The “Open Up the MLS!!!” Battle Cry – Houston, We have a Problem.

pngIt’s a battle cry I hear often enough from the public in general and  from FSBO’s and Expireds particularly. There seems to be this tremendous anger against the real estate industry and agents because we simply won’t “open up” the MLS for the public to use in the same way as real estate professionals do.  But this issue must be taken in its proper context.  The bigger problem lies with how the public perceives the real estate industry – and that is where we have a much more serious problem.  The two issues overlap each and become intertwined kind of  like the rats nest of wires hidden behind my computer!

Although I had been planning a post on the MLS the content of this blog was altered and influenced by three posts that if you haven’t read, you should. 

 Lenn Harley's post: Memo to Johnathon Washburn: Re: Redfin and the MLS. 

John Washburn's post: NAR Mission: To be the gatekeepers of listings....  

Jesse & Kathy Clifton's post: The Enemy Within. 



The issue with the MLS, although a valid issue is also a symptom of a much bigger  problem.  If our profession was respected,  many of the issues with respect to the MLS would disappear or at least not exist with the same poisonous intensity it does now.  As the reputation sinks to new lows, the “open MLS” issue RESONATES  with the public in a way that it wouldn’t if the public understood that working with a qualified professional brings true value to a real estate transaction.

I’ll address the MLS issue first:

Part of the problem  with respect to the MLS has to do with a public misunderstanding as to what the MLS actually is.  Many people think that when they link to IDX or Realtor.com, they are viewing the actual MLS that brokers and agents use.  That is simply not true.  They are looking at the public version of the MLS.  First, there is no one MLS.  There are hundreds of local MLS's operating throughout the U.S. The version of each local MLS that agents and brokers use is a proprietary database. Created by Realtors for Realtors, the MLS database remains proprietary because it IS private intellectual property.

The public hunger for more, more MORE “free” information has lead to a release of more information than may have been wise. This has fueled  the urban legend that the MLS should be a public utility.  One of the major aspects of the MLS that remains tightly under broker control irks a portion of the public to no end. That is the ability to list a property for sale or for rent.  But, it is that very tight control that makes the MLS what it is:  a reliable database of accurate information.  This restriction, no matter how contentious, ensures the continued reliability of the database.  Could you imagine allowing just anyone to list their home on the MLS?  People would be slapping up listings right and left with numerous errors and omissions and without any of the constraints that govern Realtors.  Talk about a mess – the information would be about as reliable as a Zillow “zestimate.”  There are VALID reasons why listing a property is restricted to licensed individuals. 

Another reason you can’t “open up” the MLS is that if you do, who will pay for it? Agents, brokers and appraisers support the multiple MLS’s with their dues.  Access to each of the local MLS’s is a privilege , not a right.  We PAY  technicians, programmers and administrators to perform the complex task of maintaining and regulating a very complex and constantly changing database.  Why would I – or anyone else – choose to pay for what everyone else can access and contribute to for free?

So to members of the public who think that feel they should have free, unfettered access to the hundreds of national MLS’s, I say “Get over it.” The MLS’s can not and will never be free and open and with good reason.  The minute you “open it up” in this way, you destroy its value and much of the “free information” you now have access to will be gone.

The second issue has to do with our perceived value to the public: png

As pointed out by Jesse and Kathy,  we have seen the enemy and he is us. There are three problems:

  • There are plenty of stupid and incompetent agents running around destroying the reputations of the rest.
  • There are plenty of dishonest, greedy agents running around destroying the reputations of the rest.
  • There are plenty of stupid, incompetent, dishonest and greedy agents running around destroying the reputations of the rest.


How we got there is an interesting story and there is plenty of blame to spread around.
Here are a few highlights:

NAR got greedy:
  It wanted dues from more warm bodies more than it wanted to maintain high standards.  So there was little incentive to raise the bar on licensing that would have kept out many of the incompetent “get rich quick” types.  In spite of a mountain of evidence that there are large numbers of poorly trained agents running around, they remain mum on making it harder to obtain a  license.  The status-quo suits them just fine.

