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To test or not to test?

So I have decided to actually ask a real question related to home inspections rather than continue to harp on the conflict of interest thing (at least for a little while :-)

My question relates to the testing of Radon as an added service to the regular home inspections. I already do Mold testing, and WDI inspections and thought for a while about adding Radon monitoring. Now I have seen these Siren pro series 3 continuous Radon monitors selling on the Internet for 119.95. I have also seen my competition charging upwards to 250.00 for a 48 hour Radon test. My question is this...Why would a client pay 250.00 for a one time Radon test, when they can buy these monitors for 119.95 and monitor Radon in the home all year long?

I am not so sure I could sleep at night if I added Radon testing to my services because of this. Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Am I missing something? Is there a difference?

Peace

Safety Siren Pro Series 3 Radon Gas Detector Monitor

Posted by MC2 Home Inspections Indianapolis Avon Plainfield Brownsburg Indiana on 03/24/2008 01:29 PM

Comments (14)

radon, inspection, inspections, inspector, inspectors, air quality, gas

14 Comments on To test or not to test?

MAR

2008

WOW.

They use test canisters here (not sure what particularly) and charge $75 for the service.

I have a Safety Siren pro series 3 in my home.

While it's more than adequate for home uses, it's not a True continuous Radon Monitor. While it does give an average within 2 days, it does not graph in real time like the more sophisticated monitors that the Radon Professionals use.

Also, since the test is not performed by a registered Radon Professional, it's not really "binding" in the case of an agreement of sale with a Radon Contingency (generally).

To give an owner an idea of what the level is, it's a nice little device but unlike a "true" C.R.M. you can simply open a window or door, move the unit, cover the unit etc and manipulate the results. A Commercial C.R.M. does not allow that as there is an alarm for tampering.

Also, the "consumer units" are not calibrated the same way. A "warning" on the unit suggests calibration with a "standard" Radon Test method" once a year to verify the results.

I can answer any questions you have about the Safety Siren though..

I've had a few clients do radon testing and, because there are so many different variables that affect the results (temperature, vacancy, window seals, etc.), I would think you may be better off letting the buyer find their own resource. There does seem to be a large discrepancy in the prices.

Good luck!

Can you tell me what the professionals use and how much does it cost?

My whole thing about this is that it will cost me near 600.00-800.00 just to get certified, licensed, insured for Radon testing here in Indiana and that doesn't even count the cost of whatever these professional units cost. I am having a hard time justifying doing all of this when they have products out on the market like the Siren 3.

Thanks for all the input

Thanks Jackie

Mike, if your state regulates radon testing then you do not have the option about the training and certification. You can purchase a good Sun Nuclear 1027 (CRM's) for around $600. That is all you have to purchase. Once a year you need to send the CRM off for calibration, this will cost around $100. I have 4 machines and on the average have 3 of them out in homes every week. I'm in Middle Tennessee and we are considered to be a high radon area so testing is fairly common. It is not unusual to have readings over 8pcL or twice the EPA action level. As for the $250 fee, that is really high. Most CRM testing in my area ranges from $100 to $125 if done at the same time as a home inspection.

With the CRM you can provide instant results for a real estate transaction. This allows the buyer to get the seller to install a mitigation system in the home. This is the main reason for testing before the contract is finalized.

The EPA has set protocols for homes that are being sold or short term test. Your state might even have required protocols as well, you would need to check on that.

The little machine that you show in the picture is not designed for short term radon testing. What we are looking for in testing is an average reading over the period of time that the machine is in place. 48 hours is the shortest test time for a real estate transaction.

Stay away from the canisters. Each test requires (2) canisters per EPA guidelines. If someone is only using (1) canister per test, that is not a valid test. Once the test is done you have to send them to a lab for reading. With a CRM you just read the machine.

Radon testing is a very honest business as you are testing for the second largest producer of lung cancer. Unlike mold testing, Radon testing is a science that has it's protocols established by the EPA. We know that readings above 4pCl is the action level for the United States so anything over this reading is an issue.

MAR

2008

Thanks for the info Scott. I am not sure how Indiana ranks as far as Radon levels. According to the Maker of the Siren 3, it is supposed to be able to do the short term 48 hour test that you are talking about, but you are saying that it doesnt? I have also heard from locals that there are actually "Radon testers" who use this little machine when doing Real estate Radon tests?? I am definitely going to look into that and everything else before I make such a large investment.

