Internet Explorer -vs- Firefox

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Internet Explorer -vs- Firefox

There are two very popular internet browsers on the web. When using google analytics to check my website stats today, I found that there were more Firefox browsers than ever before. Is Microsoft Interenet Explorer on it's way out? Is Firefox soon to be "standard" for internet browsers?

I noticed that on my wifes PC, her Internet Explorer would keep locking up. When I downloaded Firefox on her computer, and she started using it regularly, we never had her system lockup ever again. I noticed that some webpages (including my own), looked different in Firefox too.

Google Graph

Firefox claims to have the following advantages:

Faster surfing using tabs:
Several websites open at the same time? Firefox has a special feature that enables you to browse easily and quickly from one window to another.
Popup blocking:
Fed up with windows that open up spontaneously? Mozilla Firefox recognises and blocks unwanted popups automatically, ridding you of this irritation.
More secure:
Spyware, adware, worms and viruses? Mozilla Firefox automatically protects you against these, removing any worries you might have in this respect.
The Google toolbar:
A search feature always at hand when you are looking something up? No problem. Use the Google Toolbar to search effortlessly and at high speed. This is a standard feature of Mozilla Firefox.

I have compared the two and see many similiarities, I'm wondering if it is just a matter of preference?!?

Just trying to decide which one is best for me to use with the amount of Internet Searching and Browsing I do. Would love to hear your thoughts and comments on this. Which one do you use and why? I am most curious.

Always trying to be the smart Fox, and Exploring new and better ways to browse the NEW WEb 2.0!

Tutorials | Training | Mobile | Widgets

"May this blog be just one more planted seed of wisdom that helps you or your business blossom today!"

Posted by Brad Andersohn on 03/24/2007 04:49 PM

Comments (143)

internet explorer, firefox

Originally posted at: Real Estate 2.0 Technology : Internet Explorer -vs- Firefox

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Post is included in group: Solano County Realtors

143 Comments on Internet Explorer -vs- Firefox

MAR

2007

We've been using FF for several years now. I absolutely love it. The only issue I have with it is that Top Producer doesn't work with it, nor does our MLS. That's a bummer.

Brad-I use FF at home, there is an internet explorer tab extension available. I cannot edit my site from FF. We also need Internet Explorer for our MLS. GO HERE, this should help.

FireFox may be faster in some ways, but the restrictions make it useless. Just like Christina said in the post above, I too had many websites that would not work with FF. Let's face it, It's a Microsoft World!

I would be using Firefox except that our MLS and various secure websites that I use don't support it. Until the powers that be open up additional options, I can't use it beyond random browsing.

I use both. I prefer Firefox, but our MLS and a few other sites won't work properly on Firefox so I have to use Explorer for those. Our county property appraiser's site, on the other hand, won't work on Explorer and asks you to use Firefox, particularly for any maps.

I prefer Firefox for normal personal browsing, but still use IE for business use for all the reasons listed above as well. I tried upgrading to IE 7.0 but still has too many issues:(

Love Firefox. My MLS works well with it. I especially like the intuitiveness on my email (once you get it trained). It does a great job of cleaning out spam.

My only problem with it is working with Point2, Am still going round and round trying to gett the Puflite program to download so I can install pictures.

I have firefox on my home computer and also on my office workstation as well I am very happy with it

Eddy

I have heard great things about FF, however, in NH our MLS will not work with FF. We will have to see how things develop in the future.

Firefox is very popular with those friends of mine that use it. As for me, I haven't downloaded it but I'm sure tempted after reading your blog. Many thanks for sharing your findings.

Firefox is great & with some of the add ons you can do really amazing things, My IE still shows error at a fairly constant and annoying rate so I avoid it when possible.

Kathleen Lordbock Re$ale Design

fIREFOX ROCKS!!!!

Brad you know me - Firefox all the way!

And there are more add ons for FF coming out each and every day.

My newest favorite...

Sage

I like fire fox, it's quick and I haven't had any issues with it....yet! I use internet explorer also it just depends on what I'm doing.

Patricia Aulson?SEACOAST REALTOR/NH & ME

I forgot to add something...

I have to use IE sometimes for certain Lenders sites as they are not compatible with FF.

But by default, FF all the way!

I've been using FF for several years. I switched because of all the security issues with IE. I still need to use IE for my MLS but I use FF for everything else.

I love the FF, and have been using it for a year or so, and I do not have enough great things to say about it.

Brad,

I did some general reviews about some browsers, speed, etc

you can check my past blogs :)

Opera was a winner overall among others. but still I do not get used to use different browsers than IE :) LOL

I used FF for a while - I loved the features and being able to customize the toolbar was great but I switched back to IE. THere were so many websites that had errors on them that are only visible on FF that it just became annoying to use FF. For example a lot of links do not show up on FF so I would have to go into IE to access the link. I've heard that the AR spellcheck does not work with FF either. Also my email program (Optonline-from Cablevision) had a weird glitch that all the words would run together when I used spellcheck. I'm sure every month or so these glitches get worked out but right now it ended up being more of a paint to use FF. These are just my experiences.

I'm a firefox user as well. Many of the lender websites interface with IE only. Thanks you for the IE tab recommendation, Midori. I installed and am using it now. You have literally saved me about 30 minutes a day, Midori

Brad, I started usine Firefox nearly two years ago and love it. The only problem with it is that our MLS system does not run under Firefox so we have to use Explorer unless our MLS comes up with a way to run under Firefox. Competition is definately good for us and who knows who the winner will end up being but Firefox has surely put the heat on and "Let the battle begin". Have a great weekend.

I love FF, loathe IE. Whenever I have IE going, it always seems to slow my system down and web-surfing is a chore - pages take longer to load. Our MLS only works with IE, but like Midori mentioned above, there are IE addons for FF. The IE Tab addon works great with Rapattoni MLS (our MLS provider). So, enough with this...it only works with IE business.

In response to some comments above I have to say FF is actually more forgiving of bad webpage coding than IE is. Though, tables, unless written with CSS, don't seem to render well in FF.

And, the AR spell check works perfectly with FF...I used it for this comment posting. I've never had a problem with links not showing up in FF.