Agents got greedy: Established agents started demanding more and more in the way of splits from their brokers.  It got to the point where quite a few top producers were getting such high splits, they were not earning their keep with their brokerages.  The services they demanded, exceeded what they were bringing in in commissions.

Brokerages got greedy and hungry:
  As revenue fell from top-producers, brokerages had to find income from other sources. Many became puppy mills where they took in anyone with a license and a pulse. They didn’t train, they didn’t mentor, they didn’t share leads,  but still felt free to collect fat splits for doing nothing for the agent while leaving them to sink or swim. The idea was that the fat splits they would get from the newbie agent would bring in revenue at almost no cost.  Most agents can get a couple of sales from family and friends. So it was “easy money.” But it created an untrained, starving and desperate group of new agents who would do anything to get a sale. Apart from the moral aspect of taking advantage of agents in this way,  this type of agent can do a lot of damage while they are handling a person’s single largest investment.  It doesn’t take many people like this to create a lot of public bad will.  For more on this,  see my previous blog on this topic.

Desperate new agents were greedy and hungry:
  I will not elaborate on this, it was explained above.

Licensing education and continuing education (including designations) are a joke:
  Almost anyone can get a license.  Almost anyone can get several designations.  All you need is money and time.  The formal education I have received is nothing short of pitiful.  We need to get rid of the Mickey Mouse nature of education and designations so that agents actually EARN their licenses and designations and THEN and only THEN will they have some meaning in the eyes of the public.  I have a Ph.D. in another field.  I could easily fill up on designations but I don’t because the education behind them is useless.  I can sit and listen to the stupidity or I can actually LEARN something on my own. That’s pitiful.

Those who hide behind the Realtor Code of Ethics are fooling themselves. 
There are serious problems that are intrinsic to the system that makes the COE nothing more than an empty promise.  This has lead to the degeneration of our value in the eyes of the public.   If the public perceives that we are lacking in educational and ethical standards and bring nothing more to the table than submission to a tightly controlled database, then it is understandable that they feel that opening up the MLS will solve all their problems and put an additional 5-7% profit in their pockets.

 
Post is included in group: The Ninety-ninth Percentile

32 Comments on The “Open Up the MLS!!!” Battle Cry – Houston, We have a Problem.

I totally agree with you that the MLS should not be open to the public and that getting a RE license might be too easy.  On a side note I'm wondering why once we earn a designation we have to pay to keep it?  Seems like another way to make money off us agents.

03/01/2008 03:10 PM by JenRan Realty, LLC


It is a way to make money. Its insane and serves no purpose when the designation is probably not worth the space the initials take up. 

03/01/2008 03:14 PM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Ruthmarie:  I can find nothing to disagree with you on.  You lay it all out there very well.  Seems like our society , general public, expects everything to be free and considers it almost a right of citizenship?

03/01/2008 03:17 PM by Joan Snodgrass Tri-Lakes Realtors, Shell Knob, MO (Tri- Lakes REALTORS)


IMHO:  If the MLS opened up, the markets would flood, there would be "free radicals" everywhere and gone would be the trust in the price ranges for the listed properties.   It's quite possible that a number of non serious sellers would input properties grossly over priced and some homeowners could equally grossly under price their properties!  Where would confidentiality and safety go?  Anyone could find out a house is vacant and the owners live 2 states away...Some Americans feel entitled to everything.  If they don't want to pay a full time professional to do the job, they can look for a broker witha la carte services.  Grrr  Are these same people beating on the doors of the NYSE to pick up their stocks directly?!?!

I wouldn't go as far as to mock the COE or devalue others by saying they didn't work hard enough to get where they are today.  Nor, would I call Licensing education a joke.  It should be expanded, but it's in no way a joke.  IMHO, designations just make you a little bit smarter than the next guy...or gal...    :>) Nat

03/01/2008 03:31 PM by Natalie Langford, Winchester, VA Real Estate (Realty Direct of Shenandoah Valley)


I agree in all aspects, but will comment on the designation issue.  I took the first of three courses for the GRI designation, but when I realized that they were just taking the money, running EVERYBODY who signed up through the class, and were giving ALL of the attendees a certification, I saw that it was only about the MONEY.  The biggest joke is the CNC, the most affordable designation here.  Almost everyone in my area is now a Certified Negotiation Specialist.  WoooooHoooo! 

