In this brave new mortgage world, where at least half of all sellers are either lending institutions or agencies that represent these lending institutions, can I just say this? I MISS THE "REAL SELLERS".

You see sellers used to be real people who actually cared about closing on time. They had a real estate agent who was getting paid enough that she relentlessly contacted me for updates, making certain everything was moving along to the seller's satisfaction. 

The title company was chosen by one of the agents (instead of dictated by the lender seller) and was actually competent. Contracts and addendums did not need to go through 3 lender committees for the smallest change.

And rarely did you come across penalties in a purchase contract for closing late. As an example: $150 a day for closing late, when the only reason for closing late is repeated delays by the lender seller.

My advice to buyers agents on this? DO NOT ALLOW A LENDER SELLER TO IMPOSE THESE PENALTIES.

During a recent transaction, the lender seller slipped a late closing fee of $150 a day into an addendum which extended the contract. Then they proceeded to delay the transaction even more than they already had, forcing the buyer into a late closing. Why did we need an extension IN THE FIRST PLACE? Because:

  • Lender seller took the first 3 weeks to sign the purchase contract
  • Title company could not find the buyers deposit money
  • Preliminary title report arrived with a different buyer's name on it, and dated November 7, 2007

Naturally, my lender refused to draw docs without these critical items being in order.

The listing agent was someone who knew nothing, refused to talk with me, and referred me to a part time student who was his assistant and also knew nothing. His attitude was this "I'm not getting paid that much so don't call me....and anyway, most buyers that go into these contracts never get financing ANYWAY."

Title company attitude was "You are one of thousands of bank owned properties. We will get to you when we get to you and don't blame us for being confused".

All of this would NEVER be tolerated by a REAL SELLER. I have never had more respect in my life for the OFTEN OVERLOOKED role a listing agent plays in a transaction after the property sells.

Who would have thought that it would come to this? Buyers of lender owned properties should impose the penalties to the sellers for closing late, not the other way around. My advice when writing a contract on a lender owned property?

  • Do not accept penalties for closing late
  • Write a contract for at least 45 days
  • Try to use your own title company, not theirs
  • Make sure mortgage broker is a pitbull...or at least a VERY SQUEAKY WHEEL

Written by Janet Guilbault, Mortgage Lending Expert based out of the San Francisco Bay Area

 

 

22 Comments on If The Seller Is a Bank, You Just Don't Rank

FEB
16
2008

You nailed it. So much nonsense dealing with the short sale and the ridiculous process lenders take it and the money they are trying to "save" is not a savings at all BUT some loss mitigation department has their annual goal of recovery and regardless of the circumstance they will fight until the end.

The whole process is aggravating.

Great post. This topic not discussed enough.

10:33am • #1
1 Featured Post
Great article Janet! As a lender too, I've seen the extensions & you're absolutely on target.  The "Real Sellers" are coming back soon!  I can feel it!! :)
10:36am • #2
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Absolutely right. IMO, banks could sell these properties a lot faster if they would put experienced real estate practitioners in charge of processing.

We know how to get properties to settlement. 

The first thing foreclosure buyers need to have is patience.  The first thing their agent needs to know is that the bank addendum is negotiable. 

Too many agents are so anxious to get a contract, they tell their buyers that "if you want this property, you have to sign it as it is". 

Good post.  Thanks.

 

12:22pm • #3
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Janet, Not accepting the penalties sounds good in theory. I just tried that with a buyer on a REO and the lender(seller) would not even look at our offer because we had scratched out 2 clauses on the "bank addendums". One was the $150 a day per deim and the other was a clause giving the bank the right to cancel the contract at any time with no penalty and no recourse!!! We scratched them and they kicked our offer back.

My buyers really want he property and they are cash buyers so reluctantly they accepted the addendum as written.

We are however ordering a second title search through our own Title Company just to be on the safe side.

12:43pm • #4
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Thanks Kirk, for stopping by and for your supportive comments. As mortgage brokers, we are used to being blamed for late closings. I usually try to "protect" my buyer from the aggrevations associated with dealing with agents and title companies that mess up, by just taking care of things myself.

