Lions & Tigers & AVMs - Oh My!

Real Estate Agent with Realty One Group Mountain Desert AZDRE# SA582422000

At NAR's Mid-Year Conference in Washington D.C. (now rebranded as the REALTOR Party Convention & Trade Expo), there are always issues before the Board of Directors that drop out of the sky like a sudden downpour to drown out the conversations started earlier in the week.  This year is no different.  The meeting may have a new name, but the game remains the same.  The issue dropping out of the sky for 2014 is AVMs - and whether NAR should require member MLS systems to provide the data feed to brokers that is used to produce them.

Earlier in the week, hallway & lobby conversations revolved around the Core Standards issue being voted upon this morning, only to be wiped away like smog by a rainstorm by the motion carried out of the MLS Committee meeting on Thursday. By early evening, AVMs dominated conversations in lounges & dinner tables near DuPont Circle.

As Friday dawned, battle lines had been drawn and opponents started sharpening the points of their defense in the argument to bring into the afternoon caucuses.  The interesting thing about listening to both sides is that passionate non-understanding & smug arrogance took precedence over meaningful discussion of the issue.  Opponents weren't seeking to understand how AVMs worked (or in the case of some 'non-disclosure' states, the difference between Custom & Law). Supporters who blindly joined the side of pro-AVM were overheard talking about how "only the ignorant could be opposed" to letting brokers have the if they knew the issue in-depth. The most passionate arguments I heard were full of fear & little fact to support them...with the exception of one I heard in the mens room (usually the place of benign sports discussion while, well, you know - doing bathroom things):

"The issue is the feed that already goes to companies like CoreLogic, RPR, Courthouse Retrieval Systems, etc.  What the brokers want is the right to have the same feed for themselves - after all, it IS their data," said one man.

"If the brokers in the Realty Alliance who are pushing this through NAR want this so bad, why couldn't they get their own individual MLS's to allow it? Must have met a stone wall, so this is an 'end run' to get it required from the top down."

I know a little about how such things work, but certainly am no expert - I know just enough to be dangerous. This morning I will listen to both sides & sort out the facts before me prior to casting my vote as a member of the NAR Board. Could this be the type of issue that causes another "Special Meeting" to be called? Who knows. I tend to fall on the Data Freedom side of things - if a data feed is already going out to 3rd parties, why not let brokers have the same feed? It will be an interesting session - and I hope there are compelling, cogent arguments on both sides instead of what may well turn out to be Fear vs Arrogance with a whole lot of uninformed passion from both viewpoints.

We'll see by 1pm!

Posted by

TucsonKent Signature
Real Estate Is About People

NAR® Board of Directors 2013-16
   Land Use, Property Rights & Environment 2016
   RPAC Participation Council 2014-16
   Federal Finance & Housing Policy 2013-14

AAR® Board of Directors 2013-16
   Legislative Policy 2013-16

Inside Tucson Business "Up & Comer" 2014

Greater Tucson Leadership Class of 2012


Visit our facebook pageLink to our YouTube Channellink to Kent Simpson's LinkedIn profileFollow the TucsonKent Group's Twitter Feed
Bookmark and Share

web counter

All original material written by Kent Simpson unless attributed to source.©2007-2014



This entry hasn't been re-blogged:

Re-Blogged By Re-Blogged At
Real Estate Industry
mls policy
nar board

Spam prevention
Show All Comments
Liz and Bill Spear
RE/MAX Elite 513.520.5305 - Mason, OH
RE/MAX Elite Warren County OH (Cincinnati/Dayton)

Kent, I wish I could be surprised that there's a lack of rationality and willingness to listen to each side's viewpoints by many of the reps, but that reflects too often the same thing I see in this forum and in FB groups.  Glad you're able to listen and form a decision based on facts and not fear.  Bill

May 16, 2014 11:26 PM #3
Tammy Lankford,
Lane Realty Eatonton, GA Lake Sinclair, Milledgeville, 706-485-9668 - Eatonton, GA
Broker GA Lake Sinclair/Eatonton/Milledgeville

That's why I love that I am a shareholder and equal broker vote in my MLS.  We literally can't be told no.  We own it, we control it.  We did start our own and it's not association tied and we LOVE it.

May 17, 2014 10:05 AM #4
Kent Simpson
Realty One Group Mountain Desert - Tucson, AZ
Real Estate Is About People

Bill - during the Board meeting, it was apparent that there had been quite a bit of study going on overnight. There was a lot of good points made on both sides of the issue - actually some healthy discussion.

Tammy - you've got the freedom that many brokerages dream about (and the responsibilities too, no doubt) - good for you!

May 17, 2014 01:38 PM #5
Joan Whitebook
BHG The Masiello Group - Nashua, NH
Consumer Focused Real Estate Services

Thanks for this post. Please keep up update on this very important issue.

The most passionate arguments I heard were full of fear & little fact to support them.  Now that is not a good way to make a deicision. Press for the facts.

May 17, 2014 01:44 PM #6
Laura Cerrano
Feng Shui Manhattan Long Island - Locust Valley, NY
Certified Feng Shui Expert, Speaker & Researcher
Non-disclosures are vital cases like these many times in my experience. Good luck, Laura
May 17, 2014 01:46 PM #7
Patricia Kennedy
RLAH Real Estate - Washington, DC
Home in the Capital

Hey, Kent!  I included this post in today's Last Week's Favorites.  Enjoy your Sunday.

May 17, 2014 10:54 PM #8
Lisa Heindel
Crescent City Living LLC - New Orleans, LA
New Orleans Real Estate Broker

Kent, I'm firmly on the side of anyone who opts to allow feeds that are sent to 3rd parties be used by the brokerages that actually provide the data. 

I can only assume it's being addressed at the national level because there are MLSs like my own, who don't allow the display of sold data, who then turn around and happily provide it to Move Inc for their Market Snapshot product. Why in the world would they favor a 3rd party over a member broker? They shouldn't and perhaps the NAR rulings will spark some changes.

May 17, 2014 11:35 PM #9
Kent Simpson
Realty One Group Mountain Desert - Tucson, AZ
Real Estate Is About People

The measure passed as presented before the Board of Directors, after healthy debate on an amendment and whether to refer it back to committee for more study.  You can read yesterday's release by NAR - I'm sure more details will be forthcoming in the next day or two.

One thing to note:  any policies and decisions made by NAR are superceded by state or local law.  Anyone concerned about that kind of thing can rest easy - there is and will not be any intent to run contrary to the rule of law in any jurisdiction!  Joan, Laura, Lisa - thanks for your input! Patricia - that is mighty kind of you, thanks for the honor of inclusion!

May 17, 2014 11:49 PM #10
Bruce Kunz
C21 Solid Gold Realty, Brick, NJ, 732-920-2100 - Howell, NJ
REALTOR®, Brick & Howell NJ Homes for Sale

Hi Kent. Thanks for taking the time to post this. Many of these "out of the sky" topics are usually confusing to me because so little of the arguments are actually based on facts and often I've not experienced the problem. Your post helps.

May 18, 2014 12:35 AM #11
Wayne Johnson
Coldwell Banker D'Ann Harper REALTORS® - San Antonio, TX
San Antonio REALTOR, San Antonio Homes For Sale

Well, I know I'm out of my depth when I don't even recognize the acronym (AVM). But then I looked it up to gain a bit of knowledge on it.

May 18, 2014 03:22 AM #12
Travis "the SOLD man" Parker; Broker/Owner
Travis Realty - Enterprise, AL
email: / cell: 334-494-7846

I've tried to follow this, but have been too busy. We have an Association Board meeting in a few days and I'm SURE this will be THE topic!

May 18, 2014 01:23 PM #13
Debe Maxwell, CRS | The Maxwell House Group | RE/MAX Executive | (704) 491-3310 - Charlotte, NC
The right Charlotte REALTOR!

Thanks for the update, Kent.  I believe that if the feeds are allowed to go to 3rd parties, then they should be allowed to be used by the brokers.  Of course, I'm pro doing away with the 3rd parties altogether so, my 'vote' probably would not count!  I'm dealing with clients now who are utilizing the 3rd party sites and are losing on Offers because they believe that they are correct on their valuations...simply because of the name.  Forget that they have an agent whom they SHOULD rely on!  Arrgh!  That's a whole other can of worms though...

May 18, 2014 01:40 PM #14
Kent Simpson
Realty One Group Mountain Desert - Tucson, AZ
Real Estate Is About People

Here's the info straight from NAR about the discussion and the new policy:  MLSs Must Share Data For Use In AVMs

One of the most compelling arguments I heard in favor of the policy change came from a California agent (can't remember his name, sorry dude!).  He reasoned "there are a multitude of aggregators using inaccurate data to produce AVMs & we gripe about them all the time (Zestimate, et al).  Our brokers should be able to use OUR data to produce a better Automated Value Model that they can use on the consumer side - otherwise we're giving the bad models a free ride" (quote is contextual, not verbatim).

Basically, my thoughts were along the same lines.  As a whole, we do not enjoy having to deal with inaccurate data, especially when a consumer believes it to be gospel truth. Not allowing our brokerages to use the data feeds they actually generate is shooting ourselves in the foot.  Again.  

Glad the proposal passed & look forward to seeing what we do with it!

Thanks Bruce, Wayne, Travis & Debe for chiming in!

May 19, 2014 08:54 AM #15
Chandler Real Estate Liz Harris, MBA
Liz Harris Realty - Chandler, AZ

Thanks for the take.  Look forward to the next one.  Liz Harris in Chandler. 

May 19, 2014 09:50 AM #16
Show All Comments

What's the reason you're reporting this blog entry?

Are you sure you want to report this blog entry as spam?


Kent Simpson

Real Estate Is About People
Tell Me More About Tucson Real Estate