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IDX in iframe or not? Indexable or not indexable that is the question...

By
Real Estate Agent with HER Realtors

Maybe I should not even ask...Frame rotated -

Should your IDX be in an  iframe or not?

spam from "Listingware" made me do it... made me ask today should your IDX be in an iframe or not?

" Check out Listingware's indexable IDX. Anyone using it? "

The comment was on Jeff Corbett's Indexable IDX Questions post from January 2010.

Back in early 2010 Jeff C.  wrote:

"First things first…Why is this a big deal to begin with?  IDX solutions are typically framed in to web/blogsites and offer little to no SEO value.  An indexable IDX effectively creates separate posts for every listing, thus creating GOBS of real estate and general property related content that the Search Engines can’t help but crawl all over and index. "

We were discussing the question on Facebook a couple of days ago... kinda.  There was a featured, public, post on ActiveRain that brought up the question...

IDX = Internet Data Exchange - The mechanism to let consumers search the MLS on a site

MLS = Multiple Listing Service  (or Major League Soccer?)

SEO = Search Engine Optimization

...the ActiveRain post about IDX and SEO got unfeatured.  The post which was public went Members Only and then disappeared all together... but the post on ActiveRain member Victoria Stankard's WordPress site is still available. I hope it is OK for me to post it here....

Choosing the right IDX/MLS solution for your real estate needs

I believe this is the same post that started a firestorm on ActiveRain. Or perhaps the missing ActiveRain post was slightly different.   While I can not tell you what was in the comments....because it went MO.... and ultimately MIA , it got a lot of discussion.  A lot of the discussion was not about indexable vs. non indexable...  the comments got... let's say off topic. 

MO = Members Only

MIA = Missing in Action

In her post on her WordPress site Victoria gives a thumbs up to IDX in an iframe.  If I understand it correctly (and I asked the other day for clarification.... as a firestorm happened on ActiveRain)  iframes are not indexable?

On her WordPress site Victoria wrote: 

"3). IFRAME – This type of IDX solution has a bad rap, but the fact remains that when a broker creates links to specific links the searcher gets what they want, but also, that gives more SEO depth than publishing duplicate content. Do you really want the same search pages indexed that every other website has also created?  That my friends is duplicate content and will NOT help your website rankings or search engine placement. One of the best ways to use Iframe is to write up some optimized content on the page or post, then embed the property search Iframe below it or simply link to the appropriate property search page WITHIN your own website that has iframe."

Is there a duplicate content problem?

Othdog in frame - er SEO / marketing people seem to have a different opinion than Victoria about this question.   Jon Hardison   said something in a comment in another Members Only post that would lead me to believe that we (real estate agents ) should know the difference and be discussing it to make informed decisions.   Since it was a Members Only post I can NOT tell you what Jon said but Indexable or not indexable that is the question... or isn't it?  Is the question something else?

Disclosure   Jon is husband of Inna, son-in-law of Jon Z and seems like he is qualified to discuss this and we are talking about WordPress blogs and SEO not choosing sides for a game of kick the can.

Photo credit thanks to Cuttlefish for allowing the top photo, "day 162: detroit, framed" to be shared.  Thanks to ghentooo for allowing "framed Riebmann" to be shared.  Both frame photos are licensed with a Creative Commons license which allows commercial use.

 

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Comments (33)

Maureen McCabe
HER Realtors - Columbus, OH
Columbus Ohio Real Estate

Thanks everyone for the discussion. 

I am in one of those funky MLSs (like Miriam's) where I have to link to the brokerage site, so I am NOT really asking as a consumer of what you are selling... (whether it is an iframe or indexable IDX)  except I see people in my market who have something that does not look like a brokers IDX and I believe if you get a permission slip signed.... 

I have been craving me some minor nitifying lately though...  whatever that is.

Anyway Jeff Corbett said to Jay back in 2010:

@Jay Adding an indexable IDX to your site is like adding a a twin super-charger to a 500HP engine.

it does not look like Jay is using the same search now?  Maybe I need to poke around there more.

Anyone who understands this when Victoria wrote of  IDX sub domains- and sub-domain wrap sites, is this what Tom Branch and Chris Olsen have? 

" 2). IDX sub domains- there are quite a bit of sub-domain wrap sites that take your original site and “mirror” it in their domain, with your site linking back and forth between the 2 separate websites. While they say this is an “SEO advantage,” it is NOT."

Is the search in Tom's and the finder in Chris's the subdomain?

Tom Branch

http://search.thebranchteam.com/idx/8795/basicSearch.php


Chris Olsen

http://finder.clevelandhomessearch.com/idx/8579/

Is what Jeff Corbett was talking about a sub-domain?  Or is it something like what Tom Branch describes in the first paragraph of his comment? Where Tom wrote:

"In my experience the only way to get decent SEO is to host the IDX on the same server with the main website along with custom page titles and META description/tags. I know one team in our market who hosts their own IDX and their site is on the first page of Google for many searches."

or something different...?

