Hi, Mike,

Please allow me to disagree with your conclusion that "mobile closers" somehow share the blame for so many predatory loans being signed by so many borrowers who are unable to repay them.

I am a mobile notary who has witnessed the signing of more than 5000 mortgage loans in the past 8 years.  Note the word "witnessed;" my role has been to act as a neutral third party to these transactions by presenting the facts, offering to contact the loan or escrow officer when there are questions, and diligently pointing to the figures that comprise the terms of the loan.  I make sure that the borrowers I work with understand their right of recission and receive the legally mandated 2 copies, correctly dated. 

You are casting a very wide net of blame in suggesting that somehow I am tat fault because I witnessed these signatures.  Get-rich-quick loan officers filled out the applications, which were approved by underwriters and signed by people who in many cases were greedy but were assured by their trusted loan officer that he would help them refinance before their payment adjusted.  I listened to these conversations and heard the stories and in no instance under my watch was a borrower not fully aware of their right to cancel and how to do it.

I ask that you please re-think your position on this, Mike.  Thank you.

Linda

Mike,

I have to agree with Kim & Linda. I have been a Notary Public & Loan signing Agent full time for almost four years and have conducted more than 1000 signings. In every signing, where reg. z required a three day right to cancel, each borrower has received and signed their two, correctly dated, copies of this form. In the event there are not sufficient copies in the loan package I make additional.

It is not our function to "discuss and disclose the many documents contained within the closing package they are given by the mortgage lender.". That is  their Loan Officer's responsibility. 

It is our job to verify their ID, administer an oath or affirmation (where required by the lender or escrow company) and Notarize their signatures on the appropriate certificates.

While I'm sure there were many "bad" Mobile closers out there I'm equally sure there were many more "bad" Loan Officers...

Well, I also disagree with this blanket characterization of wht I do - with over 25 years experience as a real estate paralegal, I know when I leave the appointment my borrowers are clear about what they've signed and how to cancel the loan if they decide to.

Keep in mind - when someone finds themselves in a bad situation with no obvious way out, the usual first statement is "I didn't know" or "they didn't tell me"....doesn't mean they didn't know or they weren't told but they just want out and don't know how to accomplish it other than to blame someone other than themselves.

I've seen some horrible loans and seen many people taken advantage of, and I've often wondered how in the world the LO slept at night...to put the blame for these loans on the backs of the "mobile closers" is just ridiculous.

Linda H.    Columbia County, FL

Mike,

Laying the problem on the Mobile Notary as you did makes me question your knowledge on what the notary signing agent's job is or what they are allowed to do and not do according to the respective laws of the state. The loan officer is the one that should explain the loan to the borrower.

I have performed thousands of signings in accordance with California law.   I make it a practice to present the important documents first. The RTC, TIL, and the other important financial documents first and read them to the borrower if necessary to make sure they understand them.  I have seen many loans that should not have been made, but I am prohibited from commenting on whether I believe the loan is a good one or not, or answering any questions other than those where the answer is in the documents themselves and then I can point out that answer.  Anything else  and I can be charged with Unauthorized Practice of Law and be fined, lose my commission or even serve jail time under the laws of the State of California.

Put the blame where it belongs. On the loan officer, the loan processor, escrow and title companies and the lending institutions themselves. But first, see if the blame does not belong to the  consumer. In every case of the questionable loans that I closed, the borrower knew exactly what they were doing. In most cases, taking the equity out of their homes to buy toys, take trips, buy cars and put in pools. The comment I heard most was "I'll just refinance in a couple of years and get a better rate". Even when there were signs of the market crashing a few years ago, I, as a notary signing agent, could not comment on what I thought market conditions would be. UPL. I do have no doubt that some were duped, but from what I saw, they were few and far between. But of course, after things fall apart, now they claim they were duped.

And please, before you blame a person in the loan chain, please study the laws that apply to the notary signing agent and what their job is.

I certainly disagree with your assertion that mobile notary signing agents failed to do their job in presenting documents to the borrowers.  Since almost all loans have numerous copies made and housed in various despositories, one will find that even theough the borrowers may throw their copies of the RTC, TIL and other pertinent documents away, title companies and lenders have these documents in their possession clearly showing signatures that will match the various other documents also signed by the borrowers, especially all of the AKA statements, identity verifications, one and same name affidavits and so on.

