This is why people should not use new or young RE agents. They are clueless and have not learned their business!

Experience is a real key in this business.

Go find a mentor

I stopped cold calling years ago...i mad a good living with it until the list came out and spent too much time looking all the do not call numbers up...I'd rather send out my expired letters.

This is exactly how I handle expired listings Lissa and works.  People are bombarded from all sides in the information age in which we live...  Adding to that with phone calls and pesky door knocking, just upsets them further.  Approaching the issue as a friend that wants to help works so much better and it really attracts the ones you would WANT for clients, and we all know what I mean when I say WANT...  Thanks for a great posting and keep on working those expireds!  Steve

As a newer, but not so young RE agent, I am a bit dismayed by Scott's response.  I am in the process of working on EXPIREDS by following up with a mailing several weeks AFTER the expiration date.  My second mailing includes an offer of  Home Warranty paid for by me, at closing.  I also approach these sellers with the question, "Aside from the fact that the home did not sell (and that is HUGE), what gave you the most issues with your RE experience?"  If Scott doesn't need to do this "fishing," good for him!  But I guess we aren't all in the same place.

Lissa, I must say your headline caught my attention. "Expired homeowner" sounds like they're recently deceased. I believe it's the listing that expired.

I know that there will always be a certain number of expired listings every day especially in this market, but agents, new and experienced, need to be more selective on which properties to list.  If an owner won't listen to your recommendation on preparing their home and pricing it, then you need to move on.  Sometimes too many agents want an over-priced listing just to have a listing and it hurts everyone.

Lisa, I agree.  I would be very annoyed with phone calls too.  I do send a series of letters.  My thoughts are that if they are still interested in selling they will read the letter; if they are not they will throw it out.  I have a listing now because I mailed but did not call.  The owner told me that if I would have called she would not have considered listing with me.

Lissa - Chin Up!  We can't - and really don't want - to get them all.  Do the right thing and the right thing will happen.  Scott's a bit harsh, I agree!  Your attitude is great and you're on the right track.  The key is to always tell the truth.  I know this may surprise you but, in our profession, some agetns don't alway tell the truth.  Lying for a listing is a common tactic but not the right way to go about it!

Lissa,

Dang!  If I called someone on the Do Not Call list, it's a potential $11,000 fine!  Isn't it the same for agents?

Mike in Tucson

Hey Lissa...

Great post.      I am with Lin about Scott's response...       Not only because I am new realtor, but just because everyone has to start somewhere.        I am not big for cold calling or door knocking, but I will do it at as a last resort to get in contact with someone.          Too all the rookie realtors out there...     Keep on keepin on.

Your blog is always great to read!

Scott,

your response to this excellent post goes with my opinion of the "bad" used car salesman...

Lissa, working expired listings is one of the best ways of getting business whether you are new to the business or have been in the business for years. The homeowner was right though, calling expired listing owners who are on the Do Not Call Registry is a violation of the law and the caller is subject to the $11,000 penalty. There is an Established Business Relationship Exemption, if the listing is your listing or a previous listing in your office unless the homeowner specifically asks that you do not call them.

Deep doing what you are doing. Good Post!

Scott, Itsnot a matter of being a newer agent but rather on following the law and having respect for another person's privacy. I know there are many agnets who have been around for a long time who are pushy and act like a used car salesman. (not all car salesmen are bad either).

Scott: I disagree. The agent's in this area that pester the seller have been in the business for 10+ years. And they still call these people at 6:00 in the morning. The new ones lack the confidence to make these calls and show up at the door. A new agent has not yet had time to develop bad habits either.

When it comes down to it, we are here to provide a service. There are great agents out there that want to help the owner sell their house and want to help the buyer find one that they are happy with. I can't speak for all, but I myself do not want every listing out there. It cost me too much time and money to have a listing that doesn't sell.

Thanks for your opinion.

Neal: I hate telemarketers, therefor, I choose not to be one. In this area, you might find phone numbers for a small percentage of the owners and only a handful of those aren't on the do not call list.

Steve Homer: Thanks for your support. I always try to give them time to "cool down" after being approached by every other agent in town.

Lin: Keep up the good work. It is my opinion that just because a listing did not sell, doesn't mean the owner no longer wishes to have it sold.

