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Mortgage Advice: When Advertising is Misleading, this AD's numbers don't ADD up!

By
Real Estate Agent with THE PODGURSKY GROUP @ Re/Max Direct

I saw a great advertisement today for the new ING Direct Mortgage plan.

Click on the graphic to see their banner ad:

 ING DIRECT MORTGAGE BANNER

 

 

"WOW!! A 5.50% INTEREST RATE" you say.  Let's jump on that one!!!

HOLD YOUR HORSES

What's BOLDED next to RATE??  6.39% APR... and $895 Closing Costs...

OK... so how did we get from 5.50% all the way up to 6.39%?  That's a 0.89% jump!! 

Let me tell you this... from my experience as a Mortgage Broker - there is no such thing as $895 creating 0.89% difference in the APR and RATE without some major hidden costs.

What does that mean?? That means that just like ANY OTHER BANK - there are costs in the rate besides the $895 Closing Costs

How can that be??  Well... Lenders - Direct Lenders - don't have to disclose all their fees up front like a Mortgage Broker does.  They can hide them in the rate and APR until closing!!

So... let's just run a $200,000 mortgage through my Loan Origination Software and figure out how much is tacked onto that loan to come up with 6.39% APR from 5.50% Rate.

In the meantime, here's the graphic that  starts the "CATCH"... click on it to see it full size

 

 

 

First of all... quoting AVERAGE Closing Costs does not really help consumers. Plus this is BankRate.com info which is notoriously unreliable as they hide fees in their ads all the time. 

On a $200,000 loan in Florida, just Title Insurance will be $1075!  Add in Attorney Fees and Notary Fees and you've got at least another $300.  Add in State Endorsements and Transfer Taxes for another $1350.  Wow... We've already reached $2,725 and we've just started!

Does this mean Mortgage Brokers have higher fees??

  • NO - it means we disclose all fees!!
  • It means we show you how we got to our numbers without showing you a gimmick
  • and it means that BankRate is either not disclosing or not counting all fees in their surveys!

So, back to my other window... my software has ruled this:

5.50% Rate on 30year Fixed Rate Mortgage... add $895 closing costs and your APR is......(drumroll please)

  • 5.532%!!!..... still 0.86% unaccounted for!

So... I adjusted for the 5/1 ARM that they're advertising and had to make some assumptions to make this fit.

  • I assumed that after 5 years, the adjustment would be no more than 1% - given that I know that most rate caps are higher than 1%, this is a tough one. 
  • Then... I assumed that the rate hike every 12 months after that would be capped at ... a startling 0.21%!
  • Then... I assumed a total interest cap of 1.5% (1 in the first adjustment and .25% more for the rest of the loan)...meaning only slightly more than 2 adjustments would actually occur.
  • THEN and only then, I came up with the 6.389% APR for the Loan.

Now... maybe I'm just not as good at these calculations as some of my fellow Mortgage Brokers ... and maybe I just don't know programs as well as they do either...but my feeling is that this is just not a realistic assumption to make.  I make it a habit of not ASSUMING anything... and I would never assume that I could find an ADJUSTABLE RATE that would adjust that little FOR THE LIFE OF THE LOAN.

Now... perhaps an assumption of ING would be that NO ONE would adjust!!  That every person in this loan would refinance at month 60 and that all their mortgage originators would be on the phone converting ALL their clients just in time!

  • Whoa... that brings me someplace totally different!  I had to add $21,925 to the Good Faith Estimate to get the Truth In Lending form to calculate this loan to 6.39% APR
  • $21,925??? that's one heck of a buy down!!
  • Back to the 30 year Fixed Model - $21,925 in fees would make this WELL BEYOND predatory lending in the State of Florida

I know that I'm going to get someone stopping me here so let me preface the comments with - THIS IS A FLAWED MODEL. 

What's going on here?!

  • First, the scenario they show does not work without some major tinkering...
  • Now the new formula of refinancing at the end of the 5th year and basing the program on a 30year fixed scenario doesn't work without some major closing costs.

Where did the Fees go??

Look... this is a very rudimentary analysis and I'm sure some of my fellow mortgage pros will comment in some of the flies in my ointment... and I'm sure some of the LENDERS out there will add their $0.02 even though they don't like this kind of news being put out there.

The long and the short of my exercise is just to show that ADVERTISEMENTS DON'T ALWAYS ADD UP.

