I was doing an inspection on a large house yesterday. My clients had told me the listing agent had tried to tell them the house had just been inspected for the seller and they didn't need one. A builder they had met gave them my name as a "good inspector". 

When I got to the house, I was told that a termite inspection had been done and some treatment completed last Tuesday (4 days ago). I had noticed a spot where an old mud tube had been scraped off, and signs of a few drillings in the slab.

The crawlspace in this house was pretty interesting. 1. It had a poured concrete floor., 2. It had some areas where the clearance was pretty small. 3. There were lots of little nooks and cranies where the foundation walls created a maze.

From the main part of the crawlspace I could tell there was a lot more that I just couldn't see very well. It looked like it was going to be next to impossible to get to it, however after I looked more, I could tell that if I went under some ducts, it opened up again. So in I went. I will call this "The Hard Part".

1st clue. The property owners have been traveling and have not been in the house for several weeks. On with the story.

As I got to "The Hard Part" I noticed the dryer was not vented to the outside. So I was greeted with a large amount of lint covered spider webs. LOTS of webs! Off in the distance ahead (about 30 feet) I could see some staining on the foundation wall. I needed to get there. So off I went. I had to go over and under pipes and some ducts, and sweep webs and lint out of my way. 

When I finally got there, I could see a lot of termite tubes. What was really cool (for an inspector anyway) was one of the tubes went from the concrete slab up 32" to the floor joists. There were also some on the front foundation wall. STRIKE 1 for the termite inspector. He didn't go back there.

I was under the master shower, and as I pulled the floor insulation away, I found EXTENSIVE wood rot and damage on the sub flooring and joists. STRIKE 2 & 3 for the termite inspector, STRIKE 3 for the home inspector (I skipped strikes 1 & 2 for the home inspector).

I am not usually one for pointing fingers and saying stuff like "That guy should have caught this", because we don't know when they were there. However, I do know when they were there, both of them. I can pretty much bet they did not even attempt to go back there. Remember the 1st clue? There would not have been as many spider webs with dryer lint if they had gone in there. There may have been spider webs, but since no one has been in the home doing laundry, NO LINT!

I don't bring this up to imply that I am a "super Inspector" or did anything out of the ordinary to get into that area of the house. I was just doing the job I signed up for. Yes it was hard, for about 15 seconds when I squeezed under those ducts. Yes, I had to go over and under some pipes. It WAS hard. I didn't like brushing all those webs out of the way. 

But this is the job I signed up for. I knew it involved going into these tight places, with spiders, and snakes and unpleasant things. And this is the job that my clients are paying me for. They hired me to do this job. I owe it to them to do my best.

When I was showing the listing agent the photos in my camera, it became obvious to him that maybe the guy he recommended was not committed to doing the best job they could for their client. Especially when he noticed there was over 30" of space between the floor and the joists.

I have a feeling there might be some angry phone calls first of next week.

Here's the photos....

 
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81 Comments on Someone needs to be fired

MAR
22
307,904 Points 3 Featured Posts Hit Router

Nice job Jack.  You sure saved the buyers some interesting surprises.

8:33am • #1
835,585 Points 213 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

Any home buyer who would use a seller's home inspection report could probably be sold that famous bridge.

8:36am • #2
9 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Not something they wanted to hear but thankfully something you discovered they need to know about.  Great commitment to doing an A+ job.  Just the kind of inspector that they needed!  I would not like to be on the other end of that phone call, if they were so kind as to wait till Monday!

8:38am • #3

I left the house at 3pm, the call may have been made at 3:02 pm. 

8:45am • #4
357,391 Points 9 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

You sound like the type of inspector buyers want to have inspect their homes.  Unfortunately, I find that many real estate agents, especially those whose business is mostly listings do not tend to recommend thorough inspectors.  I also tell buyers to NEVER rely on anyone else's inspection.