Steve Hoffacker: Sorry, I hadn't had enough coffee when I wrote it. But then, it got your attention. Thanks for stopping by.

Lisa,  there are many ways to find new clients.  For many agents, cold calling FSBO's and expired listings works great and there are many who make a good living just by doing that.  As far as the do not call list, if you are careful and have well thought out scripts, you can avoid penalties.  You are not allowed to call to solicit for a listing; but you are not breaking the law to call for other reasons (i.e. find out more about the property - see if they still want to sell it if you have a buyer, etc.)  If I do call expireds, I begin by asking a question about the property (not breaking the law yet).  If they are the type of person who would report me to the DNC authorities then I will get a sense for that right away when they jump down my throat and yell at me for calling as soon as they find out I am a real estate agent.  If they yell and rant then I simply hang up and I have never actually broken the law since I never solicited them for anything.  If, however I am able to build enough rapport by asking a few questions about the property then I will proceed with gradually crossing the line.  With that said, I actually do very little of this because I'm honestly not that effective at that kind of sales.  I do much better by getting involved in my community and networking with neighbors and consistently following up with those that I have had the opportunity to meet.

Dan: I agree. Overpricing is a huge reason there are so many expired listings.

Patty: My view point, exactly. You go girl!

Lisa: Those are the agents that make it difficult for the rest of us! If only it were easier for the public to differentiate us.

Mike: It is! Some don't even think about looking at the list though. Maybe they will after they have to come up with $11,000.

I think you need to keep doing what you are doing so that you can find your niche!  Go for it!

Chris: I find it best to send mail. If they want to read it, they have that option. If they don't call me, they aren't interested in having me working on their side. The only way I will call or knock on the door is if I have a serious client that has expressed an explicit interest in that particular property. Don't give up on expireds. As I said earlier, just because it didn't sell the first time, doesn't mean the owner doesn't want it sold.

Wow. $11,000. Who came up with that. Somebody must have really been mad at telemarketers. I just tell them I'm not interested. Some people are afraid of sales people though.

I stop be the homes that are on the expired list and just say hello.  Maybe I am being too pushy.

Dave: This is an example of why some people rate us the same. Thanks for stopping by.

Michael: They certainly have a valid point. I guess it's because I don't have a habit of calling, but I was unaware of the Established Business Relationship Exemption. Thanks for bringing that to my attention.

Richard: Thanks for the comment. We are not all bad. I wish there was an easy way to prove that to people. But then, I wish there weren't so many pushy agents. In this business, it's a case of guilty till proven innocent.

Matthew:I believe the expired and FSBO areas can be very profitable for some. If done right. There is a high percentage of expired listings in my area. I know the owners want to sell and I know my buyers want to find the right home for them. To me, it just makes sense to get them back on the market.

Renee: Thank you for your support. I wish I knew who "Realtors Stop The Harrassment" is. I'm sure that after having a chance to vent and seeing who I am when it comes to the business, they would feel more comfortable with the idea that not all of us are bad.

scott: that is a very broad statement to make. you were new once and wanted business and didn't want to be discriminated against. when i was new, i guess you can still consider me new because i've only been licensed for 3yrs but anywho...i made my living selling properties that "experienced" realtors couldn't. i didn't have a mentor but i knew not to act like i knew something i didn't know. i had the sense to ask someone who did and i have yet to have a client give me anything but praise.

i shouldn't have read this,lol it only confirms my discomfort with cold calling and door knocking,lol

Kevin: I don't really think stopping by to say "Hello" is being pushy. I think that the owner thinks it's pushy. They are overwhelmed by the number of agents that stop or call. I'm sure it can be frustrating for them. Like around election time when every politician knocks on your door while you're enjoying dinner with the family.

Dee: I'm glad you did read it. You reinforced a belief by doing so. And you're right. Every one of us was new at one time. We all had to start some where. And we all have formed our own habits, whether good or bad. Where does the experience come from otherwise?

There are holes in the DNC registry that allow an agent to contact the owner of an expired listing.  However, you can't sell to them.  But, you can ask them questions, and follow up from a mailing to make sure they got it.  The problem is that phone calls are WAY more effective at securing appointments than letters.  

