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Buy Here, Finance Here, At Your Own Risk

By
Mortgage and Lending with Platinum Home Mortgage Company NMLS #238304

 In response to the discussion about Realtors being "encouraged" to use their affiliated lender, I would ask this: What do you think happens in the Toyota dealership when you are ushered over to the finance department and walk out with a Toyota Motor Credit loan or lease? That's right, you have just been referred to the "affiliated lender". Does it work to add profit to the dealership? Of course...especially since you are in an altered state of mind from being under the influence of new car smell.  Is it the best thing for the consumer? Not by a long shot. 

"Buy here, finance here".  That's what they call it in the auto business (where I spent 20 years of my career). Please, let's not pretend that the reason real estate companies "encourage" their Realtors to use their in house lender is for the sake of "mortgage broker quality control".   It is another profit center, plain and simple, just like in the Toyota dealership. The more the Realtors use the in house lender, the more money the real estate company makes.

Excuse me, but I don't think the profitability of the real estate company should be the criteria for anyone making a decision on where to obtain their mortgage. As I have said many times before, what is best for the client is always what is best for us.

Okay, PROFIT is not an evil word, and many people who buy a big ticket item (like a car or a house), welcome being referred to the in house finance person. They are too scared or too lazy to go out in the world and compare mortgages, mortgage brokers, and closing costs. That's okay.

But just like buying a $5 coke in the ball park, convenience carries a higher COST. Sorry, but that's just economics 101.

Now when you're thirsty at the ball park, what do you care if the machine right outside the park will spit out a coke for a buck? You don't.

But when you are financing something that costs a million bucks, (or even a $50,000 Lexus) maybe, just maybe, it isn't the best idea to pay for convenience. At least you should CHECK OUT the other financing options out there.

Very small differences in mortgages and finance plans can add up to thousands of dollars in costs that could be avoided altogether. Or, maybe the in house finance plan IS the best one. But you'll never know for sure until you compare.

While in the car business, it never failed to amaze me the time, intensity, and research that people put into getting the best price on the car. But for financing, (after being exhausted from the negotiations with the "desk") they would go straight into the finance office and in 3 minutes sign the worst car lease in the world.

No thought was given to shopping for the financing, just sign and "get it over with".

Is it a conflict of interest to have a buy here, finance here operation? If it is, there would be no GMAC, Toyota Motor Credit, or BMW financial. But consumers need to understand that when you buy a car, or buy a house, you are BUYING SOMETHING ELSE. You are also buying the FINANCING.

Would you buy the first house the Realtor showed you? Would you go into one dealership and pay full price for the first car you saw? If not, then consider in house financing for what it is.... a convenience to you and another source of profit to the real estate company. Check out other options, always.

PS Have you ever wondered why mortgage companies don't have in house real estate operations? I have. I also wonder why so many Realtors rebel against using the in house lenders and worry what the management of the office thinks...("pssssst, Janet! I could get in alot of trouble with the owners for giving you this loan, but here's the phone number. Could you call them right away?")

 

Janet Guilbault
Platinum Home Mortgage Company - Walnut Creek, CA
San Francisco Bay Area Direct Mortgage Lender

Roger: Fragile is such a great word. Sometimes it seems pretty funny to me that when a Realtor tells me jump, I ask "how high?". But as a mortgage broker in partnership on a real estate transaction, we all need to realize how much is at stake, and be over the top in terms of service and support to our Realtors.

One thing that has been a huge benefit to me here on AR is reading the opinions of Realtors. Plain and simple, it has helped mold me into a better mortgage broker. Thank you to ALL of the opinionated Realtors out there.

Nov 07, 2007 03:11 AM
Janet Guilbault
Platinum Home Mortgage Company - Walnut Creek, CA
San Francisco Bay Area Direct Mortgage Lender

Jeff: Gosh, I haven't heard from you in ages. It is so nice to see you in the mix of things again. You are one of my favorite bloggers, and just like you predicted....FHA has come to my company (although I still haven't handled one....my confession!)

Brian:  When it comes to car dealerships they have that finance here thing so smoothly orchestrated that it is scary. If you could move into your house the day you bought it, the real estate companies might have more luck with buy here, finance here as well.

