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If it Walks like a Duck and Quacks like a Duck ... it isn't always a Duck!

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Mortgage and Lending with NMLS #216987, IL Lic. 031.0006220, WI Licensed. APMC NMLS #175656 IL Lic 031.0006220/WI

 

If it Walks like a Duck and Quacks like a  
Duck ... it isn't always a Duck!   
 
 
 
 
     Condominium ... or Townhome?  Which is it?

Contact Gene Mundt, Mortgage Lender
     This age old question recently reared itself, had me scratching my head, and doing some major homework and clean-up for a couple of weeks.  First, let me give you some background on an unusual circumstance ...

     My Borrower had transacted for a property listed as a  Condominium.  Only thing, after a couple weeks into the deal, we uncover that it's legally described as a  Townhouse  Style unit within a PUD (Planned Unit Development).  There are 4 Units attached in a row with a row-house design; meaning side-by-side Units.  

     The exterior of the building's maintenance is provided by the  Homeowners Association  through its  Reserve Funds.  Monthly Dues are consistent with a Condominium Project.  Assessments and Property Tax Identification Number (PIN) are consistent with a Condominium Unit.  The local Assessor and the Appraiser considered it a CONDO.
 
     Remember, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck ....
 
     This property looks like a Condominium, walks like a Condominium, and quacks like a Condominium.  But after receiving file documentation (the Certificate of Insurance and Title Commitment from the Seller's Attorney, and lastly the Declarations of the Association from the Management Company), I discovered red flags.  Legally ... it was a P.U.D.  (Planned Unit Development/Townhouse)! 
 
     Having been an Appraiser for well over 20 years, I knew what to look for and where to look for the supportinfo and details needed to clear up the confusion.  I knew how to argue my case so we could move forward with the mortgage processing for this property.  It took days of pleading my case, but the Appraiser finally came to recognize that this property is a P.U.D. ... and not a Condominium, as represented.
 
     What ARE the differences between a P.U.D. and a Condominium?  The terms themselves refer to the legally designated form of ownership.
 
     In a Condominium, the land is NOT owned by the Unit owner, but rather is shared with all the Unit owners in the Association.  The same is true of any "common" land areas.
 
     In a P.U.D., the land underneath the Townhouse Unit is legally owned by the individual Unit owner.  In the case mentioned above, the developer set-up this particular subdivision as a Planned Unit Development, even though it takes on the typical and usual attributes of a Condominium. 
 
     Through the combined efforts of myself, my assistant, my processor, and a few others we confirmed the property's land use.  Then we also convinced others that there was in reality a problem regarding this property.  One that was causing me, as the  Mortgage Lender, real difficulties when trying to secure loan approval and a Closing.   

     After gathering all the needed documentation and evidence together, it was easy to see why there had been confusion.  It took the following documents in order to straighten this problem out:

     *  Appraisal:  Initially, the appraisal was performed as though the property was a Condominium.  It was confirmed as such by the Appraiser.
 
     *  Title Report:  The Legal Description described this property as a P.U.D.  (Planned Unit Development). 
 
     *  Tax Bill/Assessment:  Both referenced the property as a Condominium.
 
     *  Certificate of Insurance:  This document stated NO Building Coverage provided with Association's Policy.  That is consistent with a P.U.D. project where each unit is insured separately.
 
     *  Property Declarations & By-Laws:  This document finally reached us about two weeks into the deal.  Its legal description matched the Title Policy's, confirming that this project had indeed been set-up as a Planned Unit Development.
 
     *  Survey:  This document was also provided after a request from my office.  It shows lot dimensions for each Unit.  
 
     *  County Plat Map:  The plat map shows this property like a Condominium.
Link to FREE Consultation with Gene Mundt, Mortgage Lender 
     The outcome?  The duck was wearing a disguise and walking funny!

     This property IS a P.U.D. and I will close the loan accordingly.  The incorrect documents are being revised as a result and will be revised in time to assure a successful Closing.

      The points proven to me by this property's saga?  A FULL  Legal Description  and/or the  Legal Declarations & By-Laws  on any multi-unit project is definitely needed when working on these types of transactions.  
 
      I'll also stress the point that it definitely pays to work with an experienced  Mortgage Lender.  One that knows the details of all phases of the real estate transaction and mortgage lending process.   
 
      And finally, looks can be deceiving.  You can't always judge a book by it's cover.  If it Walks like a Duckand Quacks like a Duck ... it isn't always a Duck!

