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Drywall Screw Happy - 1 of 3

By
Home Inspector with Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC 3380-000723

This is new construction, selling for well over $1 million.  It should reflect that in its workmanship and material use.  PROFESSIONALS should be working on this house (as they should on every house, but that is the subject of other blogs). 

I have done enough of these to walk into a house and see where the professionals work and where they don't...

Not only should proper materials be used in their various applications, but they should be installed with best-practice techniques as well.  Why put together something that is not going to last?

To get by cheaply and beyond the warranty period before things fall apart?

Yes, that was cynical.  But, unfortunately, not far from the truth!

This and the next two posts will show three examples of unprofessional work, not employing best practice and using the wrong materials all found during one pre-drywall inspection of the same house. 

THE PEOPLE WORKING ON THIS HOUSE ARE DRYWALL SCREW HAPPY.  That reflects unprofessional work, done by unprofessional people, to get work done unprofessionally quickly and unprofessionally cheaply.  You catch my drift...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Example #1 - the toilet flange. This plastic device is screwed to the floor directly under a toilet.  It directs the flushed water into the plumbing drain, hopefully without a leak.  It also houses the big brass screws you see on each side of the toilet to hold the toilet securely to the floor.  These screws combine with bolts, and are gently tightened under the round plastic caps on each side of your toilet base.  Go look!

Best practice - stainless steel screws!  These are included with the flange in a small plastic bag.  Why?  Because there is water here and the water can leak.  Stainless steel can handle some water, even over time.  Also, the stainless steel screws intentionally come with larger heads which nearly fill the small bowl you see for them to sit in.  You should use a minimum of four for each flange.

Why not drywall screws?  Because --

1.  they are weak and thin and the head can sheer off!

2.  the heads are small and as people try to seat themselves on the toilet it necessarily rocks.  These small heads can snap the plastic and it can literally pop off, as they break the plastic around them.  As someone who has replaced toilets, I have seen this!

And 3.  they rust!  As they rust, they get weaker.  As they rust, they quickly rot the floor around them.  Those are two problems you don't want under a toilet!  Leaking under the tile, and sometimes vinyl, can rot the flooring underneath and show no clue!

Drywall screws are meant for, um, drywall! I looked under each of the toilets (the house is skeletal at this point) and I did not see screws penetrate through the floor under any of the four upper-level toilets!  Not only are they the wrong screws, but too short too! 

But even if these screws were long enough to penetrate through the flooring, they are NOT the right product to use!  EVEN IF YOU USE SIX!

My recommendation:  whenever your clients are buying new construction, get a pre-drywall inspection every time.  That is the only time the house is skeletal and such things as these can be seen.  While we might hope or imagine that on OUR house The Golden Rule is followed, very, very often it is not.

Stay tuned for two more examples of similar unprofessional work, on this very house.

 

 

 

Posted by

Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC  

Based in Bristow, serving all of Northern Virginia.

Office (703) 330-6388   Cell (703) 585-7560

www.jaymarinspect.com


Comments(79)

Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Lyn - a large person, when using the toilet, has a tendency to rock and roll a bit, sitting and standing up afterward.  That puts real pressure on the toilet and its connections.  I'm not joking when I say that drywall screws can be problematic.  They are!

Jeremy - flange kits here come with pretty large stainless steel screws with wide grips.  If they don't the instructions will say to use them.  Drywall screws just can't cut the mustard.

Brenda and Ron - for sure.  If someone thinks the world is interested in the Golden Rule, generally speaking, I think that person may be a bit naive!

Feb 06, 2011 09:14 AM
Lynn B. Friedman CRS Atlanta, GA 404-617-6375
Atlanta Homes ODAT Realty - Love our Great City - Love our Clients! Buckhead - Midtown - Westside - Atlanta, GA
Concierge Service for Our Atlanta Sellers & Buyers

Dear Jay,

I was a licensed General Contractor for 20 years before going into Real Estate. After a few years at a larger national firm, I passed all the Broker exams and started my own Brokerage -- called One Day At a Time!

And that is what I practice ---- a steady caution and concern for detail ---- keeping my philosophy in front of me every time I see my company name.

Needless to say, when with a Client and showing property, that experience really is an asset.  I am constantly appalled when I show expensive homes and see shoddy work.  I asked my client to walk out immediately when we entered one home and the firebrick in the "mega" Living Room fireplace was installed improperly.  We didn't look at anything else about the house.  Why should we?

