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Ask An Ambassador: Missing The Point of Points

By
Real Estate Agent with Transaction Alliance 513.520.5305 www.LizTour.com SAL.2002007747

Points are a genius idea...and the bane of this community.

The philosophy behind points is pretty straight forward:

Do the RIGHT things in the community to participate and you get a reward of points that helps the Type A competitive types track their progress up the Leaderboard, gaining at city, county, state and overall rankings.

Legitimate comments of 50 or more characters come with points and reward you for the opportunity to build relationships with fellow Rainers (and maybe a referral later?).

Posts of 50 words or more (for the first 10 posts of the week) provide 225 points, and if you pick your topics to provide what consumers want, you may get found and gain business.

Challenges/contests typically are associated with doing something that promotes a good habit (write consumer facing posts, write relationship building posts, etc.).

At the beginning, points are like the training wheels on a bike, they help you develop good balance and encourage participation.  Strive to hit 500,000 points and gain a FREE Rainmaker account. 

After a certain time (e.g. passing 500,000), points SHOULD be extraneous, you do the participation things in this community because you KNOW they're the right thing to do.  You may post less, you may comment less, but your participation is driven by purpose and not points.

So why are points also the bane of the community?

Because sometimes the pursuit of points supersedes the INTENT behind gaining points.  Points are there to encourage good participation, not as an end all, be all reason for doing something in this community, especially if you've already passed 500,000 points.

Maybe it should be a "keep your eyes on your own paper" moment as Susan Emo likes to say, but it does personally irk me to see generic comments that are obviously cut and pasted time after time:

"Thank you for sharing the real estate information.
Buyers and sellers in your area will benefit from your expertise."

What I believe any creator of content would want is some indication that you actually READ the post, and demonstrate that in your comment.  That's the social pact.  Someone writes, someone comments. 

For example, if you're going to comment on a market report, mentioning the geographic area, the agent's name, even a particular fact from within the market report will give a clear indication you actually did read the post, and are willing to take a shot at boosting the post's SEO a bit (yes, comments get indexed too!). 

Good faith commenting potentially leads to relationships, and perhaps business or other assistance when needed.

Serial commenting?  Most people that work hard on writing their posts will add a serial commenter name to their "I'll refer to them when Hades freezes over" list.  It's a lost opportunity sacrificed at the altar of Points for Points sake.

Points, love 'em or hate 'em, they're a key part of this community.  How you go about gaining them says a lot about you and how you handle your day to day business.

Until next Tuesday, just Ask An Ambassador if you need help,

Bill & Liz aka BLiz

Posted by

Serving Warren County Ohio & Adjacent Areas

The Liz Spear Team of Transaction Alliance
Elizabeth Spear, ABR, Ohio License SAL.2002007747

William (Bill) Spear, Ohio License SAL.2004011109  Kentucky 77938
Ask for us by name if you visit the office!

EHO
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Comments(28)

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Kat Palmiotti
eXp Commercial, Referral Divison - Kalispell, MT
Helping your Montana dreams take root

Points can be a heck of a lot of fun to see increasing, especially when we get to go to the ActiveRain store to turn them in. :-) 500K was the big goal for me way back when - I wanted that free account! And then I thought it would be cool to break a million. I don't have any point goals anymore.

As for the cut/paste comments, sigh. They aren't helpful to anyone including the person leaving them.

Dec 19, 2023 06:29 AM
Kat Palmiotti

Haha, that would be great!

Dec 20, 2023 04:33 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

Maybe we could both cash in for that shiny new greenhouse?!!

Dec 19, 2023 09:14 PM
Charita Cadenhead
eXp Realty - Birmingham, AL
Serving Jefferson and Shelby Counties (Alabama)

Bill, Bill, Bill, Bill, Bill, Bill, Bill. You hit the nail on the proverbial head. Where's that love button. This is beyond a "like." The points for me used to serve as motivation to keep going and not so much for the sake of just gaining points.

With regard to comments, as I've made my way back to AR for the umpteenth time, I have been increasingly frustrated by the generic comments. Debe Maxwell, CRS made a comment on one of my older posts this morning. She said that she missed the days of 100'ish comments and so do I. The difference is that back in the day, and you know this to be true Bill, we ENGAGED. We didn't just read. We wholeheartedly engaged with one another with the utmost sincerity and interest. I really hate those cut and pasted comments and it's been crossing my mind to just ignore and not acknowledge them. I'm not there yet, but I'm very tempted. I would much rather someone not comment at all than to make a thoughtless comment or a cut and paste. I'll be the first to admit that not all of my posts are interesting, but I've been around here long enough to not be disappointed if people don't comment. Thanks for writing this Bill. I wanted to but I figured that since I'm just getting back in the fold, I’d better not.

