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Nutty Neighbors and Disclosure...Do you?

By
Real Estate Agent with Tomson Burnham, llc Licensed in the State of Oregon

There is lawsuit occurring in Maricopa county over a neighbor.  A buyer purchase a home in 2005 only to find that his neighbor had some serious issues.  She yelled obscenities at his daughter pretty much every day.  He decided to sue the previous owner for failing to disclose the nuisance neighbor.

You really need to read the article to appreciate her behavior. I'll wait, while you read it. 

For those of you in "nuisance neighbor" disclosure states what constitutes a nuisance?

  • Would someone having outdoor cats that come into your backyard and eat your koi be a nuisance?
  • Would someone failing to scoop their doggy doo be a nuisance?
  • Would someone who loves opera be a nuisance to someone who loves Nine Inch Nails?

I find it interesting that some states requires these types of disclosures. This seems very subjective to me, and very difficult to enforce.

I can just see the evolution of the real estate disclosure form to include:

Do any neighbors within a 10 block radius have any of the following behaviors on any occasion?

  • Shooting off fireworks for many days prior to and after the 4th of July at all hours of the evening
  • Excessive alcohol consumption that leads to bouts of drunken cow tipping or lawn mower riding?
  • Wear pants that expose their behind when bending over for all to see, despite not wanting to?
  • Wears tube socks with Birkenstock sandals, or some other major fashion foo-pas?
  • Talks non-stop to you while you attempt to do yard work, forcing you inside in order to escape?

You get my drift...There are people with significant mental health issues, but sometimes a neighbor conflict is just that:  a personality conflict.  Maybe the real issue is the seller of the house and not the neighbor.   Who get to decide what a nuisance is? 

I know some states require that you disclose nuisances, Oregon does not.  I find this an interesting lawsuit.  This woman's behavior is clearly odd, but what would define a nuisance? 

 

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Anonymous
Linda

LOL.

 

Well, in that case, my buyer's agent should have disclosed that my landlord was Jabba the Hutt!

 

http://outsider222.wordpress.com/2008/02/10/bangor-maine-recap/

 

 

Apr 01, 2008 11:36 AM
#1
Joe Virnig
RE/MAX Gold Coast REALTORS, Ventura County, California - Ventura, CA
No Ordinary Joe

I have to say that if I knew about the neighbor, I'd disclose it.  A friend told me about a similar case where a guy in a condo complex harrassed them continuously about HOA violations, groundless noise complaints, etc.  She told the real estate agent and he said not to disclose it.  They and the real estate agent were sued for non-disclosure after escrow closed.  They lost.

Apr 01, 2008 11:39 AM
Beth Anderson
Goedert Real Estate - Tecumseh, MI
Realtor - Tecumseh / Lenawee County

Interesting case.  I don't believe that the buyer can win such a lawsuit, but I would never have thought that McDonalds would get in trouble for hot coffee so what do I know :)  I think it is too much to put on a seller to be expected to disclose annoying neighbors as well as leaking roofs.  The next thing would be neighbors suing for slander when they drop into the open house, pick up the info and read a seller's disclosure that has them labeled as mentally disturbed for all the world to see.  Where is the line?  Where ever it is, I hope they never require me to draw it.  

Apr 01, 2008 11:47 AM
Nathan Diones
Regioncy Real Estate - Redlands, CA
Very interesting. Thanks for sharing.
Apr 01, 2008 11:58 AM
Liz Moras Migic
Chilliwack, BC
Chilliwack, British Columbia - Realtor

Hmmm very interesting because it is very subjective....I can relate on 2 levels:

1.) MY neighbour!  Drives me nuts........we live in a strata townhome (I almost said 'daycare' lol)

It seems to me they do renno's 24/7, a 24 hr day care, park vehicles blocking my garage and chain smoke outside their door......to name a few.....does it affect my enjoyment of my own property?  You bethca!........My alternative - is probably to move...but ...

2.) Clients - I was showing them a series of townhomes, until we finally came across one they wanted to write an offer on.  As we were sitting in my car in the driveway........someone came out of the neighbours place.......started yelling, came up to my car and started banging on the  window........and appeared to be drooling/salivating.......I don't know........but it totally freaked my clients out and turned them off purchasing there.......and I don't blame them.  Then again, the neigbhour could have been a visitor, had some sort of health issues.......perhaps been in respite care, or something like that...but we'll never know.  I called the realtor......she said she didn't know anything about it........that she would call her clients and get back to me....and I never heard back from her.