Update: Retracting the AR spell check comment. It worked the first few times, but now it's crashing FF. Luckily, FF has the restore feature.

like many others, i use both because of software functionality.

Firefox is making a run!! I like the tab function myself.

Great posts and comments everyone. Just today, someone was trying to promote Clearwire to me and was mentioning FF. I haven't really had any real problems with IE, so I needed to do find out more info on it. What better place to come to than AR. I knew someone must have posted something about.

The AR spell check works great with FF. I saw someone recommend the extension that allows you to run an IE tab under FF. That allows you to open all those sites that still require IE. FF is great and since I started using it the popups and spyware have been reduced to almost being non-existent.

Rita

I use both IE and FF, I seem to default to IE for the same reasons mention above and Just an FYI I.E. 7.0 has tabs

It's clear that FF and some MLS's have issues! It seems like most of you love FF and it would be your default browser of choice if not for the conflicts. I have downloaded it on my "new computer" just to compare. It seems to work great. The add-ons are a nice feature too, I'm still checkin them out.

Looks like I'll be using both, just like many of you.

Viewers to my site using Firefox were about 10%. I'll keep tracking it so I can report back in the future.
All your comments are appreciated. Thank you.

I use IE and have been having problems regularly. My daughter has been recommending that I switch to Firefox. I have to laugh though. When I clicked the link to your website IE froze! I originally thought that you had done something tricky...trying to make a point...but in the end...as ironic as the timing was...it appears that IE is up to it's old tricks. I can see that Firefox may something I look into in the near future.

Hmmm...going to check out FF again now. Sounds like they may have made some improvements.

Thanks for reminding me via this BLOG.

FYI-One of the many reasons I love Firefox

One feature that Firefox has that I love is if you receive error message from microsoft to either report or don't send and Firefox shuts down, once you restart Firefox it will ask you if you would like to start from the last session or start a new session. So if you were in the middle of anything (even on activerain) and you didn't mark it draft, all of your work will be restored if you choose the last session option. (I should know it's happened to me before).

Kelly, I have some java scripts that may have froze your IE. That is exactly why I am trying to figure this all out. Sorry that it was my site that your IE took the dump. I have looked at it now with both browsers and it seems to work fine. I have IE 7 and the most recent version of FF. They both work great. Try my site again and let me know if IE freezes or locks again. If it's my Java causing it, I will remove it! Thanks Kelly for sharing that with me. www.TheEscrowGuy.com I set the site up in FrontPage and that might be part of it too.

Well it seems that almost everyone says they love good old Firefox and are basically fed up with IE. I too at first thought "what am I going to do I can't use FF with a few of the sites I HAVE to use such as MLS." At first the TP7i thing was a problem, but not now...(see my post Outlook and Real Estate can be friends.)

That's when I discovered as a know a few others (millions really) that Firefox is so awesome because it is so easily customized. There are two options that will help you be able to use FF with your MLS site and yes even TP7i. One is called IE Tab the other is IE View. Both can be found here: FF Addons .

I once used both of these but decided that I would just use IE Tab. After downloading you are then able to open with IE inside the FF browser and also set defaults that certain sites always open with IE inside your Firefox such as that dreaded MLS site. Trust me it WORKS LIKE A DREAM!!!

There are many, many, many other great add-ons that just blow the old dragon MS IE7 away. It would really excite you if you would take just a few to get acquainted or maybe re-acquainted with Firefox. You will be glad you did.

BTW I am using FF 2.0 now and spell check is working fine. Thanks for the opportunity to share.

Real Estate the Tony Montana way

Actually I was just looking at my reports from Analytics today and see just the opposite by quite a long shot. I've noticed more and more IE and less FF.

Brad - just started working with FF so the verdicts out however, I did email another quesion for you if you have a chance to help I'd really appreciate it. Thanks

I have used Firefox for quite a while now, and one of our MLS'S won't work with it but I use an extension called IE View to render it using IE in Firefox, problem solved

Firefox,

Was a browser developed ( as I understand the story ) as an alternative to IE ( whooo beware big brother )

The popularity quickly spread for those that wanted to rebel against IE and for a while they had some advantages. Most notably was little or no virus attacks. Simple to understand. If you are creating mischevious code and want to infect the majority, then that is going to be IE not a noname browser with a small following.

That is not necisarily true today. AS firefox has become a more household name it also is becoming a target.

Web sites. There are a lot of websites that will not load or work correctly with firefox.

In your article above you your first 3 points are all on IE 7 and to use the google toolbar you have a Google all ready built in you need only to activate the tool bar.

IE over firefox hands down.

I use IE only when I have to such as when using the MLS website. It is only IE compatible. I find with Firefox, that I get less junk in my computer. Also, as it is not associated with Microsoft, the internet vandals don't attack it. At least yet. I am still waiting for our MLS website to work with Linux and Apple.

I like firefox but with it not being compatable with our MSL I just found it too difficult to use. Both of my young adult children use it and prefer it.

Here's my stats on browser usage from visitors to www.KnoxvilleMLS.com so far this month.

Browsers (Top 10) - Full list/Versions - Unknown

BrowsersGrabberHitsPercent

MS Internet Explorer	No	471852	85.4 %
Firefox	No	50978	9.2 %
Safari	No	17120	3 %
Unknown	?	5536	1 %
Mozilla	No	2656	0.4 %
Netscape	No	1997	0.3 %
Opera	No	1744	0.3 %

Firefox is still less than 10% of the market, in fact it hasn't increased very much in the past 2 years with my website visitors.

It is a very cool browser though; I believe it has it all over Internet Explorer.

Well, here's another view. But there are many variables. I suspect I'd have more FF visitors only because of the technology sector of my market compared to other areas. BTW, what is Camino?

I'd like to share two different charts for you.

Same period of time - current to a couple of days ago.

The first is from my mortgage site: Almost 50 -50

The second is for the Classic Car website (912 Registry) I also manage. Demographics? You betcha!

Lot's of older folks driving classic Porsche's, resisting change.

MAR

2007

Brad - Interesting. Can you provide a overview of what this should mean to the me (I am not being a smartalec), I really do not understand the significance. Can you also provide instruction on how to get my stats.

Thank you!

James

You've received a contact message from your Contact Form on the ActiveRain network.