You need to rethink this and revisit this topic after you educate yourself with actual court cases that get thrown out.  By advertising these services to the borrowers, you and others are giving them ideas.  Many HUD statements have the fee for storage of documents , sometimes line 1115: Scan storage fee, or line 1113 for Document storage and scanning.  These are on many loans, not because the title company wants this done, but because the lenders want this done.  Were they thinking in advance, knowing that they were making awful loans?

Julie A., Orange County, Florida, serving most of central Florida past 7 years

It sounds as though you have had a bad experence with a "Mobile Closer".  In order to eliminate this problem the loan officer should take the time to make sure that the "Mobile Closer" is experienced.  I know that if I was a loan officer and I just spent months trying to obtain a loan for a borrower, I would make sure that the person attending the signing was experienced.

As a former escrow officer and now a full time Notary Signing Agent, I have always made sure that the terms included in the Note, TIL, HUD & RTC, etc. are gone over prior to any other documents at a signing.  I advise them of their recission rights at the beginning and again when I hand them their copies of documents and leaving the recission papers at the top. 

So many times when there was a problem with the terms of the loan, I have had the loan agent come on the phone with the borrower and they tell the borrower not to worry, with promises that the borrowers believe, just to get the borrower to sign.  Those loan agents probably prefer to have an inexperienced "Mobile Closer" that would prefer a point and sign NSA.  This must come to an end.

Mike,

 I have closed loans as a Notary Signing Agent for  4 years and I am proud of the work I do! I have closed thousands of loans. Non of these loan packages were lacking the required RTC form. I know when they should be included, if they are not I will question this. There are thousands of Notary Signing Agents with plenty of experience and knowledge to execute a loan closing! I understand the UPL concept and know my role and limitations I also know when to make the necessary telephone calls to get questions answered when needed! To blame us for others misdeeds is plain wrong and I think you owe us an apology!

Claudine C. Osborne

From the tone of your blog, it sounds like you have been using some very "cheap" notaries who don't know what they are doing but the "price was right" to hire them.  I have been a legal secretary and paralegal for 30 years and worked many years in real estate law firms.  It was OUR duty to make sure the borrowers understood all of the documents - including the RTC - and, if your firm is having trouble with notaries who don't know what they are doing, then I would suggest that you report them to the Secretary of State.  We, as citizens, report attorneys to the Florida Bar (if they are Florida lawyers) so why don't you do the same?  Bottom line here is, you got and get exactly what you pay for - and that appears to be incompetent notaries who don't even know how to spell "notary" because you want more money in your pocket.  That's called "GREED".  I bet if you paid a decent fee (really you aren't paying the fee, but the borrower is - so I don't see why you offer a fair fee for the closing) and if you did pay a fair fee you might, just might, find competent notary signing agents that will be more than happy to work for you and handle the closing in a proper, professional and perfect manner.  Further, as "notaries" we are NOT authorized to explain documents to the borrowers - that would be considered practicing law without a license. We are there to present the documents, ID the borrowers, swear them in, make note of certain information that we need to verify, sit there while they sign the papers, notarize where we are supposed to, and send the package back to the lender, or mortgage company or signing service or law firm.  The only other reason that I can see that might have brought you to write such a blog is that your business is suffering because there are a lot of us out there who actually do know what we are doing and possibly we might be taking some of those "big bucks" out of your pocket. 

Mike, of the thousands of loan I have closed, much if the time I noted that the Realtor seemed to be pushing the client to buy a more expensive house than the borrower could reasonably afford.  Many realtors encouraged "cheating" on various loan details in order to make the sale. Lets face it, the more expensive the house, the larger the commission. Before you point the finger at the mobile notary, perhaps you should look in the mirror and examine the behavior of your profession.

Don't shoot the messenger.

Dear Mike, 

I am a full time mobile notary.  I am glad that you are out to get predatory lenders, but predatory lenders are not the "fault" of the mobile notary, as you seem to imply. You say the average loan is about 2 inches thick. I have closed over 8,000 loans, and I have never seen one that thick. ½ to 1 inch is the norm. Also, every loan I have closed, I have always had the borrower's copies there at the signing, I never needed to say their copies will be sent later.  Also, I have NEVER seen the TIL or the RTC missing in a set of refi documents.  TILs are not common in HELOCs. 

