BRYAN....   they certainly have boomed in the last several months. I think part of the reason though is that so many have lost the true 100% programs. Which in all honesty, an FHA with a DPA was still cheaper in most cases than 100% when it came to rate and MI. And I use to get in heated debates with those that weren't FHA approved, telling me that they were still giving their client a better deal. I even ran numbers back then and still proved them wrong.

MONICA.....  thanks for the compliment.  It certainly is one of the better ways to go, FHA that is. Here is a great example to as why.... FHA loans vs Conventional loans - Knowing the true numbers....

DAVE....   FHA is about 95% of my business right now. I do have 2 clients currently with 700 credit scores, putting down 20% to 35%.  But it's been a few years since I had clients like that. 

Overall, I will be writing a post about this....  that I am able to do more business now, because there are less mortgage programs on the street. Sometimes it would take days to sift through what programs were out there. Now, it's full doc in most cases, FHA or conventional. I am loving it.... 

GARY....  I agree, that the real estate community needs to understand this better... even some loan officers. But especially realtors. I will be writing a blog for the realtor and the seller, showing how to sell this.  Thanks for the polite compliments.

BILL....   you said... "Nor is there any evil in any of the DPA's, they saw a need and fulfilled it. God bless them, they have helped a lot of people buy and sell homes! 600,000, you say, that's alot good!"

That's the part that kills me.  There is a post out there saying that these DPA's are taking advantage of borrowers by charging a fee. As you stated, they saw a need and fulfilled it. So it costs somemoney.  Do away with them and the buyers would need a lot more money out of pocket. You have to love the complainers that want it all....

THESA....   I guess they can be confusing. But most of all, more confusing when people that don't understand them or the value of these DPA's, gives out opinion that sounds like real information that is actually misleading.

VIRGINIA.....  as you, Lenn, and a few other realtors have mentioned, I am going to wrote a blog tomorrow about how a seller and a listing agent can view this and use it to their benefit.

Overall, if listing agents understood more about FHA, that they aren't such a bad program... and how to make a DPA program work, both sides of negotiating would go much smoother.

LENN.....  great answer.  ;o)   Knowing that you know how to handle these types of transaction, which is not very hard, certainly benefits your sellers.  thanks

JANET.....  as mentioned before, I will be writing a post on how to present this to an agent, either a buyer's agent or a listing agent.  Hopefully tomorrow I will do this. Thanks for the polite compliments and good luck with your clients tonight.  Overall, it is very easy to explain, as long as you use the simple explanation of addition and subtraction.  Meaning, if they put an offer in for 100k, but need 5k in help, then they are really buying it for 105k....as long as it truly appraises for this amount.

In how I explain it to the seller or their agent....  80% of all transactions take at least a 94% to 96% offer on their house. If it was comp'd correctly, then giving 6% to 4% back to the buyer at the regular price should not be an issue.

RICHARD.....  the examples that you used in regards to those DPA companies that sent checks, and not wires... scary. Mini scams in my mind. Hence why I just stay with the big boys.. it takes about 2 or less days to receive funds from Nehemiah. I have not had one problem in 8 years of using them.

In regards to putting people in homes that they otherwise should not be buying.  This is a touchy situation by some.  If my clients qualify and I am not pushing the envelope, I don't stop them or tell them that I can't help them.  All I do is educate them... explaining how to save... what to do in case they get in a bind..who to call, etc etc...  letting them know that things happen, don't be a shame of it or a shame of asking for help, and call someone...

AUDREY....  why do people fight in general?  That could be a 100 year debate in itself. I have found in life that more people fight issues when they truly don't know the ins and outs of something.... when they don't know the full facts. And if you think about it, it's easier to fight against something when you think you clearly understand, yet you don't.  Just my opinion, but I think I might be onto something with that one.

RICHARD..... you pretty much hit the nail on the head, which I will try to write about tomorrow. By not understanding the true numbers... or afraid to try and show their seller, in fear that they will lose the listing, it's easier to just turn their heads.  But....  the house might sit longer.  If a good realtor can explain this well, it could open the doors to more listing business. SOme great points... thanks

KARL.......  yes, these can be excellent programs, if explained correctly. And it's great that your sister utilized this program to its maximum.  And the addendum issue?  Sad.. because it's just a little extra work, but to sell a property.  Edcuation on this issue is key.

MATTHEW.....  it does amaze me also....  I always thought that realtors wanted to sell homes.  To me, everyone's money is green.  And money laundering comments?  What is a seller's concession then, when the seller gives money to the buyer, even when the price of the home is raised.????

KRIS.......  wow, 50% of your business?  I had one last month and I am closing 8 this month, to where 3 of them will be using the DPA programs. But yes, it does sell homes and it does get buyers into homes with hardly any money.

CAROL.....   yup, legal and ethical. Why not use it then, if it works.  Thanks for the polite compliment.

CASEY..... exactly, what's a couple hundred.....   in this case, $599 as of next week. Just wondering why so many people make a big deal about this. If it's extra money, then you, the realtor, pick up the cost. Lower your commission if you are so concerned about the seller's money. Make the buyer pay for it... get the lender to pay for it.  Thanks for the compliment.

CAMARILLO....  that's a great point. When a confused or inexperienced loan officer tries to explain this. When I did my first one, I made sure I asked a lot of questions...  learning everything possible. And in all honesty, there isn't much to know about this type of program. It's very easy to use and to explain.

MARIA.....  you would think more listing agents would be opened to these also.  What a great way to try and sell your home. As I have stated, many sellers sell their house about 4% to 6% below their asking price.  So, if you sell at the original asking price, then everyone is happy. .. right?

