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More on the Astonishing Bankruptcy Court "Game Changer"

By
Real Estate Technology with http://www.medicalandspaconsulting.com

Many have made comments to my blog or emailed me separately in regard to my blog about a recent bankruptcy appellate case that could potentially revolutionize loan modifications, forensic audits, short sales, deficiency judgments etc. I wanted to review the case with colleagues prior to discussing it further. Last evening, I met with prominent tax and bankruptcy attorneys.  I traveled from the Giant Litter box (Las Vegas) to Palm Desert, California and another traveled from Phoenix to Palm Desert to discuss this case – it is that significant.

The case is In re Veal and it involved AHMSI and Wells Fargo. It was a Ninth Circuit Appellate panel (BAP). It is significant to note that the appellate panel consisted of judges from California (Riverside vicinage), Montana and Arizona.  The case affects much more than just debtors in bankruptcy.

I will summarize the 46 page opinion and the impact that it may have.

Essentially, the first part of the decision indicated that since Wells Fargo could not prove that it had the original note; it did not have standing to enforce its right to foreclose upon the property. In bankruptcy, the creditors are prevented from any action against the person, but they can readily proceed against the property, IF they have a perfected security interest in the property.  This is referred to as “relief from the automatic stay”.  It is routinely granted because it is a right that a secured creditor has.  In this case, since wells could not prove that it had the original note, they did not have standing and the automatic stay remained in place and Wells could no proceed against either the debtor or the property!!

 

The second impact is potentially even greater!! The court appeared to rule that a lender can only proceed against the secured interest to the extent of its VALUE and not the amount owed. In other words, if a borrower owes $400,000 but the property is worth $200,000, this court is ruling that the lender can only seek to collect $200,000 under its secured interest. This could put an end to deficiency issues.

 

We also discussed ways that a borrower can argue against the “forgiveness of debt” issue on a short sale. WOW, this could be huge….collective thought really stimulates great results.

 

Paddy Deighan, Esq

http://www.homesavers.pro

Show All Comments Sort:
Dave Halpern
Dave Halpern Real Estate Agent, Inc., Louisville, KY (502) 664-7827 - Louisville, KY
Louisville Short Sale Expert

Paddy, thanks for this information. The threat of deficiency judgments pushes many borrowers to bankruptcy rather than a foreclosure workout. I have subscribed to your blog and hope to read more updates from you. All short sale Realtors should subscribe to your blog.

Jun 30, 2011 02:03 PM
Paddy Deighan MBA JD PhD
http://www.medicalandspaconsulting.com - Vail, CO
Paddy Deighan J.D. Ph.D

The other amazing thing as that we came up ith a VERY solid plan to utilize this rationale to help home owners avoid the forgiveness of debt issue and a former IRS auditor agreed with the tactic!!

Jun 30, 2011 02:16 PM
Paddy Deighan MBA JD PhD
http://www.medicalandspaconsulting.com - Vail, CO
Paddy Deighan J.D. Ph.D

Banks may ignore this, but it is a federal appellate court and they will ahvea  hard time ignoring this....the legal doctrine of "res judicata" is very compelling...

Jun 30, 2011 02:18 PM
Bob Hertzog
Summit Home Consultants - Phoenix, AZ
Designated Broker

Wow, this could be HUGE when it comes to both loan mods and short sales.  It will be very interesting to see how this plays out.  Can't wait for the next report.  Thanks Paddy!

Jun 30, 2011 02:22 PM
Kathy Sheehan
Bay Equity, LLC 770-634-4021 - Atlanta, GA
Senior Loan Officer

Just another mess that needs to be cleaned up.  Thanks for the update.

Jun 30, 2011 02:53 PM
Pamela Seley
West Coast Realty Division - Murrieta, CA
Residential Real Estate Agent serving SW RivCo CA

Paddy, thanks for your follow up posting. Glad to see a judge from Riverside County CA in the homeowner's favor (go team!) I am still skeptical because the banks will find a way to ignore. They already do not follow HAMP and HAFA guidelines. Then, of course, who can decipher what the convoluted language of HAMP and HAFA means anyway. Maybe the person who wrote that could enlighten us. Sorry, I digress.

I await further updates from you on this exciting news. If Lenn says THIS IS HUGE, then it has to be. I just have my doubts, although it may make debt forgiveness easier on short sales. Although that isn't such a big deal any longer on first trust deeds in California. Thanks again!

