No, I Did Not Lie...

By
Real Estate Broker/Owner with Daytona Condo Realty, 386-405-4408

The email, which hit my computer, stated that I provided incorrect information on my website. The author claimed that in my description of one of South Daytona condos I had minimum rental period of 1 month, however, when she called the City of South Daytona, they told her that minimum rental period in the city was 6 months.

Can it be that Declaration of Condominium has 1 months, and the City – 6 months? Theoretically yes. City Code of Ordinances trumps the Declaration of Condominium and if this is the case, then I might be wrong.

So, I am calling the City of South Daytona. I am transferred a couple of times, and finally “the right person” tells me that yes, it is 6 months. He immediately started explaining to me that it is unfair to neighbors when someone rents on weekly basis… 

If there is a regulation, then there is a regulation, and one does not need to justify it. So, I asked him if this is written anywhere in the City Code of Ordinances. He said “no”. So I continued by asking what would happen to any owner, who rents for shorter than 6 months period of time. Would there be a fine?

There was not.

The official simply said that “they” (implying the City) wished it were 6 months. This is funny. If the City really wants something, they vote and change it in the Code of Ordinances. Here we had only a wish, but not a regulation.

But if you call them on the phone and ask them whether there is a city-wide minimum rental requirement, they (at least this official) would say “yes" even though there is none.

So no, I did not provide wrong information. That condo restriction of 1 month minimum is correct.

Telephone converstaion

P.S. Actually, if the City adopts a more restrictive rental period, I believe, it should not affect the existing owners, as the State law prohibits changing the rental terms for the owners, which were in possession of dwelling at time of change, so they would only affect those who buy dwellings after the change, or existing owners, who agree to be the new limit in writing. And it is all because the State Law trumps any City law and regulation.

Life is never boring...

Image by Andrew Wippler via Flikr.com

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Rainmaker
1,028,953
Sam Shueh
(408) 425-1601 - San Jose, CA
mba, cdpe, reopro, pe

Put a disclaimer with contact infomation. Try not try to be a hero.

 

Sam Shueh

Aug 27, 2015 12:43 PM #2
Rainmaker
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William Feela
WHISPERING PINES REALTY - North Branch, MN
Realtor, Whispering Pines Realty 651-674-5999 No.

When dealing with multiple agencies some differences can occur.  And many won't budge

Aug 27, 2015 01:21 PM #3
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Tammy Lankford,
Lane Realty Eatonton, GA Lake Sinclair, Milledgeville, 706-485-9668 - Eatonton, GA
Broker GA Lake Sinclair/Eatonton/Milledgeville

WOW, he's actually telling people it's 6 months.  I think I'd have to go over his head.

Aug 27, 2015 01:23 PM #4
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Jon Zolsky, Daytona Beach, FL
Daytona Condo Realty, 386-405-4408 - Daytona Beach, FL
Buy Daytona condos for heavenly good prices

Tammy Lankford - you do not even need to. Just question him, and there is nothing besides the wish. And I would be very surprised if this was not just his wish.

I am afraid that whoever goes over his head, and who makes the superiors kow about his answers, his head might go down :)

Aug 27, 2015 01:43 PM #5
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Jon Zolsky, Daytona Beach, FL
Daytona Condo Realty, 386-405-4408 - Daytona Beach, FL
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William Feela - that's what happens all the time. BEst example is Chapter 718 Florida Statutes, where you can read that no matter how the title was obtained, the new owner is liable for the amount of unpaid Association Dues (loose quote).

However, if you buy at Tax Deed, then you don't own the association back dues. But people read this Chapter and charged the new owner, and some had to pay hefty court costs losing the battle

Aug 27, 2015 01:47 PM #6
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Jon Zolsky, Daytona Beach, FL
Daytona Condo Realty, 386-405-4408 - Daytona Beach, FL
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Sam Shueh - Thanks :)

Aug 27, 2015 01:47 PM #7
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Jon Zolsky, Daytona Beach, FL
Daytona Condo Realty, 386-405-4408 - Daytona Beach, FL
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Kathy Streib - yep, they are the boss :)

Aug 27, 2015 01:48 PM #8
Rainmaker
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Gabe Sanders
Real Estate of Florida specializing in Martin County Residential Homes, Condos and Land Sales - Stuart, FL
Stuart Florida Real Estate

Hi Jon.  I don't think the city (or county) can restrict the rental duration, even by law.  It's something the state now controls by law unless the rental restrictions were in place last year.  (At least that's what my fading memory is telling me.)

Aug 27, 2015 10:02 PM #9
Rainmaker
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Rob Arnold
Sand Dollar Realty Group, Inc. - Altamonte Springs, FL
Metro Orlando Full Service - Investor Friendly & F

Interesting to hear all the various nuances in the cities.  Just because some person wants the law to be on thing does not mean that is the case.  Plenty of people want Obamacare thrown out, but it is the law of the land. 

Aug 28, 2015 03:42 AM #10
Rainmaker
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Marte Cliff
Marte Cliff Copywriting - Priest River, ID
Your real estate writer

Petty bureaucrats - wielding their power. Kind of disgusting, isn't it? I think you should write that in your description: The Condo association says one month, but the City quotes six months because they "wish" that was the law.