PATRICIA.....  hhhhmmmm....  I have never had an issue with those working for Nehemiah. As I had mentioned to someone else, the blame could be on the lender or the loan officer, but they make the DPA company look bad. Just a thought...  once I get licensed in DC, hopefully I could open your eyes on this one.  ;o)

TERRIE...... thanks for the compliment.  Glad that you had a smooth transaction. As I have mentioned to a few others, sometimes the negativity of a DPA program thay delayed a settlement might have been an excused used by the loan officer, just to cover up the lender's mistake.  And my pleasure in regards to the links. Hope you find them useful.

PATTY & SCOTT........  that's good to hear. I think if we hear more about the good and not how some of these have failed or delayed settlements, then more realtors would understand that these are very good programs to help sellers sell their homes.  Sellers & Listing agents - One extra way to sell your home !!!!

What ticks me off is that many of these types of closings that don't happen or get delayed is usually because of the lender and not the DPA company. But the loan officer uses this as a way to escape blame and point the finger elsewhere.

STU.......  you make two great points.  But we will always have people argue even the good things in life, just to get noticed, make waves, or just because they love to argue or are negative people.

DAVID C. ......  yes, it's a win-win.  What we need to do is educate more listing agents and sellers out there. That this is a great way to sell a home.  I gave the link to my follow up post in my comment to Patty & Scott.

MIKE J. ...... my pleasure.  And just a FYI, you can Google just about anything in a matter of seconds. I didn't know the website for AmeriDream, so I googled it.  AmeriDream®, Inc

JANET G. ......  yea, I know. Kind of funny... I had a great comment for that post last night, but I deleted it and didn't feel like writing it out all over again. I'll do it tonight, but I feel like it's now been like beating a dead horse...  some people just like to argue, even if their point is off the map and doesn't make that much sense.  just my .02.

JOHN . ......   that is a key point. If these programs are used correctly. And not only that, but if explained correctly.

PETE...... well, 100% financing was talked about in congress, but it never got it's full approval. I think they should leave everything where it's at. As it stands, even with the DPA money, you still need to use some of that money to put at least 2.25% down. At least there is a little equity in the property.

People talk about the fact that there is a higher default rate when using the DPA's. But what would it be if FHA went to 100% financing? Hence why I say, keep it like it is.

JIM L. .......  That is one very good point. That these gift funds don't need to be repaid. Other type of non-profit companies that are part of the state, might have to be repaid, if you sell your house less than 6 years or sometimes 5 years. And in regards to gifts from family members, even though you sign a paper that says you are paying back the gift, you wonder how many agreed to pay it back?

LANRE.......  as I mentioned, we will always have complainers out there.  This is a good program and it has helped over 600,000 people.  Okay, so some have defaulted.  Okay, let's say 3%. That would mean 18,000 people defaulted, yet 582,000 people are still homeowners, living the American Dream. In my honest opinion, a very respectable trade off.  Wouldn't you say?

PAULO.....  each neighborhood is different. The examples that you gave,..  did this really happen?  I have a slight problem with the house that was listed for 199k, but then was listed for 219 with a DPA offer that netted the seller 213.  First off, since I don't know the market, I have no idea if the appraisal was raised when it shouldn't have been.  Secondly, something doesn't sound right, because all the previous information is listed on the MLS, showing what the house was previously listed for. A good realtor will check this out and bring it to the buyers attention. If this was checked, why would I buy a house that is later on, listed for $20,000 more and still end up $14,000 higher than the previous listing price?  I could still have bought it for $205,000 and still received 6k in seller help.

Overall, even if this situation did happen, someone didn't do their homework.  Maybe the blame is on the buyers agent?  In any case, yes, the DPA programs can help sell homes.  Just that this example seems a little odd. Just a few unknowns to think that this was actually a good deal, especially for the buyer.  But thanks for sharing..... 

KORINA.....  there will always be pros and cons on any type of program or deal. It's when you speak to a mortgage professional that can break it down for everyone, so everyone understands. Again, it really comes down to the true value of the house for this to work in the way it was meant to be.

JASON S. .......  thanks for the polite compliments.  yes, everyone needs to see it broken down.... I see that this program doesn't get explained well in many cases.  And if the lender is confused?  How can it be good for all parties involved.  thanks again..

ERIC......  yes, knowledge is power.  And yes, as mentioned many times over, if the appraisal comes in lite, either the seller lowers their price or they need to walk away from the deal.  A good real estate agent will bring this up when negotiating price. You need an exit strategy on the sellers side, when to bail. But if not explained correctly, this is when the negotiations don't get off the ground.

NET ORIGINATOR........   you make some great points.  And yes, when we were in a strong market, DPA's wouldn't be common practice because the seller could pretty much dictate their price.. and buyers would still buy.  In regards to the tax issues with the DPA's, I am not worried about it, because I use Nehemiah. And Nehemiah gives back in some communities...  thanks for the comments.

CHUCK - The N.O.A.H. foundation.......   first off, as much as I respect anyone's comment and opinion, which is what your comment was, opinion...  you said that I am pro-nehemiah.   Most others that read this noticed that I talk about Nehemiah because I have used them before and that I have had a lot of success. Why fix something that is not broken. Since you are unknown, didn't leave a link, it would be hard to ask you a question. But I could go in many directions with this.

For example... do you have a favorite cereal?  A favorite car or manufacturer?  I don't mind change, but when things are good, moving along without a hitch, why should I switch. And I did a search on you, which I will mention later....