Message details:
From: Jack Haydon
Subject: How do you include the graph picture

Brad,
I had a quick question and hoped you could help. How did you get the graph picture into your post. I spent a long time today trying to include an excel spreadsheet of market stats. I would really appreciate any help. Thanks

Great Question Jack:

Here's what I did. I run google analytics on my website. Because you can't copy cut and paste the charts and pies from google, I did a screen capture to my clipboard. (print screen option) Next I cropped out just what I wanted to show and then saved it as a new file name. Lastly, I used the graphic tool in AR to import that image. It's that easy. Let me know if you need any additional help. All these folks on AR are really supportive and can help you if you need. You can also do a search in AR and find lot's of posts that will give you more detailed instructions. Thanks for the comment and email. I hope that helps.

James, in response to your question, I cannot provide an overview of what this should mean to you. My post was simply a comparison and evaluation of both web browsers in a quest to build my site to work with the most popular and widely used browsers. Based on the above comments, I have found the significance. Both browsers seem to have quite a reputation and their ever changing. I will now use both!!

Secondly, to get your stats on your own website, you can go to www.google.com/analytics and apply the html code to your website pages. It will then report back to you more information about the visitors to your site than you will probably ever want to know. If you need detailed instructions, I'd be happy to give you a helping hand, just shoot me an email or give me a call. Hope that helps you, thanks for the comment.

Mike - exactly...demographics. That's what I was trying to convey with my "variables" comment but it didn't click. Though, 7 visitors is not quite a meaningful stat ;) But, we get point.

Cant sign into AR on IE from my office, security settings too high, have to use FF for that. The back end of my website hates FF so I have to use IE for that....and so on and so on.

I need both browsers.

Ben - I was in a hurry and just selected the last couple of days - gimme a break. ; )

Camino is a firefox kind of browser for Macs - why they need it I'll never know. But that's a whole 'nother enchilada.

I also love Firefox over Internet Explorer... but, as many have said, it's not compatible with a lot of the website editing features. This is very annoying when I'm busy doing stuff and realize I have to switch back to IE.

I watch my website stats and have noticed a steady increase in the traffic from FireFox. Hopefully, this compatibility issue will be history soon.

That is what I was beginning to notice on my website Carol. In the last couple weeks, it seems like I have gone from 2 - 3 % FF viewers to almost 10% FF viewers. I too hope they workout compatibilty issues with MLS's and other applications. Get the bugs out so to speak!

Dear Brad,

You forgot to do a great research and deep research, I will let you know about my Blog :)

Brad,

Thanks for the post. I have not have much interaction with Firefox. However, my wife is the resident tech guru and I'll pass this one by her. Reserving comment for now1

Internet Explorer still ranks a hard # 1 on my sites. I noticed that Firefox is gaining by about 0.8% of share per month for the past 4 months.

Hola Ray, not sure what great and deep research you are referring to, this post is my great and deep research, and boy has it proved to provide insight and opinion wouldn't you agree? I'll check out your blog. Thanks for reading mine. :-)

Dear Brad,

I already posted and I respect yours, just I was wondering that you forgot to mention Opera, I wrote facts too and if you need all the source where I got this information I would love to share it with you.

It is just kind of a different point of view, I respect your blog so much, but read mine and I will appreciate all your comments, opinions, etc. that's the reason that I love AR, we can discuss details and change points of view, specially for the ones that use Firefox. Let me tell you something that maybe I forgot, even when I know that Opera is one of the best, I still use IE 6 :) why not 7.0? I had some troubles with it, so I got back to 6 :) LOL, funny uh ? I am crazy, I have opera too.

I think eventually Firefox will be more compatible with things as it is becoming more used and more popular all the time. I have both on my computer but had to install an IE plug in in order to work on my website.

Carol O'Hanley

PEI

Canada

Brad... I use more of Firefox.... there have been some things in the past that wouldn't work on FF, that's when I switch to IE. What I like about FF... is if it does go down or the site that I am on, as in AR and I had work on there, ie: my blog that I was in the middle of, it saves my work. If I go up to the box and click the red box at time, next time I sign into FF, it asks me if I want my previous tabs to be pulled back up. It has my work saved.

jeff b

My opinion is there will continue to be new performers in the High Tech arena but they will never replace Microsoft. Microsoft is so embedded into the architectural part of our computer designs that it won't allow that. It would take the DELL's and HP's and IBM's of the world to totally redesign the internal operations of the computers to overcome Microsoft's influence. I worked in High Tech 30 years and this is also one of the very reasons that AMD or other chip manufactures cannot overcome Intel's influence. It totally takes a redesign of the computer and most manufacturer's cannot afford nowadays to produce two types of systems to accommodate the changes or dual production.

With all that aside as a business man I can't afford to try FF as it is not compatible with lots of the Microsoft features. Thus when communicating with other businesses or clients the two cannot meet in the middle. Do I want to change and not be able to communicate 100% with my clientele? No.

I love IE and i'm sticking to it!

Personally, I prefer IE.

Firefox has a tendency to shift things around and make websites look funkier. This is my number 1 problem with designing websites. Getting your layout to conform to all browsers..Firefox being the most difficult...

Scott

Brad, unfortunately anyone in the web design industry makes their websites assuming 75% of the people on the net are using IE. And the others explorers are simply a 2nd thought in the minds of the designers.

Scott - Sites do sometimes render differently in FF. I had a problem with tables and replaced html tables with CSS tables and they seemed to work out fine.

I downloaded Foxfire for awhile, but I couldn't get my ROboForm to work on it. Perhaps I was doing something wrong, but it bugged me to be without my passwords, so I uninstalled Foxfire. Now the notebook I installed it on is screwed up. Grrrrr.

Fire Fox has been one of the first web browsers to take market share from Microsoft and obviously has quite the following, as demonstrated by all these comments. It has yet to take a significant share away from IE though. It's doubtful it will ever become a true contender as long as IE remains part of the MS operating system. I would say what you should take notice of is that there are obviously some tech savvy consumers visiting your site. I hope you are marketing to them.