But I hate getting the calls, and I hate making them.  I don't make many at all... and that is one of the problems I face. 

That is the same comment I get from Expireds....they will call me up and tell me how all the Realtors are the same...They are all calling and bombarding the expireds.  So if we all stop....they wont have anyone call....lol  I dont think we will ever get a happy medium.   What if you could dominate your market place so you dont have to call them...they just call you! :)

Lane: You're not alone. I will not make that call unless I have a serious buyer that has expressed an interest in that particular home. I will agree that those that do call seem to be more effective in obtaining the listing though.

Dave: That is my ultimate goal. Eventually, maybe it'll happen.

Lissa.  Real estate is a numbers game, always has been, I'm guessing always will be.  Consequently, whether you call, knock, email or otherwise, 90% (made up number) are going to be disgruntled with your contact - but that's great news!  That means if you knock on 10 expired doors a day, ONE is NOT going to be disgruntled and will listen to you.  If you have a 10% close rate (which is really good), that means every ten expired that are NOT disgruntled (one every ten days if you knock ten times a day) is going to list with you.  That's three listings a month just from expireds.  Nothing wrong with three listings a month from one part of your business!

Door knocking takes longer and has a much higher rejection factor - who wants to have someone angrily close a door on them?  But do you know how much higher your chances of getting them to talk to you is if you're in front of them?  Don't forget above, one out of ten right?  Back when I was one of uneducated Scott's (first comment above) new AND young agents, I would knock on expireds AND fsbos and part of my presentation was to ask them "how many people mailed you?", A: "gazillion", Q: "how many people called you", A: "alot, but less than the mailings", A: "how many people showed up ready to work with an aggressive and guaranteed marketing plan designed to get you the highest possible price in the least amount of time?", A: "only you." "Mr. and Mrs. Expired/FSBO, there's only one reason an agent would call or send mail instead of showing up at your front door ready to aggressively market your home.  They're either afraid or lazy, and can't we both agree that neither of these traits in an agent would increase the chances of you getting the highest possible price for your home?" POW!

EVERYONE mails, EVERYONE calls, you'll be one of the ONLY (if not THE only) agent knocking on the door.  Hmmm, let's see, you can be one of 50 sending mail, one of 30 calling, or unchallenged at the front door?  I like your odds at the front door.  Real estate is full contact.  There may be agents who have gotten expired listings by drip mailing or drip calling but I assure you that it was more accident than design.  Real estate needs to be by design.  Successful real estate is when you can duplicate and predict your results.  Tough to do mailing, tough to do calling, easier to do face to face with a potential home seller.

Best of luck with expireds Lissa!

Folks should take a lesson from Bryant Tutas about expireds. He mails them.  But, he does it with great decipline and consistancy.  He opens the door with a piece of mail. 

I believe it is a great disservice to a home owner to let the listing go to expire.  In my MLS, the listing can be changed to "WITHDRAWN" and does not hit the "expired" list.  I realize that thwarts a lot of agents who mine the expired lists.  But, it's a kind gesture to the consumer. 

Leonard: I've never thought or had it explained to me in that way. It makes sense. I just don't want to seem pushy. I hate pushy people. Thanks for giving me a thought to ponder.

Lissa.  Nine out of the ten WILL think you are pushy, or aggressive, or some other typically negative word generally associated with Realtors.  It's that ONE out of ten that you're knocking for.  It's that ONE out of ten that's going to list with you.  It's that ONE out of ten that's going to help build your business.  It's that ONE out of ten that's going to help you buy that Mercedes! :)

Don't join the masses of mailing and calling out of fear of the nine, knock on the door out of the reward of the ONE.

By the way, don't confuse pushy with aggressive.  Aggressive is one of the most common underlying traits of all successful Realtors.

Hi Lissa, Wow...you brought about some great input with this posting. It's really got me thinking. I use a online card sender that allows me to set up a campaign one time for expireds etc.. then i simply drop a expireds name and address in and it will send out cards on a monthly or weekly basis or however you want to set it up, without me even having to worry about it. If anyone wants more info on the card sender just let me know and i'll show you how to try free demo. Sometimes I think this is the best way since the do not call list went into effect. Like the one fellow said, if they want to read your mail piece they can, and i feel that if they do read it and call you, they are probably going to be the best ones to work with.