When you go to college, you have to learn something and not everyone graduates.  That is where the value is in getting a degree.  That is why they refer to going to college as getting an education.  If EVERYBODY who pays for the course gets the designation, then what value does it really have? 

I guess I should have a list of the 100s of seminars that I have attended on my business card!!!

03/01/2008 04:11 PM by Richard Parr, Realtor, Real Estate Agent Elmhurst and DuPage County Real Estate (Prospect Equities, Oakbrook Terrace, IL)


Knock..Knock..Knock..Ruthmarie..is that you..seriously??? What in the heck were we arguing about over at Lenn's post? I mean I had to pinch myself!

This is what I was talking about Kudos to you for this post!

One small p[oint, an open MLS would not need your dues. Can you imagine the eyeballs out there. Advertising would most assuredly support it.

Other than that..HooRah!!!

Sinscerely,

Your "Bottom Feeding" Friend

03/01/2008 04:59 PM by Brett Wilson -|South Florida Real Estate |Real Estate Radio USA| Real Estate News (Real Estate Radio USA)


RM, I enjoyed your dissertation and stream of thought. I think the public should have equal access when they have equal minimal training and pay equal dues, including NAR dues. I'm all for Open and equal access.

03/01/2008 09:09 PM by Suzi Gravenstuk|Independent Broker| License # 17787 (MGC Realty, LLC)


Well, you said it quite comprehensively.  I for one am so tired of the entitled public.  They seem to be "know it all do it yourselfers" until they get themselves in trouble and then they whine and cry about the Realtors that won't help them for nothing and not being able to use our tools.

03/01/2008 10:10 PM by The Best Spot Realty/Norris Lake Real Estate/Ooltewah Real E


Hi Joan,

The internet has created much of that feeling of entitlment.  We are ALL guilty. I read the NY Times online - for FREE.  Mostly because I hate recycling the big newspaper - but still there it is.  I read other newspapers and magazines for FREE and don't subscribe. I use AR for FREE.  I pay for IDX on my web site, and if there is a photo that MUST have on the net I purchase that.   I don't infringe on the rights of others, but I don't pay unless I have to! 

As Realtors, we have been doing a great deal for FREE for a long time because few people decided to go it alone.  Before I was an agent, I took it for granted that I could use a Realtor and not necessarily have to pay if things didn't work out.  This aspect of what we do may need to change.

Lenn wrote a very interesting history, and since I've only been an agent for a short time, it was very informative. We have given away too much information and lost control of much of the data.  Some of this may have to be pulled back - if it even can be done.  But NO MORE can be released.  As was pointed out by others, people want a piece of the MLS because IT WORKS SO WELL.  Making it public would destroy it.  And there is no need to make it public because it is PRIVATELY OWNED.

 But there is another aspect to all of this. There are way too many new and totally incompetent agents running around. I am fairly new, but I am actively learning and care about doing the job correctly.  Others are not so committed and many new AND long-time agents have their eyes only on that check. I've seen PLENTY of improper behavior on the part of agents - old and new alike.  The perception by the public is in part based on truth and we have to own that failure and deal with it.  If we did, a lot of the other problems would go away. 

03/02/2008 10:48 AM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Hello Natalie, 

I don't see the big issue with a la carte services as long as customers/clients KNOW that it is limited and that they are taking a RISK.  The RISK is that things (particularly LISTINGS) may well not work out.  If you come back to me after trying something and putting out $2-3k including discount listing and advertising which is the minimum you need in our market - I still have to charge what I charge.  Since they still have to offer buyer's agents a going rate if they are truly serious, what are they saving? And at what risk?  The answers are "not much" and a "their single largest investment, a protracted, messed up deal, huge amounts of time and energy, and the greater likelihood of having two mortgages at once." Sellers can do this but they may well lose time and money.  When I started during the heights of the boom - you could realistically sell something yourself if the price was right, but that's no longer true. 