Yes, I failed to mention the other types of down payment assistance programs. And yes, the ones that I mentioned, were just clones of the Nehemiah program. See, each state is different, so I can't advise on who to talk to or how do you get a hold of these other DPA's that are given out by the state or townships.  The programs that I mention, can be done in each and every state, and done the same way as the next. The type that you handle through your company?  They are given out differently, depending on the township.  And some have pay backs, if you sell the house or refinance in a certain time period.  I couldn't find this on your site, but I would love to know the answer, that's if you would be upfront with us. Why I might sound negative towards you in my comments coming up?  For two reasons.... you tried to pick me apart, making it sound like I don't know half of what I am talking about.  And as I am showing here, I know a lot more than you gave me credit for.  But you must read my whole comment to appreciate that and to understand this.... depending on what kind of person that you are. Secondly, I read some of your testimonials and I feel that some are false or exaggerated. You couldn't get a 30 yr FHA fixed rate at 4.5% in 2005. There was no coupon out there for that type of pricing. And the testimonial made it sound like they were able to achieve that very low rate because of the help of your assistance programs. That there were special programs. Now, each state has bond money programs... and if that was the case, you didn't mention it. And if it was bond money, you then withheld some important information.. ... Number 1... that this money has to be paid back or has a penalty if you sell the house or refinance, usually in the first 6 years.

And then you go onto say this......   "I doubt that you or any of the responders to your post have ever actually done a true Down Payment Assistance transaction."

Chuck, when you make a statement like that, it shows me that you are a true sale person. You have something that you are trying to convey and sell. The first approach from a true sales person, as I will put this mark on you, is to make the other product look bad.... not worthy. For your information, I have been doing mortgages for almost 16 years. I have done the other types of DPA programs that you have mentioned.  I have done both the city/township and the state monies or bonds.  In many cases, you either need classes or time to accomplish these. In many cases, I get buyers that want to buy in 2 to 3 weeks. In many cases, the other types mentioned, can't be done in that time period.

Okay, at this point, in regards to your comments, you are now starting to disrespect who I am and what I stand for.  And here is why I state this.... this was your next comment... "During the heat of the Real Estate Market most real estate professionals relied primarily on the Subprime 80/20s & NIV loan types to "help" their homebuyers! "

Again, I have been doing this for almost 16 years and I can count on my fingers and toes on how many subprime deals and stated deals that I did.  I even helped someone that was promised a stated from another lender and I closed his loan as a full doc. I am not the average nor are many of the loan officers or realtors in this forum. I hated the average loan officer for many years, because they were typically like your true car salesperson, such as yourself. Because most of your comments are negative in what I wrote about or speculate in what I have done in my career.  But I can gather more information from your web site than you can gather from me. During the subprime glory days, I was still putting consumers into FHA mortgages, especially when the other lender was promising a subprime loan... because it was easier for the loan officer.

And you said this....  "Even Nehemiah-type DPA was rarely used due to the unspoken FHA finance ban by greedy Sellers. "

By your comments, it just sounds like you have it all figured out. But all you are doing is spouting out your opinion with statements that you make sound like facts, but they are just assumptions.  And that is part of the problem that we are in today's economy. The seller being greedy, sure... but what about the listing agent that didn't know his or her duty, didn't educate the seller on all options, and usually just wanted a quick sale????? 

Here is your next statement which I am going to break up in two parts...  you said...

"Nehemiah-type programs are not just for First Time Homebuyers.  They are open to any and all homebuyers regardless of whether they own a home or even multiple homes, but that in itself is another reason why these programs are bad and should be eliminated!  This opens the door to the fraud of homebuyer investors purchasing investment homes instead of primary residences!" 

Okay, so many of the other programs that you mentioned, are not just for first time homebuyers. Yes, with a Nehemiah DPA, you don't have to be a first time homebuyer. But under FHA, you can't buy a 2nd home or an investment property. So, your statement is extremely misleading. I can see how you try to sell. And I am only sound harsh, because you were the one that made the statements, thinking that you are dealing with an average joe blow in lending. In regards to your statement about fraud?  There will always be fraud, from the seller, the buyer, and or the lender. In reality, no matter where you get the money from or how, fraud can still take place. So, I find your comment pertaining to this very lame. If we were in a court of law, your statement would lose.

Then you go on to say this....

"FHA does not fund investor purchases, so this is one of their concerns as well.  These programs profess to help minority and low to moderate income families, but the reality is that the serve any income of households they wish...even if you are a millionaire. Real DPA programs have Real guidelines that are protective of the buyers as well as the marketplace."

Exactly, they did away with this in the early '90s.  You can still streamline an investment property under FHA though....   now, if you are rich, yes, you could still get a mortgage with a DPA. But before the new loan amounts were raised, the average mortgage amount was about $280,000 to $350,000. I would hardly consitute that as helping a millionaire.  And even with the new loan amounts up to $720,000 in some areas, housing is very expensive in some areas of the country.  And families that are buying a house in that price range, might only be making $275,000 a year.  Is that a millionaire?  Are you going to see a millionaire buy a $400,000 home as their primary?  I think not. Your statement is correct  that anyone can use these programs, with no income restrictions... but you fail to realize that you still have a cutoff on the mortgage amount. Which it will be reduced back to it's normal amounts by December 31st, 2008.

Overall, in regards to your statements, shouldn't my goal to be helping those in need of financing, from an honest and ethical loan officer? First time home buyer?  Multiple borrower?  Millionaire?  Shouldn't I be giving them their best options, which would save them money.

Here is your next statement....