Lenn: In this area, alot of agents treat withdrawn listings as expireds and fsbo's. I agree that it is better to have it withdrawn than expired.

Leonard: I like the idea that one of the ten will be willing to work with me. I just had one of those thoughts though. If nine of ten will think I'm pushy, than aren't I reinforcing the belief that REALTORs are scum to that 9?

I have never cold called a FSBO or expired listing.  I detest solicitors, so I don't do it to other people.

I think this is one reason that we are ranked low for professionalism.  I know I don't get cold called by doctors, or CPA's...

David:I used to use canned mail. Until it dawned on me that they were probably receiving the same mail from different agents. That's when I decided to make my own. They are very unique in design, verbiage, and show my personality. Admittedly, I spend too much money on postage, but then the longest "days on market" I've experienced with expireds was 42 days from listing to close. In the long run, it has been worth the time and expense.

Lisa, I agree generally with your points, but one thing I learned is that I can't always apply my opinions about life to other people--I hate phone calls interrupting me and I routinely hang up on them, but yet when I used to make cold calls I could get most people to talk to me! I would still rather contact people on the phone (if it weren't for the do-not-call issues).

Melina: I don't get calls from Dr.s or CPA's either, but I do get flyers and postcards. If I'm not interested, I put them in file 13. How do people don't know you exist or the services you provide if you don't make it known.

YEAH!!!! This is the attitude I wish we all had in this industry. This is a perfect post for my Selling Soulfully forum... Congratulations on the feature.

Lissa.  No, that's a real leap.  Showing up at the door, without appointment is going to irk some people for sure.  But if you, dressed professionally and with a good opening presentation at the door (email me if you want one, I won't bore everyone here with it), you'll get a lot more "no thank yous" with a smile than angry "scum" door slams.

But let's pretend for a moment that all nine DO think you're pushy and you ARE reinforcing the scummy Realtor stereotype (and I completely don't believe this hypothetical by the way but for argument's sake ...) - are you (or your family, or your husband, or the future of your career) better served mailing from a distance, getting lost in a stack of postcards, hoping to get one out of gawd knows how many 100s to call you back or knocking on ten doors a day KNOWING that one is going to talk to you?

The average Realtor makes $30-35K a year ... The average Realtor mails expired postcards ... If you aspire higher, you have do be proactive, you have to do what others won't do or are too afraid to do.

Don't concentrate on all the reasons not to do it, concentrate on all the reasons TO do it.

Lissa Uder, your proactive and aggressive Lebanon Realtor!  Love the way that sounds!

Leonard:Great post, it makes me think. I just started doing a mailing of expireds since I am a newer & younger agent. And your right alot of the door knocking comes from fear. Our team farms our neighborhood once a month and those first few houses are nerve racking and we aren't even always knocking but by the end of the morning, I'm pumped and ready to talk and have some courage.

This is great topic. The need is out there, for these expireds. I'm always looking for a way to increase business.

Yeah, that's a touchy subject.  I know a few Realtors who make quite the living off of intrusive marketing.  It may be legal, but I don't like it when it's done to me...and I don't do it to other people.  So then, how do "nice" agents get the expired listings business?

Lissa, Which ever way you choose to approach expireds the main thing is to be consistent.

Jennifer: Thank You! That's quite a compliment. I'll make sure to check out your group in a little while.

Leonard:  Lissa Uder, your proactive and aggressive Lebanon Realtor!  I like the sound of that too. I'm just very unsure about the whole door knocking thing. It seems so intrusive.

Lissa, I just want to second Leonard's advice.  He is extremely successful in the Dallas market and walks the walk.  He's very well respected.  As for Scott's comment about finding a mentor, I sought one when I first got into residential (from commercial) and found that many experienced agents do not want to mentor young agents and find them annoying.  Just like prospects, 9 out of 10 will reject you I guess but when you do find that 1 out of 10 to mentor you, it's worth it.  I started my own agent exchange group for agents of all levels of experience from various offices and "brands".  We meet monthly and it's been great to exchange ideas and support each other since finding a mentor was challenging.  Good luck to you!

