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When The Water In The Toilet Rocks And Rolls

By
Home Inspector with Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC 3380-000723

Have you ever been in the bathroom and the water in the toilet becomes disturbed when some other plumbing, either in the bathroom or the house, is turned on?  The reason for that is there is some kind of a vent problem or a blockage in the drain line. 

Some older houses around here have the old drain lines called "orange-burg," which were glorified ceramic sewer tubes from the house to the street.  Over time they weaken and get crushed, or a tree root can find its way into a crack and grow in there, clogging it completely.  The toilet is the best way to see how the system is draining - look for the rock and roll!

On a recent inspection, I noticed that the front yard had a dip in the grass all the way from the house to the street.

That is a sure sign the drain line has been replaced with a newer PVC plastic line.  There are also clean outs visible inside and out.

So I wasn't so concerned about ceramic drain lines.

But something really odd happened.

Going into one of the bathrooms, and closing the door, I noticed that moving the door caused the toilet water to dance in exact rhythm with the door movement!

I confess - I don't remember seeing that before!

That's where the fun begins!  Now we have to answer why!

When I went into the attic my question was answered!

Somebody took the bath vent line and HOOKED IT INTO THE COPPER PLUMBING VENT TUBING WHICH BISECTS THE ROOF!  And it leaks air!  You can see the black staining on the sheathing, so moisture is added to that space and onto the wood.

A couple of things come to mind:

1.  It must have been really hard to get back behind that vent tube and cut a hole!  There is very little head room there and it can only be done with a saw, maybe even hand held!

2.  It would have been soooo much easier to properly cut a hole in the roof and install a vent cap!

The result of this installation?  When the door is moved, the air in the bathroom is sucked in and out.  The most convenient source of air to bring the air pressure back to homeostasis is the sewage vent tube.  There's sewer gas in them there tubes!  And for that reason, THE BATHROOM SMELLS!  Things just work that way. 

I invited the buyers and Realtor into the bathroom to demonstrate my little physics lesson and it got a good laugh.  The wife wondered if I had used the bathroom previously and I was the source of that smell!!  Well, no!

I am doubting the little plug-in "Spring Bouquet" deodorizer has enough uumph to counteract that sewer gas!

My recommendation:  A home inspection has a look at the SYSTEMS of the house and how they all interact.  It requires a complete examination, inside, outside, down AND up!  Be sure to see it all!  Oh, and remember to ROCK 'N ROLL!

P.s.  Inspectors are going to write that the insulation is "backwards" and I didn't mention it.  Patience, my friends - wait 'til you see the next picture!

 

 

Posted by

Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC  

Based in Bristow, serving all of Northern Virginia.

Office (703) 330-6388   Cell (703) 585-7560

www.jaymarinspect.com


Comments (39)

Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

There was no platform to safely crawl back there to look.  I would have had to remove that vent line to do it anyway, and I don't want to do that so the sellers can see it Charlie!  But it had to be by hand!  Maybe that new Fein vibrating cutting tool?

It would have been sooo much easier to cut the roof!

Oct 29, 2010 04:07 AM
Damon Gettier
Damon Gettier & Associates, REALTORS- Roanoke Va Short Sale Expert - Roanoke, VA
Broker/Owner ABRM, GRI, CDPE

Interesting.....do you find more people venting through the roof or the soffit?  I get scared when someone cuts a hole in a prefectly good roof.

Oct 29, 2010 04:54 AM
Reuben Saltzman
Structure Tech Home Inspections - Minneapolis, MN
Delivering the Unbiased Truth.

You're right, it would have been WAY easier to do it right.  

By the way, the insulation is backwards and you didn't mention it ;)

Oct 29, 2010 08:08 AM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Damon - through the roof or the soffit, either is ok.  But NOT through a plumbing vent!  The vent caps which are made to go on the roof are perfectly safe and the template will say what size hole to cut.