"Assisting buyers that owned a home before (not "First Time Homebuyers"), but have little or no retained financial benefits from that prior ownership, therefore, unable to afford a down payment on their next home are probable foreclosures waiting to happen.  However, and in fairness, even the "real DPA" programs make exceptions to the "must be a first time homebuyer rule" by allowing those that have not owned and or lived in a home that they owned in the past three years...or displaced homemakers (Mother with children) are allowed "first time homebuyer" status and participation.  The commonsense approach of these programs makes the Nehemiah-type programs agenda even more obvious, THE MONEY THEY MAKE FROM THEIR FEES!"

This comment in my opinion was a joke. You were trying to attack the definition of a first time homebuyer. Yes, not owning a home in the last 3 years, is the states programs guidelines.  Do you know that some of these state programs, that help with DPA's or lower interest rates, are very strict when it comes to credit and income ratios?  Ah, something that I see that you failed to state.  Unless you didn't know.  But your comments profess you as a very knowledgeable lender. So, unless you lend money as a bank, you can't know everything. Only assume...  and here is the killer part... the money that they make from their fees. Yes, you have a leg up, because you don't charge fees. You get subsidized by the township, the state, or the gov't. You want to show me your books?  Will you allow me to pull a 4506 on you? Because I won't believe anything otherwise. Don't lecture me on non-profit companies, they still make money and in some cases, make a lot of money, with a creative accountant. So, what would make you any different.???  Again, you are just showing me that you are a true sales person, because you bring nothing up that can't be see, unless someone else knows what they are talking about.

Before I paste your next comment, I will be honest and say that I am going to ignore a few comments and not address them. One of which how much Nehemiah has made.  You don't talk about their suppport staff which costs money.... NOR, do you talk about when they have given back to the community. You sound just like a politician. Holding back some facts, making the whole thing look very bleak. And that you have an agenda.... 

Then you go on to say this....

"3.  We should all remind ourselves of the most recent lesson we have been taught by the Real Estate Bubble's subprime loan component.  The 80/20 loans are today being replaced by the Nehemiah-type DPA "loans".  Although they are not quite as effective as the early day 80/20s, due to the still-to-high housing prices, they have the negative effect of adding on another drag-parachute further slowing the necessary and inevitable decline of housing prices."

You just have proven to me that you don't know much about the lending practices and what was what, even in the early '90s. You mention subprime and 80/20's in the same paragraph. There were conventional 80/20's way before subprime started to copy these. And you fail to mention that many of these DPA programs that you represent, are liens against the property, until they are in the house for 5 years, 6 years, or sometimes 8 years. You talk negatively about the Nehemiah/AmeriDream DPA's, because they don't have their own money into the transaction. I am sorry.. that's the same case when it comes to the DPA's that you represent. And I read in your web site, that in many cases, your clients will need $500 to $1,000 out of their pocket.  So, your statements on your web site are semi false.... "no money" out of pocket. And just a FYI.....  when I do one of these Nehemiah programs, I tell each client that we want to see some skin in each deal.... at least $1,000.

As you go one with your comments, they get more evil in nature.... here is what you said next.

"Nehemiah-type DPA transactions are the replacement loans for Subprime's 80/20s!  If we continue to thing like squirrels with short-term memory loss we are doomed to repeat the same mistakes.  For the sake of your children that one day will need an affordable home of their own, I pray we all wake up!"

As I mentioned before....  this statement of yours is false and misleading. FHA loans have been very successful with just 3% down (out of pocket) You are making DPA's sound evil and putting them in the same category as subprime 80/20's.  What about the states on the 80/20's when it came to the conventional loans?  or the 100% financing that was approved with 65% back end ratios.  How come you don't mention this?  Most of your comments are one-side and I am presenting to you both sides.  You are very good at making something look bad. But you are preaching to the wrong choir here. Do you know that bad decisions and in many cases, loss of job or death of a family member that was the sole provider, are still the two most biggest reasons to foreclosures... if not, in the top 4...  yes, fraud is moving up there. And fraud can still take place if the borrower went your route of the DPA monies.  And so can loss of job take place, which means that they couldn't afford the mortgage, no matter what kind of loan they received or where they got the money.  Again, your statements and lack of information proves to me, your agenda and how you talk to people... how you advise people, and how you direct them.  As I have stated, I have told many clients about the other types of DPA's.... but either they don't meet the income guidelines or they need the money now....  Do you know I can save a client some money the price of the home, if I tell them that they could negotiate a quick close, less than 3 weeks. Many of these sellers need to close quickly.

You then make this statement...." Builders/Sellers are still able to abuse the  appraisal system!  To this very day pre-emptive and comprehensive measures necessary to provide more accurate and public sales data for accurate appraisal valuations has been neglected. "

LOL....  please, spare me the insults. This only happens if the builder or the seller controls the financing and the lender.... which happened a lot with builders having their own in-house lenders.  My appraisers don't practice this type of behavior....and I know this for a fact.  You are now putting out misleading information out there, like everyone does this.  It was actually a small handful.  But once you make the news, it escalates to the point that everyone is pointing fingers at the industry as a whole.  I am trying to act professional, but give me a break in your so-called political statements.  You aren't running for office here.

Then you make this statement....  "5.  What might be our first clue that something is rotten in Denmark.  Many of the Nehemiah-type DPA providers profess to be Faith Based Ministry, Charitable Models...(Reverend Wright has a faith based ministry, too)!  It seems odd to me that a faith based ministry would not provide information to ALL available down payment assistance opportunities for their homebuyer believers!  Why do you think that is?  Maybe they just don't know about other DPA programs sponsored by the State and Local County/City municipalities....does that seem reasonable?  OR could it be All About THE MONEY (see paragraph 2 above, "Let's do the math")  You decide."