I use Avant myself

Thanks Michael for the comment, that helps me to just focus more on my web than who is looking at it with what browser. After this post, I realized there are close to 10 different browsers, and I can't download or please them all. Your comment was well received, but I will still use both IE7 and FF to view my own site. I still default to IE7 for doing my own surfing. Great observation and advice. Thanks

KK - sorry you are having trouble with your puter, hope I didn't cause any of your Grrrrrr. :-)

Hey Jeff Link - I have heard of Avantgo for the palm and HP compaq, is there a browser now that goes by the name Avant? If so, I was unaware. My google analytics and site meter have never picked that one up.

By the way, I have not had anyone hit my site with browsers called Avant, Opera, Camino, Safari, Gzip or even Netscape (which I used to use) Before this post, I did not realize how many different browsers there were out there. Even Macintosh has a few options for browsers. I think IE7 will remain the KING as long as Microsoft keeps improving it.

Check for Avant now I have been to your site twice. I have been using Avant for three years. I also have no MLS problems. Check it out here

Hey Brad and rainers,

Here it is yesterday at midnight I was posting this one regarding good information of these browsers.

http://activerain.com/action/blogs_admin/write/63531

If you want the direct website where you can get more information, details, explanation, I will be more than happy to provide you the URL, many browsers with Graphs / details, let me know, but I need that you request it, author do not like to be flooded with his bandwidth and I respect that.

bottom line,

if you feel better with FF that's ok, I do not have anything againts that browser, the only thing to worry about Firefox whether this browser is the 2nd in the popular list of internet web browsers than other browsers, It will be a super great TARGET for developers of Worms / Viruses / spyware / adware and some other malicious scripts, etc. Internet explorer is the first in the target, most popular one, next it is followed by Firefox and then by the next following popular ones.

Don't you hate it ? programmers just do not have anything better to do than start annoying people with bad treats and harm, bad things for good people.

Before you go. The test data my be old. The test for Avant is 1.1 yet Avant is now on 11.0 build 46

Jeff,

author made a typo, if you check the rest, it is updated ok

Ray: The guy made a plea in his site not to use his data in another blog. So you go ahead a blog about two year old data? Quote from The source "

A polite request

Please stop posting this article on sites like Slashdot, Digg, newspapers, etc. It is old news. This article is around 2 years old now (although it has been kept up to date), and has been retired - posting it simply shows how long it took you to find it. It has already been posted on Slashdot enough times, Digg more than enough times, similar sites more times than I can count, as well as newspaper sites all around the world, and far more blogs than I will ever be able to read.

I thank you for your attention, and I am very happy that you found this article interesting or useful enough to read. However, it really does not need you to post it yet again - all you will do is eat my bandwidth, and I ask you not to do that.

NYTimes, you may wish to note that this is a site where I publish research articles, tutorials, and scripts.

Not to mention hijacking this post so we can waste time with two year old data? I have better things to do with my time. ps Ray fix your link. and for the people coming in after me just google (browser speed comparisons)

I think if more of the general public knew the benefits of firefox they would use. Firefox also adds a higher level of security such as preventing spyware and adware from automatically installing.

I just want Jeff and Ray to be friends. Sorry, but some of the comments on this blog have gone right over my head. Not sure what you both are referring to but I hope you can come to terms, shake hands, give each other a hug, and post your next blogs or comments. I know that the beauty of AR is to have open discussions and even some debates, just not sure I understand what you guys are debating. Thanks for being good sports and sharing your ideas and opinions here on my blog.

I have had Firefox on my office and home computers and i have not had one problem.

What do you all think of Windows Vista?

Eddy

Thanks Jeff for the link to Avant, I appreciate it much, I'll check it out. Says its the fastest web browser out there. Thanks again. Brad

Hey Eddy, I have windows vista and so far so good. It came on my new computer so I haven't had to deal with upgrade issues like many others. I like alot of the new features, still some glitches but overall, I give it an 8 on a 10 scale. I have heard that others who just upgrade operating systems have some software application difficulties. Are you upgrading or just inquiring? Brad

This is the 2nd time today i've heard/seen the words "firefox". I am a virgin in this category but I will definately educate myself. Thanks for the information.

Brad: I just want people to know the data that Ray is using is 2 years old and testing against old browser platforms. People need to really chose their browser on their needs. When I started using Avant I really liked the fact I could open more windows using the scroll button(center button) I have 16 windows open right now. The thing I like about having so many windows available is when doing research, I can have the web sites I need open and switch back and forth. I have seen firefox in use by my kids and some of it looks like Avant. I also think that Avant is IE based and my come up in your analytics's as IE.

Brad, thanks for the tip on graphs - i'm off to give it a shot - I'll let you know what happens. Will that work for excel graphs too? Sorry to be so new!

Hey Jack, Graphs can usually be cut and paste. Let me know if you need help, I'll walk you through it. No need to apologize for being new, I am new too. Today is my 1 month anniversary as a rainer on AR. Let me know how your post with graphs goes.

Desiree, Firefox is a browser like Internet Explorer. I was checking to see who uses it and what they thought. I think the comments above make it pretty clear. I am using both browsers and comparing the two. You should check it out, there are so many different browsers out there, IE and FF seem to be the most used by AR professionals and consumers. Great stuff here on this post. Let me know if you need help or have any questions.

Thanks Jeff for the clarification, I appreciate and respect your wisdom and knowledge. I think you're right, selecting a browser based on your own needs is good advice. I am currently doing the same with IE7. I need to have multiple windows open to multi-task, IE7 now has tabs instead of new windows. Windows Vista lets me put them in a 3D mode for easy switching. Again, it's all about preference and comfort zones with each user. Thanks for keepin it real regarding old data comparisons and cut and paste posts. I respect that kind of integrity! Blog On!!

MAR

2007

Brad,

I did upload the graphics for my Market Report - thanks for your help (I had spent hours yesterday trying to get it to work) I'd appreciate if you could check it out and let me know if I got it right. Thanks again for your help.

Would love to, send me a link, in the meantime, I'll check around on your blog. Thanks Jack!

I use both browsers at the same time. I can't get along on one or the other because of some of the online software I use. I have to say I like firefox better and would love to stop using IE7 but the vendors that supply my online forms and other services don't seem to want to make their products compatible with more than one browser.

Brad, this is great research you are doing.

Thanks alot!

Dayuan, Thank you I know where not to find a watch now.