The WP plugin that Jeff wrote about, Listing press has not been updated since 2009?? Last Updated: 2009-9-23

off to poke around on Renee's site and others to understand this all better.

Mar 27, 2011 11:09 AM
Victoria Stankard
Get Found Now - Tampa Palms, FL

Renee,

Thank you so much for your comment. It really deserves to be its own post! Unfortunately, Michael was out of commission when Victoria posted the IDX explanation. I must say with the utmost humility, that your comment depicted better than we could of, in the post we wrote together.

Most Realtors have some kind of IDX solution. The fact that you are running 6 pretty much covers them all. The graphics and explanation of where your sales come from were the icing on the cake. Sub-Domain sites that get tons of listings may bring in more actual calls, but that doesn't necessarily mean where the actual quality leads and sales come from.

If you are using an iframe solution, but have optimized content about the AREA, you will get visitors that only want to search specific areas based upon their specific needs. Unless a user is targeting a specific address or MLS number, which is rare, they are looking for the best property that suits their price range, lifestyle and needs in a particular area.

Pushing the same pages over and over through sub-domains ONLY works if you have an old and established domain. New domains will not get that same type of placement no matter how many search pages they build and push out. Wrapping optimized content around IDX frames WORKS.

Thanks Renee for being so articulate and astute and setting the record straight.  On your own with no one to lead the way, you have found the key to success and what we preach from the pulpit as SEO experts. There are truly no straight answers from Google about how they handle iframes. Unique geo-target content on your iframe page is the recipe for success and unique quality content is what Victoria preaches in every post she writes.  

Our next post is going to outline Google's guidelines, which we hope will help everybody blog more effectively and get the best results for their efforts.

Mar 27, 2011 11:41 AM
Renée Donohue~Home Photography
Savvy Home Pix - Allegan, MI
Western Michigan Real Estate Photographer

Inna:  the traffic "that produces more results from google" (quote from your comment #13) from indexable comes in from long tail searches.  It's not coming in from general searches with a large global reach.  As an agent who sells I can tell you that these are the best type of leads you want.

With the community example that I gave - all the information is the same - the IDX solution is the only difference.  #1 & #4 are framed IDX, #3 is indexable IDX.  I am also not the only person in this valley with indexable solutions so if I am ranking well on these pages, the others (besides the lasvegas.condos) have been punished somehow.  Obviously I am not being punished for having duplicate content because the way it is arranged (although the community description is the constant), tagged, aged, backlinked & hosted.

So obviously there is a "punishment" going on because of the way google picks who owns the top spots.  I am not convinced that indexable will get me to the top with key search terms.  It will get me to the top with long tail - provided that everything I put surrounding listings & subdivisions is the most relevant according to google.

 

Mar 28, 2011 02:23 AM
Maureen McCabe
HER Realtors - Columbus, OH
Columbus Ohio Real Estate

Renee you do think there is a penalty on indexable IDX?

All things being equal... good content surrounding both IDXes, the iFramed would be a better option because the indexable IDX would be showing duplicate content?

Mar 28, 2011 04:48 AM
Renée Donohue~Home Photography
Savvy Home Pix - Allegan, MI
Western Michigan Real Estate Photographer

I don't believe there is a penalty for me but many times you have to go pages out with my competitors to find them.

I don't believe it will get me on front page of google for "las vegas real estate" or "las vegas homes for sale".

I do believe that if you work it properly (in the same way you would work a framed html version) that it will work in your advantage.

I do believe that what Jeff said about dilution since so many people have it now is true.  It definitely isn't something you plug and play anymore.

Mar 28, 2011 08:09 AM
Jon Hardison
Hardison & Associates, LLC. - Daytona Beach, FL

 

Hi Maureen:

I said I'd be talking about this, so here it is.  =)

I just wanted to stop in for a second because I really feel like I have to.  Just a few quick things that need to be said.

 

The Perceived Impact of Sub-domain IDX

 

Each product is different.  Each vendor built their systems taking different things into consideration. Therefore the benefit or lack thereof can't really be discussed in sweeping terms.  Here are some questions you may want to ask yourself when choosing your IDX:

 

a)  Do you have the ability to modify IDX generated pages or results whether by title, meta data or content?

Believe it or not, some IDX providers enable you to do this and it can be an incredibly powerful feature.

b)  Can you use your own content on pages containing IDX generated content?