I know that it is a crime for me to give any legal opinions or advice to the borrowers, yet I am usually there alone, and they are looking to me for answers.  I tell them I am a disinterested third party, and I have no incentive to lie to them about what is on the papers.  Before I start a closing, I review the Note, the TIL, HUD and RTC with them.  If there are any problems with the loan, that is where they will be. 

Anyone who has ever cancelled a loan I signed, already knew when they were signing that they were uncomfortable with something. They usually say, "Well the loan amount and the interest are correct, but I am very upset about that figure on the HUD. If I don't get that straightened out in the morning, then I am canceling." So, it's not like people need to read 100 pages to find the problem.  

Many times, when sub-primes and pick-a-payments were all the rage, the borrowers had no idea that they were paying neg-ams, or that they had a PPP. I pointed those out as we reviewed the facts on the Note and the TIL.  That is the job of the LO and the Broker to be honest about the loan they have sold their client.  

One time a borrower would not sign because he believed his loan was fixed for 5 years, and I showed him that it adjusted every month starting with the first month. He got the LO on the phone and said he would not sign. The LO told me to TELL him to sign. I was not going to do that, since it was a crime. The LO said that I worked for him and it was my job to GET it signed. I said I worked for the State of California, and I was forbidden to allow people so sign anything they were uncomfortable with. He said he would never request me again. I said it would save me the trouble of telling my boss the same thing.

Another time, a borrower read every doc (2 hours) and kept asking my opinion. I told him repeatedly that it was a crime for me to give him my opinion, and I refused to give it.  He did not like the loan, but he signed it. He wanted a "better deal". He told my boss that I told him not to sign, and I was mortified. I would NEVER do that.  I was afraid I would lose my license, my job, my income, and my freedom as they sent me to jail.  I was so upset. Why would I risk my whole life for a stranger's loan?  Well, he just wanted a new (cheaper) loan, and he said that if I signed him "for free" he would drop the accusation.  What an evil man.  

After I review the figures with the borrower and make sure they are all correct, the signing goes quickly. You and I both know that the rest of the 100 pages are a lot of standard boilerplate.  I have sat there many times while borrowers read every word. It takes two hours. And they always come to this conclusion: the figures on the loan were correct, and the rest was a bunch of boiler plate. But I am capable of explaining every one of those pages: sheesh! I've seen every one of them 8,000 times.  

You should be grateful that you have mobile notaries signing your clients at all hours of the night (like 11:45 pm), on the weekends, Christmas Eve, Thanksgiving morning, New Years Day, etc. Many times I have been at a borrower's house, and they have a question for their LO, but the LO has turned off their cell phone, because they are off for the day.   If I miss a signature, I have to go back in my "spare time" the next day, hunting both parties down at their work and shipping the docs back on my own dime (or rather, $25).  

It is not "our job" to explain the docs, but that is what we wind up doing.  It is YOUR job to make sure the borrowers know the truth about the loan before we even get there.  A notary with no experience should have no trouble if the loan is what the borrower was expecting and the LO gave the borrowers a cell phone number.  

Sincerely,

Carolyn

I think part of the problem here is that Mobile Notaries/Notary Signing Agents, or as Mike calls them, "mobile closers" are not actually closers at all. They are not loan officers and they are not closing agents. They are notaries who are going out (and not being paid very much for it, either) and getting closing documents signed. Their job is extremely important in the closing process, but they do NOT close the loan. They do not originate the loan and they do not process the loan. They just verify the identity of the person signing the documents and verify that all of the initials are in place, all the proper seals are done, etc.

For the borrower, this person is often the only live face they get to see in the loan process. To them the signing *is* the closing, and some notaries (even those here) take upon themselves the role of a closer. Most are well aware, as has been pointed out, that UPL is a major concern and any decent notary knows when to keep their mouth shut. So even though people may think that the notary is the closing agent, that just isn't the case. I think notaries need to do a better job of educating people about that. By Mike's blog here it's obvious the education needs to get to more than just the consumers.

The problem is that people do not understand that Notaries are under a great deal of scrutiny when it comes to the practice of law. What might be a simple voiced opinion for one person could put a notary in jail if it is perceived as any kind of legal advice. A notary's job is simple, but important and not something that should be derided.