If the builder couldn't construct the areas that show properly --- what horrors await behind the walls where prospective Buyers cannot see?

Have a happy day -
Lynn

NOTE: My experience is the first "filter" when selecting.  My clients still hire professional home inspectors during the due diligence period.  L.

 

Feb 06, 2011 09:35 AM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Lynn - I like your attitude and the name of the business!  Wondering what we can't see is something home inspectors deal with every day!  And especially on flips and "remodels."  What's being covered up!?

Feb 06, 2011 09:39 AM
Not a real person
San Diego, CA

Just stopping by to invite you to the 2nd Annual ActiveRain Super Bowl Party. Hope you’ll come and bring some friends!

Feb 06, 2011 12:29 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Hi Russel.  It's been a while since you stopped by.

Sorry, I missed this until this morning!  I wasn't on line much yesterday, church stuff in the morning and early afternoon and football stuff later!  Sorry I missed your party.

Did you read my post?

Feb 06, 2011 11:45 PM
Gene Riemenschneider
Home Point Real Estate - Brentwood, CA
Turning Houses into Homes

I used to do contruction defect claims.  It is amazing what you find when the walls are opened up.

Feb 07, 2011 06:20 AM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Well, typically we inspectors can't do that Gene, but in this case they were wide open!

Feb 07, 2011 06:31 AM
Cynthia Larsen
Cotati, CA
Independent Broker In Sonoma County, CA

Jay - someone was smart to hire you for a pre-drywall inspection. Will the contractor be fixing all of the boo-boos? Do you report this stuff to anyone?

Feb 07, 2011 07:12 AM
James Quarello
JRV Home Inspection Services, LLC - Wallingford, CT
Connecticut Home Inspector

Have they hired Uncle Bob as a consultant? A million dollars apparently can't buy quality these days.

Feb 07, 2011 12:36 PM
Diana Mehnert
Coldwell Banker Harris McHaney & Faucette - Bella Vista, AR

I agree with Tim #41, let a licensed plumber do the plumbing work.  Again, another great reason to get a home inspection, pre-drywall inspection on new homes is a must.

Feb 07, 2011 01:41 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Cynthia - I have been doing pre-drywall inspections for about 12 years.  Prior to that they simply weren't done, at least around here.

He does get around Jim.  I run into his work so often, it makes me kind of proud to know him so well...

Diana - how do you know this ISN"T a licensed plumber!?

Feb 07, 2011 10:28 PM
Reuben Saltzman
Structure Tech Home Inspections - Minneapolis, MN
Delivering the Unbiased Truth.

Quit picking on drywall screws. They're good for everything.  Joist hangers, ledgerboards, electric panel covers... everything.

Feb 08, 2011 01:24 PM
Jeremy Wrenn
Winslow Homes - Youngsville, NC
VP of Finance, Winslow Homes

Joist hangers!  Ha!

Feb 08, 2011 02:25 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Well, Reubs, you are right, everything, well, except drywall that is...  I can't tell you how often on inspections I see drywall screws used for drywall!  OK, it's not often at all, well, almost never, but they are really good for that!

Jeremy - he says that because we see'em all the time!

Feb 08, 2011 09:25 PM
Jeremy Wrenn
Winslow Homes - Youngsville, NC
VP of Finance, Winslow Homes

Wow, that's crazy.  Have any collapsed floors been reported yet?

Feb 08, 2011 11:33 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

If you're referring to joist hangers, Jeremy, the screws are usually seen on decks.  But just as bad!  Any decks collapsing lately?  All the time!

Feb 08, 2011 11:35 PM
Jeremy Wrenn
Winslow Homes - Youngsville, NC
VP of Finance, Winslow Homes

I've seen them in deck boards, but never in joist hangers.  That's reallyTRYING to use the wrong screw!

Feb 08, 2011 11:45 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Virtually all uses of drywall screws, Jer, are wrong when not used for drywall!

Feb 08, 2011 11:50 PM
Wayne B. Pruner
Oregon First - Tigard, OR
Tigard Oregon Homes for Sale, Realtor, GRI

That certainly is poor practice. I've seen those flanges nailed down!

Feb 17, 2011 02:54 PM
Jay Markanich
Jay Markanich Real Estate Inspections, LLC - Bristow, VA
Home Inspector - servicing all Northern Virginia

Even better Wayne!  Gee, I hope the used the right nails!   ;>)

Feb 17, 2011 06:35 PM