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Stupid Underwriting Tricks

By
Mortgage and Lending with Perl Mortgage

Those of us who live and die mortgages on a daily basis often times have to go get a strong drink and just laugh.  One of the favorite topics among loan originators at the water cooler is dumb ass underwriting conditions.  Basically, conditions that need to be satisfied on a loan approval that are so absurd and illogical that all you can do is laugh about them.  Of course, the challenge is trying to explain to clients, Realtors, and others with a straight face as to why you are asking for this stuff...

Because of the market we are in, underwriters are scrutinizing every single loan application.  Unfortunately, instead of using this time to actually think and make prudent lending decisions, every loan now is underwrittten with a fine tooth comb and we are getting conditions like "loan application to be completed in blue ink".

It is getting to the point that I decided to start a weekly post called Stupid Underwriting Tricks so I can share with the public some of the absurdity we deal with from time to time. 

We recently funded a loan that is being sold to a very very large bank.  Absolutely perfect file.  A 60% loan-to-value.  800 FICO scores.  Low DTI.  Conforming loan amount. The borrowers are perfect in every single way.  The kind of loan any bank should be begging for in this market.

Get this... the investor purchasing the mortgage came back to us POST CLOSING because they want "proof that borrower is not selling vegetables."  I AM DEAD FREAKING SERIOUS.  

What happened was that the purchase contract has an addendum about personal property and the house our clients bought has a very nice small garden.  The borrowers wanted to make sure that the sellers would leave all of the foliage with the house.  Some how the post closing audit weeny at Big Ass Bank thinks the house has a working farm.  Mind you the house is on a quarter acre lot.

The house is not in a farming community.  It is a just a little suburban house in a regular little town.  The borrowers are attorneys at a major law firm.  The garden isn't big enough to produce any sustainable produce that one could actually make a living on.   How this person was able to make this logical leap is beyond me.  Is is it April 1 already?  Has this person diluted the gene pool already?  

WTF?  Proof that the borrowers aren't selling vegetables! 

I couldn't make this up if you paid me...

Randall Schrader
Competitive Insurance of Dundee - Dundee, FL

Sounds like someone was recently burned by a farmer, LOL.  Realtors have no clue of the environment we are dealing with.  They tell me, "That makes NO sense!"  I'm like, sense?  What does that have to do with anything?

Oct 03, 2008 02:32 AM
Bill Ladewig
LoanOfficerSchool.com - Escondido, CA
Experience Is Your Advantage

On it's face that is a pretty dumb condition and should not go unchallenged.  I have had pretty good luck over the years in convincing underwriters to re-look at their conditions.  Underwriters are under a tremendous amount of pressure these days and sometimes take the wrong view.  Our job as LO is to make it come out ok for the borrower.

Oct 03, 2008 02:50 AM
Russ Msrtin
Perl Mortgage - Chicago, IL
Residential Mortgage Advisor

common sense and underwriting parted ways a long time ago.  I am constantly telling my clients that loans are not made because they make sense, they are made because their is a market for it. Underwriters have gone from being knowledgable about risk management to basically being paper pushers checking a box.  Big banks and wall street have removed any ability for them to actually THINK and make prudent decisions.

Oct 03, 2008 02:50 AM
Russ Msrtin
Perl Mortgage - Chicago, IL
Residential Mortgage Advisor

Bill;

We have definitely challenged it.  However, it just bothers me that I even have to spend time trying to get it resolved. 

Oct 03, 2008 02:52 AM
Susan Haughton
Long and Foster REALTORS (703) 470-4545 - Alexandria, VA
Susan & Mindy Team...Honesty. Integrity. Results.

ROFL...that is freakin' hilarious.  I have seen some absurdities at times, but this one is truly special.

Oct 03, 2008 03:01 AM
Dena Stevens
Rocky Mountain Realty - Canon City, CO
Putting The Real Into Realtor Since 2004

It's like should we laugh or should we cry, because some times I don't know anymore.

