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BUYER (SELLER, AGENT & BROKER) BEWARE!

By
Real Estate Agent with Coldwell Banker Hobin Realty, LLC - Hampton & Rye, NH, USA

 

WHEN THE GOING GETS TOUGH, THE TOUGH GET CREATIVE!

The other day, I read an post by Glen Gaspar entitled Are some of our fellow agents violating our Code of Ethics? and it got me thinking about what I am seeing in our local MLS.

With the market such as it is... deals have been harder to come by.  I am sure that many of you have thought of some creative ways to get your listings noticed.  My mom always told me: I'm a tea-bag person ... I work best in hot water!  Well, I think many of us are that way.  When times are tough, we get creative in order to make things happen and that's good!  However, I have to wonder ... could some of us have taken it too far?  Don't get me wrong, I'm ALL FOR CREATIVITY, but I have seen some things that I feel in my gut are not ethical.

Please read the following scenarios and let me know what you think:

Scenario #1 ~ Recently, I received an email from a listing agent advertising an open house and new bargain price.  It happened to look like an exceptional deal and was in the price range and area of a buyer that one of our agents was working with.  I forwarded the email to the agent in our office and recommended that he tell his buyer about it.  Well, he was going to be out of town for the weekend, but decided to tell his buyer to go ahead to the open house.  He told her to let the listing agent know that she was working with him as her buyer agent.  (Normally, I wouldn't advise a buyer going on their own, but it seemed like an extremely good deal, so we thought it best that she see it rather than possibly miss out on such a good deal.)  While at the open house, the buyer gets the high-pressure pitch from the listing agent. This doesn't turn her off because she has already fallen in love with the home and is prepared to pay full price.  She meets with her buyer agent and they write up the full price offer.  Well, that wasn't enough!  The listing agent kept pushing for more & more to the point that this (very mild-mannered lady) buyer was nearly put off to the point of walking.  Long story short... she finally closed at several thousand dollars over asking. (and this wasn't a high priced home, it was a starter priced condo) We don't believe that there were other offers as this went on for quite a long time.  Certainly, if there were other buyers they would have just gotten it over with and taken the other offer.  After all was said & done, the listing agent tells the buyer agent that their office attended a seminar where they learned a strategy whereby they list property below market value with no intention of selling it for that price and work people into a frenzy to over-pay.  I thought that was called a "bait & switch".  I do admit that the agent certainly seemed to do a good job for her seller, but at what cost? 

Scenario #2 ~ In reviewing listings to update a market analysis for one of our listings, I noticed a listing that was priced way below the others in this condo association.  At closer inspection, it was noted in the remarks that "seller would entertain offers between $140,000 - $175,000".  Wow... that's quite a range!  Now, it was in the MLS listed at $140,000.  What do you think buyers are going to offer?  Duh!  I questioned whether or not this was against MLS rules.  Certainly seems sketchy to me!  However, after calling and asking the direct questions, I was told that "it does seem very odd, but we don't have rules against it".  I started doing some research and found that there are quite a few listings that are in the computer this way.  Some agencies put in the high end of the range, some put in the middle, but one almost always put in the low end of the range... with the exception of 1 listing that showed up at the high end of the range with the disclosure "broker interest".  Hmmmmmm ... does that seem fishy to anyone else?  I am certain that the idea here is to get as much interest in the property as possible, but I have to question how ethical it really is.  Seems to me that any buyer (and especially in a buyers market) would obviously offer the bottom range or lower - AND - Any Seller that would not really consider an offer at the low end of the range shouldn't have it listed and / or advertised at that price.  So, who is this practice serving?

SO... Buyer, Seller, Agents & Brokers BEWARE!  Know that these strategies are being used and arm yourselves with knowledge so you'll be prepared to deal with these types of strategies. Remember that saying that begins?:  If it sounds too good to be true...

 

Lane Bailey
Century 21 Results Realty - Suwanee, GA
Realtor & Car Guy

Ahh yes, creative marketing...

The first example might actually involve a violation of the NAR Code of Ethics (if the listing agent were a REALTOR(R)), since pressuring the buyer with "other offers" that don't actually exist would not be considered as dealing honestly with all parties.   

Sep 21, 2007 05:29 AM
Anthony Stokes-Pereira
Better Homes and Gardens Rand Realty - Nanuet, NY
Realtor

Hi Katherine,

I think the first in looks like a violation.. I really enjoyed reading your post, I think it is very informative.

Anthony

Sep 21, 2007 05:43 AM
Monika McGillicuddy
Berkshire Hathaway HomeServices Verani Realty - Hampstead, NH
Southern NH & the Seacoast Area

Katherine,

Our company uses the Value Range Marketing and we put in the low price in MLS....which in NH is perfectly okay to do. 

Creative ....yes and once it is understood you'll see it is nothing to be "Beware" about...but rather an other way of marketing. And it is not unethical as well.