I am full service - really full service. In our market to be full-service I need to take a certain amount when I do a listing and if I have a client with difficult needs on the buying side, I need a certain amount or I am making $5/hour.  But our properties MOVE and we work to get as much as we can for them. We don't try to get people to list UNDER value for a quick sale.  For this kind of service, the brokerage I'm in has a marvelous reputation. No puppy mills there, they are picky about who they take on and will not bring in people with $$ in their eyes.  I am not afraid of discounters - they usually fail.

As far as education. I have a high degree.  These classes are PITIFUL.  I'm sorry but that's the truth.  I have an undergraduate and two master's and a Ph.D.  In any of these programs there is an attrition and failure rate.  For the doctorate, it can be as much as 70%. That failure rate is what makes having the degree worthwhile. You had to WORK for it. Most of these designations are just "put down your money and its yours and it will stay yours if you keep paying." That's NONSENSE!!  Sure you pay for a degree - but once you have a doctorate - you don't keep PAYING to keep "doctor" in front of your name!  I don't use it in real estate, but my name is "Dr. Hicks" and it will always be "Dr. Hicks" and I don't have to PAY for that.  I went through one HELL of alot more to earn one Master's than any licensing and ALL the designation courses put together could ever deliver.  The designation needs to mean more than "put down the money and attend the classes and its yours" but that's what it is.   The licensing course was ridiculous - just downright silly. And the on-the-job training at my early brokerage was almost non-existent. You can't have people with such pathetic training running around working with a person's single largest investment.  Quit with the money machine designations and make sure about 20% FAIL the first time the try to get the designation and then it will be worth the paper its printed on.  The reason the designations don't resonate with the public is in part because they aren't worth much in terms of service - because all too many do it to add it to their resume,  and not to increase their knowledge or service.  The same can be said for higher degrees, but the candidate is FORCED to work for them and obtain a certain amount of knowledge.  This is a real hot-button issue with me. NAR needs to clean up its act. If you want PROFESSIONALS then make it a true PROFESSION with training that is difficult to get through. That would also stop the FLOOD of agents that come in with every single housing boom.

 

03/02/2008 11:18 AM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Richard,

We pretty much agree.  I guess I have to refer to my answer to Natalie.  For someone who comes from an academic background - this is a real problem.  Establishing our VALUE when virtually ANYONE can get a license and any designation they want is an act of futility!  Let's get back to making it WORTH SOMETHING.  Until then I won't waste my time and money.  I am capable of learning MORE on my own than in the class room - at least this type of classroom.  I think that agents and brokers will eventually recognize that education is a MUST - if we want to maintain viability in the eyes of the public.  

03/02/2008 11:24 AM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Ruthmarie,

Good posting.  I agree that just like corporate greed is bad for America, Realtor/broker greed is part of our problem with public perception.  I do not understand your comment about the "COE (is) nothing more than an empty promise."  The Code is like the constitution or the bible/koran, it only works when it is the basis for one's behavior.  If we do not utilize and enforce our Code, it then becomes your "empty promise".  Consider this, a 2005 CRS survey reports that "47.2 percent of Realtor respondents report an increase in ethics violations" yet "some 16.4 percent have reported violators to their local boards."  We do not know what percentage actually filed an ethics complaint which is the true test.  If we do not require our fellow/sister Realtor to follow the Code, how can we expect the public to take our ethics seriously?  Indeed, how can we Realtors take ethics seriously?  The best way to make the Realtor term mean something is for all of us to actively participate in adherence to the Code and to it's enforcement.   

03/02/2008 11:25 AM by Bill Schwent - Santa Fe broker (RE/MAX Capital)


Brett and Suzi -

Like the education issues I sighted above - when something becomes open and easy - it generally ends up being destroyed.  The MLS is private and it is maintained privately.  Fact is - it IS intellectual property and must remain so.  We open it up - we lose control of how the database is run.  The MLS is on of the few things that works WELL in our industry.  People can list - but they have to pay a discounter to do so or get their own license. Neither requirement is onerous. LET THEM DO THAT MUCH FOR THE PRIVILEGE.  Keeping it private and REGULATED is what ensures the high degree of accuracy that we have now.  Opening it up to anyone - whose interests are limited (they don't CARE about losing a license that allows them to work -because they are only selling their home)  so if they pad the information or put in "modified" information about taxes, fees and the like - its worth a SHOT.  By my previous posts, it should be apparent that getting a licenses and hanging with a broker is easy enough as it is.  If they want to list without ANY help, let them get their license.