Dec 19, 2023 06:49 AM
Kat Palmiotti

Charita Cadenhead - I've lately been ignoring those comments - the commenter(s) won't come back and read the response anyway.

Dec 19, 2023 09:48 AM
Charita Cadenhead

Kat Palmiotti I'm right there with you.  I have made the decision to not ignore, but I will acknowledge with a "like."  Beyond that, I'm unlikely to respond to a comment that is blatantly generic.  I know it may sound ugly, but I can't image that even those who make generic comments, don't experience the same frustration when it happens to them.

Dec 19, 2023 09:54 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

Agreed across the board with both of you.  Without some punitive impact (and with no Kerrie/Bob to slap the hands), serial comments gonna be serial commenters.  Find someone with lots of old market reports, cut/paste 25 times in rapid succession and 5 minutes later comment points are maxed out, all without having to actually read the posts!

Dec 19, 2023 09:18 PM
faye schubert
Retired - Branson, MO
Living the Branson Lake Life

The posts and commenting on the posts INSPIRE me and the point system MOTIVATES me. 

Dec 19, 2023 07:07 AM
Charita Cadenhead

Ditto faye schubert.  As they should.

Dec 19, 2023 09:54 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

It's a chance to learn, get to know each other, have fun, etc.  Cut/paste totally misses the opportunities given.

Dec 19, 2023 09:19 PM
Candice A. Donofrio
Next Wave RE Investments LLC Bullhead City AZ Commercial RE Broker - Fort Mohave, AZ
928-201-4BHC (4242) call/text

Aaaaaahhhhhh . . . I'm just posting grafitti on my wall. LOL 

The day points can be cashed in for dollars, I'll care more. 

 

Dec 19, 2023 07:10 AM
Charita Cadenhead

I literally laughed out loud on your comment. Points/posts for $ is the ultimate goal but we balance that with a little friendly banter as well among ourselves.

Dec 19, 2023 09:56 AM
Candice A. Donofrio

I literally laugh out loud on your comment.

 

My work here is done 😉🤣🎄

Dec 19, 2023 11:34 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

I was just reading an article in Smithsonian, now even graffiti has become a specialized academic field :)

Dec 19, 2023 09:20 PM
Lorrie Semler, REALTOR® in the Dallas area. Call/text 972-416-3417
HomeSmart Stars - Addison, TX
Real Service. Real Results. Real Estate

And let's not forget the bloggers who post DAILY with NOTHING more than market statistics. It's being done only for the points. It would be lovely every once in a while (or more often) to see something, anything, from them with more substance. 

I love the points. They keep me motivated. Some day, I'll reach my (for now) goal of climbing to #10 in the state. But bloggers with more points have GOT to stop moving here (I'm looking at you Kathy Streib, lol!

Dec 19, 2023 07:17 AM
Charita Cadenhead

Lorrie, in my opinion the bloggers that only post daily with nothing more than market statistics are solely focused on generating business.  I can't be made a them for that.  When people search for market statistics in areas of interests, the AR blogger that consistently post statistics will rank higher in searches and generate business.  Quite frankly, I should be doing more of those. While we may not have the same point of view on this, I respect your position.

Uh oh Kathy Streib better watch out (lol). 

Dec 19, 2023 10:00 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

I concur with Charita's assessment, the templated market reports do serve a purpose, and can't hurt the SEO for this site, but I am glad we're past the days where they could mass blog page after page after page...

Dec 19, 2023 09:22 PM
Jan Green - Scottsdale, AZ
Value Added Service, 602-620-2699 - Scottsdale, AZ
HomeSmart Elite Group, REALTOR®, EcoBroker, GREEN

So many great comments here. I'll keep it short.  In the beginning points ruled the day, but I still tried mightily to write something worth reading.  These days, points aren't the reason for writing.  My inspiration to write has waned, darn it.  Today's inspiration is a funeral, now that's sad!  Agree with all about the copy and paste crowd - zero engagement so zero interest in responding to those comments. 

Dec 19, 2023 09:49 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

Funerals can be a time of self-reflection and if a spark of a blog post comes from it, that's understandable.

Dec 19, 2023 09:24 PM
Jeffrey DiMuria 321.223.6253 Waves Realty
Waves Realty - Melbourne, FL
Florida Space Coast Homes

I like the idea of points, I hate the idea of contests...especially those that give you more points than ten well written posts. It might discourage many from writing. 

Dec 19, 2023 10:14 AM
Charita Cadenhead

I like the points and the contests for a variety of reasons.  However, I kind of got burned out on contest years ago when I participated heavily in the 30 day challenges (aka 30DCs).  I'm hoping that I get that mojo back and start participating in the contests and challenges again.  One thing about, we can pick and choose what we participate in and that's the great thing about AR.