A good NSA does as Glenn and GW have noted. I also know of several extremely well-respected notaries across the country who use a disclosure form at signings. This disclosure form clearly explains the notary's role in the signing process: that he/she is a public official who is working on an independent basis to verify signatures in order to complete the loan process. They also often indicate the usual language about not being a lawyer and that they cannot give any advice regarding the particulars of the loan. A few have a notation that the borrowers sign that state that the NSA explained the purpose of the RTC forms and the the NSA left the form with them. This type of "CYA" behavior is one of the reasons a lot of CA notaries get thumbprints for every notarization -- whether they need to or not. It is proof that the notary did his/her job and that the person was actually present.

Notaries are not going to risk their commissions, fines, civil judgments and even jail for the lousy amount of money they get to facilitate these signings. They are public officials with their integrity at stake. To blame them for the lawsuits is just too easy and ridiculous. The good notaries aren't worried about those law suits because they acted within the state law that governs their jobs. It's just a stall tactic to pick at the little guy and deflect blame on the true source of the deception.

I don't know where you got your information & what your motive is in this article.  This blog contains a lot of general statements about "mobile closers" that are biased & not factual.  Why would you attack an industry that has helped to expedite the closing of tens of thousands of loans in the industry, and is cost-effective for the borrower? Are you advocating "attorney only" closings?

I am an experienced Notary Signing Agent & have taken training & been background checked.  I provide a valuable service to the borrower.  There is not one single loan package I have executed that did not contain all the legal requirements--appropriate # of RTC, TIL, etc.  In fact, I have the borrower sign their two copies of the RTC, so they can in no way say they didn't get it at closing.  If the borrower has any question regarding the loan, they have the legally required 3 days to review & question any aspect of the loan.

We were not the ones who sold these loans to the public.  We had nothing to do with the inflated values of real estate created during the "bubble".

I also think it would be a responsible thing for you to print a "retraction" of your unbased information.

Mike,

I used to be a settlement agent for a title company and prepared the closing documents, so I'm not one of those that "got their notary license" and went out and closed loans.  Since the local title companies close shop at 5 pm and most folks want to close their refi or second mortgage in the evening after work at the convenience of their homes.  The national lenders picked title companies that were licensed in many states so the lenders didn't have to shop around for local title companies and therefore could accomodate the clients' request for at home/business closings.

With that said, I cannot begin to tell you, how many loan officers from subprime lenders such as Ameriquest, Town and Country, Wilmington Finance, et al would out right LIE to the borrowers in such matters as "No, there is no prepayment penalty" when the note indicated there was, or you can refi in 2 years without closing costs if you come back to our company, when in fact they are charged again.  Or had interest rates that were much higher than the quoted and closing costs that were thousands of dollars higher than originally quoted, with the excuse that the credit score was lower than anticipated.  People signed those documents, ususally with cash out to pay high interest credit cards and even though they were flaming angry with the loan officer, they wanted the credit card companies off their backs.  Additionally, I saw inflated appraisals and promises from loan officers that all the closings costs were tax deductable in a refi or fixed second mortgage.  Many times, the borrowers would call the loan officer on my cell phone (so I had proof that a call was made) and said they wanted to have their attorney review the papers and they were told that their rate locks would expire or that they were spending $$$ unnecessarily.

Some loans were in excess of 100 pages, including some of the lenders mentioned above, but some were not as many.  As you know, the entire loan can be summarized in the Settlement Statement, Note and Right to cancel.  My borrowers were always presented those first and were given plenty of time to review, read and ask questions. 

You know I'm right.

Having closed more than 1200 loans in the last four years, I take exception to your generalizations and inuendos.  Mobile closers ARE NOT responsible for the sub prime lending situation. 

My job was never to explain the loan or the terms of the loan to the borrowers.  My job was to present the loan documents to the borrowers, point out basic items, make certain they signed the proper documents and notarize the needed areas.

I can't tell you how many times I arrived at a $300K + home in a new housing development, and saw a new Hummer and a new Lexus parked in the driveway.  Upon entering the home, there was not a piece of furniture in the place.  The wife is carrying around two babies in diapers, and the busy, young executive husband is answering 2 to 3 cellphones every few minutes.  I would sit down on the livingroom floor with these people and we would sign an ARM or a balloon payment loan on a telephone book which we passed back and forth between us while the babies screamed and the cellphones continued to ring.  These people were obviously way out of their league and obviously way in over their heads in debt.  And you are saying this is MY FAULT...