03/02/2008 11:33 AM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Hi Bill,

Here is the problem with the COE.  Around here EVERYONE is a Realtor. So for people to say "I'm a REALTOR, I have a COE - while others may not." is just beyond silly. I'm not seeing much of premium on honesty lately and that's one reason i bring value.  I AM honest, but someone who doesn't know me from a hole in the wall can't know that!   Unfortunately, we are living in an age of "I've got mine, so F*** YOU!"  A crude statement - and not mine, but unfortunately, its appropriate.  I've seen outrageous behavior that borders the lines.  I've seen behavior outside the lines - but the BURDEN OF PROOF is on me. If there is a stunning and clear violation - I don't hesitate IF 1) I can PROVE it and 2) it doesn't interfere with my fiduciary obligation to a client.  Number 2 is part of the problem. You have a problem agent on the other side, but your client's who have tried hard to sell or have been looking for six months for the right house finally have a deal that would work well for them - WHAT DO YOU DO? I have to think of my client first.  I think that's the reason why a lot of violations are not reported.  I had a real issue like that this summer - I put the client first and the agent walked away from a STUNNING violation - although there is no love loss.  He probably has my face on a dart board somewhere. I wasn't nice or kind.  He knew EXACTLY what I thought of him. 

03/02/2008 11:57 AM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Ruthmarie, I'm glad you wrote this. I've been pushing for higher standards for a long time. Lenn Harley has been crying for higher standards for a long time also. It seems we are "whistling in the wind."

But you are right, the public is NOT going to respect us until we respect ourselves enough to run the incompetents out of the business, then slam the door on any more of them getting in. The NAR isn't going to do it. Like you said, it isn't in their perceived interest to limit admission to the "profession."

I don't have any advanced degrees but I do have a BS in Finance. I took all the real estate classes required for a brokers license in California as part of my undergraduate degree.  I have been licensed for almost 33 years as a broker in California. I do not have any designations. My take on that subject is exactly the same as yours. But I am better educated on Real Estate than 99% of the licensees out there.

Even insurance agents treat themselves with more respect than we do. To become a Certified Financial Planner (CFP) they undergo an educational curricula that is on a graduate school level. As a matter of fact some business schools offer MS degrees in financial planning. Aren't we at least as good as insurance sales people?

As long as we continue to allow anybody in, the public will continue to "see" us on a level with used car salesmen. It is no wonder they resent paying our fees.

Bill Roberts

03/02/2008 01:59 PM by Bill Roberts - "Baby Boomer" Retirement Planning (Brooks and Dunphy Real Estate)


Ruthmarie,

I agree that we must put the needs of our clients and customers first; that's why Article 1 is the first article.  But what you do is, in the course of the transaction, document everything.  You then let the Realtor organization resolve the issue after closing.  Take a look at my recent posting, Deperate Times, for a case study of just what you are noting.  And you are also correct, you need to prove your case.  The transaction paperwork, events that can be corroborated by the participants (other brokers, the closing officer, your client) all of whom can be used in the form of witnesses (best) or affidavits or other evidence.  Your narative of the course of events is of utmost importance and it is best to keep a log in the course of the transaction so that you have it (1) well documented and in (2) a good chronology of the events.  I have found that in almost three dozen professional standards hearings that the truth usually comes out.  What we sometimes forget is that the process is both education and vindication.  If your cooperating Realtor is unethical, how do you expect that Realtor to learn or to change if the behavior is not called to task.  The process really does work well if it is used.

03/02/2008 02:27 PM by Bill Schwent - Santa Fe broker (RE/MAX Capital)


Bill R. - I agree with you on all points.  Its not ROCKET SCIENCE, but the education MUST be more comprehensive.  What I have learned, I learned mostly on my own.   Now my degrees are NOT in business.  But having advanced degrees helped because I understand what the learning process entails and Ph.D. candidates are very often left in a sink or swim mode - so I was familiar with that "what do I do now?" feeling - and not letting it get to me. I think being a new agent can feel a lot like being a doctoral candidate.  I remember once I had a problem with an experiment that wasn't working no matter what I did.  I asked my mentor what to do and she gave me this look like "why are you bothering me?"  then she said "Go to the library!"  I promptly went to the library and said "Ok, I'm in the library - now what do I do?" It took me a while to find periodicals with protocols, but I found them and solved the problem. It's very much the same as a broker saying - "Go get prospects!"