I call this reverse psychology....  you mention religion on your site.... ????   Do you see religion statements on Nehemiah's site?  hence why I use them and hence why I talked down about other DPA programs. Even if I am religious, believe in God, that I am Catholic, Christian, Jewish, or the many other types of religions.... not at any point, do I bring this up or sell it.  You did on your site, but then you talk negatively about others that do it?  What does that make you then?  Almost like above the law?  Which now even discredits most of your comments, in my opinion. So, then I go to your site and this is what you have stated....

You are not only practicing religion in this comment, but you make a statement about God and you make this statement on your site.    "For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works,
which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them" (Ephesians 2:10)"

I don't care if I am religious or not. I don't mention religion or politics on my sites. I don't share scripture, versus, or anything else. I have a huge problem with this type of marketing. And I am not going to get into this part..... because it's opinion based... and religion should not be brought into any type fo business, unless you are at a church, speaking.... etc etc...  to the masses, the general public, I view this as a different kind of tactic.

This is directly from your site.  You come in here preaching this and preaching that.  But when I do some research on your non-profit organization, I find this next paragragh very, very misleading. So, then I ask you.... whose best interest do you have in hand????  And even though you are considered a non-profit, non-profits can make money, serious money. And I know this for a fact. Not saying that you do, but non-profits can launder money. And since you don't charge anything... so you say on your site.... I bet it would be surprising by many where you get your funding.  I know you negotiate with the state or individuals that offer these grants. I have known lenders that have done the same and kept a lot of the money. I know this for a fact also.  Again, not saying that you do.  But you were very defensive in your comments....  trying to get people to go through you?  Everyone always has a motive and I can see some of it in your statements below, which is on your web site....  and I will dissect it at the bottom and share with everyone what I think is extremely misleading.

There are numerous other Non-Profit organizations to be found on the internet that expound their "Down Payment Assistance/Gift Programs". However, they all incorporate the same methodology of "gifting" you money, based on, and provided your Seller "participates" in their program. The Seller's participation requires he/she give back to the Non-Profit an amount equal to the gift funds that the Non-Profit gave to you, plus a "service fee" (generally equal to 1% of the purchase price). This "seller participation" money comes out of the Seller's net proceeds at the closing of the property sale to you. Therefore, the reality is that you (the home buyer) are financing into the purchase price your own down payment assistance funds! These Non-Profits claim that these are "true gift funds", that there is "no repayment" required of these "true gift funds". In reality you (the home buyer) are paying interest (based on a 30 year amortization) on these "gift funded amounts", which are included in your mortgage loan until they are paid off!

Here is what I see.... the reality.....  if I have no money, I should not be upset to get a house for its true value, but I should still pay nothing for it.  You make a point, but you lose so many other points. And as I stated, you make no mention of the townships and states DPA's, that those in many cases, have to be paid back if you sell the house or refinance in a certain time period. So, are you any better than those that you just mentioned?  In my opinion, I think you are worse, because you are leaving some important facts out of this whole conversation. Were you hoping that myself or a few others wouldn't read every word that you wrote?  And take the time to comment on just about every word?  Newsflash... I take what I do very seriously and I will point out the flaws just as you did.  But I will back mine with facts. And I won't leave things out, as you did....

And this still goes back to your last comment hightlighted in light green.  You tell people on your site that generally, most of these programs charge a 1% fee.  OUCH....  Nehemiah, I think, is the most expensive... and they are raising their fee to $599.  That means that more than 50% if the homes sold are $60,000?  You did say 1% fee,,,,  on a $300,000 house, that would cost the seller an additional $3,000, not $599?  You want to talk about exploiting your comments on your web site?  You remind me of someone else, who I won't mention.  But you are very misleading in your comments.  Here is your comment again...

"The Seller's participation requires he/she give back to the Non-Profit an amount equal to the gift funds that the Non-Profit gave to you, plus a "service fee" (generally equal to 1% of the purchase price). This "seller participation" money comes out of the Seller's net proceeds at the closing of the property sale to you."  

And here is mine again... OUCH.  Misleading.  I want you to know all DPA's that generally charge a 1% fee.....  I love your words... very creative.... generally equal to.....   sounds like most, but it is very few. You say, show me the money.  I say, so me the proof of these so-called companies.

Your web site also mentioned this.....  "Which programs to avoid and why!"

Is this a decision that you make for the homebuyer?  Does it help you if you steer them away from such programs as Nehemiah or AmeriDream?  Let me answer that question for you... yes, it would hurt your business, hence why your comments were all one-sided.... all against Nehemiah and others like it.  How blind do you think some of us are?  You have a motive and an agenda and I can understand that. But when you talk all negatives about others and all positives about yours?  That tells me one thing... I always bring up both the negative and positives, no matter how I feel about a program, which I did in this post also.

Here is your last comment, which is listed above.

"Jeff, I believe you mean well, but what I also believe is that you, like so many others, are compeletly missing the reality of the devil's details.  I hope this provides you insight to the dark side and puts the spotlight on where it is deserved and needed."

Again, don't insult my intelligence.  The devil's details?  Now, you are definitely preaching and using religion in a subtle manor. Many might not be able to see this, but I do. That to me, means that you have a different agenda. Just like such people as Jimmy Baker or Tammy Faye, and so many others that preach religion, who made millions.... live in mansions... drive fancy cars... 