For some reason this one has been the source of much debate (as of late).  The contention that your data is in some way limited from display or indexing on pages generated by your IDX is entirely untrue. In fact, I am not aware of a single provider where this is the case, so I've answered that question for you.  =)
You can always build your pages with your own content, as well as that of your provider.  That said, some providers make this easier than others, so the next question is...

c)  Who is building your site?  You or a service provider?

There are IDX providers with amazing products out there.  For many of them, their documentation make end-user implementation nearly impossible.  Others are far easier, but have other issues that may make getting your site to look the way you want it to very difficult.

As an example, IDX Broker has an incredible product.  To be honest, I'm floored at how good it is.  They really thought of everything.  Well, almost everything.  Their documentation is insane.  The process of integrating it is pretty straightforward, but you wouldn't get that from anything they say in their instructions.

 

DS also has a good solution that's well documented and easy to install and integrate, but their product has a very specific look and feel.  It's also very wide which can be very limiting if content and design are a concern.  Another issue "I" have with DS is the fact that full WP integration with advanced search capabilities is expensive, but again...  It's really an issue of your capabilities and what you want out of your site at the end of the day.

 

d)  This is the most important question.  Which product do your client's like most?

This is where we find we spend the vast majority of our time consulting clients about.  Questions like forced registration vs opened searches vs gentle nudges to register.  Whether your market is primarily upgraders or more transient (which will directly affect the number of advanced or detailed searches you get).  What is your market's user behavior like?  What are your competition's IDXs like?  These are all factors you should be taking into consideration.

Duplicate Content - Should I be concerned?

 

Well... the short answer is no.  Again, there has been a concern that Google's new "Farmer Update" might adversely impact sites "duplicate data".  While we were all shocked about Google's recent announcement killing GoogleBase, I assure you Google isn't out to destroy Real Estate, or any other legitimate business.

 

The internet, for the most part, is all duplicate data.  Even the news stories on major network sites are often identical as dispensed by their sources which makes Google's job all the more difficult.  Google's job, as they see it, is to give people the information they want.  First and foremost, this is what they want to be the best at.  As most of you know, Google is working very hard to design systems that see the world from the perspective of the individuals using their services, so if I were to truncate everything you've ever learned about SEO into a few simple rules you could follow, they would be these:

 

a) Use Google to try to figure out what "YOUR CLIENTS" want.

 

b) Write to YOUR CLIENTS interest, concerns, fears... whatever.

c) Write on these subject often and do your best to syndicate these articles to other places of interest (duplicate content by the way.  Lol.)

d) Pay attention to the news in your area, market trends, etc...  Current events are often the greatest source of much needed traffic, which takes us back to "c".  If Google doesn't see you writing regularly, this reduces the rate at which your site is indexed and greatly increases the amount of time it will take your post(s) to get indexed.  There's actually very little magic involved.

Back to duplicate content.

 

If you syndicate your stories, is it duplicate content?  No it isn't.  In fact, in the case of blogs and pingbacks, it's actually quite helpful to you.  IDX data is also not considered duplicate data.  Its treated as syndicated data, and has a value to your overall ranking, BUT NOT AS MUCH AS YOUR WRITING DOES!

Sub-domain IDXs will help you with Google...  They'll enhance your site's content relevance, increase the number of links, etc, etc...  But if your web model involves relying solely on your IDX, I can promise you it's not going to work.

 

In my opinion, sub-domain IDX solutions provide a clear advantage over framed IDXs.  Furthermore they can NOT hurt you, your site, or your rankings.  They're worth the effort, unless you're just not comfy enough to implement one.

 

Just one guy's take, and I hope it's helpful considering how stinkin' long it is.

 

Thank you.  =)

 

Mar 28, 2011 06:01 PM
Maureen McCabe
HER Realtors - Columbus, OH
Columbus Ohio Real Estate

thanks Jon!  

Lots to digest there.

Mar 29, 2011 02:11 AM
Renée Donohue~Home Photography
Savvy Home Pix - Allegan, MI
Western Michigan Real Estate Photographer

How long has that page been up there because it isn't indexing here.  I know it takes about 2-3 weeks for me to get solid results so I want to give the benefit of the doubt.

Mar 31, 2011 01:31 AM
Maureen McCabe
HER Realtors - Columbus, OH
Columbus Ohio Real Estate

Renee I remember seeing comments some place which may have been deleted that Chris's websites  that Inna and Jon built are new. I believe this is the newer of the two. 

Chris  looks great.  I'll be watching you and your sites.  Thanks for all the detailed info.

Mar 31, 2011 04:24 AM
Maureen McCabe
HER Realtors - Columbus, OH
Columbus Ohio Real Estate

It's all new!!! 