03/02/2008 07:31 PM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Bill S. - True, I've only had a situation where that would have worked - ONCE.  But I made a fatal mistake.  I pointed out his MLS violation not realizing that I didn't have a copy of the broker's listing IN HAND. He modified it before I secured a new copy.  He had failed to disclose that he was the owner of the property and was being a complete jerk with riders that made no sense for my client.  Had I had that one piece of paper, he would have been at least reprimanded. I've seen an awful lot that just skirts the rules. I sell a lot of condos and coops and I have a zero tolerance policy for agents/brokers who play the key game.  If I see consistent problems of having to pick up keys at an inaccessible office with the same agent/broker and I know lockboxes are allowed - I threaten them and have called the MLS.  It's generally an attempt to control a listing increasing the chances of double-ending a deal.  There are several agents who think this is cute.  I don't.  It discourages showings and may lead to a lower sale price.  It has been somewhat effective. I think a lot of people got fed up at once.  There isn't much money in these types of deals and no one wants to be chasing keys around at 4-5 different brokerages in a dense area with traffic/parking issues. 

03/02/2008 07:39 PM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


+

Ruthmarie,

In your repsonse, you did not repond to my suggetion that youc onsider filling an ethic's complaint.  Indeed, your response ingnored my recommendation all together.  That leads me to believe that you may not have a legitimate case and the problem is all in your mind.  Give us a scenario of the problem and I'll bet you'll get some good advice.  This is an excellent venue for review and introspective.l

03/02/2008 10:39 PM by Bill Schwent - Santa Fe broker (RE/MAX Capital)


The problem was this: The listing did not disclose that the agent was also the owner of the property.  There are two ways in which this can be disclosed.  Neither was included. THAT was the violation.  Unfortunately, he modified the listing after immediately after I called him on it.  At the time I thought I had a hard copy of the broker version of the listing in a folder at the office.  I did not. Instead I had the client hard copy.  In any case, when I was talking to him I had the listing up on my computer.  At the time, the disclosure was NOT THERE. We even argued about it.  I said "wait a minute - you are the OWNER? Why isn't this disclosed?" He went on to say he had "no problem with not disclosing this and I was crazy to think it mattered..yada, yada, yada.  It was a violation - plain and simple.  He was supposed to disclose who he was.  I didn't do anything until the deal fell apart.   He got really lucky that I hadn't printed out the broker version prior to the conversation.  He also got lucky that I wasn't able to print a second copy while we were speaking.  I had just bought a new printer and was having a bad time with the printer drivers on Windows which is needed for the MLS. There were several days when I couldn't use a printer on Windows and it was during that period of time.  Stupidity and bad luck on my part.   As for the rest, it wasn't a violation - just a terrible negotiation with a total jackass. The riders in the contract were absurd and the inspection revealed why he wanted them.  There was a minefield of problems with the bathroom plumbing ($$) and he was making sure it was the future owners headache and not his.  When he wouldn't discuss appropriate changes their attorney and I recommended that my clients walk away from the deal- which they did. He had another buyer on the hook who (apparently) agreed to his terms - but for less money. 

As far as the other situation with keys.  That had nothing to do with the above situation. I just have no more patience with people who try to control listings in that way. I'm with a smaller brokerage and we can't get away with garbage like that. Selling internally would be a very unusual event for us.  Some of the bigger brokerages try to shop the listing internally and make it as difficult as possible for other brokerages to show their listings, by dragging the agents  all over the place for keys.  Some very big fish do this and it is an enormous waste of time and money.  Gas is expensive and getting a parking ticket is worse.  But I am often forced to park illegally when I have to pick up keys. 

03/03/2008 12:26 AM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Ruthmarie,

Bill Roberts sent me here, I'll go back and thank him.