Dec 19, 2023 01:21 PM
Liz and Bill Spear

Usually there's a key nugget/behavior being reinforced with contests/challenges, so I'm okay with the extra points because that's what gets the largest portion of this community to pay attention and play.  If they develop better blogging habits as a result, then an extra 3000 points are well invested points.

Dec 19, 2023 09:26 PM
Paddy Deighan MBA JD PhD
http://www.medicalandspaconsulting.com - Vail, CO
Paddy Deighan J.D. Ph.D

I thought this was a fantastic post...very thoughtful and thorough and you made very good points!!!

Dec 19, 2023 09:53 PM
Liz and Bill Spear

No pun intended?? LOL!!  I try :)

Dec 20, 2023 10:41 AM
Laura Cerrano
Feng Shui Manhattan Long Island - Locust Valley, NY
Certified Feng Shui Expert, Speaker & Researcher

They can be a little bit anxiety inducing, but you just kind a half that one with it in my estimation.

Dec 19, 2023 11:31 PM
Liz and Bill Spear

They are what they are, I have other sources of anxiety that rank higher than AR's point system.

Dec 20, 2023 10:41 AM
Alan May
Jameson Sotheby's International Realty - Evanston, IL
Home again, home again...

The points done brought me in, the points done kept me here, and the points done pushed me away.  God bless the points.  Hallelujah!

Dec 20, 2023 05:51 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

Points, schmoints...

Dec 20, 2023 10:42 AM
Wanda Kubat-Nerdin - Wanda Can!
Red Rock Real Estate (435) 632-9374 - St. George, UT
The best agent in Southern Utah!

Fly by commenting is a less than sincere form of participation but yet it continues by the point collectors and am glad that only 10 posts per day shows up in the roll feed, that curtailed the robo-posters. Some copy/paste commenting has now been replaced with AI prose that more than fulfills the minimum amount of words to get credit. 

Points aren't the most important aspect of being here, Bliz. Fantastic post, thank you for that!

Dec 20, 2023 07:40 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

Yep, I don't know how (or if) AR will even address AI generated content.  Points don't pay my bills, and for me personally if points stopped being awarded, I'd continue doing what I do.  But I do understand the motivating purpose of them for some members, especially starting out and working towards the free membership.

Dec 20, 2023 10:44 AM
Kathleen Daniels, Probate & Trust Specialist
KD Realty - 408.972.1822 - San Jose, CA
Probate Real Estate Services

Hello Bill Liz and Bill Spear - it truly is about engagement for me. Before joining AR it never occurred to me that I could connect with people I've not met in person the way I have with people here in the AR community. 

So many offline conversations ... so many friendships created ... so many referrals sent out ... so many referrals received ... so much trust and respect created! 

The Good Old Days live on.  I received an online lead that I referred (an adjacent county I do not serve) out to another AR member I met years ago who no longer participates here. 

Dec 20, 2023 08:44 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

A lot of my real estate relationships have left this community, but the roots started here long after the members left.  They're still my go tos for referrals, and always will be.

Dec 20, 2023 10:45 AM
Ginger Harper
Coldwell Banker Sea Coast Advantage~ Ginger Harper Real Estate Team - Southport, NC
Your Southport~Oak Island Agent~Brunswick County!

LOl.  Good one.

Dec 20, 2023 08:47 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

:)

Dec 20, 2023 10:45 AM
Sheri Sperry - MCNE®
Coldwell Banker Realty - Sedona, AZ
(928) 274-7355 ~ YOUR Solutions REALTOR®

First of all, I didn't even know that points led to a "free account" when I started on the platform.  I paid for this.  It was part of gaining SEO.  After getting to 100,000 points, I noticed that I was paying less each month.  It wasn't until I got to 400,000 points that I figured it out.  That didn't change the way I posted.  

I refer to the generic comment as a "drive-by comment."  This is not something I came up with.  I am sure I read it in another post that was written about points.  It is interesting how many different opinions there are about points.  

I think the powers-to-be did a marvelous job when they came up with the rules for gaining points.

This platform is successful, in part, because of all the thought that the founders put into it.  I commend them for their effort.  

 Most REALTOR®s are competitive, even if it is to enhance their own goals.  Points help me with my own goals. 

I won't disparage others for the way they use or abuse points.  That is their business.   

I do what I can to move forward, help others, and learn from others.  I work hard to make my presence on this platform mean something; to me, points are an incentive to that end.  

Dec 20, 2023 09:38 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

Agreed, points are a genius motivation for agents starting out in the community.  What I don't get is if someone is at 3 million, 4 million, etc. that points are still the motivator for doing what they do, especially when what they do denies engagement with other community members.