8:45am • #5
203,488 Points 4 Featured Posts Outside Blog

I would never encourage a buyer to use any report generated by a seller - be it a home inspection, termite inspection, radon inspection, etc.  These types of 'finds' are most disturbing, especially since the 'inspections' (using the term loosely here) were done in the days/week previous to your inspection.  Great job!  If I were in your market you would certainly be getting calls from my buyers.

8:47am • #6
134,834 Points 4 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor

I have seen some inspectors promote seller inspections.  I have never brought into that concept. 

What I have done is when I sell one of my properties.  I insisted on a home inspection at my expense.  I also insist the buyer choose the inspector.

9:08am • #7
Outside Blog

This is the precise reason why I strongly recommend that ALL of my buyers get their own home inspection.

9:14am • #8
183,989 Points Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

I also agree, that all buyers should gt their own home inspection.  I must say, this is a job I would not want to do....

9:27am • #10
1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor

I do ask the sellers to get an inspection for their own record.  If the inspector finds something we know about it before hand and get it taken care of so when it is time to get a inspection we have little to no worries.  I do not promote "we already have a home inspection". I have gone on many re-inspections with my husband and found they have not done their job. Those inspectors are the ones doing 1 hour inspections and charging half the fee to get the job and the result is half an inspection.

I am so glad there is Inspectors like Jack who REALLY DO THEIR WORK PROPERLY! They are rare in my neck of the woods.  Buyers love ya and sellers hate you.

9:36am • #11

Wow - what a mess. You are the type of inspector we want for our buyers. Thanks for sharing your experience.

9:38am • #13
107,440 Points 9 Featured Posts Outside Blog

The one thing that inspectors in our area do not get is the value of pictures. We go back and forth over stuff when photographic evidence would end the argument. Thanks for demontrating that.

9:43am • #14
4 Featured Posts

A picture is worth a thousand words. Being a Realtor for quite a few years myself I can pretty much tell if a house is stable or a can of worms...

Good job jack!

9:57am • #15
2 Featured Posts

yikes... I wonder what that law suit against the first inspectors would have looked like?  You may have saved them, no?  Except they could always say the damage occurs after the inspection.

10:01am • #16
Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

I would never tell a buyer to use the sellers inspection report.

 Get your own, it's a cheap way of gaining an unbiased look and a book of knowledge of your new home. If you choose not to have an inspection you must sign the waiver. Also, you the buyers should be there for the inspection.

10:01am • #17
266,351 Points 19 Featured Posts Outside Blog

that was cool... I've never seen a "freestanding" mudtube... that wasn't attached to a wall.... now that's determination.

10:02am • #18
376,340 Points 23 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Ruh roh----what a mess.  Good job though Jack getting in there and doing the job.

10:02am • #19
Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

I don't use any inspector, home or WDO that doesn't use photos.

10:04am • #20
Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Great job!  I can't believe that listing agent even attempted to say that a home inspection "wasn't needed."  I would NEVER make that determination for my buyer clients.  Whether one was done that day even, I would leave it up to them to pick their inspector and to make their OWN decisions. 

 

   

10:22am • #21
151,838 Points 19 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

I would never let my buyer's rely on a seller's home inspection.  Good for you for doing your job and doing it well.  It will come back to you tenfold.

10:33am • #22
Outside Blog

The problem with some home inspectors is that they assume things are alright and no one will ever know so they just skip the "Hard Part". The problem is home inspectors are the buyers last line of defense and in most cases will belive what they are told and wont question it. Nice Job, Keep up the good work!

10:34am • #23
1 Featured Post

Jack, great job and good photos.

Those were some determined termites. How'd they figure that out?

Oh, and Ann Hayman is another woman after my heart!: "...Get your own, it's a cheap way of gaining an unbiased look and a book of knowledge of your new home." I guess I would substitue "inexpensive" for "cheap".

So much more I could say about this. It might be food for blog.