Reuben - so, so much easier!  Insulation?  I don't see any insulation...

Oct 29, 2010 12:35 PM
James Quarello
JRV Home Inspection Services, LLC - Wallingford, CT
Connecticut Home Inspector

That insulation was perfectly fine 40 or 50 years ago. ;)

Isn't always the way, the hard way instead of the right way.

Oct 29, 2010 12:55 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Lots of things were perfectly fine 50 years ago!  Like me...

Hard to see things done the right way anymore, right Jim?

Oct 29, 2010 01:02 PM
Chris Alston
Chris Alston (Keller Williams Realty, Silicon Valley, California) - Campbell, CA
Silicon Valley, California

Sometimes I read thses and say...  Whaaaaaaat?  Man!

Oct 29, 2010 02:22 PM
Mel Ahrens, MBA, Kelly Right Real Estate
Kelly Right Real Estate - Hood River, OR
Customized Choices for your Real Estate Needs

Learned something from your posting AGAIN.  Thanks,

Mel

Oct 29, 2010 04:22 PM
Sally K. & David L. Hanson
EXP Realty 414-525-0563 - Brookfield, WI
WI Real Estate Agents - Luxury - Divorce

Maybe the dancing water was a house theme...matching rhythmically dripping sinks...a symphony of plumbing !

Oct 29, 2010 10:36 PM
Debbie Gartner
The Flooring Girl - White Plains, NY
The Flooring Girl & Blog Stylist -Dynamo Marketers

Yuck.  Good detective work on your part.  You guys find the oddest things.  Very interesting job you have.

Oct 29, 2010 11:27 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Chris - that's why I have to take pictures!  Otherwise people think I make this stuff up!

Some of the things I find I am not imaginative enough to make it up!!

Mel - what did you learn?  Oh, that I can move in time to a door and toilet water's movement!    ;)

Oct 29, 2010 11:57 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

S&D - yeah, quite the symphony!  To demonstrate the movement of the water I actually did a hula.  The funniest thing is that the wife politely excused herself thinking I had done in the bathroom!

Debbie - it can be interesting, fun, weird, sad and wildly entertaining!  And I meet a lot of great people!

Oct 30, 2010 12:04 AM
James Quarello
JRV Home Inspection Services, LLC - Wallingford, CT
Connecticut Home Inspector

Yep. When seeing something done right becomes the exception, we've got troubles.

Oct 30, 2010 01:03 AM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

And we are counting on that as inspectors, right Jaime?

Oct 30, 2010 01:38 AM
James Quarello
JRV Home Inspection Services, LLC - Wallingford, CT
Connecticut Home Inspector

Counting on as being wrong? I would say yes to that. It's what I call job security ;)

Oct 31, 2010 01:07 AM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

¡ Sí Señor !

Oct 31, 2010 01:09 AM
Jack Gilleland
Home Inspection and Investor Services, Clayton - Clayton, OH

I've seen it when there is no other fixtures on the vent and some fool bird decides to build a nest in the vent.  This also causes bubble back (or that is what I called it) when you get air bubbling in the toilet bowl.  I've also seen the water raise and lower when the vent fan was turned on.  Nice detective work Jay.

Oct 31, 2010 09:24 AM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Yeah, but it took the hula to demonstrate it Jack!   Yikes!!  Once I had a TV antenna AND a flag pole in the plumbing vent and guess what?  As you call it, BUBBLE BACK!  Wasn't exactly a hard one, that one!

P.s.  Don't you love birds!

Oct 31, 2010 10:11 AM
Chris Smith
Re/Max Chay Realty Inc., Brokerage - New Tecumseth, ON
South Simcoe, Caledon, King, Orangeville Real Esta

Jay, I am amazed by the stories home inspectors have told me about what they have come across in their travels...

Nov 01, 2010 11:22 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

It is fun, isn't it Chris!?  And just when you think you've seen it all...

Nov 01, 2010 11:26 PM