 

Mar 11, 2008 08:04 AM
Jay McGillicuddy
Berkshire Hathaway HomeServices Verani Realty - Exeter, NH
Real Estate Broker

Hi Katherine, this is not unethical at all. It is another way of marketing the home. The problem lies within our industry when agents do not understand this type of marketing.

NNEREN recently changed the rules from allowing us to put in the high price to put in the low price. This was due in fact to agencies in both our markets putting auction listings in the MLS at 99,000.

I am providing you links for your review so you may be better informed.

http://www.realtor.org/rmomag.NSF/pages/feat2jan06

http://www.prudentialhomesite.com/marketing.asp

http://lundteam.com/Sellers/ValueRangePrice.aspx

I hope you take a look at these to better understand how Prudential is marketing some of their properties.

 

Mar 11, 2008 08:15 AM
Katherine Anderson
Coldwell Banker Hobin Realty, LLC - Hampton & Rye, NH, USA - Exeter, NH
Managing Broker
Jay & Monica:  Thanks for your comments.  I do understand what value range marketing is and understand the principals behind it.  I also understand that the MLS doesn't have a problem with it because I did call them to ask the question.  I just think that everyone should be fully aware of this practice.  Although it does state in our MLS remarks (in most cases) that the seller is entertaining offers in a certain price range, those remarks are generally not uploaded to sites such as REALTOR.com, so unless the listing agent has an enhanced site and takes the steps to make it clear in the on line advertising, the consumer doesn't know this.  How are buyers responding to you when they see homes listed on line at a bargain price when they find out about the range marketing?  Are your sellers aware that the listings are put in the MLS at the lower price?  In the current market, I would think that this would encourage lower offers.  Am I wrong?  I can see how a below market price can attract more buyers and cause a sort of frenzy that could drive up the price, but I would be interested in seeing how many times this actually happens in our current market.  I will look into the links you sent.  Maybe there's something I'm missing.  BTW... when I commented about one company, it wasn't Prudential. 
Mar 11, 2008 09:00 AM
Guy E. Gimenez
The PowerHouse Group - Austin, TX
ABR, CRS, GRI - Broker & Investor (512-731-5613)

I can see your position on this Katherine, and I'm sure it is abused at times just as any other advertising / marketing technique is abused.  Many folks feel as though the ends justify the means.  However, I would like to make a couple of points.

First, I too have advised my clients to list on the low side of the scale in order to expedite a sale and significantly increase the chances for a multiple offer scenario.  I don't use the Prudential (VRM) method, I just list at the bottom of the market and often below that.  Practically speaking, this often drives offer prices up to and above the list price.  Just worked for me on two homes, both sold in 12 days and one had 4 offers all in a single day.  And since I represent sellers most of the time, I think its imperative that I do what is within the ethical, moral and legal boundaries to get them their best price and terms.   

Second, I haven't seen many posts complaining about buyer agents who submit offers 30K below asking price when the home is priced (250K) right in the middle of the market.  Why?  Because even as unrealistic as the offer may be, they're trying to get the best deal than can for their client, the buyer.  I don't get upset with these agents, my clients simply reject the offer and wait for a more realistic offer to come in. 

 

Mar 11, 2008 09:25 AM
Stephanie Ballou
Keller Williams Coastal Realty - Dover, NH

We have agents here in NH that use the "range". I am not fond of it. I have actually had 2 buyers pass on even looking at houses with this type of marketing because they feel it is "fishy" and just doesn't seem like anything they want to deal with. Who is going to pay more than the low end!!!!? I don't discourage them from seeing them! However, I'm not using this type of marketing.

As for the other, seems like a question of ethics to me.

Mar 11, 2008 10:03 AM
Monika McGillicuddy
Berkshire Hathaway HomeServices Verani Realty - Hampstead, NH
Southern NH & the Seacoast Area

It all comes down to education. My seller will entertain all offers in a certain range. It clearly states on the listing sheets and all buyers are made aware of it.  Maybe an offer on the low end will get accepted - who knows ? It all depends on terms...the whole package.  It just opens the door, allow more buyers to  see the  property and if the seller wants to accept a low offer ...it's their call not mine.  If not...the buyer can move on.

In this market everything helps...I'm hired for my expertise. My sellers and buyers have options and that is just one of them. If they don't feel comfortable with it..no big deal. It's only an option and yes they know the low price will be in MLS.  Absolutely. 

Mar 11, 2008 11:39 AM
Steve Loynd
Alpine Lakes Real Estate Inc., - Lincoln, NH
800-926-5653, White Mountains NH
I don't want to sound dense about this range pricing schedule, it would appear to me that the seller would have to accept the lowest price advertised period, when does specific performance come into this marketing effort.If a car dealer said I'll sell you this car for between 100-200 I would say I'll be there with the 100 have the car ready for me to drive off the lot, if not I'll call the better business agency/Right?
Mar 11, 2008 02:00 PM
Richard Weisser
Richard Weisser Realty - Newnan, GA
Richard Weisser Retired Real Estate Professional

Katherine,

If the seller would not actually entertain the low offer range advertised, the seller is acting in bad faith and the practice may violate FEDERAL false advertising statutes.