Nichole & Monique: The need is definately there. Just out of curiosity, what are your statistics for listing the homes that you visit?

Tony: That's a good question. I was told by a broker at a different office yesterday that I need to be more pushy, step on more toes, etc. I just don't feel it's in me.

Cameron: I'll bet you learned that from your wife. You know she's right 100% of the time, right? LOL

Valerie: Finding a trustworthy, ethical mentor in this area could be a challenge. I like the idea of your agent exchange group.

I'm not discrediting Leonard. I have found that if I am going to open my mind up to a new idea, I need information and someone to help me see the other side to my belief. He's doing an excellent job of making his points.

We don't usually have any rules or category that says 'no calls' from the Seller after a Listing Expires.  I find that probably 95% of the people who's listings expire end up relisting.......I do call and try not to be too intrusive, and with just a few simple questions.....Hi My Name is ......, and I work with......I noticed your listing just expired.......are you still interested in selling?  A simple yes or no answer is usually what they give.......sometimes we joke about the barrage of phone calls after the Listing has expired vs. before........but its not usually difficult to build some rappore - and at least stay in touch.  Perhaps different markets garner different responses?

Lisa, we agree....the real issue here is why do we feel the need to either tell people why the home did not sell...or let them know we will re-list the home at a lower commission rate...condition, marketing, and price. Unfortunately most agents do not market a home beyond lock box, mls input, and sign out front...they may do a homebook ad just to keep the homeowner happy.

Hi Lissa, Thats what I like about this card system...it allows you to create your own cards. I can put my own pictures on the front of the card and on the inside on the fly, and there is also a bi-fold card that I use as a newsletter. My buyers love the one I send of them in front of their new home after closing.

I don't know if anyone else has had this experience, but i have found that 99% of the time in my area a fsbo has already consulted with a realtor friend, and gotten a cma, then once they cannot take it anymore the realtor friend gets to list it.

Hey Lissa - Great post.  I'm working with Borino's expired plus system, but haven't implemented it because I hate bothering people too.  But his system overall is pretty respectful.  Hope you don't mind.  I wrote a blog, linking back to this one asking a few folks out there how they have found ways to reach out to sellers without p...ing them off.

Hi Lissa, great post.  Cold calls and fsbo's are my downfall.  I hate the thought of them. 

Great points on this post Lissa.

Lissa ~~ I agree with you regarding treating people with respect.   If they lump you together with a bunch of other agents they don't like, you won't have a chance.  You need to differentiate yourself!

Good post! 

Liz: In this area, we have a broker that starts making these calls at 6:00 in the morning. She is a very pushy person that can be extremely hateful if you don't agree with her. She gets them riled up and ruins it for the rest of us.

Amazing how many of the sales seminars base their approach on this exact same strategy.

Lissa, Your just too d**n funny. Guess it's a wife thing. LOL

Congrats on the feature!!!!

Hi Lissa!

You made a wonderful point about considering whether or not you would want a given marketing tactic done to you when deciding on a given marketing plan.  If more people thought this way, we would live in a different world.  As Real Estate Agents, we should act not only as business people, but as stewards of our communities, figuring out new ways to serve people, not just our clients.  People who serve will always make great leaders.  Lets build credibility, not only for ourselves and our businesses, but for this profession as a whole.  The very reason people think we're sharks was well-illustrated by the comment you re-posted into your blog.  Thank you!

Team DiMuria: I know agents that don't even bother with pictures or inputting all the information in the MLS. Drives me nuts. That gives the public yet another reason to hate us.

Why do we feel the need to tell them why their home didn't sell? Hmm...for me, it's because they want or need it to sell and I want to help them. It's just another service. Even if they don't want to list with me, I still appreciate the time to discuss some of the possible problems and solutions with them. It is a learning experience for me as well.

I don't cut my commission to get the listing. In this office, we aren't allowed to. I work very hard for the money I make and have never had anyone complain about my services.

David: Sounds like an interesting system. I agree with your input on the fsbo's. It seems to be the same here.

Thanks Lissa, Go to my website and take the free trial, Kody will come on and talk you through the whole process. sendoutcards.com/3056

Jessica: I've never heard of the Borino system, but I got the site from the blog you mentioned and am going to check it out. I also parked on your post to see the comments.