Brad, you bring up a great point. I recently "launched" my web site with a mailing to 650 people on my list and within a day a few people we kind enough to contact me and let me know that some pages were not working correctly when viewed with Firefox and Netscape. I contacted my hosting company and they helped with a work around, apparently they knew they had a problem with non IE browsers. If possible you should minimallycheck things out with Firefox, Netscape and Safari.

MAR

2007

Tom, the same thing happened to me, I had Mike Mueller point out that FF was overlapping my images at my website. He helped me correct it, and now it looks ok with both. I do my own html and website, one benefit of not relying on a designer and the cost. Wish I Knew more, I've learned alot from the rainers out here. Thanks for your comments, I'll take your advice!! :-)

Thanks Susie, as it helps me, I know it is helping others.

APR

2007

I have tried Fire Fox, but have had too many problems with it along with the fact that I can't use my local MLS on Fire Fox as it is not compatible. I like the new Internet Explorer 7 and it has added some features that are similar to the ones I liked on Fire Fox. I will stick with Internet Explorer!

Teresa, sometimes a girls gotta do, what a girls gotta do. (boy that sounds cliche...sorry). Sounds like you've gone through what it takes to make a decision like that. I have heard about lots of problems with FF and MLS's. I have both installed, but I find myself defaulting to IE7. It works for me too. :-)

JUL

2007

Thank you for sharing, I actually use both now because some pages don't work in one or the other??? I was told Firefox was safer, but I need IE for some pages, I wish I could just use one.

I use both as well but lean more toward IE because of compatibilty issues! Thanks Shane!

I use both, Firefox and IE. I definitely prefer Firefox. What kills me is that Furl ( a bookmarking program) stopped working with Firefox. So to bookmark an article, I have to copy the post to IE and bookmark it.

Artur - I like Firefox, but it does not seem to work with many MLS and other RE related sites. It even makes my website do some freaky stuff. I use both because I need to know how to support both with my clients in my area. Thanks for your comment!

Now I am seeing more Mac users that use Safari as the browser. That's what my son uses for his new Mac laptop for college. The Mac is Back! :-)

Brad, that's unfortunate. This is exactly my experience. Thank you for getting back to me.

Anytime Artur, my pleasure, what are networks for!! :-)

I work with both technologies ... Firefox and Internet Explorer

Brad, I'm late to your party, but look -- I brought wine. :o)

I use Firefox now because it works better with the blogging I do for Jeff Turner. He's on a Mac and he is using his mind control to switch me to the other side ... and I believe Firefox may be the gateway. ;o) No, seriously, I like that it checks my spelling as I type.

JUL

2007

Larry - you're not alone! :-)

Sarah - I just spent the weekend moving my son to Cal Poly and he has the new Mac notebook computer. All I can say is WOW! Gotta get me one a dose!! Also, I find it hard to believe YOU need a spell-check! LOL! B-)

The reason firefox has problems displaying many websites run by MLS or RE is not Firefox's fault usually. A properly coded website should follow XHTML standards. Nearly 100% of websites that follow the coding standard will work equally well in Internet Explorer, Firefox, Opera or any other browser. and it will look the same on all of them too. Please note that not all differences are coding defects. There are differences in the way Internet Explorer and Firefox render pages because of using different engines. In these cases even 100% compliant code may display differently on different browsers.

If you have a system that does not display properly on Firefox, it does little good to complain. The administrators of the site will simply state that they are not compatible and tell you to use IE instead. On the other hand if you ask them why they are not XHTML compliant you might be able to get somewhere.

To check whether your favorite website is XHTML compliant look for the following symbol displayed somewhere on the page

If this symbol does not appear on the site you can check for yourself whether or not a site complies by going to the following url:

http://validator.w3.org

You may type in the url of any website or page on the site and it will analyze the site and tell you how many errors are there. If you find a site that is not Firefox friendly run the validation tool and sent the webmaster the contents or a link to the report. You don't even have to mention that you want them to become Firefox friendly. Use the link above to check your favorite website.

Here is a link to Brad's validation report, perhaps this is the reason the site does not appear the same in both browsers. The more we encourage website developers to write compliant code the easier it will be to achieve multiple browser compatibility!

PS - I am not picking on Brad, just using his site as an example of what the validation tool can tell you about a website.

Bud - Great information! Wow...the one thing you missed though, my website has been down for 3 months as I have moved it to a secured server which is password protected and can't be run using your tool here. Let's try activerain.com and see what you come back with. My site is definately NOT a good example to run this test, in fact, activerain and my profile and my blog are my webpage. Let's run those and see what we come up with shall we? I look forward to your results. This is an interesting point you bring up and has not yet been addressed in this post. Great stuff, thanks!

Brad, here is the results of ActiveRain validation. You will notice I just used this blog page to show you that every page on a non-secure site can be checked for XHTML validation. Any other blog page would work. Here is where I think a concerted effort to get MLS Administrators to update their site codebase would help everyone. Perhaps an ActiveRain campaign!

Of course, it might be a good idea for ActiveRain to clean up their code also.

One thing I only glazed over was the fact that Firefox and Internet Explorer use different rendering engines. This is readily apparent on sites that are of fixed width. When a website uses Cellspacing, Cellpadding, and margins of different sizes to place items on the screen (please note, that this is the preferred way, no modern programmer should use frames) IE and Firefox count up the totals differently (IE defect, Firefox counts correctly) so a programmer needs to be careful to make sure text does not overrun the margins or strange results will be visible.

They also should be aware that certain techniques that extend beyond the specifications can be used in IE and do not work in Firefox. As an example Charlotte MLS has a pop-up side menu that is totally non-functional in Firefox. When you ask them specifically for Firefox compatibility, I don't even think they read your email past the word Firefox before they send you their standard answer that they are only IE compatible. This is an example of poor programming practices and is one thing the XHTML standard is trying to address.

With regard to secure pages. The webmaster can run the tool while developing the code and should do so. But of course if you are restricting the audience you could also mandate what browser they should use, although I don't personally believe this is a good practice. Of course that is exactly what most MLS systems are doing.