Apr 01, 2011 03:27 AM
David Monsour
Keller Williams Keystone Realty - Gettysburg, PA
ABR - www.realty-insights.com

I found it took me a few weeks before my blog started ranking.  Here in Gettysburg there isn't much competition though so ranking high has turned out to be pretty easy.  Some topics basically turn up nothing but my posts but I suppose that is the point.

Apr 01, 2011 03:55 AM
Maureen McCabe
HER Realtors - Columbus, OH
Columbus Ohio Real Estate

David you are using RealBird on your site rather than IDX aren't you?  David has a post about his WordPress sites 1st Birthdday?  Anniversary?  Or do you have your brokers IDX on?   

Miriam B. #8 is in a market where she has to link to her brokers IDX, I believe.  Her beautiful New Orleans blog has RealBird for the home search. 

Apr 03, 2011 06:03 AM
Beth Larsen
RE/MAX Sedona - Sedona, AZ
Sedona Arizona

Wow. There is so much interesting information here I'm going to have to give my brain a rest and come back later. Thanks for the ongoing debate on a hot topic.

Apr 04, 2011 07:20 AM
Maureen McCabe
HER Realtors - Columbus, OH
Columbus Ohio Real Estate

Jacky please read the guidelines and remove the link in your post,  It turned your comment into spam. The place for contact info, links and anything promoting you and your business is your blog or your profile.  The signature "Damian Henry (Galtindesign)" is a link to where you promote yourself.

I gave a troll 100 points for saying remove the link to a newbie yesterday. 

Remove the link.  I have no problem with a link carrying on the conversation.  Promoting your company is not continuing the conversation.

I am disappointed.  Good comment but the link makes it spam for me.

Apr 07, 2011 02:16 PM
Maureen McCabe
HER Realtors - Columbus, OH
Columbus Ohio Real Estate

I feel really strongly about comment spam and use the Report a Concern button.

What was said in #30 with a link to a website:

"One thing to keep in mind is what works today may not work tomorrow. I see many of these companies pushing indexable properties in a limited CRM system such as Wordpress. Dont get me wrong wordpress is  great for blogging but Drupal and Joomla hands down blows away Wordpress. When google adjusts to this indexable benefit you are going to see tons of WP sites vanish from the web. If you are going to buy an IDX system you need to do it right the first time. Buy into a system that is scalable from day one and one that offers more than just indexable properties and a blog. Custom IDX is on the rise and is becoming the standard for serious agents who are Technology driven."

The comment from a business builiding sites was signed by a Jacky.

"When google adjusts to this indexable benefit you are going to see tons of WP sites vanish from the web."

I will be watching for that...  I suppose that will help your business if that is what you are selling. 

No I am NOT giving anyone 100 points because I am reporting a concern on a comment where the member chose to promote their business.

 

 

Apr 09, 2011 07:51 AM
Rich Cederberg
eXp Realty - Albuquerque, NM
eXp Realty Agent Albuquerque

Illuminating discussion of the pros and cons of some IDX solutions. I use three different ones, each with it's own ups and downs.

Apr 09, 2011 06:20 PM
Kathleen West
Trademark Realty Group of Palm Coast - Palm Coast, FL
Flagler County & Palm Coast Realtor

From my personal experience with an IDX, indexing does positively affect SEO and is very beneficial.  In fact we've even tested things like changing the mapping type within the property display and found impacts (good and bad) on SEO.  We rarely speculate and try to stay very clear of the "I think" lines of discussion with online things or any tech and strategies for that matter.  The facts are the facts, and in our experience any IDX that is not indexed or allows for creating custom links is not worth the investment.  

At the same time, an IDX in of itself will not create successful online presence.  It's always about how effectively you use it as a beneficial service for visitors.  It's a significant component to positive SEO and when paired with other smart SEO strategies will prove to be very beneficial.  Again, from my experience successful IDX uses will produce better quality leads in a steady stream (i.e. appointments).  As with anything, if you are getting leads and no appointments . . . it's worthless.  

Great points here.

May 11, 2011 05:43 AM
Maureen McCabe
HER Realtors - Columbus, OH
Columbus Ohio Real Estate

ok...

thanks Rich not sure how I missed your comment...

May 11, 2011 05:57 AM
Adrian Willanger
206 909-7536 AdrianWillanger-broker.com - Seattle, WA
Profit from my two decades of experience

Maureen-thanks for posting this and the discussion has been great! It sounds like both IDX solutions have their merits and special features, yet I still believe content is king and figuring out how best to use the IDX you employ is the challenge. 

Nov 28, 2011 10:28 PM
Maureen McCabe
HER Realtors - Columbus, OH
Columbus Ohio Real Estate

thanks

If you have good content I would think you would want the indexable IDX.  If you don't have good content I still think you'd want the indexable IDX. Just my humble opinion.

 

Nov 29, 2011 12:15 AM