Even though you took the time to leave a long comment, you have proven to me an agenda.  And it reflects in the same manor as those I just mentioned. Unless you tell me that you are doing this as a hobby and for free.....  don't preach on the fees that companies such as Nehemiah and AmeriDream charge.  And don't use that dark side crap.... stuff with me.  You might be able to pull this off with a loan officer or realtor that wouldn't know any better... or the average consumer that only has your word,.... which I find very scary after reading what you wrote...   hey, opinions are okay, but making your opinions seem like facts?  That is where you will lose.  And it's not a threat, it's a promise that can be backed up with facts.   That's how you win a debate.... and sources are the end to all debates.

JASON....  You might need more popcorn after you read my response to Chuck's comment.  06/09/2008 05:34 AM  I don't mind any comments... and not to sound rude here, but his comments were all one-sided. He has an agenda and his own non-profit company.  Google N.O.A.H.   I don't mind opinion, but misleading information, that is based on opinion, not fact...  I dislike. Hell, that is 50% of the reason why our economy is in the tank.....  not educating the consumer properly.

JANET....   bingo... and I mentioned part of this in my comments to him.  If Chuck comes back, I am sure he will have an answer for that. And one that will make our statements sound bad and his good. If that is the case, then I truly know his agenda....   As you stated, the true DPA's do take time and I am getting many buyers that need to settle in less than 30 days....  they need that money in place then, in 24 days or less.     good point...

RON.....  I will get back to your blog... just haven't had time as of yet.  Look how long it's taking me to reply back to these comments.... 4 days later...

Well, you bring up one good question... why does FHA report that the default rate/foreclosure rate is 3 times more on these DPA's...   If you do some research and your homework, you will understand that at least 50% of these were because of those that commited fraud or didn't educate the consumer... or gave them the bad deal. Just a builder's site in NC, reported that 80% of his homes went into foreclosure and most of the homes at the DPA program... and this builder had his own lender and appraisal company. Do I need to say more?  If I do, please ask and I will spell it out. But part of the issue is appraising the home for more than it's worth. The other issue?  Many of these clients were given higher rates than average and many didn't really qualify. THe reports dug all of this up.  So... who is to blame?  The unethical lender and builder....

So, you think changing the rule is going to help?  Does it really matter where the money comes from?  And 100% financing is not the issue. At least with the DPA's, part of the money is still used for the down payment.

NETORIGINATOR....   sour graps?   nah... I would think a lot more. I left Chuck's comments up because I love a good debate. Especially when someone states mostly opinion, trying to make it sound like facts.  Most of his opinions had holes in it...

Overall, it's semi funny on his comments, because he owns a non-profit company. I would love to see his books. He spouts off about how much money Nehemiah made... and how much that these DPA's cost.  How much money does he make?  And he never talks about the fact that most of the DPA's that he talks about place a lien on your property, for so many years... and then releases it...

ROSS......  they are a little different than a 100% loan. Rates are lower... mortgage insurance is lower... and you still have to use part of the money as the down payment.  It all comes down to the appraisal... if the house is truly worth what is stated on paper, you can't put any blame on this. Everyone screams about houses being under water... gee, wouldn't it happen on a 100% program or a 5% program?  It's even happened when a consumer put 10% down... it all comes down to what market you bought in. It's easoer to point the finger now. Hence why education on this is so important now.

RON.....   the one problem that I have with your statement is.....  even though companies were doing 103% financing, 100% financing, and 80/20's is that people just pushed FHA and DPA's by the waste side....  a few reasons why...

• many loan officers were and are lazy.  Why take a client to another program that takes more explaining. It was easier to do a 103% financing....or in most cases, 100%.  But you know what, rates and MI were higher to much higher. But the consumer didn't know better, if they didn't do their research or if the loan officer took the time to explain.
• many companies back then and even now, weren't FHA approved.  The rise of FHA approvals and applications to apply to FHA approved are higher than ever this year than in the last 5 years total. What does that tell you?

Overall, the FHA loans and DPA's should have never left....  but so many turned a blind eye and just went with what was easier, even though it wasn't the best for the consumer. Just my opinion....  but the numbers proved which is better... meaning, a FHA rate vs a 100% rate, even 2 years ago.

LISA....  if you ever have any questions about these, never hesitate to call me. Not sure how long that you have been on AR, but I put together a AR gathering a few weeks ago which was held in Princeton. Maybe next time. 

But you are correct to say that we can't believe that so many realtors would reject an offer such as this, just because they don't know much about it. That they are doing a disservice to the seller and others. 

DANNY......  that's good to hear..... but you lost me on your last part of the comment.

BILL..... many of us hope they stay around for a long time also.  Sure, the IRS stuck their nose into this also... but apparently it's just crap, because if there was something illegal, it would have been discontinued by now.

PAUL.....  you hit the nail on the head... so many people rag on this kind of financing, but I  never saw anyone complain about the 100% financing when it was out there... when in reality, the rate and mortgage insurance was usually higher than a FHA rate....  and that people are underwater on those now also. You can't blame a program just because the market went bad. It depends on how it was explained to the consumer.  And yes, these 100% programs being approved with a 65% back end?  Please....  afte paying their mortgage and paying their debt, what is the borrower left with?  

In regards to the FHA rations...  31% front and 43%.... depending on the loan and the compenstaing factors, I can do a manual underwrite at 39% front and 49% back.  And thanks for the compliment....

BETH.......  thanks for your feedback.  Yes, you need to keep your personal feelings aside from this.  But let me ask you this....  should I then be upset that you are getting 3% from your seller or for showing a home?  Or when a specific real estate company charges the buyer an extra $250 and calls it some fee?  In all honesty, we could be here for ever.  Yes, there have been non-profits that have lined their pockets. But you can't be so quick to pass judgment without prrof, and not hear se. There are way to many rumors out there soley based on opinion. And most of these DPA's that I am talking about, have some sort of fee. How would you expect them to exist or survive, without picking up some administrative fee? And Nehemiah?  They give back to the community in some areas also.