Since your home state of Florida is one of the biggest foreclosure states in the nation, you need to re-evaluate your criticisms of "mobile closers."  Try looking at the lenders, LOs, and brokers who used deceptive techniques to SELL their over priced loans.  You also need to consider greedy borrowers who "want it all, and want it now..." 

Obviously, as someone who is right in the middle of this situation, you should be ashamed of yourself for trying to "pass the buck." 

Must also remember from salesman 101:  Buyers are liars

This is what I suspect as well.  Port Charlotte was a huge development/sales area during recent years.  Remember, Mobile Closers or Notary Signing Agents aren't  selling anything, and are not as involved in the "Greed" aspect of the industry.  Many of the HUD's I see have $10K/$15K in closing costs, most of it going to a mortgage broker, and we have to fight to be paid $150 per closing.  This should be on "20/20" in their "Give Me A Break" format.

I will say it again--Paragraph 2 of this blog presents some very serious accusations that are not based on fact.

Mike,

I've been a mobile notary/certified signing agent for over five years. I've closed over 4,000 loans in two states. I maintain certification and membership through several professional associations and keep abreast of the laws regarding the documents I handle. I am a professional and take my role as a notary and as a signing agent seriously. My education is ongoing in both my state's notary laws and the mortgage industry.

However, I cannot, nor should I be asked to do your job for you. It is the loan officer/broker's responsibility to make sure that your clients are informed and understand the loan product they are buying before a person like me even comes into the picture. Not only is it your job it is your legal obligation to make the necessary disclosures to your client within certain mandated time frames. It is also your responsibility to make sure all required documents are in the package and are accurate. I personally have never seen or executed a loan package where there was a right to cancel and not have the RTC form in the package, though I can believe it happens.

Your attempt to shift the blame for shady loans off to notary signing agents is really shameful. I would like to give you the benefit of the doubt that you're trying to help consumers but when I see you blaming notary signing agents for the immoral/shady practices of your peers I know that you're not really trying to help at all.  You're merely looking for a scapegoat.

Every day I go into clients' homes and listen as borrowers explain the nightmare they've been through at the hands of shady loan officers/brokers who won't return phone calls and deceive them about origination fees, closing costs, and brokerage fees/points.  I've witnessed so many loan officers and brokers flat out lie to their clients just to get them to sign documents.  

I've also been asked to perform illegal notarizations and lie to clients. I've been asked to backdate documents, notarize blank documents, sign documents as the settlement agent, and to coerce borrowers to sign documents. I've refused all such requests and disassociate from any individual/company asking me to engage in any illegal, immoral, questionable behavior.

The mortgage industry is well served by notaries. Consumers benefit from having the impartiality of professional notaries helping to protect their documents from fraud. I shudder to think what would happen if notaries were not involved with the execution of documents.

You should confront your peers and ask them to clean up their act. You also owe professional "mobile notaries" an apology.

Hi Mike,

I just reviewed some of the comments the mobile notary's had for you.

I got one of those California loans and it was loaded with TILA/RESPA violations

and pure deception. I even have all the memo's during the loan and it's not good for the bank.

This problems led me to examine my recorded mortgage and I found out after the notary left us

a witness was later obtained that was supposenly at closing and was not. Now you have a instrument

that is invalid because poor judgement was used and the lender don't have a clue. This was a Florida

notary that has been around for years. Some people feel they are above the law. This one admitted

adding a witness after the fact and sending it to the lender for recording. I would have never caught

this if I did not have so many other problems with the loan. Mobile noteries you have some people

feel like no one is watching them. My hat off to you all and some lenders are killing good people out

there and you guy's are not aware of what's going on. It's a paycheck!

Seems like attorneys would be standing in line to do a  "CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT"  for all those borrowers who were told they could Refi out of their Subprime loan in a couple years, and PMI would cover the loan if the borrower defaulted on the loan, which was not true ...  Keep in mind that most borrowers did not lie on their mortgage apps and would not have defaulted if the price of gasoline had not tripled during that time period and were also faced with massive job layoffs.