It does make you think though.   How often do we interview the neighbours before we buy?  You never know who your neighbours are going to be.....I mean you may 'at the moment' ...but that could change at any time..........they move........?  And then..........there is no screening process after .........as neighbours...we don't get to read their resumes!  smile

Apr 01, 2008 12:02 PM
Donna Yates
BHGRE - Metro Brokers - Blue Ridge, GA
Blue Ridge Mountains

The rule I follow, if you have to ask whether or not to disclose, then the answer is to disclose.  I love the one about tube socks and birkenstocks.  I must admit, I have been known to do this but only in an emergency situation when my feet are extremely cold and I already have on socks but need to grab a pair of shoes, preferably my birkenstocks to run outside to catch my dog before she makes a break for it.  I hope that excuse grants me some forgiveness!  LOL

Apr 01, 2008 12:12 PM
Show4you Realty Redefining Full Service with our Limo
Show4you Realty - La Canada, CA

Look it seems in this country we are always finding a reason to sue others. It is called not taking responsibility for our own actions. I mean the McDonalds case is proof. I can't even believe that went to court..but it did. Anytime that something goes wrong we as a society are quick to yell "sue".

I see both sides of this story. The guys real estate agent knew that he would not be able to sell the house if they disclosed about the neighbor. That is why they didn't.  I feel for both parties. It sounds like the lady next door needs some help! She is really causing problems for everyone.

I really would like to know how this story plays out.

Apr 01, 2008 12:26 PM
Melina Tomson
Tomson Burnham, llc Licensed in the State of Oregon - Salem, OR
Principal Broker/Owner, M.S.

Joe-I think in some states you are required to disclose nuisances. Not in Oregon. There would be no legal basis for a lawsuit here (not that that has stopped people in the past).

Beth-that is a good point.  Would it be slander if you said your neighbor was mentally ill or a nut case, when they did not have an official diagnosis...

Liz-Now, if you are going to have to disclose anything about your neighbors, them being chain smokers would be one. At least smoking has known health implications.

A couple of years ago I had an agent get upset that I didn't tell her buyer about the barking dogs...Now the dogs bark every time you are on the property.  You can't miss it.  She was from a nuisance neighbor disclosure state and I just needed to let her know that we aren't required to disclose those things here.  Interestingly, the sellers also had dogs, so they didn't consider the barking a nuisance...Who's right?

Apr 01, 2008 02:00 PM
Steve Loynd
Alpine Lakes Real Estate Inc., - Lincoln, NH
800-926-5653, White Mountains NH
I think the initial disclosure act was a way to insist sellers tell potential buyers of physical characteristics of the home, structural, and mechanicals systems. How can you be responsible for a abutters mental illness I can't believe a case could be settled against the prior owner.
Apr 03, 2008 12:23 AM
Marchel Peterson
Results Realty - Spring, TX
Spring TX Real Estate E-Pro
Melina, I had no idea that there were states that would require you disclose nuisances.  That seems VERY SUBJECTIVE!  What I think is a nuisance might not be to someone else.  I can't believe that the police would just let that woman rant like that.  It seems like maybe she should have been in some kind of therapy but instead they sue the prior owner; that's unreal.  One of the problems with our court system are these frivulous lawsuits. 
Apr 03, 2008 03:12 PM
Melina Tomson
Tomson Burnham, llc Licensed in the State of Oregon - Salem, OR
Principal Broker/Owner, M.S.

Steve:  I agree. What if she was stable on meds and then had an episode and then was stable again. If she is stable at the time of sale, but then goes off her meds two weeks after is the seller liable for not telling the buyer that she might go off her meds and be a nuisance??

Marchel:  I hope the judge in this case realizes the importance of this lawsuit. He is setting precedence for real estate transactions. The issue with this case is that Arizona has a line item on their disclosure forms about "nuisances."  I am interested to see where the judge draws the line with mental illness.  Mental illness is a protected disability under ADA, but she wasn't involved in the real estate transaction.

Apr 03, 2008 03:43 PM
Anonymous
california girl

what about smoking?  neighbors who's cigarette smoke enters another's condo unit every time they light up? 

which can be up to every 45 minutes when they are home.

should that be disclosed in a sale?  and if so, wouldn't it decrease the number of potential buyers, especially

in california?  and if that is the case, what to do about the smoking nuisance?

Aug 13, 2008 10:09 AM
#12
Melina Tomson
Tomson Burnham, llc Licensed in the State of Oregon - Salem, OR
Principal Broker/Owner, M.S.

CA Girl, I don't know if CA is a nuisance state or not. In Oregon, you would not have to disclose this. 

Yes, out here if you disclosed that, you would limit your pool of buyer's significantly.

Aug 13, 2008 12:52 PM