Overall, you can't relate this to the late United Way scandal.... sure, I am sure some of the smaller DPA programs tried to scam. I heard some that sent checks that bounced at closing. Nehemiah and AmerDream wire their funds...   And besides, why jump on the bandwagon of some of these haters/complainers, when it's legal and it works....  and it closes deals for your buyers and or sellers.  Just curious  then....  why do you par take in these?  Because it's a commission check?  I only ask because usually, if someone is really against something, they don't par take in them... again, just curious...

RON.....   the one problem that I have with your statement is.....  even though companies were doing 103% financing, 100% financing, and 80/20's is that people just pushed FHA and DPA's by the waste side....  a few reasons why...

• many loan officers were and are lazy.  Why take a client to another program that takes more explaining. It was easier to do a 103% financing....or in most cases, 100%.  But you know what, rates and MI were higher to much higher. But the consumer didn't know better, if they didn't do their research or if the loan officer took the time to explain.
• many companies back then and even now, weren't FHA approved.  The rise of FHA approvals and applications to apply to FHA approved are higher than ever this year than in the last 5 years total. What does that tell you?

Overall, the FHA loans and DPA's should have never left....  but so many turned a blind eye and just went with what was easier, even though it wasn't the best for the consumer. Just my opinion....  but the numbers proved which is better... meaning, a FHA rate vs a 100% rate, even 2 years ago.

LISA....  if you ever have any questions about these, never hesitate to call me. Not sure how long that you have been on AR, but I put together a AR gathering a few weeks ago which was held in Princeton. Maybe next time. 

But you are correct to say that we can't believe that so many realtors would reject an offer such as this, just because they don't know much about it. That they are doing a disservice to the seller and others. 

DANNY......  that's good to hear..... but you lost me on your last part of the comment.

BILL..... many of us hope they stay around for a long time also.  Sure, the IRS stuck their nose into this also... but apparently it's just crap, because if there was something illegal, it would have been discontinued by now.

PAUL.....  you hit the nail on the head... so many people rag on this kind of financing, but I  never saw anyone complain about the 100% financing when it was out there... when in reality, the rate and mortgage insurance was usually higher than a FHA rate....  and that people are underwater on those now also. You can't blame a program just because the market went bad. It depends on how it was explained to the consumer.  And yes, these 100% programs being approved with a 65% back end?  Please....  afte paying their mortgage and paying their debt, what is the borrower left with?  

In regards to the FHA rations...  31% front and 43%.... depending on the loan and the compenstaing factors, I can do a manual underwrite at 39% front and 49% back.  And thanks for the compliment....

BETH.......  thanks for your feedback.  Yes, you need to keep your personal feelings aside from this.  But let me ask you this....  should I then be upset that you are getting 3% from your seller or for showing a home?  Or when a specific real estate company charges the buyer an extra $250 and calls it some fee?  In all honesty, we could be here for ever.  Yes, there have been non-profits that have lined their pockets. But you can't be so quick to pass judgment without prrof, and not hear se. There are way to many rumors out there soley based on opinion. And most of these DPA's that I am talking about, have some sort of fee. How would you expect them to exist or survive, without picking up some administrative fee? And Nehemiah?  Nehemiah has given back to some communities.

So... were you also the one complaining about the 80/20 loans?  The conventional and subprime loans that were 100% financing?  Do you realize, that it is tougher to save nowadays, yet there are thousands that would still be responsible?  Do you know, many of those that did default when using a DPA program, was due to either fraud from the lender, lack of education from the lender when it came to buying, or some bait and switch habits ... to where the client was given a higher rate at the time of closing?  Just things to think about.  And one last stat......  that we have more first time homebuyers that now have the American Dream, more that have kept their home, than those that have lost their home?  Again, just food for thought...   thanks

CHUCK..... I'll get back to more of your comment later.  But it's ironic that I reply to each and every comment of yours, bringing up good points.  And wondering what you would have said if this news never came out yesterday.  Besides, there is a lot more behind those numbers that is not mentioned.  Again, proving to me that you suck up the media news if it favors your opinions.  Typical of the average consumer.

Do you understand in specifics why there are so many that are foreclosing?  Do you understand that a whole subdivision in North Carolina, that was controlled by a builder and his lender, that more than 80% of these went under. Do you know that adds to these numbers and that this is not the only builder to add to these numbers? 

In any case, it's obvious that you have one agenda. You own your own non-profit company and it would be nice to see you reply to my comments. Or are you afraid of some of the answers and questions?  Stop playing the media crap....  the media chit chat and David Montgomery. They wanted to kill the whole thing previously. There is more behind it than just the news.

CHUCK....  I'll get back to this later....   but I have no way of contacting you and I would like you to take the link out of your comment, in the beginning...    you can mention the name, but please remove the link.  thanks.  I'll be back to this and to everyone else's comment.

thanks

CHUCK..……   there is no confusion….  I haven’t had time to read your current comment.  I asked you a favor. I asked you to remove the link to the other mortgage company. Yes, I did ask you and I said you could mention their name.  But not a link. This is my post…  I don’t want links to other mortgage companies in my posts.  I am not hiding from anything. You can think what you want. But now you aren’t respecting me. I could have deleted all of your comments. 

