Called Shot Master
Lenn,Your stats are in line with ours in the great state of SO.CAL(fifty first).The public needs to be educated on the facts of short sales as they are not freebies because we all know we real estate people take all of those.LOL.Had a lender call me a month ago on their fresh REO and asked for me to do a BPO for them since I do get their business.House had been a short sale and in escrow for 65 days at $450,000 but the lender had now kicked the second mortgage holder to the curb so here are the numbers: $450,000 listed short sale,$472,000 bpo price,short sale closes at $450,000.Right in line with your stats.
9:22pm • #26
175,854 Points 14 Featured Posts Called Shot Master
Lenn. ps,Calling it the way you see it without running in circles around the issue is what makes you great.As Andy Rooney says,Thats my opinion,good night.
9:29pm • #27
FEB
10
2008
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Bill.  The "net" proceeds is very important around here, especially in Maryland, because of the extremely high cost of closing.

Cameron.  The one thing that buyers lack is the ability to interpret the comps.  Believe it or not, the media do not report on the real market, just the headline grabbers.

Cameron.  "The facts ma'am.  Just the facts".  Friday.

 

 

6:50am • #28
167,951 Points 12 Featured Posts Outside Blog
Lenn, I can't agree with you more! A little knowledge can be a very dangerous thing.  Now you gave me an idea for a post. thank you
7:00am • #29
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Matthew.  Thanks for commenting and "go with it".  I'll watch out for more commentary on this subject.  While I didn't post this to Localism, the public may get the word from many resources. 

In fact, I'm going to change the title to get Google's attention.

 

7:08am • #30
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master
Matthew.  O.K.  I "tweeked" it so Google will get the message.  Might as well let the public in on the facts. 
7:15am • #31
Lenn, I like the idea of going into the MLS and doing a study of short sale closings.  I'll put that on my TO DO list.  Thanks for sharing some common sense.
7:19am • #32
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Dan.  Thanks.

Our MLS Market reports and SOLD stats don't reflect a lot of what I consider good information to really get a handle on the facts.  I have to pull it myself, but it keeps me on my toes.

8:18am • #33
4 Featured Posts
Hi Lenn, thanks for the post. Like a lot of agents I get calls from buyers that want info on short sales and foreclosures. And like others I spend time explaining and describing expectations for short sales, REO's and traditional sales. I've found some pretty good properties, but all in all banks aren't playing let's make a deal and are sticking to terms.
9:09am • #34
811,199 Points 91 Featured Posts Outside Blog Called Shot Master

It depends on the area.  I spoke with an attorney the other day, and I was advised the closings they are seeing now, the bank is taking the offer without counters.  So a rediculous offer is going through.  That does not mean it is a good deal, or the property did not have issues.  Sometimes a buy is not a buy, it is just the wrong property.

Where I have seen that a short sale is a better buy is in the condition of the property.

9:24am • #35
293,614 Points 19 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Oh Lenn - I think you and I are both on a Short-Sale rant!  People don't GET IT !!!!!   and it's enough to make me crazy....

I was about to write a HUGE comment - but I feel a post coming on.....

1:16pm • #36
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Craig.  I suppose it depends on the area.  Jim is in Atlanta and they have a higher percentage of bank owned that have we.  Not too many in Southern MD either.

Jim.  Sell them.  Sell them.

James.  I've been out.  I'll look for your post.

 

3:49pm • #37
4 Featured Posts
I did mean in my area. I agree with you and Jim, it depends on the area.
9:30pm • #38
FEB
11
2008
110,915 Points 26 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog
Lenn as usual a fantastic analysis. Oddly enough this has just started being an issue for me (it's only in last few weeks I've had buyers calling about short sale purchases though). Had a gal last week say she felt the house would sell for about 30k less than list price. She got a tad haughty when I told her why that was probably not so for this particular house.  When I was reading your post I couldn't help but want to say to the one consumer, uh, 200k is already pretty darn good! 
11:03am • #39
1,545,239 Points 416 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Attended Rain Camp Called Shot Master

Carol. 

Funny thing about the average consumer.  Sellers always believe their property is worth more than it really is and buyers always think a property is worth less than it really is.

We have a short sale listing whereby the seller agreed to our recommended price immediately, no argument.  They've already moved out and we're just waiting for bank approval on a good offer.  The home is priced at about 5% below market and should sell and the offer is good. 

My fingers are crossed. 

11:18am • #40
APR
01
2008

I had a question.one of my family friend bought a house at 170,000 in a nice neighbourhood in 2001.Another friend bought the same exact house one block down at 600,000 in 2006.I am sure people who were so greedy has to pay for it.the prices were inflated out of proportion.And somebody has to pay for it.i can see an appreciation upto 300,000 but this was way too much.

SUE
9:25am • #41
433,119 Points 110 Featured Posts Outside Blog Called Shot Master

Hi Lenn-yes buyers do believe they know so much due to the internet but to me there are so many details they will not understand or remember.  I know that buyers are looking for deals all over the country  and in most instances short sales are a great deal without trying to get them for absolutely nothing.  I think a savy buyer will in fact listen, accept the advice of a real pro!  Those who claim to be savy...are usually still waiting to buy!  Great post and congrats You...have selected this post for a blogger's choice selection.

p.s.  This fool would have done the same!  Love it.

1:51pm • #42

This blog does not allow anonymous comments

 


Listings

Links

Archives

RSS 2.0 Feed for this blog