Aug 28, 2015 06:41 AM #11
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Jon Zolsky, Daytona Beach, FL
Daytona Condo Realty, 386-405-4408 - Daytona Beach, FL
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I guess I need to clarify the issue. There is no limitation in the City Code of Ordianances. The guy, who I was transfered to, who is repsonsible for licensing rentals (yes, it costs $52.50 a year, and the inspector will come and inspect the property offered for rentals).

The 6 months is his personal wish. I am pretty sure the City did not authorize him to give this information, and I am pretty sure the City Attorney would cringe if he finds out that employees give their own ideas for what the City wants.

basically, it is not the City, but the City employee sayiong something without thinking and without the authority. I could understand if he would say "I wish it were 6 months". And sigh... That would be clear that it is his wish. But the way he said it makes one think that this is the position of the City, and it is extremely unlikely that it is.

If the City wants something, the city gets it.

And yes, the cities and counties have the authority to limit or prohibit rentals.

Aug 28, 2015 09:50 AM #12
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Jon Zolsky, Daytona Beach, FL
Daytona Condo Realty, 386-405-4408 - Daytona Beach, FL
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Gabe Sanders - of course, they can. Remember St. Petersburg did it a few years ago? Latest was Flagler County. There was a time, when State prohibited municipalities and Counties to touch rentals, Flagler County fought for 2 years, and they won.

Locals are getting back their right to handle rentals.

Aug 29, 2015 12:30 AM #13
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Jon Zolsky, Daytona Beach, FL
Daytona Condo Realty, 386-405-4408 - Daytona Beach, FL
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Rob Arnold very true. The guy's problem is that he is voicing his wish, but it comes as if this is the City's wish. he simply took too much upon himself

Aug 29, 2015 12:32 AM #14
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Jon Zolsky, Daytona Beach, FL
Daytona Condo Realty, 386-405-4408 - Daytona Beach, FL
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Marte Cliff - that's an interesting suggestion. Very tempting, but I am trying to avoid doing it. The reason being is that these people with wishes come and go, and what I wrote on my page on the website could become obsolete tomorrow, and I would not know. I could easily end up with wrong information, as whoever would call the City would get another person answering the phone and that person may say that no, they have no regulation regarding minimum rental period.

I have a similar problem with showing maintenance fee on my pages. Maintenance fee may change every year, and with over 200 condos, I risk having outdated intformation, and plus, put on myself a pressure to verify the maintenance fee for each building, which would take a long time, especially because smaller complexes do not have on-site managers, and you really have to hunt them. I am not even talking about condo associations changing companies, which makes it even trickier.

Aug 29, 2015 12:39 AM #15
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Jon Zolsky, Daytona Beach, FL
Daytona Condo Realty, 386-405-4408 - Daytona Beach, FL
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Gabe Sanders - thank you for the link in the email. Very-very interesting. Actually they reference Al Hadeed, the attorney for Flagler County. I remember relatively recently reading that they won, and now there are some restrictions on rentals in Flagler County. Also, in Flalger Beach some streets are allowed rentals, and some are not. This is for a long time, not something new. Were they grandfathered? I do not know.

I read the Advisory once, but I am not that smart, so I will have to read it again and again. And I will. There are dates there, 2011, 2014, and I did not figure what can or can't be grandfathered. Also, for lodging facilities here the municipality uses the definition of transient from Chapter 310.2 of the Florida Building Code, and it is not more than 30 days, and this is confusing as we have snowbirds, that come for 3 months and this is still vacation use in nature

Thank you again, very thoughtful of you.

Aug 29, 2015 02:03 AM #16
Rainmaker
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Gabe Sanders
Real Estate of Florida specializing in Martin County Residential Homes, Condos and Land Sales - Stuart, FL
Stuart Florida Real Estate

The only reason I am familiar with this is because Vero Beach tried to restrict rentals to over one month and were shot down by the State just last year.  Also, it's becoming an issue with AirBnB and online rentals.

Aug 29, 2015 02:14 AM #17
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Jon Zolsky, Daytona Beach, FL
Daytona Condo Realty, 386-405-4408 - Daytona Beach, FL
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Gabe Sanders - this is interesting. I believe the regulation in St. Petersburg is still unchanged. However, it was prior to 2011, and this may mean something, not sure. What they did, as far as I was told, is that properties directly on the golf could rent short term, and those across the stret, unless they are Hotels/Motels, couldn't do it.

Aug 29, 2015 02:20 AM #18
Rainmaker
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Marte Cliff
Marte Cliff Copywriting - Priest River, ID
Your real estate writer

Jon - You're right. It's probably best to just state the condo rules and say that city regulations may differ. 

Aug 29, 2015 03:58 AM #19
Rainmaker
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John Cunningham
eXp Realty - Phoenix, AZ
Helping Phoenix Sellers and Buyers find each other

"wished it were 6 months". I love that part

Aug 29, 2015 08:15 AM #20
Rainmaker
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Inna Ivchenko
Barcode Properties - Encino, CA
Realtor® • Green • GRI • HAFA • PSC Calabasas CA

Life is never boring. But it is good to have such notes. It keeps us on the toes:) Only the best bloggers will go extra mile to find the truth.

Aug 30, 2015 04:34 PM #21
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