Back to the original question, which to use, Firefox or IE. I personally use Firefox exclusively.I even use it with IE only sites like the MLS system here. I use a Firefox extension called IETab. with the click of a button on the status bar Firefox will re-render the page using the IE rendering engine. It can be set up to automagically switch rendering engines on specific domains.

Brad, please give Firefox a look and then look at all the extra functionality you can add to it by browsing the mozdev.org site and look at the extra search engines you can add an/or extenstions. You won't be sorry you switched and would probably never go back to IE again.

Link to Firefox extenstions

Link to mozdev search extentions

I only use IE to access our MLS system. Only because the MLS cannot be accessed through any other browser but IE. For everything else I use Firefox or Safari (Mac browser) and love both.

Griselda, I am in the same situation. Only IE is officially supported, But look at my post again. If you use Firefox, there is no need to run IE ever again. On sites like your MLS use IETab instead. just clink the link in my message above. What it basically does is run an instance of IE in a Firefox tab. It will even run Windows Update in Firefox. I am not a Mac user so I can't tell you if Safari has the same extendable architecture as Firefox.

JUL

2007

Griselda - did you try the IETab that Bud refers to above? We'd love to know if this works for you. Thanks!
I'm "The Escrow Guy" and can't get into an MLS to try it! :-)

Bud - I do not search the mls as I only close transactions, I don't list or sell property, but this information could be very valuable to other members on Active Rain who do use the MLS daily. If in fact your link above does correct these MLS browsing issues, then we need to make a bigger deal out of this than we are. Did you read all the comments above regarding these issues? Even Griselda might not have read your comment or any others for that matter, but in her defense, often times people just read the post and after 111 comments, they tend to go right to the bottom and comment...like me! :-) I think this IETab just needs to be tested by some of the readers and commentors here, and see what percentage of them it helps or corrects their issues. I may even do a FULL-ON Post regarding this if you are correct. Let's see if Griselda returns, reads your comment, and then check to see if it works for her. Lastly, we must remember, we are all creatures of habit, and some will never leave IE and others will never leave FF, then there's those like me who just use both. Whew...I'm done!! LOL! Thanks Bud for all your time and research on this. Let's follow this one through. Nite!

Bud, Brad is right, I didn't read your comment above. When there are so many comments on a blog, I usually read the few first ones and a few at the bottom. But this time I just read a few at the top! So, yes, I missed your comments about the IETab extension. Now I don't have the time, but later I will see if I can try this. By looking at their website it seems that this extension would work only on windows. If that's the case then it will not make much of a difference for me. Let me explain. I have a Mac where I have Parallels installed, this program creates a virtual machine inside the Mac and that's where I have Windows installed. I can be using both systems at the same time. Only that I don't like windows at all. So I do EVERYTHING out of my Mac system. Only running the virtual computer when I have to access the MLS. I have Firefox installed on both systems, but in Windows I only use IE because when I want to do anything else on the internet that is not going to the MLS, I jump to the Mac and use Firefox there, or Safari. Anyway, I'll go to this site again later and see if I they have an option for the Mac. Even if it works only for windows I'll download it and try the MLS. I'll let you know what happens. Thank you for all the information and the links.

Griselda, I noticed you were a mac user but since I saw Firefox I assumed you used Windows a lot too, boy am I silly! I don't know if there is an extension that works for Safari like IE Tab does, There is a great site for Safari users called PimpMySafari that includes many applets to extend the functionality of Safari and you might want to subscribe to its RSS feed to see whats new. Sorry if you already know about this site.

Brad, I too am guilty of only reading the last few posts before commenting. Just to let you know I have been using IE Tab and Firefox for over a year with the Charlotte MLS and have experienced no issues. I have written a blog entry on our website and will probably do one here too.

Brad, I will try the IETab with the MLS later tonight. But I wanted to drop by for a moment to thank you for writing this blog. The amount of information and the number of tech tools and software that are out there is so huge that's impossible to keep up. So blogs like yours start a conversation where sharing people exchange information and that's great. I already learned quite a few things and have added bookmarks to a few links that are very useful. Thanks again and keep blogging!

Griselda - thanks for coming back and for your willingness to check this IETab out. Please keep us posted as to how it works for you. I am doing a post regarding this next week and would love to give you some kudos and "link love" for your efforts and time. Also, thank you for your kind words, I am glad you find my blog to be of value, I hope others will as well. This research and conversation is what makes these posts so worthy of their time and space on AR!! :-)

JUL

2007

Hello Brad, I found out that the IETab is not available for the Mac system. I installed it on my windows virtual machine and it didn't work with the MLS. Or at least I couldn't make it work. Tomorrow I plan to look at it again, because tonight is too late and I'm very sleepy. So just in case I'll try it again when I'm awake. I'll let you know if there are any news. Thanks for your generous comments.

JUL

2007

Griselda - I have been out of town for the past 4 days, was wondering if you managed to get this to work? I really do appreciate your time and research. Keep us posted ok? Thank you so much!

JUL

2007

Brad, I didn't have a chance to try again. I'll let you know when I do. Thanks,

I love Firefox and use it exclusively except for accessing MLS. I feel like it is much more secure. Websites can look very different in IE vs FF so it is always important to look at both!

Ginger - there may be a fix for the MLS - Firefox issue. We are looking into it now with some other members, we'll be back to post our findings soon....thanks for your comment!

JUL

2007

Thank you for the info. I never heard of Fire Fox.. As always with Active Rain I learned something new, and now have my homework... I'm off to check this out.

Diane - firefox is a great browser, it works great, just has some issues with some of the MLS systems out there. IE is a great browser too, it's nice to have both.

Brad, I tried again, but still can't make Firefox work with the MLS system. If anybody can figure out how to do it, please let us know.

AUG

2007

Griselda - let's see if Bud pops back in here to comment. He is claiming that his works fine with Firefox, time to put him to the test. Inquiry minds want to know .....like me! LOL! Sorry it isn't working for you yet, let's see what we can come up with for you. Thanks for your patience and help with this.

BUD HAMMERTON to the principles office please...BUD HAMMERTON to the office please!! There Griselda,
that should get him back here... LOL! B-)

No need to yell. I am on vacation so I am not online every day, but here goes. First off, I use Firefox exclusively with the Charlotte MLS. Charlotte does not support Firefox but IE tab works perfectly. Charlotte is a marketlinx based MLS and I would suspect that the same setup should work with all Marketlinx based systems.