Granted mold testing isn't a science YET, but mold is a huge issue just like Radon. The kits they sell to the homeowner for Mold testing are useless, whereas the Radon monitors appear to actually work.

Thanks for the rest of the information though I really appreciate it.

Hi Mike, glad to help. The Sire 3 might work according to the manufacturer's but you have to follow the correct protocols for testing. I do not know anything about the Siren 3, but if it does not produce a record of the testing it would be almost useless for the type of testing needed for real estate transactions.

Mike,

Here in NJ, the average cost for a radon test is about $125.00. Like Scott, I use the Sun Nuclear 1027 (I have 7 of them). It's the initial start-up cost of buying them. Once that's clear, the monitors are actually cheaper to operate than the canisters.

One note on Scott's post (just so everyone understands); here in NJ, one canister is considered to be a valid test.

95% of my home inspections include a radon test.

Darren

www.aboutthehouseinspections.com

Succasunna NJ

MAR

2008

I had no idea that one could purchase an in-home monitor for so little.

Here's a suggestion - if you are feeling conflicted about selling this service to your clients, why not give the client a choice as to whether you do it - or they spend the money for the in-home test.

But here's where I can see the benefit of having you conduct the test before the Buyer closes on the home. If there is a Radon problem, it would be great if s/he knew about it before closing so that it can be remediated before closing. Otherwise, the Buyer will become responsible when they're trying to sell the home later.

MAR

2008

Mike,

Looks like radon is prevelant in Indiana. Most of your state is in the red (highest radon potential) according to the EPA. I think it would be a valuable service for you to add. I would have trouble sleeping if I were inspecting houses in Indiana and not providing radon testing. It should not be an option, your clients NEED it. Get certified and price accordingly. You will sleep just fine.

MAR

2008

Thanks for the advice Wes. My whole thing really is this. If I were buying a home and paid someone say even 125.00 for a one time Radon test only to find out a few weeks later that I could have purchased one of these models for 120.00, actually own it and have the protection year round, I would be highly upset. I would, as a consumer feel like I just got taken advantage of. (I know that is not the case), but I am just putting myself in the consumers shoes and forgetting that I know anything about this.

And Darleen, I see what you are saying about having the home tested before closing. That does make sense, although I am sure the seller doesn't like that too much as they would be the ones that would ultimately have to pay for the remediation. (doesn't seem really fair as it really isn't their fault if they have high radon levels) it isn't like they just neglected the home causing it to need a lot of work.

I guess in my opinion, if someone wanted to buy a home because they really liked it, they would be the ones that would take care of any remediation if necessary. To me it would be like not having smoke detectors in the home, the consumer buys the home with no smoke detectors, doesn't put any in themselves and there is a fire. Would that be the sellers fault? Certainly not. I think that education for the consumer is the key. People need to know about these kinds of products like the Siren 3 that ARE out on the market that can save them money and keep them protected. I know that most inspectors offer Radon testing to their clients and thats all well and good, as for me I will not. I would think that my clients would appreciate the fact that I am honest with them in telling them about products like these. I am sure not too many people would do that, I guess thats what makes me a little different (That one was for you Charles :-)

Thanks guys!!

Charles, You have a very interesting point of view. I can't say I disagree with it. Having your clients best interest in mind is admirable. You seem to be very objective which is also an admirable virtue.

All others: The rest of this post is not a response to Charles' point, but just an idea that popped into my head while I was reading his post and the previous posts.

Maybe offer the certified radon test (for what you think is a fair price) with your preferred method of regulated testing, stating that it is a legally binding test, while also making your client aware that they can purchase their own residential grade monitor. After all, you would still be providing a valuable service and fully disclosing their options. Besides, some clients simply want things done by professionals because they are unsure they would know what to do, and they want your professional advice if a question does arise. Also, maybe the sellers want to know that they have a high concentration of radon.

You don't really know what your clients want until you ask them. Most of the inspectors here are experienced, so I'm sure you all know, different clients think differently and respond to the same situation in different ways.

APR

2008

We probably have some Radon here but it doesn't seem to be an issue. Most of our basements here are swimming pools. The water table is 24 inches.

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