Fingerprinting and Notarizing Docs in Real Property Transactions

I think your answer was appropriate.  However, it has always puzzled me as how a doc can be pre-signed in some states before the actual notarization is completed.  I know in most cases that the ID is used to verify the signature, however it seems to place a notary in a sticky situation.  As a safeguard, I think I would ask the person to sign again...

In Michigan we don't have to get fingerprints for anything, but pre-signed documents? I don't think you can notarize such a document in any state. Anybody live in such a state?

I am not sure about all states, but I believe in most states, an acknowledgement is just that, they acknowledge they signed the document at their own free will, and of course, appear to be willing & capable - so they do NOT need to sign in from of you, BUT, THEY MUST STILL APEAR BEFORE YOU, and you must take normal ID steps, and anything else your state requires.  I also clearly ask them if they in fact signed the document - don't think that is a requirement, but CYA & I think that is prudent.  In FL, a log is not required, but foolish not to do in my opinion - I log every notarization with fingerprint every time.  If they refuse, in FL I can't refuse the notarization, BUT I can then ask for additional ID, which has only happened once in about 800 loans, and roughly 4-500 other notarizations.  A Jurat, says "subscribed and sworn to" so they MUST not only sign in front of you, but you must give them an oath, and then again anything else your state requires.  I hope that answers your question. 

In TN -- if it is an aknowledgement it can be legally notarized without being signed in front of the notary. It only has to be "acknowledged" to the notary that the person did sign it.

Personally, I have them re-sign it. Never too safe.

As for not getting the fingerprint--if they are in a state required that in 2005, on the date of the notarizing, then it is very possible the notary is in some trouble.

That's exactly what I would have said. Also, I get fingerprints for everything. I carry a small case of baby wipes with me so I don't leave anybody with a residue-covered thumb.

Have a good one,

Dennis

I get a thumbprint, as well, for every notary act I perform.  This way, it remains habitual, and it is one less thing that I have to determine as to what is appropriate or not for the notarization.  For me, it is my additional duty to deter fraud and obtaining a thumbprint indicates to the signer that there is a viable record of their appearance before me.  In California, it IS THE LAW that Trust Deeds, deeds, quit claims, and deeds of trust affecting real property require a thumbprint in the notary journal.                                                                                                    

Cheryl Lee Anderson

Like Cheryl, I ALWAYS get a fingerprint unless they refuse for every transaction.  In three years, I've only had three refusals, so I asked for additional ID.  In FL, not only is fingerprint not required, a notarial log is not either.  But I was trained well right in the beginning!!