Overall, I am extremely busy….  I don’t  have time all the time, as you can see that it’s 10:30 pm… you are now writing so much, that nobody is probably going to read all of your stuff, except me.  You can say all you want about Brian Montgomery and what he believes in the DPA’s….    it’s your opinion against mine. You sell DPA’s yourself… you have an agenda.   But again, I am asking you nicely. Please take the link out of my post.  Please respect my decision….I guess you are proving my points, again, since you won’t take the link out.

On another note, I will get back to your comments, but probably not until this weekend. I have a living to make and I am busy with clients.  Thank you…

CHUCK... well what?   I am way to busy to wait around for you.  I asked you to do something and you didn't want to do it.  I am done preaching to someone that thinks they know it all. You own and operate a non-profit company. Of course you are going to say everything possible that would be negative about the Nehemiah type of non-profilt DPA programs.  This is how you make your money. You want to ignore what I say. My main thing... I have 3 settlements that are using the DPA (Nehemiah) that need to settle in 2 weeks. You could not settle a loan with your programs in 2 weeks.  So then what?  You would need to tell the buyer to go buy another house and not settle for over 30 days?  Not in a buyers market....

In any case....  sorry if this is rude or not.  But you are closed minded and one-sided, because you have a product to sell. Me?  I can sell any DPA program, because my primary goal is to make sure the client gets a good deal, gets what they want, and closes in a timely manner.  enjoy, but you wanted to ignore my last request. I don't have time for games with someone that is making money and tells everyone that $499 is too much. So, you get your money through other avenues.

CHUCK... I am going to ask you kindly, if you can refrain from making comments about me and what I want and don't want.  Especially since you are now twisiting my comments. I ask you not to list other mortgage companies links in your comments. I never said that you couldn't include your own link. Even though I consider it self prmotion, I never deleted it nor told you not to. But I will ask you from here on out, not to link any more in your comments. We will make this very easy. The next time that you link or feel the need to semi-bash me, your comment will be deleted. Period, end of story. I don't want to sound like a jerk, but I don't need name calling or finger pointing in this post. Just because many people don't agree with you, there is no reason for trying to make others look bad. Let's act as professionals in this forum and educate the average consumer.

To everyone else, I will try to reply to each comment this weekend.  thanks

BOB....  hence why I have stopped replying to Chuck.  He is pushing one product and only one product. He has not addressed the income restrictions.  He hasn't really addressed the fact that his program can't be done in 2 weeks, if I have someone that needs to settle quickly.  Lastly, if I used a subprime loan in the past, it was for a reason. If that client couldn't qualify for a conventional or a FHA loan, why should I keep them from their American Dream.  Especially if I tell them everything about that program, all pros and cons, and hide nothing from them.

@ Chuck.... stop putting some of us in the category of that bad and unethical loan officer.  Many of us are very professional and care about our clients. All you are doing is bashing, because you have one product to sell and only one. Overall, there is no point to keep coming in here and commenting.  I have said that I would never delete a comment.  But you have gone over board with the name calling and the finger pointing. I am asking you not to comment again, unless it is polite and that you address all questions and not what you want to address. If you can't comply with this request, please do not comment again.

Chuck... what compliments?  I am asking you one more time. Keep to the topic.  You disagreed with most in here and are pushing just one thing. I have asked you over and over.  I do have the ability to delete comments.  Again, stick to the topic please.  You have used this post as advertisement and I won't allow any more of it.  thank you.

I will try to address everyone else later....

Denied & Lied to homebuyer.......  What was it that you were lied to about?  Your comment is semi commical. With all due respect, not every loan officer or lender was is a crook. Watch, the housing market will get worse in some markets, without the DPA's.  you say True DPA's.....  they aren't for everyone. They have restrictions.  I do depend on these and I am very good, close to damn good at what I do. I have closed 9 people just this year that were approved by other lenders, to find out that they were denied the day before or the day of closing. I still got them to the table.  3 of the 9 had DPA's.  These people were good, hard working people, that stull could save. But I would rather have them save their money. If you don't understand that part, then you fit right in with the politicians that have no clue either....   this is what I said in another comment directed to someone in regards to DPA's....

            the sky is not falling, but it will be bad for a while. Those are the facts.  I said 1 1/2 years ago that it wasn't going to get better until mid to late 2009. Yes, business has been better for me this year than in recent years. But the overall aspect of things, more people are doing worse.

I will be writing about this over the weekend or on Monday.....  it's will be titled, "Buckle Up".....  I am getting sick of the politicians, the realtors, and some loan officers that have no idea. The figures they keep touting are misleading in regards to the DPA's.... and people don't think common sense.  The bottom line, the average person just can't save, period. But if their rent is on time, what makes them a bad risk when buying with no money. We will see that the housing market will slow down even more once this is pulled....  mark my words... in markets that have homes priced from $80,000 to $300,000... depdning on the market.

Overall, the misleading facts that DPA's were bad recently, they aren't dissecting these figures... there is more behind the numbers. Gee, I have been doing DPA's since 1996....  all of a sudeen, these are bad?  Did anyone look at all loans and how they are performing??   Coupled by the enconomy?  It's just sad... the gov't needs to let the market correct itself.... period....

So, mr or Mrs denied and lied to homebuyer....  why do you hate these programs?  You obviously have a bad taste in your mouth about something. It's one thing to oppose something, but when I debate or argue a point, I bring facts into the equation and not just talk. Again, this will all be listed in my blog in the next few days.

Thanks for your comment...

Carl.... please ignore chuck....  

Chuck..., there is a reason why I am deleting your comments.  Many said that I was nice enough to leave youe previous comments. Just leave it at that, no sense in name calling or pointing fingers.  Please go start your own blog then.   I will end it at that and say nothing else. Please respect my decision and stop posting your copied comment.  Thanj you..