I totally agree from the beginning to: "NRA got greedy" I agree with your conclusions, you just missed some facts. The NRA sold out in late 1974 or early ‘75 when they agreed with the FTC to reduce education standards to no more that the individual states licensing requirements.

From there it's a matter of semantics.

I do totally agree about education.

I disagree about the COE, it totally depends on the local Board and varies from one to another. When the dregs take control you get what you voted for.

All in all one great and revelant blog. Well done.

Bill

William J Archambault Jr

The Real Estate Investment Institute

 

03/03/2008 01:51 PM by William J Archambault Jr (The Real Estate Investment Institute )


Ruthmarie,

The lack of proper disclosure on the part of your "friend" was significant.  Fortunately, you found out and were able to advise your buyers accordingly.   I encourage you to talk with one of the technicians who manage your MLS provider's program.  I suspect they can establish when changes to the listing were made, by whom and what the changes were.  That gives you the chronology of when the disclosure was made and makes your case.   Go for it!!

03/03/2008 02:03 PM by Bill Schwent - Santa Fe broker (RE/MAX Capital)


Ruthmarie, we're quickly moving into a post-MLS world in the sense that listings, sales data, and estimates will be available to everyone, not just MLS members.  I agree that a listings publisher has to have rules and sanctions to ensure quality data, but that only relates to getting data into the system.  Anyone will be able to pull data from the system.  Competition from Zillow, Trulia, and other outside listings publishers has forced the industry's hand on that issue. 

As for funding the MLS, I hate to sound insulting, but the industry has been duped into overfunding a bunch of mom and pop software developers over the past two decades.  Imagine your local AOR forcing you to pay someone to develop word processing software or spreadsheet software.  That would be an absurd, unthinkable waste of money, yet the industry did precisely that by creating numerous companies to develop local or regional MLS platforms instead of a single standard platform. 

The people who oversaw this local development were generally non-technical, so many local MLS developers were able to palm off lousy software on a captive audience.  Regardless of your position on who gets to enter data and who gets to access data, the end of the locally owned, controlled, and developed MLS is a boon to the industry that will save brokers and agents millions of dollars per year that had been spent on redundant local development.

Frank Jewett

03/03/2008 02:36 PM by Frank Jewett (tech4REpros)


William - what were the standards BEFORE the change.  Interesting that this was quite a while ago...even I was just a little kid at the time (and I'm getting up there.) Was there a national standard that went beyond State licensing requirements?  Interesting if true. I've never heard of it befoe. 

As to the COE - I just see an awful lot of "skirting" around things in the name of shopping the brokerage for a higher split and trying to double-end.  That might be unique to our area.  The splits for newer agents most brokerages are very poor in NY and it makes the desire to double-end particularly strong. Also, the NUMBER of deals is small and the percentages offered are not great - lower on both scores by a long shot  than in the rest of the country.  That creates a lot of pressure to squeeze  the most out  of every transaction.  What I see may be the result of that squeeze.  Loved the comment about the "dregs!"  To me it probably has more to do with the "culture" in some of the brokerages - not all by any means - but enough of them to create problems.

03/03/2008 02:40 PM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Interesting Bill, I never thought of that possibility.  I thought that once he modified it - it was "gone." I guess it was a misconception based on the fact that we see all the STATUS CHANGES to a listing, but not simple corrections. I thought the MLS would not bother to "save those."

03/03/2008 02:43 PM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Ruthmarie,

I don't remember the exact classes I was taking so many back then, but they were substantial. I believe we had one year to finish them. In Kalamazoo we had additional local classes we had to attend.

The FTC gave the NAR the choice between eduction requirements or open up the MLS to non-realtors.

Bill

03/03/2008 02:51 PM by William J Archambault Jr (The Real Estate Investment Institute )


Ruthmarie, GREAT post.  My feeling (quite unpopular) is that hindsight has played a big role in the distaste by consumers for the real estate contingent.  "My house only took three days to sell, yet I paid x amount", "My Realtor got me into this mess, after I overpaid", etc.  There was never, at least in NY, an understanding from real estate companies that, with properties escalating hugely,  consideration was due to the consumer, as in, "It's only going to take a day to sell, so we'll give you a break on costs."  Should real estate brokers have addressed this in some way? Yes, but not after the fact- hindsight is killing the reputation of real estate agents right now.  Go ahead- slam my opinion, which is all that it is.  Again, great post- thank you.