Jun 30, 2011 03:55 PM
Paddy Deighan MBA JD PhD
http://www.medicalandspaconsulting.com - Vail, CO
Paddy Deighan J.D. Ph.D

I met with Bernie Gartland from Palm Desert as one of the attorneys...he is an amazing tax attorney, The lenders ignore HAMP and HAFA because thge federal government does not participate in the federal programs so the troublesome twins, Freddie and Fannie get a free pass so to speak. This is a bit different....it is the courts that fix many problems that the federal government creates

Jun 30, 2011 04:10 PM
Vince McEveety
Gilleran Griffin Realty - Sherman Oaks, CA

sweet post

great info

just sat through a short sale class that addresses deficiency issues

 

this does change the game

thanks for sharing it

 

V

Jun 30, 2011 04:17 PM
Stanley Stepak
Howard Hanna - Avon Lake, OH - Avon Lake, OH
Realtor - Avon Lake, Avon, Bay Village, Westlake,

wow this can be something special in the long run.  I really like to see the impact of all this

Jun 30, 2011 04:35 PM
Lynn B. Friedman CRS Atlanta, GA 404-617-6375
Atlanta Homes ODAT Realty - Love our Great City - Love our Clients! Buckhead - Midtown - Westside - Atlanta, GA
Concierge Service for Our Atlanta Sellers & Buyers

Dear Paddy,

The saddest part for all here is the large group of folks whose homes are GONE.
WHo knows how many folks lost their homes when the banks' paperwork was faulty? 

Have a happy day -
Lynn

Jun 30, 2011 04:38 PM
Gina Chirico
Lattimer Realty - Fairfield, NJ
Real Estate Agent - Essex County, New Jersey

Thanks for the update!  I was intrigued by your original post on this issue.  Please continue to keep us updated.  This is indeed a "Game Changer"

Jun 30, 2011 04:43 PM
Rosalie Evans
Meritus Group Real Estate - Sioux Falls, SD
The Evans Group, Sioux Falls, SD Homes For Sale

This would really stink for anyone who has had to settle for a deficiency judgement in the recent past. The could be paying it off for years and the next guy could get it forgiven just like that. I am curious to see how it all plays out. 

Jun 30, 2011 05:50 PM
Bryant Tutas
Tutas Towne Realty, Inc and Garden Views Realty, LLC - Winter Garden, FL
Selling Florida one home at a time

Paddy. Being as how I do short sales in a deficiency state (Florida) It will be very interesting to see how this all plays out on a National level. Please keep is up updated. This is huge.

Jul 01, 2011 12:24 AM
Keith Lawrence
Christie's International - Mahwah, NJ
ABR, SFR

Great blog.

The Deficiency Judgment issue is going to be major decision.

Jul 01, 2011 12:51 AM
Elizabeth Weintraub Sacramento Broker
Elizabeth Anne Weintraub, Broker - Sacramento, CA
Put 40 years of experience to work for you

Hey Paddy, the troublesome twins have their own HAFA programs, and they run the HAFA program. Yup, the government put Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in charge of HAFA. Freddie Mac is in charge of compliance and Fannie Mae is the financial officer. Doesn't that blow you away?

Jul 01, 2011 02:44 AM
Richie Alan Naggar
people first...then business Ran Right Realty - Riverside, CA
agent & author

This is very informative and need to know material. I cannot help but have just a small moment of sadness amongst the gladness from this thought...It takes litigation in this country to bring about any meaningful changes...Its like holding a gun on someone and making them perform. In any event, change is needed because if we all keep using the current understanding and systems, we are all guilty of partaking in the definition of "insanity"...thank you for this post Paddy...

Jul 01, 2011 02:54 AM
Bill Gillhespy
16 Sunview Blvd - Fort Myers Beach, FL
Fort Myers Beach Realtor, Fort Myers Beach Agent - Homes & Condos

Hi Paddy,  thanks for updating your original post and adding a short review.  This is exactly the type of information we all need.  Yours is a terrific addition to our collective intelligence.  Have a great 4th of July weekend !

Jul 01, 2011 05:20 AM
Jeff&Grace Safrin
F.C.Tucker 1st Team Real Estate - Valparaiso, IN
SpousesSellingHousesTM

subscribed to your blog counsel and waiting for more  of your updates!

thanks

grace

Jul 01, 2011 09:03 AM
Karl Falk
Summit Mitigation Services - Monument, CO
Summit Mitigation Services

Paddy, keep us posted.  Interested to hear the outcome and speculate on any ripple effects this might have.  Thanks for taking the time to share.

Jul 01, 2011 07:19 PM
Paddy Deighan MBA JD PhD
http://www.medicalandspaconsulting.com - Vail, CO
Paddy Deighan J.D. Ph.D

Elizabeth, I have found that ironical as well...I have referred to the HAFA/troublesome twins dichotomy as teh government giving the prosoners the keys to the cell block LOL Wait a minute, it isn't funny!!!

Jul 01, 2011 07:50 PM