You actually have three choices with regard to IE functionality in Firefox, besides IE Tab there is IE View and IE View Lite. You may have to try those also to see which one will work for you.

Back to IE Tab. First you must log into your MLS system with IE you cannot switch after the fact, It will not work! There should be a status bar displayed in Firefox, If not go to View >> Status Bar and make sure it is checked. On the status bar you should see an icon that looks like a small version of the Firefox icon or perhaps the IE icon, that is the status indicator for IE Tab. If you right click on the status icon the IE Tab Options box will appear, by default you will be at the first tab setting which should be Sites Filter. There you will see a small list of sites that automagically switch to IE before they actually display in your browser. In the URL: box you would type the url of the login page of your local MLS. In my case it is http://cmls.marketlinx.com/*, then click on the Add button. While you are there also make sure that the Enable Sites Filter box is checked.

Please note that it is important that the entire domain and all pages be rendered in IE, to assure this do not include any other parameters in the URL: box and make sure that you add the /* at the end so that all pages from the domain are rendered properly.

If this is done correctly, when you go to your MLS system, Firefox will first invoke the IE rendering engine before actually going to the correct domain. At this point your entire session will be in IE (actually in a Firefox tab that is using IE). Another crucial point is that you must have IE installed on your Windows PC or it will not work. I am assuming this is the case. Also since you are using Parallels on your Mac make sure that IE works by itself (without Firefox and IE Tab) because if it doesn't work by itself it won't work in the tab either.

Gri, If you need more assistance I would be happy to help you. Try these thing first.

Griselda, there you have it, from a guy who sounds pretty confident, but doesn't like yelling...LOL! Give it a try and let us know how it goes!! Bud - who said you get vacation?!?!? :-)

AUG

2007

We host several other site beside our own, www.homsale.com, and are seeing about 30% of our viewers are using FireFox. It is clear that the browers behave differently and cannot stress enough that all site should be tested with both to ensure it is appearing properly.

I have friends using Firefox, I looked at it and that was it. I personally wasn't impressed, but I am not as experienced as the rest of you. I like the one that works for me and I am not as computer advanced as most of you. My son has Vista and loves it and I will start learning that. I will get frustrated if I get too many new things to learn at once. Give me time, I will come around and try it again.

Hi Brad,

Checking my web stats I have about 18% of users using Firefox and 77% using IE. Even though Firefox is gaining ground the difference is still significant. As a former programmer back in the day when Netscape and IE were the major browsers; I don't see websites developers taking Firefox more seriously until they gain more ground, as far as percentage of users. I'm not saying developers are discounting Firefox but it will not be supported equally to IE because the numbers are not there yet.

The reason more developers are not supporting Firefox(MLS, TopProducer) because developers would have to basically maintain two different sets of code because they both render html differently. On every page, the code would have to detect if a user is using IE or Firefox and then the session would be directed to the appropriate set of code. For a programmer that would be a nightmare situation because it basically takes twice the work. Every time you modify the code you would have to change it in two different places.

The reason many sites don't render properly on Firefox is simply because they are not designed to work on Firefox. When Firefox gains more market share (probably closer to IE numbers) is when more sites will be compatible on both browsers but I don't see that happening anytime soon.

As far as preferences I use IE mainly because I come from a MS background and those habits are hard to break, but I do QC my websites with Firefox just incase.

I enjoy using firefox, but too many of my on-demand applications require IE. Microsoft is guarding themselves well. When I bought a new system with Vista, firefox caused so many problems, I had to remove it...

Alex - Stats are just what they are. IE still comes bundled with every Windows OS and so it will continue to dominate. If you take that into account 18% usage for Firefox is significant. Every marketing study I have done or seen all say the same thing. If you currently use a product just the fact that it is bad is not enough reason to change to something else. The same applies to IE.

A properly written website or web application should work equally well with IE or Firefox or Opera or Safari (for you Mac users) and does not need separate codebases. It is only when programmers are not diligent or want to use very specific (ie non standard features) that we run into trouble. This is the real reason many sites do not work on Firefox, not the need to maintain two separate sections of code.

You actually hit on the exact reason for many not using or even trying to use alternative browsers when you said, "those habits are hard to break".

Candy - I think the appeal of Firefox is that you can extend the functionality with add-ons. As an example, I am a cyclist by hobby and old-school cyclists tell you everything about their bicycles in terms centimeters, millimeters, grams and kilograms. Then in the same sentence they talk about their bikes weighing in pounds and ounces. Now I would like to think of myself as a pretty smart guy but I can't convert from imperial to metric in my head. I happen to have a widget in the status bar that when I press on it it redisplays the page with all the measurements converted from one system to the other, just a flick of the button, try doing that with IE. BTW, my road bike weighs in at 6880g just over the UCI lower weight limit for racing of 6.8Kg.

Stuart - Our site is seeing a huge increase in Firefox traffic, over the last month Google reported to us that 38% of the site visitors are using Firefox!

Brad - I am training for an upcoming Century in early September so I do need some time off to "Get the miles in." I had tapered off the mileage in July because of work and other stuff, but was able to ramp up the mileage to about 180 last week. Take a look at this Blog entry to see a goal I reached this year as a result of 150 pound weight loss and a return to cycling after a 15 year layoff. Assault on Mount Mitchell.

Bud - (Sorry Brad for bypassing you since this is your blog post, but Bud addressed me through a comment so I wanted to respond). Bud it's your opinion that that IE is "bad" product. Firefox has some features that I like but I use IE because I have no reason to switch. As a software engineer (in a past career) I've always had multiple browsers on my PC because it has always been requirement in my former line of work, but I've always stuck with IE because I prefer it. I've had issues with IE in the past but I've always known how to trouble shoot them.

Most of the time it's a dll conflict with another program installed on the computer. The reason this happens is because IE shares a lot of dll (libraries) that other programs use. Sometime installers replace system level dll with their own versions and those modified versions are not fully tested / compatible with the IE version installed on a particular computer. By the way, I built a brand new computer in January and IE has yet to crash. I wish I could say the same about Windows but that's another subject all together.