 
 
 
     *  It pays to work with an experienced, thoroughly educated and knowledgeable Mortgage Lender.  Contact me today!  I'll put my 35+ years of mortgage expertise and experience hard to work on your behalf.
     I can be conveniently found at any of the following:
Direct:   815.524.2281 
Cell/Text:   708.921.6331 
eFax:   815.524.2281     Skype:   630.219.1316 
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Gene Mundt

 Mortgage Originator  -  NMLS #216987    

                                 IL Lic. #031.0006220  -  WI License #216987                                                                                                    

NMLS #175656

 

Gene Mundt, Mortgage Originator,  40+ years of #mortgage experience, will offer you exemplary mortgage service and advice when seeking:  #Conventional, #FHA, #VA, #Jumbo, #USDA, and Portfolio Loans in #Chicago and the greater Chicagoland region, including:  The #Lincoln-Way Area, #Will County, (#New Lenox, #Frankfort, #Mokena, #Manhattan, #Joliet, #Shorewood, #Crest Hill, #Plainfield, #Bolingbrook, #Romeoville, #Naperville, #Wilmington, #Peotone, etc.), #DuPage County, the City of Chicago, #Cook County, and elsewhere within IL and Wisconsin. 

 

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Comments(46)

Harry F. D'Elia III
WEDO Real Estate and Beyond, LLC - Phoenix, AZ
Investor , Mentor, GRI, Radio, CIPS, REOs, ABR

The one thing that they do have in common would be the monthly HOA fee

Jan 09, 2013 11:07 AM
Dorie Dillard Austin TX
Coldwell Banker Realty ~ 512.750.6899 - Austin, TX
NW Austin ~ Canyon Creek and Spicewood/Balcones

Good evening Gene,

Excellent, excellent post! Jason is right..this info does make your head spin but you have to get it down to represent your buyers effectively!!

Jan 09, 2013 11:08 AM
Christine Smith
Buyers Brokers Only LLC - www.BuyersBrokersOnly.com - Canton, MA
Exclusive Buyer Agent & Attorney, Canton, MA

Gene...it always amazes me (although it shouldn't anymore) when both an owner & listing agent aren't aware of the legal details of a property.  

Jan 09, 2013 11:37 AM
Ed Silva, 203-206-0754
Mapleridge Realty, CT 203-206-0754 - Waterbury, CT
Central CT Real Estate Broker Serving all equally

Good Job in searching and battling to get the property properly described. And also and explanation on the difference between a condominium and PUD

Jan 09, 2013 11:45 AM
Joan Whitebook
BHG The Masiello Group - Nashua, NH
Consumer Focused Real Estate Services

thanks.. this is a very informative post.  I have run into this type of situation a couple of times and I always recommend that the buyers seek legal counsel.

Jan 09, 2013 11:55 AM
Joy Daniels
Joy Daniels Real Estate Group, Ltd. - Harrisburg, PA

Great information on a subject that confuses even those that are in the condo/townhome selling business!  I have bookmarked your post to share with buyers because of your great explanation.  Thanks!

Jan 09, 2013 01:43 PM
Stephanie Stringer
First Choice Loan Services NMLS#210764 - San Antonio, TX
Mortgage Loan Originator

Gene-  Great explanation of the Condos and Townhomes.  I had the same thing happen to me about five years ago where an agent contracted for the wrong property type.  Condos can be a little changing  when we truly discover what's on the condo questionnaire.  My client was approved but the condo was not.  I was able to fight to get the earnest money back because of the listing agent listing it was FHA approved and truly at the time it was not.  The seller was an attorney so you know I had to put some good solid facts out there.  

Jan 09, 2013 02:13 PM
Maureen Bray Portland OR Home Stager ~ Room Solutions Staging
Room Solutions Staging, Portland OR - Portland, OR
"Staging Consultations that Sell Portland Homes"

Wow Gene, once again you proved your incredible expertise in all lending matters when you untangled this mystery!  I was unfamiliar with PUDs but now will remember what they are, as a result of your post.

Jan 09, 2013 03:07 PM
Gabe Sanders
Real Estate of Florida specializing in Martin County Residential Homes, Condos and Land Sales - Stuart, FL
Stuart Florida Real Estate

This happens occasionally down here as well Gene.  I wonder what you'd think of my P.U.D. association which is officially registered under a certificate of condominium.  (All single family homes(

Jan 09, 2013 08:06 PM
Toni Weidman
Sailwinds Realty - Trinity, FL
20+ Years Selling Homes in New Port Richey, FL
This is super info, Gene. It clears things up and now I know. Thanks for sharing.
Jan 09, 2013 08:10 PM
Toni Weidman
Sailwinds Realty - Trinity, FL
20+ Years Selling Homes in New Port Richey, FL
Thanks for sharing this great info, Gene. It is confusing.
Jan 09, 2013 08:11 PM
Mitchell J Hall
Manhattan, NY
Lic Associate RE Broker - Manhattan & Brooklyn

Great information Gene. I learn something everyday. We have townhouses (mostly built in the 19th century) and condos primarily built post-world war II but I never heard of a PUD.

There are some new condo developments here that have townhouses as part of the complex. If I ever sell one, now I know I should find out if it's a "townhouse condo uniit" or a PUD.

Jan 09, 2013 10:32 PM
Steve Warrene
Your Town Realty - Lower Burrell, PA
Pittsburgh Realtor North and East Pgh.

We never heard of PUD but it is something that I will remember.

Jan 09, 2013 10:59 PM
Richie Alan Naggar
people first...then business Ran Right Realty - Riverside, CA
agent & author

The most savvy of the Real Estate rock and rollers could never answer this question with confidence and many still cannot...When I was put on the spot, I got through it but I wouldn't teach a class on it...good post

Jan 09, 2013 11:22 PM
Fernando Herboso - Associate Broker MD, & VA
Maxus Realty Group of Samson Properties - Clarksburg, MD
301-246-0001 Serving Maryland, DC and Northern VA

They were just selling the duck and forgot to include the land underneath. .

you are a true pro!

Jan 10, 2013 12:32 AM
Gene Mundt, IL/WI Mortgage Originator - FHA/VA/Conv/Jumbo/Portfolio/Refi
NMLS #216987, IL Lic. 031.0006220, WI Licensed. APMC NMLS #175656 - New Lenox, IL
708.921.6331 - 40+ yrs experience

Harry:  Some of the similarities are what make the situation so confusing to so many.  Hope the post proves helpful in those instances ...

Dorie:  I'm hoping that this post does just that.  At minimum ... proceed with caution ...

Christine:  It's about being thorough.  And as you know, some will be ... others won't.  Thanks for the comment!

Ed:  Thanks!  Glad that you found my explanations beneficial ...

Joan:  A good place to start, should the situation and classification of type of property need to be changed, as it was in this case.  Taking action pro-actively is so important ...

Joy:  I LOVE hearing that!  Hope it proves very benefical to all those you pass it on to ...

Exactly Stephanie!  Sometimes the attorneys are the hardest to convince and sway!

Maureen:  Wow!  I taught YOU something.  Typically you are the teacher and I am the student.  Glad you found the info helpful.

Gabe:  Sounds interesting and intriguing!  Would be interested to know how transactions are handled in your area ...

Toni:  This is a topic that can be very confusing, so if I helped to clarify it even a little ... I'm glad I wrote the post ...

Mitchell:  It never hurts to do a little extra when it comes to homework and preparation.  That way you're educated and more capable of facing and tackling issues, should they arise.  Know that you can always shout out to me, should you need a bit more info ...

Steve:  Depending on your housing market, it may be something you never face.  But if you do, you can now handle the issue a bit better hopefully.  

Richie:  Definitely something that needs to be approached methodically.  The situation doesn't arise that often, but should it ... hopefully now you know a bit more from my post.   Always feel free to shout out to me, as well ... I'll help where I can!

Fernando:  Thank you so much!  Your compliment is truly appreciated ...

Gene

Jan 10, 2013 01:29 AM
Rick Perry
Realty World - Select - Stafford, VA
RickP

Very insightful!  Fortunately you got it "right"!  Litigation is no fun!  Definitely similarities based on your blog and your research was phenemenol!  Kinda curiosu, what was the "condo" fee on this?  Normally this is a "tell tale" sign of condo or townhouse ownership.  Thanks again for sharing!!!

Jan 10, 2013 02:32 AM
Gene Mundt, IL/WI Mortgage Originator - FHA/VA/Conv/Jumbo/Portfolio/Refi
NMLS #216987, IL Lic. 031.0006220, WI Licensed. APMC NMLS #175656 - New Lenox, IL
708.921.6331 - 40+ yrs experience

Rick:  Funny you mention that ... the amount was such that is appeared as a Condo also.  Imagine that!  All relative to coverages for insurance, common areas, and maintenance too.  That was part of what contributed to the confusion.  Very astute reading ...

Hope you found the post beneficial ...

Gene

Jan 10, 2013 03:30 AM
Steven Cook
No Longer Processing Mortgages. - Tacoma, WA

Gene -- thank you, once again, for sharing your expertise with the rest of us in the Rain!  Something a lot of people haven't realized, but was mentioned by Debbie (#19) - is that a great number of Condos which used to be FHA approved, have let their approval lapse.   It is a great deal easier to renew than to start over, like her lender is having to do.

Jan 10, 2013 05:36 AM
Gene Mundt, IL/WI Mortgage Originator - FHA/VA/Conv/Jumbo/Portfolio/Refi
NMLS #216987, IL Lic. 031.0006220, WI Licensed. APMC NMLS #175656 - New Lenox, IL
708.921.6331 - 40+ yrs experience

Definitely, Steven!  And I find that we have much the same situation here.  Lots of lapses.  Good to work with professionals that know how to restore that approval ... and then get the loan closed. 

Gene

Jan 10, 2013 06:46 AM