Rebecca: We all do think this way, you are right. Isn't it great when the perspective of a blog makes you say "Oh, yeah!"

Nov 07, 2007 03:19 AM
Leigh Brown
Leigh Brown & Associates, RE/MAX Executive - Charlotte, NC
CEO, Dream Maker - Charlotte, NC
Amen.  But you know the last time I bought a car, the dealership DID have the best deal in addition to being onsite and affiliated...but I did know to shop it!  That being said, I think Realtors should be Realtors and lenders should be lenders.  It's hard enough to specialize in one of those fields, getting too many irons in the fire is dangerous.
Nov 07, 2007 03:51 AM
Todd Hueffed
Champions Real Estate Services - Everett, WA

I agree with you as every office in the last 6 years that I have been too seems like they have a in house lender and there is always a reason to use that person or some incentive somehow.

I have never used my in house lenders and have always recommended a lender that I have been using for years....but always recommend 3, then they usually ask who I would use and I point that person out but I also tell them they can shop the phone book or ask friends for referrals.

However at the office I am at now we have a lender that I really like......I have not used him yet for any reason but do hand out his cards as a preferred lender. This is the first time that I have ever recommended a lender in house like that.

I like to use my lender as I know he is fair and will get it to close.....when clients come to me with there lenders I make sure they understand they picked this person, that way if something goes wrong I have already preset the hook that its not my fault if docs are not there.....and if in the transaction the lender is not performing like should be I will call my clients and discuss it with them. I make them responsible for there lender as I will not run across the state again for a clients bad choice of lenders.....

I also don't agree with agents that are lenders but that's another story........

Todd Hueffed

http://www.thathomezone.com/ in partnership with Keller Williams North Seattle

Nov 07, 2007 03:59 AM
John Doiron
Coldwell Banker Burnet - Savage, MN
Reading the comments here, I feel like I'm in a very small minority of agents who use like their inhouse lender and title people. Every transaction I have done with them has gone well. In fact, there are many times other agants have told of when deals that have fallen through with other lenders have been rescued at the last minute by our inhouse people. Every situation is different, of course, and we should all be looking out for our customers.
Nov 07, 2007 04:50 AM
Robert L. Brown
www.mrbrownsellsgr.com - Grand Rapids, MI
Grand Rapids Real Estate Bellabay Realty, West Mic
I give them a couple people and it's up to them to pick. We had an in-house lender here and it didn't last that long. I think it's better that way. Arms length transactions are the best. Keeps your liability down.                                
Nov 07, 2007 04:55 AM
Michael Eisenberg
eXp Realty - Bellingham, WA
Bellingham Real Estate Guy
You get what you pay for, ie/ bad financing at that car dealer perhaps.
Nov 07, 2007 05:24 AM
Anonymous
Chuck
Great post janet. What about RESPA and Steering? Why do Realtors take that chance. I have always found that I can give the client a better deal due to the fact that we are a big mortgage lender and get discounts based on volumn of loans and pass that on to the clients.
Nov 07, 2007 06:06 AM
#58
James R. Gill
Manhattan Beach, CA

Hi Janet, 

I am an in-house lender for Remax and feel the need to contribute my thoughts:

The strongest point that I want to raise is that as the in-house lender I have huge fiduciary duty to not only the client, but to the agent, to remax and to JPM Chase, the co-owner.  I feel it is crazy for an agent to refer their clients away from me because they give up all that control and fiduciary duty.  If I was to over-charge their client for extra rebate or for points and fees that are not in the clients best interest, I would lose my job.

Another important point is the partnership or team aspect to being in-house.  Not only am I just a few feet from the agent's office, but we know how each-other works.  Trust is formed.

How often does a mortgage broker avoid your calls?  I can't do that.  How often do you wish you could go to the management of a broker and complain?  Here, it is also your manager. How often is there something holding up the loan docs and you have no control?  Here you have some control.

Wouldn't you want to work with a mortgage professional whom you can trust and whom you could have fired for doing something that was not in your client's best interest?!

Nov 07, 2007 07:03 AM
Janet Guilbault
Platinum Home Mortgage Company - Walnut Creek, CA
San Francisco Bay Area Direct Mortgage Lender

James: 59 comments and finally an in house lender speaks. Thank you so much for your point of view.