I usually accept blame (and pay for it) even when it is not my fault. But this is a whole new game, and without a listing agent to help me with the seller, I must come out swinging... or the borrower (or me) is paying a thousand bucks at the end for everyone on the seller's end just NOT CARING.

I had to threaten the title company when, after 6 weeks, they could not produce a receipt for buyers earnest money!!! Un- freaking- believable, and I am pretty sure against the law.

 

 

2:46pm • #5
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Josh: Is this what it is like when a FSBO sells a house? Does the mortgage broker need to play the role of listing agent? At least in this kind of transaction, the seller probably cares.

These banks are so beyond caring that there is a real person, trying to buy a real house, and get a loan.

Could someone please let me know this: How much less are you paid to handle a lender owned property as a real estate agent? Am I right in the assumption you make less?

2:49pm • #6
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Lenn: As usual you offer some sage advice, and are able to identify the main theme of this post....that is: banks need to pay listing agents the full commission because they need a listing agent even MORE than a real seller, NOT LESS.

And you hit the nail on the head about buyers needing to understand how difficult these transactions can be. Most are simply blinded by the low price and assume no problems will occur because they are lender approved.

YES...unwilling and uncooperative and uncaring sellers cause major problems!!! Yes, we mortgage brokers are still learning how to deal with this mess that has half of our loans with lender sellers.

Patience!!! Good advice, Lenn.

2:55pm • #7
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BB: Aren't those terms absolutely ridiculous? At least you tried to do what is best for your client.

I wrote a long letter to the lender and asked the agent to send an addendum to the lender along with my letter asking that they waive the penalty for late closing. It was all their fault!!!! Can't see why it is fair to penalize the borrower when we had all of our ducks in a row within 2 weeks....and I had to play hardball just to get basic documents. Really, this situation is shameful.

 I could swear they dragged it out on purpose just to get more money....

2:59pm • #8
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Janet, Let us know if they waive the per diem. My buyer is very experienced and is paying cash so it should go smoothly. He is fully aware of the risk in losing the contract should the lender just decide to yank the deal at the last minute. I do not like selling foreclosures unless the buyers are experienced.

I just listed 2 REOs yesterday. And of course they beat me up on the commission. I gave in this time but have already told them it is only because I want all of their business and these 2 are a trial run. Next time there will be no reduction. My service and getting the job done quickly will prevail. It always does. And it will cost them:) 

5:25pm • #9
423,638 Points 17 Featured Posts Outside Blog
This is the first I've heard of paying for closing late. We all know it's usually the lender who causes the closing delays. I think I'd have my buyer hire an attorney.
10:52pm • #10
121,914 Points 22 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Hi Janet,

It was sure nice to meet you last week!

I miss the "real sellers" too!  Lately I have shown a LOT of short sales and it's just depressing to think of how long they will take to respond.

Today I talked to a colleague of mine who said that she had a listing at basically $550k, got a great offer for $540l ("retail") and the bank waited 3 months to respond - by which time prices had fallen 10-15% in that price range/area!!!  They are truly chasing the market down... So sad to see.

My buyers do not WANT to buy a short sale but it is what's available in their price point here :(

As for that house - it's currentlly listed at $500k, but we think it's worth 10% less but the bank recently approved a sale of $540k but it took 3 months and those buyers are gone, gone, gone.

Banks are losing money hand over fist because of their own ineptitude and understaffing....

11:23pm • #11
FEB
17
2008
114,577 Points 9 Featured Posts Outside Blog
Janet, there's one way in which having a bank instead of a 'real' seller is nice...they don't have any emotional attachment to the property. They just want to minimize their loss. They haven't perfected their systems yet, but I like that my first time buyers and investors are getting great deals...instead of haggling with someone who, in some way, doesn't want to see their home go to someone else.
1:07am • #12
4 Featured Posts

banks are BAD sellers. they maintain their arrogance in what is a buyers market.

it's their loss as in this market they are apt to find out the property has decreased in value as they were screwing with a qualified buyer who walked.