03/03/2008 05:03 PM by Options Realty


Thanks William - it would be really interesting to find out what had been required.  My broker may have "just" missed that.  I think he started in the late 70s.  When I was a kid, we had a house rental situation. My mother had worked with a woman named Mary Nelson.  She took on the man who is now my broker - he was introduced to me as "Mr. Vrooman." So one of his first experiences as an agent was dealing with some tenants my mother had in the house - who quite literally - nearly blew the place up - while simultaneously almost burning it down!  No kidding.  Bill Vrooman survived (as did the house) and took over the brokerage when Mrs. Nelson died.  But that was in the late 1970s - so I have to find out whether he was an agent before I remember him. But I digress...

It is very interesting that the choice was to either have stronger education or a more open MLS...you are right - they sold out.  

03/03/2008 06:04 PM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Laurie:  i couldn't agree with you more. The "line" I was given when I started during the height of the boom was:  "we can't predict the markets nor are we responsible for them."  There was also this "leave the mortgage to the mortgage professionals. Many of these unusual mortgages can get them into the house and SAVE THE DEAL."

Nopers....not any where near good enough!  What I did was try to find the most STABLE situation for people. Either by force of luck (because I was brand new) or good raw instincts, what I did worked out. I can proudly say that NO ONE lost their shirts.  I was fortunate in that my first clients were savvy enough to take facts, distill them and make the correct purchasing decisions. There was one loan that I was worried about, but fortunately, the buyer saw the light and got a different loan.  Most people bought for the long haul - which is always a positive and I can't think of anyone who could possibly be upside down unless they took at further loans later on.  

Granted my prime stomping ground has been remarkably stable with mild appreciation, but there are pockets in our area that did not fare so well.  So part luck, part good instinct, part - YIKES - these people have their financial lives in my hands - DON'T BLOW IT!

03/03/2008 06:13 PM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


One of the most brilliantly written posts I've read in a while.  You are so absolutely right, and in my opinion, with the floodgates opening with discounters listing homes for the price of lunch at McDonald's (don't even get me started on discounters!) we are disrespected as bottom-dwellers and thus think the MLS should be opened to everyone.  What a free-for-all that would be!  Lord help us if that ever happens!

 

03/07/2008 08:10 PM by Jacki & Jerry Shafer, The Shafer Real Estate Team (The Shafer Real Estate Team, Keller Williams Louisville East)


Hi Jacki and Jerry,

Thanks for th complements.  I am not big on discounters either.  They have their place in the scheme of things, but people need to know what they are getting.   But it all has to be related tot he low standards we have for licensing and the poor service many offer for FULL commission.  Here is the problem for consumers: everyone has a nightmare story about a Realtor.  The consumer often doesn't know what they are getting. Why pay for full service if you are very likely to get a dud who is looking for a fat check and has no intention giving the service or setting up the systems required to perform full service?  Because we allow SO MANY PEOPLE to obtain licenses and in many parts of the country virtually ALL OF THEM are Realtors, these bad apples spoil it for everyone else.

We have to RAISE educational standards. At the very least a 2-year degree - of some kind - should be required and a year devoted to training for real estate. 

One of the reasons it is felt that it is OK to"open up" the MLS is because literally "almost anyone" can get a State License AND can become a Realtor. It isn't seen in the same light as licensing for other professions.  So we have to make it more difficult to get a license - uphold SOME KIND OF STANDARD for full service agents or the pressure to "open it all up" will increase. 

 

 

03/08/2008 12:14 PM by Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)


Great comment about zillow. It got me laughing! I hate that site, but I submit my listings anyway..

04/08/2008 12:10 AM by Christopher Watters, Realtor - Greater Austin Texas Area (Texas Ranch & Home Realty)


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Real Estate Agent: Ruthmarie Hicks (Keller Williams Realty)
Ruthmarie Hicks
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