Control (whatever that is) and fiduciary duty to the owners of the real estate company is probably not what most agents have on their mind when they are deciding on a mortgage person for their clients. Nor should it be in my opinion.

An agent does not need to be in "control" of the mortgage process  when they feel confident that the mortgage broker can handle the job. James, with all due respect....why should any borrower care about your fiduciary duty to the Realtor and the owner? Clients only care about your fiduciary duty to them.

Trust is not formed with Realtors as a result of you sitting in the office with the real estate agents. It is formed by consistantly producing on time closings with satisfied clients.

If a mortgage broker is so bad that they avoid calls and cause the agent to want to rant to the management, guess what? The Realtor NOT using the in house lender gets to fire them. That mortgage broker won't get any future business from that Realtor. 

But the Realtors with the in house lender? They are still stuck with the in house guy (who didn't perform)until the owner can find someone else, and embarassed everytime they pass his desk.

 

Nov 07, 2007 07:48 AM
Lane Bailey
Century 21 Results Realty - Suwanee, GA
Realtor & Car Guy

My brokerage has an in-house lender... I've never used the service.  My franchise has an in-house lender.. I've not used them either.  I have given both to clients to shop, however.  In a few cases, the offered about the same, or even slightly better deal than other lenders, but for whatever reason, the client chose to use other financing.  

And that is just it.  The client is free to go elsewhere.  I would NEVER counsel a buyer to not shop the rates and mortgage products.  Even with the ones I usually have clients going to, they bounce around as to the best rates and packages for each individual.  

I don't have a problem with in-house lending... I do have a problem with pushing agents in that direction, though.   

Nov 07, 2007 07:49 AM
David A. Podgursky PA
THE PODGURSKY GROUP @ Re/Max Direct - Boynton Beach, FL
THE PODGURSKY GROUP - Make the Right Move!

Janet:

A title company here is an EASY profit center if you have a big group of realtors.... 10-15 files a month and they are in the profits!...

The big franchises seem to do this a lot as well... I think it is as dangerous as any other affiliated arrangement... maybe more so...

Nov 07, 2007 08:08 AM
Bartley Wilson
Virtual Pictures Corp. (VPiX) - Monument, CO
VR Software and 360° Solutions

It isn't easy staying alive if you're a broker today. Margins are getting razor thin. The One Stop Shop concept sought by brokers today allows them to provide financing. It is a fast growing trend.

Surveys done by Clareity Consulting have shown that 44% of agents who MADE recommendations to the buyer for a custom home builder, landscaper or a mortgage source was actually followed and genuinely appreciated.

Lending Tree, Homegain, CountryWide, HouseValues are today's lead sharks and they are creating complex systems to wedge themselves between the broker and home buyer.

HouseValues set up a JustListed site which baits unsuspecting home buyers with the lure of "You can search for homes anywhere in the U.S." Yeah, right. Here, just fill out this form. When you click submit, you sort of expect to see a new screen allowing you to now search for homes. Hahahaha. Gotcha! This lead is now sold to an agent for $35 bucks or more. Or through HouseValues you get to buy a Zip code for either listings, buyers or both for $300 or more per month. The other guys do the same thing. The lead management game has too many players who are all looking for fast and easy ways to take more money out of the brokers wallet for the promise of leads. 

For really qualified leads, the broker is often faced with getting the dreaded, expensive phone call from HomeGain sooner or later. "Hello, Broker Bob? Jim here from HomeGain. How's your dog? Life treating you well? Anyway, for your One point two million dollar listing -- you know, MLS 12345 guess what? I got a solid buyer for this property. Prequalified, and great FICO scores, man. 740 score and ability to drop down 20%, too. And it's only going to cost you 35% of your commission? You want the customer...?"

Argh. This is predatory at best, and the broker coughs up the fee when the house closes.

We hate this, but this is how the business works sometimes. So what's today's broker have left to increase margins? Bring financing in house. It's new and trendy and it facilitates the One Stop Shop so many brokers are pursuing today. 

I consult with many brokers in the U.S. now and I see the one stop shop trend growing.  