The real danger with ranges is fair housing. It's only a matter of time before litigation and not legislation ends this practice.

Mar 11, 2008 02:12 PM
Gloria Ruesch
NP Dodge Real Estate - Omaha, NE
Real Estate Agent - Nebraska- Iowa

As an Exclusive Buyer's Agent, I find the first scenario offensive, as everyone should.  There are too many times when we have been told about the fictional 2nd offer, and pushed to offer more.  I'm surprised that the buyer's agent in this scenario let it play out like it did and didn't walk away when it continued like it did. 

Here's the thing about negotiating an offer, if you have data that justifies the offer or rejection thereof, you have a lot stronger standing with your client when you suggest negotiating strategy.  When you involve them in a free-for-all, someone is going to come out with bruises and sometimes it will be your client.  Some clients don't want to be thrown into the fray and I can't say I blame them. As long as the seller understands that you are changing the pool of possible buyers, you're okay.

Mar 11, 2008 02:21 PM
Katherine Anderson
Coldwell Banker Hobin Realty, LLC - Hampton & Rye, NH, USA - Exeter, NH
Managing Broker

Guy:  Thank you for your comments.  We don't use range marketing either, but have used the type of marketing that you spoke of in pricing homes lower to induce a quick sale and hopefully a multiple offer situation.  Depending on the clients needs and time frame, we sometimes find this to be quite effective.  As for low offers... we generally treat them the same way as you do, again depending on the clients needs.  We have found it effective with low offers to just tell them that we are way too far apart on price to start negotiating.  Many times buyers and buyer agents are looking for your best counter offer.  If you don't give it to them, they usually come back with a better offer.  At least that's been our experience.

Stephanie:  Thanks for your comments.  I agree that this type of marketing tends to turn buyers off.  We have seen that as well.  I think especially when they see a price advertised and it's not clearly disclosed that there is a range, such as can be the case on REALTOR.com when only certain data fields are uploaded to the site.  I am glad that you don't discourage buyers from seeing the properties.  Yes, I agree that the first scenario seemed unethical.  We really don't know for a fact that the other offer didn't exist, but it just seemed that way.

Monica:  Well, I guess the key is making sure that all consumers are informed.  As long as everyone knows what they are getting into, I can see why it's not considered unethical.  I do have one other problem with this though with regard to MLS.  I don't like how it skews the numbers when we are trying to pull stats, do a CMA and the like.  Maybe if there were a way that NNEREN could make a field specifically for these types of listings so that you don't have to see the remarks in order to find them.  

Steve:  Thanks for your comments.  You don't seem dense and you bring up a good point that I don't think everyone is aware of.  The seller does not have to sell their property for the advertised price.  A property can be listed for $300,000 in the MLS and a buyer can offer full price for that listing.  The seller does not have to sell.  The seller may be obligated to pay a commission, but they cannot be forced to sell.  As for specific performance, I don't believe that would come into play until there was an actual written P&S agreement.  I am sure that many consumers may feel the same way you do on this and therefore it may not actually be serving the seller client well to use this strategy.  Sometimes appearing unethical can have the same effect as being unethical.

Richard:  Thanks for your comments.  I am not aware of the Federal false advertising statute.  Do you have a copy that you could forward to me?  Here in NH, the seller does not have to sell their home for the list price even if they get a full priced offer.  If they are knowingly advertising their property at a price that they are not willing to take under any circumstances, I agree that it is deceptive, but am not aware of any laws prohibiting it.  How do you feel that this practice would be violating fair housing laws?

Gloria: Thanks for your comments.  Under the first scenario, we couldn't be sure that other offers didn't exist.  We thought that, under the circumstances, it was likely that there weren't other offers.  During this time, the buyers agent told the buyer about other listings, warned her about his concerns, etc.  However, the buyer truly loved the property and wanted it so badly that she put up with the whole ordeal.  In the end, she probably paid about market value.  She didn't get the great deal that was originally advertised, but she didn't get shafted either.  We always make sure to check the area comps for our buyers.  This buyer was an exceptionally easy going person.  It was lucky for the seller that they had such a person on the other end.  I would guess that many other personality types would have walked away.  

Mar 12, 2008 02:48 AM
Todd Clark - Retired
eXp Realty LLC - Tigard, OR
Principle Broker Oregon

I too think both these are questionable practices and should be banned. If they won't accept a offer at $140,000 then they shouldn't have it in the MLS that way, it is false advertising.

The other one is just wrong, even if it does work. I would put an offer in contingent upon seeing the other offers that are supposedly on the table at the same time.

Apr 06, 2008 05:58 PM
Katherine Anderson
Coldwell Banker Hobin Realty, LLC - