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When GFI Receptacles Do More Than They Are Supposed To Do

By
Home Inspector with Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC 3380-000723

I often find other electrical problems when GFI receptacles do more than they are supposed to do.

Why would that be?

Because an improperly-wired GFI receptacle indicates unprofessional work.

And in houses that have been substantially remodeled, there is usually unprofessional work. 

UNPROFESSIONAL WORK IN ONE PLACE WILL IS THE TIP OFF TO UNPROFESSIONAL WORK ELSEWHERE.  AND IF WIRING, OR PLUMBING, OR SOMETHING ELSE THAT I CAN SEE IS A PROBLEM, I ESPECIALLY WORRY ABOUT WHAT I CAN'T SEE.

Like Uncle Martin on the TV show "My Favorite Martian" (my favorite TV show in fourth grade), I have antenna that go up when something impresses me on a home inspection.

My antenna have been known to poke builders in the eyes.  And sellers, and Realtors, and others...

A GFI receptacle - AKA GFCI - is a "Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter."   The GFI receptacle, or circuit breaker, is a safety device.  It is intended to prevent people from electrical shock.

In a GFI receptacle the neutral slot is the larger one on the left.  The hot is the smaller right slot.  When things are properly wired, electricity flows from hot to neutral.

The GFI device is constantly monitoring that flow.  If there is any imbalance or interruption, even as small as 4 or 5 milliamps, the device will shut off the receptacle, and anything else wired to it.  And if working right it can shut things off in as little as 1/30th of a second.

On a home inspection I test every one.  I tripped this one.  You can see that the little green light is off.  It is located beside the lower ground hole on the lower outlet.

When I did the fridge turned off!

The fridge is not supposed to turn off when the GFI is tripped.

Similarly, when the other GFI in the kitchen was tripped, the dishwasher turned off!

And, not surprisingly, when the GFI in the newly-remodeled bathroom was tripped, the lights and fan turned off!

While consistency is important, in this case it indicates a consistent lack of understanding of electrical wiring.

AND THEREFORE THE JOB WAS NOT DONE BY AN ELECTRICAL PROFESSIONAL.  THEREFORE THERE WAS NO PERMIT FOR THE WORK.

In this case the fridge, dishwasher and bathroom lights and fan should not be controlled by a GFI receptacle, or that circuit.  These other appliances or fixtures should be dedicated or independent.

My recommendation:  home inspectors have antenna!  Really.  It's true.  They will look, and sniff, and test and evaluate, especially when a home is touted to be "newly remodeled!"  And any opinion or finding by your home inspector will be objective.

 

 

Posted by

Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC  

Based in Bristow, serving all of Northern Virginia.

Office (703) 330-6388   Cell (703) 585-7560

www.jaymarinspect.com


Comments(25)

James Dray
Fathom Realty - Bentonville, AR

I don't mess with anything electrical and leave it to those who know it best. 

Sep 20, 2014 09:39 PM
TeamCHI - Complete Home Inspections, Inc.
Complete Home Inspections, Inc. - Brentwood, TN
Home Inspectons - Nashville, TN area - 615.661.029

 Good morning Jay. I have seen all sorts of goofy stuff when it comes to electrical wiring. And you are right, home inspectors do have antennas that go up when goofy things happen.

Sep 20, 2014 09:44 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Anita - it's those cheap amateurs who are the most expensive.

James - woulda, coulda, and shoulda - but apparently on another world.

Michael - mine can get quite long, hence the poking.

Sep 20, 2014 09:49 PM
Lenn Harley
Lenn Harley, Homefinders.com, MD & VA Homes and Real Estate - Leesburg, VA
Real Estate Broker - Virginia & Maryland

HA!  I'd have a fine time writing the repair addendum for that home inspection report.  It would, of coure, begin with a request for the closed permits for the work done.

Sep 20, 2014 10:39 PM
Tom Arstingstall, General Contractor, Dry Rot, Water Damage Sacramento, El Dorado County - (916) 765-5366
Dry Rot and Water Damage www.tromlerconstruction.com Mobile - 916-765-5366 - Placerville, CA
General Contractor, Dry Rot and Water Damage

The GFCI receptacle has been long misunderstood Jay, it just wants to help. It must have been misdirected in its youth. 

Sep 21, 2014 12:23 AM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

This is a single lady, late 60s, wanting to purchase a house she doesn't have to worry about Lenn.  For the work I found for sure there were no permits.  And how would they be obtained and closed at this point?  The basement bathroom, for example, wasn't there until recently, and opens to the garage.  The ceiling in the room is 6'4".  They had to cut the door off to accommodate the ceiling height.  That left a 1" gap at the top of the door!  Right into the garage...

I bet it has issues with its mother Tom. 

 

Sep 21, 2014 12:57 AM
Donna Foerster
HomeSmart Realty Group - Parker, CO
Metro Denver Real Estate Assistant

Jay~ That was a cute show! I can just imagine your antenna going up as you walked through the house you described. One bad GFI is trouble enough, but 3! Yeesh!

Sep 21, 2014 12:39 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Donna - as I remember, Uncle Martin's antenna helped him read minds.  Glad I can't do that!

Sep 21, 2014 07:06 PM
Raymond E. Camp
Ontario, NY

Good morning Jay,

This is how an amateur gets curly hair!

Make yourself a great day.

Sep 21, 2014 11:39 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Raymond - it doesn't take the generational genetics thing when done electrically.  Much quicker.

Sep 22, 2014 12:42 AM
Donald Hester
NCW Home Inspections, LLC - Wenatchee, WA
NCW Home Inspections, LLC

Jay,

 

You are right there should be dedicated circuits to the specific areas, such as kitchens, bathrooms, laundry room etc... That being said a refer can be on the kitchen circuit and many times they are just they are upstream of he GFCI's.

Now depending on what code rule you are under it may need to be GFCI protected (within 6 feet of sink).

 

The dishwasher should not be on that circuit but again if you are under the 2014 NEC it should be GFCI protected.

Ah rules are so much fun ;)

Sep 22, 2014 04:10 AM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Don - this was supposedly all done in the last couple of years, although not this year.  Nonetheless, any fridge on any GFI is dumbass.  It could trip because of a lightning strike nearby while the people are away on a 2 week vacation and drain water all over the house from melting ice and such!  And around here all that venison gets trashed!  That would be blasfeeeemus!

I notice builders are putting the fridge well away from the sink in new construction.  Smart.  A lot of new homes here come with a fridge and freezer side by side.  Away from the sink for both is smarter.

The nannies won't be satisfied until we're all dead.  And the roaches take over.

In either case, neither kitchen circuit GFI should turn off the fridge or dishwasher.

Sep 22, 2014 06:56 AM
Sally K. & David L. Hanson
EXP Realty 414-525-0563 - Brookfield, WI
WI Real Estate Agents - Luxury - Divorce

Sellers do not realize the "domino effect" that can go on when one thing is done by the not so handy person and not a licensed professional.

Sep 22, 2014 11:01 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

One thing often leads to another S&D.  And not very often for the better!

Sep 23, 2014 02:55 AM
Charles Buell
Charles Buell Inspections Inc. - Seattle, WA
Seattle Home Inspector

Lightning is messy business.  A direct lightning strike on your electrical system mast is going to mean you simply replace everything that is damaged---including your GFCI's.  A lightnigh strike even nearby can damage sensitive sensative electronics and why homes need surge protection in the service panel and at point of use of electronics.  It is smart to always test your gfci devices after a lightning storm.  Keep in mind that a lightnight strike to the ground near your house will be "collected" by your house grounding system and energize all of your connected ground wires throughout your home for a split second.  They can make lunch of your GFCI and AFCI devices.  Surge protection devices in homes is becomming more and more critical.  If you live in a lightning prone area, ligthing arrest sytems for the home is probably a good idea.  You could argue that the GFCI device for the frige gives it a level of "surge protection" it might not otherwise have

Sep 27, 2014 09:20 AM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Lightning around here does in AFCIs, Charlie.   I tell my clients that all the time.  I've seen it trip GFIs too, but that would follow necessarily.  If your big freezer in the garage is full of venison, after the big season, and it turns off one day and nobody knows, well, bummer!

And I am seeing more and more surge protectors inside panels boxes.

Sep 27, 2014 09:29 AM
1~Judi Barrett
Integrity Real Estate Services 116 SE AVE N, Idabel, OK 74745 - Idabel, OK
BS Ed, Integrity Real Estate Services -IDABEL OK

Richy Johnson in Ada, Ok is one of my favorite professionals.  He is a Home Check home inspector and often comes to Idabel to inspect homes for my clients.  He has very good antenna too!

Sep 27, 2014 09:40 AM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Good to hear Judi.  Mine have not only gotten more sensitive over the years, but I have sharpened them too!

That's a long drive!

Sep 27, 2014 09:43 AM
Charles Buell
Charles Buell Inspections Inc. - Seattle, WA
Seattle Home Inspector

Anyone that has a freezer that does not have an alarm to let them know the power is off probably deserves to have to stuff themselves and all their friends on thawed venison :)

Sep 27, 2014 10:26 AM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

I was in a garage once with an odd odor I could not place.  There was a chest freezer in the closet with stuff all around it.  Opening it we discovered the source of the odor...  it has been off for a long while!

Sep 27, 2014 10:45 AM