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Dear Mr. Washington State Home Inspector,

By
Home Inspector with Charles Buell Inspections Inc.

 

Dear Mr. Washington State Home Inspector,Lena's house

     We are moving to the Seattle area this fall and will be buying a house in the Green Lake area.  It would be helpful if you could give us an idea of what you charge and any other information that might be pertinent to our choice of a home inspector.

Sincerely,

Sally & Sam Homeowner

 

Dear Sally & Sam,

     Thanks for contacting me about the process of inspecting your future home.

     The cost of the home inspection can vary depending on the size, age, number of bathrooms and other factors like crawl spaces, attics, detached structures, and Mother-in-law Units.  I will need to have this information prior to quoting a price and urge you to call me at your convenience to discuss the actual cost and to set up a time to do the inspection.

Connecticut House     You should also be aware that currently in Washington State; we are transitioning to Home Inspectors being required to be licensed as Home inspectors.

     Currently anyone performing home inspections and reporting on Wood Destroying Organisms or conditions conducive to wood destroying organisms (and what house in the NW doesn’t have at least one condition that is conducive to rot or bugs? Termite Frass) is required to be licensed by the WA Department of Agriculture as a Structural Pest Inspector.   This license requires insurance. 

    When the new law goes into effect (and it will be in effect when you are buying), Licensed Home Inspectors will no longer be required to be Structural Pest Inspectors and will not be required to carry any insurance.  So anyone you are considering for the job of inspecting your home, I strongly urge you to make sure that they are Licensed Structural Pest Inspectors and that they carry insurance.  For example, if you look at the beetle damaged support in the Anobiid Beetle Damagepicture to the right (a very common wood destroying insect in the NW), Home Inspectors licensed under the new WA State Law would be required to call for “further evaluation” of any such damage by a Licensed Structural Pest Inspector.  It is not likely that two separate inspectors will be able to provide the best information, in a timely manner, as one inspector licensed to do both. 

     As a side note, there can always be additional costs involved with inspecting homes if conditions are discovered that might require further analysis by other professionals (like for example if the house is in a “critical slopes” area and needed further analysis by a Licensed Geo-Technical Engineer).  Hiring an inspector that is not a Licensed Structural Pest Inspector would increase the odds that additional costs would be incurred----not to mention affecting purchasing time-lines----and not to mention that the inspection may end up being more superficial.  Home Inspectors will no longer be required to have the same due-diligence when inspecting crawl spaces as is currently required by the Structural Pest License.

     Thanks for contacting me through ActiveRain and if I can be of further assistance please give me a call.

Sincerely yours,

Charles Buell

 

 

 

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Comments (65)

Steven L. Smith
King of the House Home Inspection, Inc. - Bellingham, WA
Bellingham WA Home Inspector

Justin,

More good comments at Charlie's blog. I think it interesting that a number of inspectors on here are feeling that the coalition of inspectors, who in theory represented the industry, fought for issues that most inspectors checking in here were not in favor of.

Feb 11, 2009 03:43 PM
Anonymous
Mike O'Handley

Hi All,

Charlie, re. your post of the 10th, there are NO home inspectors in the state of Washington...really? Well, if they don't exist, why did the legislature pass a law to regulate them? If they don't exist, why did the SPI's (PCO's back then) push through coupling WSDA to home inspections back in 1991?

Don't bother answering that, Buddy, I'm just messin' with ya. You're still a mensch.

Today, Mack (Bruce MacIntosh) and I went down to Olympia to deal with SB5644. We thought it might be necessary for both of us to testify before the committee as to why 5644 should be killed but, as it turned out, the bill's co-sponsor opened the hearing by basically withdrawing the distance learning provision. Since the mold question had already been pulled last Friday and was no longer on the table, the bill was DOA. Mack read the board a statement anyway on behalf of the HI Board in order to get their objections to 5644 into the record.

After Mack, came two ladies who arrived all prepared to address the committee about mold - one with a big posterboard full of photos of her home. She's well known to some members of the HI board because she's been demanding that home inspectors be required to "look for mold." Since the bill was essentially DOA and the committee had to address three other issues that afternoon, she didn't get very far before the chairwoman shut her down, telling her, "There's a lot more work to be done with that, " or something similar - referring to the mold issue. I think it's clear from the way that she said it that the mold issue going to rear its head again in the future. I say that because the chairwoman was primary sponsor of the bill in the first place, becasue she told the ladies that she understood their concerns, because the mold issue is what attracted her to the bill in the first place, and becasue she'd co-sponsored other legislation in 2005 to deal with mold in residential dwelling. I doubt that we've heard the last of this issue; I suspect that, after they've done a little more homework and have constructed a more strongly worded bill, we'll see the issue again. In the meantime, it's gone away and hopefully won't reappear until next January.

You guys should know that just before the committee convened today they received a letter from Mike Krause and Dr. Payam Fallah, both Certified Industrial Hygenists who've been in the thick of the effort by the scientific community to dial the mod thing back to some semblence of sanity again. It was a well worded document and clearly spelled out all of the reasons why trying to create legislation that makes home inspectors responsible for the discovery of all mold in a home creates unreasonable expectations in the minds of buyers and could seriously hurt the profession. We in the profession owe those gentlemen our sincerest thanks.

So, now that the mold thing has gone away, I think that the profession should pat itself on the back; folks came together, got the word out, and it's obvious that those in the profession clearly made themselves heard and showed some folks in Olympia that home inspectors aren't pushovers despite our tiny numbers. Thank you, all of you that made your voices heard.

Some interesting commentary on the SPI thing above. Today at the hearing I spoke directly with Jerry MacDonald and Rhonda Myers (The HI Supervisor for DOL). They told me exactly what they told Steve. So, Charlie and Steve, I'm not too proud to admit when I'm wrong and I owe you both an apology for arguing with you about this.

It was interesting conversation though and I wish you'd been there, because the way the answer came across was that technically I might be right, but..... There wasn't any question that they are solid in their willingness to leave this thing with WSDA, for now, but if you had been there you would have sensed a certain tentiveness with the response. I came away from the conversation concluding that they aren't 100% certain what the correct answer is but that they intend to err on the side of caution rather than get into any dispute with WSDA about the issue. That's fine, there's no hurry, a few more months isn't going to make that much difference. Besides, one has to appreciate the fact that they're still trying to figure out this whole brand new home inspection nut that's been tossed in their laps. It's ultimately going to be their responsibility to implement and enforce the thing, not the Board's, so more power to them. 

Tomorrow afternoon a committee is meeting at 1:30 pm in the House Full Hearing Rm D of the John L. O'Brien building in Olympia to consider the elimination of 60 state boards - one of the boards being considered for elimination on June 1, 2010 is the Home Inspectors Advisory Licensing Board. I know some folks will rejoice at seeing the board eliminated, because they're going to want things to return to the way they were with no consistent standards for inspections or reports and no education requirements for inspectors, other than the need to read a couple of books about insects and pass a bug test. To those folks I'd like to point out that somewhere between 20% ad 30% of the inspectors in this profession have already left and we're going to lose more before this thing finally turns around. Across the country, the profession had problems before the recession with an image tarnished by poorly trained inspectors who were flipping burgers on Monday and began inspecting homes on Tuesday. As bad as that was, it's liable to be worse when the economy begins to recover because there is going to be a shortage of inspectors across the country and that's going to result in a flood of new shake-n-bake home inspector "schools" opening up. As much as the profession's image suffered during the good times, can you imagine what it's going to be like when the economy begins to recover, if there aren't any rules in place or anyone out there who's famliar with the profession to provide the state guidance so they can enforce those rules? I can and it ain't pretty.

I'll be going down to Olympia to urge this committee to at least keep the board in place a couple of more years, until the dust from the licensing process has settled and the only folks left in the state to be licensed will be those who are brand new to the profession. By then, perhaps the folks at DOL will have worked out all of the kinks and it will no longer be needed.

If any of you have got the time tomorrow, and you believe that a board run by home inspectors advising DOL is a better alternative to having bureaucrats who're unfamiliar with what we do responding to people's complaints against home inspectors without the assistance of a board consisting of inspectors, your support would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks, it's late; gotta crash.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike O'Handley, Editor, The Inspector's Journal

Feb 12, 2009 07:50 PM
#48
Charles Buell
Charles Buell Inspections Inc. - Seattle, WA
Seattle Home Inspector

Mike, don't sweat it----we are all just trying to sort this whole thing out:)

Feb 13, 2009 01:01 AM
Steven L. Smith
King of the House Home Inspection, Inc. - Bellingham, WA
Bellingham WA Home Inspector

Mike,

You and Mack are to be commended. You were on top of that mold/learning bill. Glad they pulled the plug. As to the SPI law, your thoughts on that had me wondering. There are enough time-lines in there that I got to thinking maybe you were right. I sure would not have known without talking to the state, so no apology required...for sure.

You are absolutely right about the board. Anyone who thinks that demise of the board would mean back to the way it was is wrong. Instead you would have nobody from the field advising the state employees on issues they do not understand. And our field is high tech enough that includes a number of things that seem basic to us. For example, inspectors know that we do not want mold in the SOP. Everyone of us on the board made that clear to DOL and legislators. Like us, or hate us, at least we work in the field.

Good luck today. I just cannot make it but will see you Tuesday.

Feb 13, 2009 01:11 AM
Anonymous
Mike O'Handley

Hi,

Well, I just got back from Olympia and I'm not feeling real good about the whole thing.

I had prepared a statement that carefully laid out all of the arguments for why eliminating the board was a colossally bad idea now that the board is halfway done with their work and the first licenses are on the horizon. I'd rehearsed it this morning and it took me about 5:45 to read. I figured that I'd have to do it in 3 minutes and had a good idea of where I'd pare it down by about two minutes, but I drove down to Olympia without editing it on the off chance that I'd be given my 5:45. I was the first person to arrive and sat there in that hearing alone for about 15-20 minutes going over the statement in my head like I used to do when preparing for a staff briefing in the military - I've done a couple hundred of those.

Then they started the meeting and I learned that they were only allowing 2 minutes per speaker. S**t! So, I sat there for three hours waiting for them to get around to the bill and I pared that statement down to just the chassis, tires and engine with an upside down milk crate to sit on. I rehearsed it in my head a couple of dozen times and it timed out at about 2:50 to 3:10 every time. I figured I'd have it licked. At about 4:15 or so, Terry Kohl, the lobbyist for ASHIWW, came up to me and asked me to step outside. Earlier, he'd handed me copies of WWASHI's position statement about the bill and asked me if I'd deliver it to staff. I said, "Sure, why not."
 
Kohl gets me out in the hallway and wants to talk about the fiscal note and how it shows costs but they're upfront costs and will be paid back over the next four years from fees and the program is cost neutral, etc. He wanted me to talk about how the amount of up-front costs are amortized over the next four years, blah, blah, blah and my eyes just glazed over. I don't do money; in fact, I'm as dumb as a rock when it comes to finances, I had no friggin' idea what he was saying to me. He wanted me to estimate how much time in manhours the staff was putting into this thing already, or some other mumbo-jumbo but it went right over my head.  I looked at him and said, "Terry, I can't even balance a friggin checkbook, I don't do money; period - that's my wife's job,  in fact, I'm a retard when it comes to money." He didn't listen, just started trying to re-explain it to me over and over. I didn't get it. Finally, I got frustrated and just said, "Yeah, I get it," and went back inside. I was kind of pissed and frazzled and everything in my prepared statement that I'd memorized was all fragmented in my head interspersed with thoughts of how the hell I was going to explain the money thing.

Then I got back in there and discovered that they'd already called my name once while I was out in the hall jawing with Kohl. Now, I'm embarrassed and pissed. Not a good combination at all. I went up to the table and just kind of flailed like a salmon left high and dry by a flood. Not my best hour; back in the Army a performance like that would have earned me a counseling statement and a threat of an impact EER in my jacket.

To make it worse, as far as I could tell, not one single other home inspector showed up to testify for or against the bill or even signed up to state that they were for or against it but didn't want to speak to the committee. Hell, even some biker dudes showed up in their greasy black leathers with chains hanging from their ass and such and testified; one guy called Texas Bob Walker had a long stringy beard like a ZZ Top dude. 

I can't imagine that we inspectors looked very good with me stammering like someone with turets and nobody else in attendance - especially when anywhere from a half dozen to about two dozen people showed up and signed the log for various other bills. It must have looked to that committee like home inspectors didn't give a rat's ass whether a bunch of non-inspectors are going to be the one's who end up investigating complaints against them and managing the program ala Texas.

Seriously bummed - not my finest hour.

ONE TEAM - ONE FIGHT!!!

Mike

Feb 13, 2009 02:24 PM
#51
Steven L. Smith
King of the House Home Inspection, Inc. - Bellingham, WA
Bellingham WA Home Inspector

Mike,

I really am sorry it worked out that way. I would have liked to have been there but is was not possible. Regarding one of your last comments, I know what you mean. It seems like inspectors have a million comments and complaints about the process but the number who have gone to the board meetings, where the future is being planned for the industry, is minuscule. Obviously we are not a group that gets a whole lot of participation. We do, however, hear a fair bit of btching and moaning when things do not go to suit.

Feb 13, 2009 02:39 PM
Charles Buell
Charles Buell Inspections Inc. - Seattle, WA
Seattle Home Inspector

Ditto what Steve said.  For a "participatory democracy"----most people tend to forget the participatory part:)

Feb 13, 2009 02:45 PM
Harold Miller
Miller Home Inspection - Stanwood, WA
Certified Professional Home Inspector

I have to say the process deserves some negative feedback (bitching and complaining). To take a day off to drive down to Olympia costs me between several hundred and a thousand dollars in lost business. Not to mention the 6 to 7 hours driving (roundtrip)...and to only be allowed to talk for 2 minutes..... I am not surprised by the low turnout by inspectors, if I am to be totally honest.

During the home inspection legislation hearing process, I was able to pull up the video of home inspectors testifying, getting prodded along by Jean Kohl_Welles, as if she did not even care what anyone had to say. The more vocal opponents seemed to be interupted the most, and they had hardly any time to make a point.

For me I find writing the legislators gives me the same chances of getting my point accross as does handing them a copy of it in person. And at least I might get a response back that way.

Just my opinion.  :)

Feb 14, 2009 02:27 AM
Steven L. Smith
King of the House Home Inspection, Inc. - Bellingham, WA
Bellingham WA Home Inspector

Harold,

I understand. Speaking before the legislature is inconvenient and now, for the most part, the finer points of the law are being developed by the licensing board. The HI licensing board meetings take time too but, for your info, our board meetings have all been in Seattle area, not Olympia, so that helps with the drive. At the board meetings, unlike at the legislature, we give longer than two minutes for audience members to speak. There was one meeting, where the agenda was tight, where talk was limited but for the most part the public gets time to speak. Keeping in touch, and writing board members, or Email works too. It just gets frustrating, being on the board, to get zero input other than, once something has been approved, people coming out of the woodwork complaining about not having any input or say in the process. In that regard, I know where Mike is coming from.

Feb 14, 2009 02:55 AM
Harold Miller
Miller Home Inspection - Stanwood, WA
Certified Professional Home Inspector

Attending the home inspector board meeting is something I would really like to do. It was helpful that you posted the schedule on your blog, otherwise I would have no clue when these were going on. 

The good news is that inspection business has really picked up in the last couple weeks, but the bad news is there is not a chance that I can get away to attend the Feb 17th meeting.  I am coming up on working 10 days straight, with no days off, and have quite a few inspections booked out still.

Maybe I will get a chance in March, but will have to wait and see.  

Feb 15, 2009 02:08 AM
Steven L. Smith
King of the House Home Inspection, Inc. - Bellingham, WA
Bellingham WA Home Inspector

Harold,

Glad it has picked up. Is that mainly Camano? I have a number of friends and relatives there and I have heard horror stories about housing sales, at least a few months back. I know a few of them have sold houses more recently, last couple months.

I understand what you mean about time. If you hear/see something you want info on or have a comment on, send me an Email. I get quite a few and try to present them to the board if that is applicable.

Steve

Feb 15, 2009 02:59 AM
Steven L. Smith
King of the House Home Inspection, Inc. - Bellingham, WA
Bellingham WA Home Inspector

Harold,

By the way, I appreciate some of your comments over at NACHI. You provide a voice of reason compared to some of the posters. The SOP we passed is just not that different than what most of us, who try to do a detailed job, are doing right now. You pointed that out and it is appreciated. The sky is NOT falling.

Feb 15, 2009 03:10 AM
Harold Miller
Miller Home Inspection - Stanwood, WA
Certified Professional Home Inspector

Steven;

No, business has picked up for me, but not on Camano Island, so much.

It is a rare occasion that I get to stay on the island for business. But that is nothing new. Business for me on the island has always been slow, but the sales volume does not compare to more populated areas.

In fact there are homes here that have been on the market as long as I have lived here. (9 years) Granted they are waterfront, and over a million dollars.

Most of my business is in Snohomish County, and primarily the Greater Everett area, and that is where I am seeing the market snap back to life. But I have been extremely fortunate that my year over year numbers have not been affected by what is happening in the real estate markets. It almost makes me wonder if all the bad news is blown out of proportion.

But I have heard of inspectors leaving the business, and I personally know of real estate agents that have had to leave the business. So it must be real to an extent.

 

Feb 15, 2009 08:48 AM
Harold Miller
Miller Home Inspection - Stanwood, WA
Certified Professional Home Inspector

Steve

In repsonse to your second post regarding the SOP and NACHI.

I felt like I had to interject a voice of reason over there. That seems to be in short supply there, and really I think that there is very little objectionable in the proposed SOP. I would think our clients expect as much as what is found in it.

But you will never convince the anti licensing group over there that any SOP is right.

Feb 15, 2009 08:57 AM
Steven L. Smith
King of the House Home Inspection, Inc. - Bellingham, WA
Bellingham WA Home Inspector

Thanks Harold. I agree with you, my business has been such that I was questioning the glum market but, like you, I know that some people have been hit hard, realtors and inspectors.

Feb 15, 2009 10:57 AM
Paul Duffau
Safe@Home Inspections, LLC in SE Washington - Asotin, WA
Caring for People, Educating about Homes

Steve, Charlie,

An update on the SPI issue - I emailed Dan Soumi for his opinion.  It is, "you are correct, until the new home inspector license takes effect, inspectors reporting on WDOs, damage, or conducive conditions during real estate transactions are still required to be licensed as structural pest inspectors."

That would seem to difinitively settle the issue. 

As far as getting to meetings, it is nearly impossible for me from a scheduling standpoint - I lose a day and a half due to travel.  It would be nice to create a webinar type system to access us in the hinterlands.  Don't see it happening but it would be nice.

Feb 17, 2009 06:34 AM
Sharon Tara
Sharon Tara Transformations - Portsmouth, NH
Retired New Hampshire Home Stager

Great post, I love the letter format.  Your pictures are awesome, even the creepy bug one!  I've never seen such long comments in a post before.  The comments are longer than the post itself!  Congrats on the Carnival of Consumer Content Honorable Mention!

Mar 03, 2009 08:15 AM
Charles Buell
Charles Buell Inspections Inc. - Seattle, WA
Seattle Home Inspector

Thanks Sharon---yes this post sort of "grew some legs" as they say:)  It is a pretty bug isn't it?

Mar 03, 2009 08:23 AM
Rebecca Gaujot, Realtor®
Lewisburg, WV
Lewisburg WV, the go to agent for all real estate

Great creative post. Congratulations on the honorable mention.

Mar 03, 2009 11:49 PM
Charles Buell
Charles Buell Inspections Inc. - Seattle, WA
Seattle Home Inspector

Rebecca, thank you

Mar 03, 2009 11:56 PM