6:06am • #13
321,231 Points 40 Featured Posts Outside Blog
Janet--Thank you for posting this information! It is something that I will be on the look out for as a buyer will look to their agent to help them review the fine print. I have had the same issue working with banks as it is a frustrating experience.
8:52am • #14
182,440 Points 2 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog
Good luck getting the sellers to change their amendments, I have tried and no dice, but I was able to get them to give us extensions without charging the penalty twice recently, when the late closing was not the actual fault of the buyer.
3:01pm • #15
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Michael: That is what we asked for...a second extension. However, I felt compelled to write the letter defending myself because I have never penalties are really designed to penalize the mortgage broker for not having her act together.

I think I also really needed to vent about such incompetence. When my processor actually needs me to get involved just to get run of the mill documents, I am wasting my time. And then they want to penalize my seller????Outrageous!!!

4:01pm • #16
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Teri: That is why I posted this in the Realtor section...it is important to know that banks are overwhelmed and not doing a good job being sellers.

Jay: What an excellent point! Time is of the essence in these transactions. I had one house in contract for $445k while bank stalled. Meanwhile, another lender dropped the price on the same house to $319k. Every loan is a race against declining values.

4:05pm • #17
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Joey: Well, as a mortgage broker I am rarely involved with sellers and that part of the negotiations, but you have a valid point. But once the house is in contract, even the most stubborn seller is usually anxious to get to the closing day and the real estate agent is anxious to get paid. Net result: Everybody does what it takes to get that loan finished for the buyer.

Not on lender owned properties!!!! They have so many contracts that fall through that they just assume this one will too. I continue to be shocked by this attitude!!!!! A real person has put money down and signed a contract.

A real mortgage broker has a lender approved client! They need to get the show on the road and stop making us sing extensions.

4:10pm • #18
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Mary: I enjoyed meeting you as well....What a special evening! Hope to see you again and would love to refer business to you. I do have many clients in your area (that became mortgage clients after they were my auto leasing clients)

The understaffing of banks right now is a serious issue not only with lender owned properties, but simply in general. My husband says that since lenders have lost their shirts in the mortgage business they want to invest as little money as possible in the mortgage divisions.

Well, maybe he is right. But the problem with the part of the bank in charge of selling lender owned properties? They have absolutely no idea how to do this, and are not willing to pay anyone to do a good job!

From here on out, I will take a no tolerence stance with these type of transactions, and warn everyone involved up front what to expect.

4:17pm • #19

Great Post Janet!,

My favorite delay (i'm being sarcastic) are the properties that the bank has not properly secured (I'm not talking about in urban cities) and when the appraisal comes in we can't close it UNTIL THE PROPERTY IS SAFELY SECURED.

Now here is why it is my favorite part....The requirement for the property to have windows, doors, etc.. are residential bank guidelines!  Now that they are selling the properties THEY DON'T want to abide by the guidelines!  I have underwritten countless bank owned properties that needed cosmetic work and the investor (a bank) would not allow it to close until the windows and doors were fixed! 

Once again: Great Post I understand exactly where your coming from!

4:35pm • #20
147,566 Points 89 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

D-bass you are d-boss. Oh, yeah, they need not abide by any of the rules!!!

I had one bank owned property and they tried to insist the buyer could only be financed through their bank. Buyer was so intimidated that he told me he couldn't use me this time. I said okay.

Pretty soon, the lender that insisted they HAD to do they financing since they OWNED the property is on the phone with me, telling me I had lied to my borrower when I pre-approved him. Tried to tell me there was no way he could get that loan.

Guess what? They decided they would rather have me do the financing than lose the deal. Guess what else? I closed the exact loan the told me I couldn't!

They are so ARROGANT! God help us if they do away with mortgage brokers and EVERYONE is stuck dealing with a bank!

5:02pm • #21
FEB
18
2008
147,548 Points 6 Featured Posts Outside Blog

It's rough...in a way it falls under the "he/she who cares least always wins" category!   If you're people want that property, then they have to dance to that lender's tune....

 

Bob Mitchell

ValueList Real Estate Services, Inc. 

3:34pm • #22

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Janet Guilbault California Mortgage Banker/Broker

Walnut Creek, CA

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Address: 3201 Danville Blvd, Suite 195, Alamo, CA, 94507

Office Phone: (925) 552-3867

Cell Phone: (925) 212-6347

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