10:34am • #24
1 Featured Post

Jack, you were doing your job! Not many inspectors go above and beyond they just comment on what they can visually see without having to life a finger. I truly believe anyone I refer is a reflection of me and I would only refer someone I would personally use myself! The buyers definately got their moneys worth - good to see you actually get what you pay for!

10:36am • #25
230,456 Points 30 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Not even mentioning the fact that it would be patently wrong for the listing agent to suggest what inspections are or are not necessary for the buyer to satisfy him or herself as to the condition of the property, it opens both the seller and the agent to potential liability.  I would never attempt to limit the other party's inspection rights for just such an eventuality.  Big headaches down the line if the buyer discovers something significant after the close of escrow when they relied on the seller or listing agent for due dilligence.  Good job squeezing in there.  Obviously, not all inspectors would do the same, unfortunately.

10:37am • #26
382,909 Points 3 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Oh my... Please say it isn't so.. This is horrible.. I would be making a few phone calls.

Thank for sharing.

10:43am • #27
178,329 Points 12 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Congratulations on doing a great job. It's unfortunate that not all feel compelled to do whatever is necessary to do a thorough inspection.  I've been under many houses, and some are next to impossible to navigate; but if you accept the job of inspecting, then INSPECT or decline the job.  I'd recommend your services to anyone!

11:07am • #28
141,465 Points 13 Featured Posts

I do prelisting home inspections for my seller and give them to buyers, but have never recommended that they use it in place of their own inspection.  I agree with Paul that because of the conflict of interest it puts too much liability on me, and quite frankly that is agency level advice.

Those termite tubes are incredible.

11:14am • #29
4 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Lazy and gullible people are every!  The inspectors who didn't catch the problems were lazy and whomever would take someone else's home inspection is gullible!

11:27am • #30

Here is a shot of the bottom of the tall tube. You can see how many attempts it must have taken,

11:43am • #31
288,824 Points 2 Featured Posts Outside Blog

This would make a great training case study - for agents and inspectors! Nice job...when you move to Florida, you get my business!

12:19pm • #32
122,413 Points 9 Featured Posts

I like the photos - thanks for sharing the termite tube shots. I am so happy to say I have never seen this bad of an infestation in anything I've sold!

12:20pm • #33
167,557 Points 6 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Jack, I realize that you were suggesting that the home inspector be fired but I am thinking that the list agent should be fired as well for suggesting that the buyers did not need their own inspection!

12:27pm • #34
259,608 Points

Yet one more reason to have your own home inspection!!

12:53pm • #35
190,160 Points 1 Featured Post

This is a great reason to insist that buyers always have their own home inspector.

12:54pm • #36
285,060 Points 4 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Isnt that lovely. Looks as if they are eating the seal as well. Great catch! If I was the sellers agent I would bring action and complaint against his License.

1:07pm • #37
656,379 Points 108 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Yikes!  What an amazing termite tube!  Kudos to you for catching this (i.e. doing your job).  It's so clear that the other guys didn't do what they were paid to do. 

1:22pm • #38
Outside Blog

Good grief Jack, that is disgusting. I never knew termites built tubes that long! Kudos to you for a job well done. I'll bet those buyers are thanking you now.

Kathy B

1:24pm • #39
211,297 Points 1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

Hi Jack,  I have never seen termite tubes going vertical without attachment to anything !  Well done !

1:28pm • #40

Well if I ever entertained thoughts of becoming a home inspector, I'm over them now!  You sound like you take your job really seriously.  You're the kind of home inspector I'd want inspecting any home I was thinking about buying. 

1:28pm • #41
386,643 Points 28 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog

In California, after a termite completion has been issued, that pest company is on the hook when a second pest inspector finds termites. I often use a back-up second inspector if the home inspection discloses possible problems. I just wait for the completion to be issued, and then go after the first pest company -- which often fights the findings but ends up taking care of it anyway in a none too happy mode.

sacramento short sale agent

2:05pm • #42

Wow Jack glad you were there to find these problems for the buyer and  pinpoint the problems.

Those termite tubes were amazing. I can't believe they can go from dirt floor through the air to the wood foundation. Those folks have big problems.

2:30pm • #43

Jack, as you know, a thorough home inspection can make or break a deal.  I almost lost a sale last week because an inspector chose not to mention problems with a french door. Nobody likes surprises at the final walkthrough.

2:33pm • #44
1 Featured Post

Dear Jack,

I definitely agree with Lenn on this one! Same thing for a seller's appraisal.

A buyer must exercise do diligence in getting his own inspections. A buyer's agent should insist that the buyer do this. Otherwise, they are buying a "pig in a poke"!

Barbara

2:34pm • #45
2 Featured Posts

Jack - well done.  I'm glad I don't have a lot of crawl spaces to deal with here in Minnesota, and I'm glad I don't have to worry about termites.  What a nasty mess.

2:40pm • #46
318,604 Points 8 Featured Posts Outside Blog Hit Router

Can you imagine the liability of the buyers did NOT do an inspection? Wow.

2:47pm • #47

Kathy,

You may not have noticed, but this crawlspace had a concrete slab covering the entire area. These termites had come out of a little crack in the slab, then "headed north" to the promise land of fresh wood.

As a side note - I know the inspector that did the previous inspection. I really try to not bad mouth the other guy, and in this case I didn't really have to say much at all. The photos spoke for themselves.

In the defense of the listing agent. I think in his mind, he thought his guy was really good. He probably felt that a good inspection was done. True, he shouldn't have pushed him onto these people. 

I think after he saw the job that I did, and the job the other guy DIDN'T do, he may think twice about using him again. I'm guessing he was probably one of the calls made on Saturday. To me, this was a huge omission (as in Errors & Omission insurance"), and an obvious case of negligence.

I always ask my clients if they have ever had an inspection before. If they haven't, I make a comment on how they will not really know if I did a good job for them or not, if they don't have anything to compare to. The L.A. now has something to compare the other inspector to.

 

 

2:57pm • #48
Hit Router

Wow interesting story...I'm sure the buyers are very happy they used you as their inspector!

3:12pm • #49

The world needs more people like you in it.

3:35pm • #50

Greeat job. I can't believe how crazy some people are.

4:14pm • #51
354,419 Points 3 Featured Posts Outside Blog

Those termite tubes are beautiful. Did I really just say that? Maybe it's because I've never seen one before.

4:29pm • #52
8 Featured Posts Outside Blog Hit Router

How interesting and wonderfully thorough of you!

My most recent inspection, the inspector said... "I'm going to call for a termite job"

"Oh, did you find evidence of termites?"

"No, but I couldn't see everything clearly.  I just may have, maybe, possibly, seen something in the distance that could maybe be a termite tube and with these moist conditions in this area I'm going to err on the side of caution and call for a treatment"

I thought that was ridiculous.

I now look at these pics and am amazed at what you went through to secure the proper evidence!

 

5:34pm • #53

I recently met my new neighbors. Their offer had been second in line, and the first offer fell through. They used the inspection from the previous purchaser, and after closing and moving in, found a lot of problems. Rodent activity had been noted in the crawl space and attic, however upon move in they found a rat nest in the kitchen behind the refrigerator. This is a house that had been "professionally cleaned"... Not professionally enough to move the frige aparently...

 

They also found more rat activity in the garage, a huge opening from the garage to the crawlspace, and rats inside the walls...

 

they have no recourse against the inspector. The inspection was not done for them. They've learned their lesson the hard way, but it's a good story for me to be able to tell my buyers as to why they should spend $300-$500 for their own inspection.

5:36pm • #54

WOW - what a terrific job you did & such a great story you shared.

You surely looked at it as doing what you were hired to do - and that you did!

Those buyers will no doubt be a HUGE source of future referral business for you....and you deserve every bit of it!!!

Kudos to you!

Edith Schreiber - Dallas Texas 

Edith Schreiber - REALTOR, ABR,e-PRO,CNS,RCC,CNHS
6:11pm • #55

Hi: Jack, another great post the picture of the termites tubes are great. Good job Jack

6:35pm • #56
443,399 Points 10 Featured Posts Outside Blog

I don't like sellers inspections.  I still recommend my buyer to do one.

6:49pm • #57
Outside Blog Hit Router

The liability of a buyer's insepction report being given to the seller is just too much of a burden for anyone to take on.  If a person is buying a house which is most likely their single largest purchase in their lifetime it certainly should be worth to spend a few hundred dollars on an inspection that was done with their best interest in mind. 

Those are great pictures of the work termites go through to get to wood!

7:26pm • #58
164,705 Points Outside Blog

Great job!- You're obviously very thorough in doing your job.  Just goes to show how crucial a good inspection is.  One thing is for sure I couldn't do your job. Spider webs covered in lint?? Forget it!

8:21pm • #59
164,705 Points Outside Blog

Great job!- You're obviously very thorough in doing your job.  Just goes to show how crucial a good inspection is.  One thing is for sure I couldn't do your job. Spider webs covered in lint?? Forget it!

8:21pm • #60
118,245 Points 1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor

Termites are not typical in Wisconsin, so I have never seen evidence of them before...thanks for the photos...

8:40pm • #61
292,165 Points 3 Featured Posts

Wow that was a terrible experience for someone uh, what were they thinking taht no one would notice.

8:47pm • #62
158,214 Points 9 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

Good job! You did what you were supposed to which is inspect the property - good, bad or indifferent. Too bad not everyone does their job, too. If they had, there wouldn't be any surprise phone calls!

9:05pm • #63
Outside Blog

Congrats on a job well done.  It never ceases to amaze me at how many people will do just the status quo.  Those other inspectors didn't even do that!  Great work & I bet you have solidified your relationship with that buyer's agent.  I do pre-inspections on my listings, but ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS encourage a buyer to get their own.  In fact, I wouldn't be comfortable if they didn't and I would be opening myself up to huge liability.  Any Realtor would be lucky to work with you. 

9:34pm • #64
175,507 Points 1 Featured Post Localism Sponsor

Great Job!! I'm sure the buyers are grateful and Beth is right any Realtor would be lucky to work with you.

9:59pm • #65

Wow, it really does make you wonder what people are paying for!

10:14pm • #66

Jake

What did the listing agent say when your report was presented? 

I tell my buyers they will do a home inspection, or sign a statement that I advised they do one and they choice not too.  I likewise provide a listof three to chose from.

Great job.

10:27pm • #67
584,603 Points 34 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

One of my inspectors generally uses an infra-red thermometer to check the walls, floors and ceilings for hot or cold spots.  We have had brand new houses were the insulation was missing in difficult to inspect places.  Inspectors have to get everywhere they can get...

10:48pm • #68
156,123 Points

Jack: You are one more good inspector. It is easy to see that you take your commitment to your job seriously and that you go the extra mile to get a good job done. We have several good inspectors in our area, who are committed like you are, to doing the best job possible. We offered our buyer clients a list of inspectors to choose from. We recommend that they call the inspectors and interview them. We also caution on using the ones with the best rates.

Your pictures are fascinating. Is that really a free standing tube? That is amazing. In over 14 years, I have never seen anything like that, and hope I never do! We are located in Spartanburg, SC and you are in TN, I wonder if we have the same species of termites. This is very interesting and do you see this a lot and is this the worst case you have ever seen? I would be interested to know. I guess you can tell by the length of this comment, that termites fascinate me; so do powder post beetles.

Thanks you for an interesting post with great pics.

11:24pm • #69
255,865 Points 2 Featured Posts Hit Router

Hi Jack -- You are worth your weight in gold and I hope your clients realize this.  The old saying: A picture speaks a 1000 words has never been more true than your photos.  Wow, I was stunned.  I know the value a very good home inspector makes.

11:28pm • #70
152,752 Points 4 Featured Posts Localism Sponsor Outside Blog Hit Router

Nice job Jack.  I hope that your hard work and professionalism bring you the business that you deserve.   

11:58pm • #71
MAR
23

First time I've seen termite tubes like that! I suppose like any other profession, some people, like yourself Jack, are the consumate professional and others do what they need to to get by.

12:15am • #72

Wow, I had encountered termite tubes from a few past inspections, BUT, never nothing of this "missed" magnitude!  All Home Inspectors must have cameras to capture evidence/proof of their findings.  In this case with your pics -- NO Words are necessary.  The pics tell it all.  Great job.

If a buyer declined an inspection when purchasing (no matter what inspections were previously done for whatever reason) we require they sign a statement saying they decline a Home Inspection.  Only makes sense.

Sue of Robin and Sue

12:16am • #73

Awesome job!!  Thanks for beng a good inspector! 

Michelle Evans
1:53am • #75

Sandy,

It really is a free standing tube. Believe it or not, this is not even close to the worst termite damage I have seen. 

Bob,

I don't know what either agent said after the report was presented, because the report wasn't finished until the next day (Sunday). I had a horrible head and chest cold and told everyone that I was going home and going to bed and would finish the report the next day (Sunday). My client had to leave the inspection early because they had a flight to catch. I was able to talk to her on the phone while we were both on the road, so she knew what was coming.

Both of the agents were present at the end (the crawlspace was at the end of the inspection), so I showed everyone the photos, and described what I had found. That's when I found out about the pre-inspection and who did it, and that a termite inspector had been there a few days before.

I really didn't have to say a lot. The photos were proof to everyone standing there that out of the three people that entered the crawlspace, only one of us went that far and found the damage.

I'm guessing the phone lines were burning up yesterday, and probably this morning. This is a very high end house, and well above the average price in this area. 

 

6:17am • #76

Wow great Photos

 

I for one have never before seen actual termite tubing! (thank God) but now I know what they look like. Thank You

I always insist my buyers do an inspection even on new constrcution (the worst) I do not care whether or not they had a pre-sale inspection or not.

As to the damage where I work we have hundred year old houses and have seen that type of damage before (not termite) easily fixed just alittle pricey.

Great Job !!!!!!!

Roe

Rosemarie Villanova
6:26am • #77

Good job Jack. I can certainly appreciate the extra effort it takes to make it to the end of a crawl. As we all know it's those far away corners that typically have a surprise or two.

Do you mind if I use one of those photos?

7:26am • #78

Vince,

Feel free to use what you need. Please just give me credit if you publish it somewhere.

Thanks

Jack

12:03pm • #79
MAR
24

Good Job Jack!!!

I promote seller inspections for reasons of helping the seller.   I agree with everyone that states the buyer should get their own inspection and not rely on the sellers.  But the Seller Inspection isn't a bad thing!!!   If anything I look at it as a way to educate the seller in what they need to do in order to sell their house and what to look for when they purchase another.  

again.... Good Job Jack.... When I read "I just had to get there"  I related so much.

 

8:21am • #80
MAR
25
127,223 Points 2 Featured Posts

Great job Jack! There are a small group of home inspectors like your self who just do; "the the job they signed up for." I hear the excuses reasons why they can't go here or the SOP or my insurance company says I don't have to, shouldn't do that. Taking pride in what you do and doing it well really seems to be a dying ethic.

8:03am • #81

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Jack Feldmann

Knoxville, TN

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Clayton Inspection Service, Inc.

Address: Knoxville, TN

Office Phone: (865) 693-7109

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