As far as your comment about "website or web application should work equally well with IE or Firefox or Opera or Safari (for you Mac users) and does not need separate codebases. It is only when programmers are not diligent or want to use very specific (ie non standard features) that we run into trouble. This is the real reason many sites do not work on Firefox, not the need to maintain two separate sections of code."You are incorrect! Programmatically you can do things IE that is not possible on Firefox (without a lot of work-arounds). For instance IE is natively uses activeX controls. With activeX controls you can pretty much add desktop functionality to a website (i.e. access the hard drive, write/read memory, and etc). You have the entire Win32 api to your disposal.

I have written web applications for IE that use facial recognition technology, text to speech functions, and control robotic arms, web-cams, printers, scanners, signature pads, and etc. All this would not be natively possible with FF. This might not be important if you are just viewing a simple website / blog but in the corporate world it is important. When you are dealing with mission critical applications that require fast turnaround times you don't have time to make applications cross-platform compatible when one of the platforms is used by only 18% of the population.

I might have taken the example to the extreme but I'm just pointing out that there are differences between the two browsers and not all applications can be handled with the same set of code. I can go on with more examples but I don't want to bore everybody with more geek talk.

AUG

2007

No active-x for mac users, no active-x for linux users, active-x does work with Firefox add-ins. My statement was incorrect only if you live in a Windows only world.

Yes you can do a ton of stuff with Microsfot only additions, but back to MLS and realty sites, most do not use Active-X controls, I know mine doesn't, so this is really not the issue.

You are correct that no one will care until market share increases. Firefox market share is still increasing but it stands at only 12.72% worldwide and 19.65% here in the US. What is amazing is that Firefox has a significant share in Germany at 26.69%.

This is all I am going to say on this subject because I am going to go ride my bike instead (I have priorities!)

Griselda were you able to get FF working with IE Tab or IE View?

Bud - Check you out!! I leave for a couple days to go to Bloggers Connect in San Francisco, and you take over my post!!! What the......? Don't be asking me for no salary or part time pay you hi-jacker you!! LOL!!

Alex - Thanks for your demonstration of the polite manner in which you gingerly and delicately hi-jack my post with style and a moral and ethical approach! LOL!! I appreciate that! Seriously, Sorry I was gone for a couple days...

Back to you Bud, if you read the comments, you'll see it didn't work for Griselda, so no "post love" for you...your IE Tabs don't work for everyone. Now go ride your bike and don't hi-jack anything while your out on the streets!!! ROFL!! You know I love ya Bud...(only 1 comment per post please) hahahahaha!!! You're on probation, next comes the ankle bracelet. My dad used to say, "Don't make me pull this blog over".... B-)

Thanks for watching my post while I was away!!

Hi Brad -I was wondering where you were. I thought you might have been in SLO showing your son how to scam for the college hotties.

Bud- We do live in a MS world. My Webtrends reports that 90% of my traffic is generated by Windows users. The world may not be fully dominated by MS but it's pretty close.

The original post was not whether the MLS worked better on IE or Firefox. The post was asking which browser you preferred. I brought up activeX because you made a blanket statement stating that a single codeset could be used for all platforms; which is obviously not the case. If you qualified your statement I could have accepted it, but you tried to pass on a statement that was obviously incorrect.

You could get away with a single codeset with some simple web applications but you couldn't get away with it if you wanted do anything half-way complex like Topproducer 7i(which doesn't use activeX). You would ultimately have to select a browser which the majority of the population uses. It's a dollar and cents thing. Would you pay a programmer $150+ an hour to code for a browser that has 70% of the market share or 18%? That is the reason many sites don't work with FF.

Alex - my son needs no help with the hotties, he's already got one of those!! :-)

You and Bud go ahead and hash this thing out, but readers have already made a decision on what browsers they like, what browsers work with MLS's and which ones don't. So I hate to see Bud try to defend a useless battle over something he feels so strongly about. Let's face it guys, even if FF did work with EVERY MLS in the Country, I'm not sure that would change a thing that has been or will be written in this post. So let's be adults, take a big breath, shake it off, and let others post their comments as to why they use either product and their opinions for what works best for them. I just checked my stats this morning and my FF readership is down, compared to when I posted this back on March 24th. Just FYI!!

OCT

2007

Hey Brad: Sorry for the confusion... no I didn't post here, I posted on the Tech Boards asking for help, I just browsed your post looking for answers to my problem with FF. I still don't have my problem solved with the Virtual Tours. Also, in FF, under File, Import, IE... what exactly does this mean; I can't find any information under the Help button. Until I get my problem solved, I will continue to go back and forth between the two browsers.

http://activerain.com/blogsview/250547/Trouble-with-Firefox-Anyone

Jan - no apology needed. I suppose I should be checking those message boards, just too darn busy these days. Wish I could help you more with your Virtual Tours, there are so many things it could be and without being there to see exactly what's happening, I'm afraid I can't be more help. Also, regarding the file. import, IE.. I am not sure what that means, or what you're trying to accomplish. I'll check out the link you posted above and see if I can help any further. You're not alone in having issues with both IE and FF. I think we all have to go back and forth depending on the task at hand. I really wish I could help you more here, it's frustrating for us both. You could fly me out and write it off on your taxes!! hahaha! :-) B-)

O.K., Brad, if any other nutcase asks you about this problem, I have the answer now. I reloaded IE 7.0 and then reloaded Flash. My problems are solved. I can see all my Virtual Tours now and all the widgets I have placed on AR... I am happy. I probably had my computer all screwed up. And thank you so much for all your work.

OCT

2007

Jan - that's AWESOME!!! Glad you got it worked out. I never thought to have you uninstall and reinstall...DUH!!
Bottom line is that if you're happy, I'm happy!! Enjoy the rest of your weekend. Thanks Jan! :-)

SEP

2008

Brad,

Our MLS requires IE but when I'm on my laptop I prefer FF.

And my iphone uses Safari and I do a lot of browsing on that when I'm away from home or office.

I wonder what Google's browser will do to the marketplace.

SEP

2008

Jon - I have checked out Google's Chrome, but not enough to post about it just yet, still doing some tests and research, but I'll be letting members know my thoughts along with the features and benefits I find. :-)

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Brad Andersohn

Fairfield, CA

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