Oct 06, 2008 11:06 AM
James A. Browning
Browning Real Estate School/REO Institute - International, IT
MRE REOCertified(R) SSCertified

Hello, thanks for the information on your post! Please, join our group on LinkedIn, ‘REO Institute’. We share Real Estate information regarding market trends, Short Sales, BPOs, REOs, OREs, BOVs, ideas, Education/Training, and Commercial Education. We value you your comments, ideas, and opinions about the Real Estate Industry. Thanks, James

Thanks

James A. Browning MRE, CEO & Founder, REO Institute

Jul 28, 2012 01:42 AM
Dave Sullivan
Real Estate One - Birmingham, MI
Michigan Realtor with an investor viewpoint

Excellent information I will forward it if that is ok? thank you!!!

Nov 18, 2012 06:10 AM
Mike Rankin
ClearPath Mortgage Solutions, Inc. NMLS #1394615 - Albany, NY
Mortgage Consultant

Hahahaha....great laughs!!!! I just had an Underwrtier ask for proof of where faxes were coming from so my borrower had to fax a letter that said "I am sending these faxes from my mother's fax at work" ....things are getting strange for sure. I'm looking forward to hearing more.

Oct 22, 2013 08:28 AM
Anonymous
Ann Onnimus
And they're still strange, and a great laugh until it's happening to you. Our profile is perfect, credit scores above 800, and the loan was DENIED today - at NOON on the on the LAST possible day for loan objection, which has got us in a complete scramble - because the underwriter thinks the house we want to buy is a FARM and they don't fund farms. The sellers and both involved real estate agents are FLOORED. It's not a farm in any way that I would define a working farm, ie something you could make money with, but how do you prove that? How do you even formally DEFINE a farm? It's on 5 acres but zoned residential, in a planned neighborhood of similar homes on about 5 acres each. It's outside the area needed for USDA guarantee, so a USDA loan (you know, the type you get for a FARM) would always have been impossible. It's not schedule F. It has a 15 x 30 foot garden, which is perfectly reasonable for a family to grow their own veggies (which, last I checked, is something that is legal for anyone to do in any yard that has space for it) and a coop for chickens (the CITY we are living in a rural 'burb of allows up to 6 chickens on ANY property in city limits. So if you have a yard ANYWHERE here, even a communal yard like for an apartment complex, if you can get the owner's permission you can have chickens. The sellers have already moved their chickens, but does having chickens make this house a farm? Would it make a house near the downtown a farm too??). And get this - THEIR APPRAISER HADN'T EVEN FINISHED THEIR REPORT, so they were making this decision without all their information from the person THEY hired and that WE have already had to pay $400 for, so we're out that money. This wasn't a rush job on our end - we PRE APPLIED for the loan for this place before we went under contract, over a month ago, and were approved. They've had a copy of our contract with the dates this whole time, so what it looks like from our POV is that they took our appraisal money, sat on our formal application for nearly 2 weeks, got an appraiser at the last minute, and then someone back East had a lobotomy and decided anything over 1/4 acre was a farm because I guess rural subdivisions aren't a thing over there and tried to spout some mysterious regulation about Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac that we can't find anywhere. Shouldn't they have decided it was a farm BEFORE getting an appraiser, so we could have had time to get another lender and wouldn't have paid $400 for nothing? And if not, shouldn't they have at least gotten the appraisal in a TIMELY manner and then waited til the appraiser's report was done BEFORE MAKING THE DECISION, because otherwise WHAT THE HECK WAS THE POINT OF GETTING AN APPRAISER IF YOU DON'T EVEN NEED THE REPORT FOR YOUR DECISION??? Now we're at risk of losing the $2k we put down as earnest money. Nearly $2400 in the toilet. I'm livid, not least because I'd been with this credit union LITERALLY my whole life, over 30 years... and over this, they've also made us lose the rate lock we had on the rate that was lowest recently, and that'll cost us hundreds if not thousands in the long term. I will probably change banks, because I just do not care anymore. There's no reason to care, because they clearly don't. We'll try to appeal, if we can, but if we wind up closing with another lender or losing out on the house, I am going to give that bank the worst press possible everywhere and writing to every politician I can, because this is insane. Seriously, can you sue a bank to cover your financial losses and legal costs in a case like this? IMO they have been negligent at almost every turn and we are POWERLESS. How do you prove a house isn't a farm when they don't even have an actual DEFINITION for what a farm is??
Feb 21, 2014 11:18 PM
#11
Anonymous
red

my underwriter wants my taxes for THIS year. why? the year hasn't even finished yet. we don't have info and do them in january of NEXT year.

Aug 07, 2019 05:21 AM
#12