Some would say that any amount is too much.

     I would argue that most have some amount of water----even if it is condensation trapped under the ground cover----where the effect it could otherwise have on the house structure is minimized.  Many crawl spaces show signs of past moisture----with high water marks on the foundation and other structures, while others have actual standing water in them----sometimes even on top of the ground cover.

     It is very important to the health of the home to control these moisture levels.  The high water line in this crawl space is pretty obvious----and may actually date to the time of construction.  The hole in the foundation at the center of the picture is a "gravity" drain that was installed to drain the crawl space during construction----before the roof is installed----to prevent the "swimming-pool effect."  These drains can just as easily flood crawl spaces from the outside if exterior water sources aren't controlled properly.

 Maybe would could make an indoor pool?

     In this next picture the high water mark visible on the chimney (and on the support post to the left) happened since original construction.  The water would have been at least 5 feet deep-----most likely accounting for the new water heater visible in the background.  Sunsmile

 High water mark on chimney

     Take a look at this next picture.  The grey "socks" on all of these support posts are stains from long standing, but seasonal, flooding----perhaps every winter this crawl space is a swimming pool.

 The Grey Socks

     When conditions in the crawl space get this bad, in this neck of the woods, it can be a big problem.  Water evaporates----they call water in this state----"water vapor" (a gas).  As the water vapor rises through the home it condenses back into water on the first surface it reaches that is cold enough.  This might be windows in the living space or the roof sheathing in the attic.  When this happens in the attic, the roof structures can be destroyed worse than structures in the crawl space itself.  In this next picture you can see how all of the roof sheathing is black with fungal-growth-----mold----even right next to the vent.  Even in well vented crawl spaces and well vented attics, this much water in the crawl space is going to be a problem for the house.

Results of Condensation in the Attic 

     Too much water in the crawl space is never enough----it is too much.

Charles Buell  

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20 Comments on How much water in a crawl space is enough?

OCT
11
2008
576,756 Points 18 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Charlie,

Surpised that you do not have this one figured. As long as, when you stand inside the house at the floor, there is no water seeping up through, then there is no problem below. If there is too much water below, it will come up through the floor. Didn't you learn that in home inspector school?

11:34am • #1
576,756 Points 18 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Dear Mr Charles,

I have my third cousin, on my great grandmother's brother's side, come view the crawl space. If cousin Almond is unable to water ski, then we say there is not enough water in the crawl space.

Respectfully submitted for your review.

Your Friend Nutsy

Certifried home inspector assistant

 

11:38am • #2
374,337 Points 23 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Steve, I thought we were supposed to go by when water is flowing out the crawl space vents?

Nutsy, I think you need a SQ-Doo for riding around in flooded crawl spaces:)

11:43am • #3
214,118 Points 19 Featured Posts Outside Blog Hit Router

I put an addition on my house here in Anne Arundel Maryland a couple of years ago and the new building code requires a sump pump in a crawl space.

11:44am • #4
576,756 Points 18 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Charlie,

No, you are confused on that. You are thinking of the overflows on some of the flat roofs. The standard test for crawl water is seepage through the hardwood floor or a soggy carpet.

11:51am • #5
374,337 Points 23 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Richard, we see sumps around here too---but usually only if the space can't be drained by gravity (as with really flat lots).

11:51am • #6
374,337 Points 23 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Steve-----so are you saying to plug the crawl space vents and come back in a few hours to check and see if the carpet is wet?

11:53am • #7

I'm confused (as is often the case) What could be greater than an indoor swimming pool?  My house is in a flood prone area and I have had to resort to walking around my basement with five gallon buckets to kick on the sump pump that has failed to kick on on its own from time to time.  About Nutzy's situation I'm even more confused could Nutzy be his own grandpa (I'll let you all figure out how this would be possible).  Nutzy bashing is so much fun and I mean that in a non physical way. Nutzy's family sure does have a lot of nuts in it.

Klee B. Patel
12:38pm • #8
224,116 Points 26 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Surprisingly, I've sold a few of these where it was disclosed, inspected and very obvious - and the buyers looked the other way. I guess this means I can sell just about anything!

12:51pm • #9
374,337 Points 23 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Klee, I can just picture you with five gallon buckets on your feet:)

Carol, as long as they know---what can you say?

1:15pm • #10
351,167 Points 11 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Charles, this was another deal "undone" wasn't it.  Good clear pictures for the buyer to see!

4:30pm • #11
378,822 Points 1 Featured Post Outside Blog

Shazzam ...... Those areas look more like potential swimming pools, especially the one with the water heater.

Question ..... The picture with the water heater ..... was this a craw space or a basement?

Sean Allen

5:23pm • #12
119,870 Points 2 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor

I never even heard of a crawl space till I moved down here.   The house I grew up in (and all of my friends..and family members homes) had a basement!    (and ours never flooded!)

5:33pm • #13
374,337 Points 23 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Barbara, those pictures are from three different houses.  The two houses involved with the first two pictures when forward.  The house of the last two did not.

Sean, the house with the water heater was what I refer to a crawl space with a dug out area for the furnace and water heater.  Common in this area.

Kara, when you say "down here" I am assuming you mean you came from somewhere "up North."  You start to see a lot more basements where the builders knew the foundations had to get below the frost line.  If you gotta dig that deep---you might as well make a basement at the same time.

6:06pm • #14
OCT
12
2008
860,979 Points 68 Featured Posts Outside Blog

I saw one house that had a river flowing from underneath it and you see where the foundation was being affected by it. We didn't even want to look underneath to see what it looked like, we walked away before putting an offer in. These people didn't have problems other than a hot water heater? I'm betting they had a lot of problems that needed to be fixed because of that!

Todd Clark, Helping Families Home - www.IFoundYourNewHome.com

12:14am • #15

Hi Charles - We do have a lot of crawl spaces here in Southern Maine because there are a lot of seasonal cottages.  But I think you are quite right, if you are going to bother to build a crawlspace correctly, you might as well pour a full foundation.

6:35am • #16
331,840 Points 16 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Charles, your last statement says it all. Water is a great attribute when it is in the right place...

10:10am • #17
576,756 Points 18 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Dear Mr Pud Thai, or whatever your name is, I do not appreciate Nutsy bashing. I find it no fun at all and I am NOT my own grandpa. I admit that my family tree is rather hard to climb. I am my own second uncle, on my cousin's side. I am  not my own grandpa. I doubt you could fathom such a complicated set of roots.

Your disgusted friend,

Nutsy

Certifried home inspector

11:11am • #18
374,337 Points 23 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Todd, the conditions that caused the flooding around that chimney had been resolved before I got there----hopefully:)  Good case for "monitoring" though:)

Margaret, yes, cottages defy all the rules:)

Paul, thanks

Nutsy,----what can I possibly say----

12:03pm • #19
OCT
13
2008

I'd contend that pretty much any amount of water in a crawl space is too much water.

Considering that mold, dust mites and some pests thrive in moist conditions (humidity levels above 60%, 50% according to some sources) I'd say any ammount of water that can evaporate and cause the humidity level to raise above that level is a reason for concern. Even if it is only a seasonal problem

By favoring the growth of mold and dust mites, it ruins the indoor air quality due to the stack effect, in addition to the problems you mention (moldy arttics, soggy carpets, buckled hardwood floors). Not to mention energy losses, specially if you run ducts through the crawl space. There is condensation cooling the ducts and the simple fact that humid air costs more to heat and to cool.

However crawl space moisture problems are also relativelly easy to fix and control, so they should not be a deal breaker in real estate transactions, specially if they are dealt with from the start, before the mold and rot take over.

11:20am • #20

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