My advice:

  • always be able to call your loan officer/mortgage broker any time you need them (within reason). 
  • always know where your loan is actually originating... people that are going to pull the wool over your eyes don't want to run into you at the grocery store
  • always get the numbers and make sure they are explained properly
  • NEVER let someone promise you the stars and the moon without putting it on paper.
  • NEVER fall for a teaser advertisement for they can almost never be trusted!
  • Rates NEVER work without pulling credit and doing a prequalification - and why would you give that much information to someone who has a pretty banner ad?
  • TRY HARD to work with someone whose hand you can shake at least once in your life.

Just my two cents on another BAD AD!

Check out Lewis Poretz's post No fee mortgages? ah cmon..what's a fee anyway??????????? for something very similar!


More Florida Mortgage and Real Estate News You Can Use From
David A. Podgursky, MBA
The Mortgage Go To Guy
Your Source for Residential, Commercial, Investment and Relocation Mortgages in Florida
Leo Namiot - LeoLends.com
Canopy Mortgage - Leo Namiot - Saint Augustine, FL
More than just great rates
great post, people are always mislead by these types of ads and it makes it very bad for those of us who are honest and really do care about our customers.
May 26, 2007 05:45 AM
David A. Podgursky PA
THE PODGURSKY GROUP @ Re/Max Direct - Boynton Beach, FL
THE PODGURSKY GROUP - Make the Right Move!

Esko & Leo - thanks for the support and the input!

It just shows that there's always someone out there that appears to be better but is actually just working the system to their advantage with their snake oil too...

Rebecca... unilateral is a powerful word and I think the current compliance issues that all smaller brokerages have to deal with is extremely costly.  The issue becomes the enforcement.  Enforcing too much means creativity suffers... it has to be a unilateral effort by brokers to clean up our own industry and bring back the reputation that is so tarnished by all the frauds and snake oil salesmen out there. 

May 27, 2007 03:00 AM
David A. Podgursky PA
THE PODGURSKY GROUP @ Re/Max Direct - Boynton Beach, FL
THE PODGURSKY GROUP - Make the Right Move!

If BANKS that are Nationally Chartered can be in on scamming a client, then what will unilateral regulation do?

the more local the licensing is, the more likely issues are to be ferreted out!!

It is not a FEDERAL case to police everyone in the country - that is why there are local police!  And when they get a federal crime, they pass it up the ladder.

There are already far too few people policing just our state to catch the entire flock of bad eggs...

Quality Control and Unilateral Regulation cannot fit hand in hand.

If you look at Toyota, a star example of quality control, they instill an ethic in their ENTIRE WORKFORCE that encourages each person to take responsibility for the quality control of the entire system.  If you look at Microsoft - people are rewarded for helping solve an issue even if it falls outside of their realm.

You can't Unilaterally regulate/control/license an entire industry without damaging it beyond repair.

Creativity - I have lots of tools, loan program, etc at my fingers... I have the ability to structure a loan CREATIVELY and help advise my clients with what best suits their UNIQUE needs... if the government or anyone tried to Unilaterally Regulate this industry, they'd start by creating conformity in all loan programs.  There would be fewer opportunities for people to finance their homes... and the ones that did exist would have serious limitations.

Just look at the states that say you have to sell off luxury items like big screen TVs before you can get an equity line like Tennessee.

Unilateral anything is Socialist in nature and will not work in a country this large or with as many citizens.  Communism failed for a similar situation

May 27, 2007 02:57 PM
Tchaka Owen
Galleria International Realty - Hollywood, FL

David, your timing is amazing!  I just had a conversation with a nice young lady Friday morning about ING's 5/1 program and explained a lot of what you said.  Their 5/1 has an excellent rate (at least on paper) but the other numbers don't add up.  I mentioned to her how I couldn't understand the significantly higher APR and tried to justify it based on future adjustments (as you did).  What was much more clear is the $895 closing costs - which is really for the 800s only.  Granted that's a good deal for that section of fees, I'm appalled that ING poses that as the total closing costs.  It's easy for us mortgage pros to see through it but everyday customers don't know any better.  My client's a first-time buyer, she has no idea.....she will show up at the settlement table with fees about $5000 higher and wonder what the hell happened.  Not fair to her nor any other customer.

I might even give her the URL to this blog.

Thanks.