Nov 07, 2007 09:41 AM
Paul Warner -- Orange County, CA Appraiser
Warner & Associates - Mission Viejo, CA

As the line in Top Gun goes (or at least something similar) 

"You hook 'em, and i'll fry 'em"

Good info! 

 

 

Nov 07, 2007 10:49 AM
Lewis Poretz
Apex Home Loans - Annapolis, MD
Business Development Manager

everybody check out this blog ( comment ) by an in house lender.....-----   

http://activerain.com/blogsview/265522/In-house-Lender

 

man it set me off ~~~~~~~~~~   so i had to write my own blog -   feel free to chime in............

http://activerain.com/blogsview/265816/In-house-lenders-let 

 

I still say Janet gets my vote for one of the all time top blogs!  Great job Janet...... 

 


Nov 07, 2007 11:09 AM
Catherine S. Read
Creative Read, Inc. - Fairfax, VA
There are an awful lot of people commenting here who are quick to weigh in on this topic with "I have never used the in-house lender."  That's a great basis of experience on which to make a judgement.  There are also sweeping generalizations here that lump all in-house lenders and loan officers into a single category.  I believe people seek out other people who validate their viewpoint.  There's a lot of back slapping and self-congratulations over having found birds of a feather.  Which is what I believe blogging is basically all about.  I don't think anyone's opinion will ever change unless they have a personal experience that changes it.  So if agents make up their mind in advance that using and in-house lender is unethical, illegal, immoral or unsatisfactory, I don't believe that viewpoint will be changed unless they have an experience that changes it.  Which is unlikely if they've made up their mind they "will never use an in-house lender." 
Nov 07, 2007 11:45 AM
Bob & Carolin Benjamin
Benjamin Realty LLC - Gold Canyon, AZ
East Phoenix Arizona Homes
Interesting post. Thanks for sharing.
Nov 07, 2007 04:01 PM
Anonymous
Anonymous

Janet, I do think my office is unique in the strength of the affiliates but the broker is also a very strong manager so she's created a good team.  I do think they are in the unfortunate position of working for the "bosses daughter" so they have to work that much harder to get business from the office.  I'm happy to put their name down as one to call when I give referrals to clients though there is another lender I'm much more attuned with and who I think just "gets" some clients better.  Some the affiliiate is better for because they have a program that serves them well... Serve each client well and the rest takes care of itself. 

As for liability and arm's length... Unless we are completely uninvolved in the referral process than no matter what we are liable.  I'd rather take on that potential liability and know that the transaction has the opportunity to close than to take on the risk of unknown lenders and title companies that consumers pick based on criteria different from what we know are their best interests!    The implication is that it's cheaper to use a non-affiliate and therefore better but every time I've gone for cheaper, better went out the window!

Just my two cents...

Nov 09, 2007 02:55 AM
#68
Katerina Gasset
The Gasset Group & Get It Done For Me Virtual Services - Provo, UT
Amplify Your Real Estate & Life Dreams!
Janet, Congrats on your feature. I sell real estate, I refer the loans to a mortgage broker, simple, it works! Katerina
Nov 10, 2007 05:35 PM
Catherine Myers
Windermere Bay Area Properties - Walnut Creek, CA
Walnut Creek, CA Real Estate

Our office has an in-house lender, and quite frankly, he's a great guy, knows his stuff and I wouldn't hesitate to refer him a deal because I see him as competent and knowledgeable. His rates, terms and cost seem to be in line and sometimes less than a couple of other lenders I've referred to in the past. I am under no obligation to refer to him, and I wouldn't "be in trouble" for not. Its not a question. Having said that I always refer my clients to 2 or 3 mortgage professionals; in house , broker, direct lender - they have choices and I send them to the three "main" choices for lending out there with a direct reference to a professional I've worked with in each of those companies.  I want it to be the consumers choice.  In the hot markets, I try to get this information to them ahead of the game so we're not left struggling for a pre-approval at the 11th hour.  In this market, they have time to shop and I want them to do that, and I want the choice to be theirs alone.  I know that whoever they choose from my list will do a great job (or at least the best they can!)  Ok, along this topic Janet, when are we going to meet?

Oh, and P.S. there is a company in town affiliated with a title company, but that's the only one I know. 

Nov 11, 2007 02:15 PM