When you do as you do (write quality posts, leave quality comments), then I think Leaderboard ranking is worthy. 

I don't find worthy is someone dropping 25 cut/paste comments in 5 minutes every day on multiple year old market reports just to easily get their daily point quotas.  There's nothing for me to respect in that behavior.

Dec 20, 2023 10:48 AM
Jeff Dowler, CRS
eXp Realty of California, Inc. - Carlsbad, CA
The Southern California Relocation Dude

Well said, Bill. And a great discussion ensued as a result. No drive by comments on this post, I bet.

Thankfully the abusers of the points system seem to be in the minority. And there have been issues as long as I've been a member. People who abuse the system are missing the true value of being here and actively engaging, sharing, and learning.

Great post BTW (LOL).

Jeff

 

Dec 20, 2023 02:13 PM
Liz and Bill Spear

Jeff, no doubt, a long time issue and will continue to be so in the future barring some surprising change...public shaming in the ActiveRain community square would appear to not be approved any time soon :)

Dec 20, 2023 07:52 PM
Lisa Friedman
Great American Dream Realty - Essex, VT
35 Years of Real Estate Experience!

I think the points were a great idea at the beginning when it was a new platform as it motivated people to product content and race to be in the Top Ten in your state. I think the points for a new agent are sort of a disincentive as someone new has virtually no chance of being at the top with so many people who have been doing it for years.

Also, there are thousands of people who got to the Top Fifty in their state who are no longer on the platform or no longer in business, retired, etc. who have those coveted top spots. I always look to Active Rain first when giving referrals searching first by city and then expanding to county, but have found that a lot of those people are no longer doing a lot of business so they seem to just be taking up space on the leaderboard.

I just searched the Top Ten agents on the leaderboard in my state. Most haven't made a post in over seven years.

Dec 20, 2023 06:58 PM
Liz and Bill Spear

It's a catch-22, those points were earned, and the leaderboard would only be found by other community members. It can give me a starting point, but not an endorsement that someone is worthy of a referral.  What I do like, even if a member isn't currently active, is that their past posts provide insight into personality and style.  There may be enough there to either eliminate, or give reason to further screen.

At one point I knew there was some chatter about filtering the Leaderboard into one of Active members (however Active is determined) and the overall Leaderboard.  I don't expect that to happen.

As far as gaining on a Leaderboard, I once never thought I could move to #1 in Ohio, but the leader quit blogging and the new #1 eventually got himself ejected.  I don't blog or comment so often that someone behind me couldn't surpass my total in time if that was their goal.  It wouldn't be quick, but it could be done.

Dec 20, 2023 07:56 PM
Dorie Dillard Austin TX
Coldwell Banker Realty ~ 512.750.6899 - Austin, TX
NW Austin ~ Canyon Creek and Spicewood/Balcones

Good evening Bill,

Well as you said  "serial comments gonna be serial commenters." We can't punish them but they sure are annoying because they are so disingenuous! 

Dec 21, 2023 07:33 PM
Liz and Bill Spear

Dorie, no argument here.  It's irksome to see people climbing the Leaderboard when you know they're violating the INTENT, if not exactly the rules, of points.

Dec 21, 2023 08:27 PM
Ed Silva, 203-206-0754
Mapleridge Realty, CT 203-206-0754 - Waterbury, CT
Associate Real Estate Broker

The serial members have always been here. How can you not remember that oldie but goodie:

Thank you for your post. I learn so much here on ActiveRain.

Or the member that had 2 accounts just so he could get points quicker and re-blog between the 2.

Dec 22, 2023 12:03 PM
Liz and Bill Spear

Ed, I've certainly seen some maneuvers over the years to amp up point totals.

Dec 25, 2023 08:03 PM
Roy Kelley
Retired - Gaithersburg, MD

Thank you very much for sharing your perspective on points.

I will admit that I do not always read market reports from other parts of the country when I reciprocate with comments. However, I do share many of those reports on X (Twitter) just to help the blogger. 

Dec 23, 2023 08:00 AM
Liz and Bill Spear

Roy, Sounds like you make up for that with the X shares.

Dec 25, 2023 08:03 PM
Elyse Berman, PA
LoKation Real Estate - Boca Raton, FL
Boca Raton FL (561) 716-7824

I never really paid that much attention to the points.  That's probably crazy, but I went at my own pace.  I remember talking to someone who figured out I could get to a million points by December if I did this and this.  Well, I didn't.  I eventually got there but it was a few years later.  If I'm going to read the post, I'm going to comment on it.  I dislike the cut and paste routine.

Dec 24, 2023 05:42 PM
Liz and Bill Spear

I went fast for quite a while, now it's what happens, happens, and when it happens may take a LONG time.

Dec 25, 2023 08:04 PM