- Tchaka 

 

 

 

May 27, 2007 07:26 PM
David A. Podgursky PA
THE PODGURSKY GROUP @ Re/Max Direct - Boynton Beach, FL
THE PODGURSKY GROUP - Make the Right Move!

 

Tchaka - I had one with a Countrywide no cost.. and I laughed in line at BoA when I saw their flyer.  People get suckered in by their banks all the time and just don't know any better.

May 28, 2007 04:19 AM
David A. Podgursky PA
THE PODGURSKY GROUP @ Re/Max Direct - Boynton Beach, FL
THE PODGURSKY GROUP - Make the Right Move!
Tchaka - that will be $599!
May 28, 2007 01:30 PM
Tchaka Owen
Galleria International Realty - Hollywood, FL

Well, a Communist is one who believes in a classless social organization in which the means of production is owned by all.  I don't subscribe to that belief but I can't imagine that it's the worst thing in the world.  I can certainly think of many other words that would cause much greater consternation.

- Tchaka 

May 29, 2007 12:37 PM
Anonymous
sheena24

Hi,

thanku for giving a nice suggestion:)

keep going on!!

 

May 30, 2007 08:36 PM
#44
Shane Sarae
Honolulu, HI

Just my opinion, but I think all originators whether they are brokers or bankers or whatever should have one standard GFE showing ALL fees and YSP/SRP/ETC...time to stop all the BS since there is no such thing as a ZERO point loan with ZERO fees! Anyone ever heard of LIETECH?

May 30, 2007 09:53 PM
Flemington, NJ
I wonder if a rep from ING is a member here to give a clarification on their APR.
Jun 01, 2007 03:23 AM
Tchaka Owen
Galleria International Realty - Hollywood, FL
True.  That would be helpful.
Jun 01, 2007 04:13 AM
Beth Bastian
Rosemont Financial Inc - Simi Valley, CA
Simi Valley Real Estate
If you really thinks is fishy, send it to the DRE with all the errors pointed out.  Let them deal with it.
Jun 04, 2007 01:15 PM
David A. Podgursky PA
THE PODGURSKY GROUP @ Re/Max Direct - Boynton Beach, FL
THE PODGURSKY GROUP - Make the Right Move!

Sheena - thanks!

Shane... that's right... but banks lobby well

Tchaka & Michael... likely it would violate a few contractual agreements of confidentiality and insider secrets

Beth - but it isn't "fishy" it is normal for banks... you go into the branch or call the 800 number and they smile, shake your hand and have an asst teller biopsy your wallet

Jun 04, 2007 03:23 PM
Anonymous
Lisa
David: Why is it so amazing/troubling to have a .89% jump from the base rate to the APR,as ING Direct is advertising? As I look at the other 5/1 ARMS that are compared on various websites, this is a very modest increase. Most are much higher.  
Jun 04, 2007 03:56 PM
#50
JEROME G
White Plains, NY
Great post. I am glad that a lot of people are enlightened. The more educated they are the easier for us "good" mortgage brokers to make business. I am suprised from the responses that many people do not understand APR. Great observation!
Jun 04, 2007 05:20 PM
Tchaka Owen
Galleria International Realty - Hollywood, FL

Lisa, the question that must be posed next is how honest those other websites are.  I would suggest you get rate and corresponding APRs from a few lenders and brokers and see how those stack up.  One of the points in David's post is that he assumes an adjustment of 1% per year after year 5 - which he does admit is an assumption.  Does that mean others show higher APRs because they assume higher adjustments?  That's very possible.  Do the others show higher APRs because there are fees that aren't necessarily being disclosed upfront?  Also very possible.  

- Tchaka 

Jun 05, 2007 01:29 AM
Nathan Fransen
Fransen and Molinaro - Corona, CA

I like your view on this.  it is ironic that the APR is actually supposed to give borrower more clarity...

May 19, 2008 12:16 PM
Chad Wille
Value Shield Financial Services - Windermere, FL

I really enjoyed your post.  I can only hope more and more people in the general public realize that advertising is not always telling the truth and you just proved it.  Obviously this is very misleading. 

May 20, 2008 07:18 AM
Don Draughn - Mortgage Professional
High Point, NC

Just goes to show that you cannot believe everything you read.

May 21, 2008 04:54 AM
Dave Sullivan
Real Estate One - Birmingham, MI
Michigan Realtor with an investor viewpoint

Excellent information I will forward it if that is ok? thank you!!!

Nov 06, 2012 09:20 PM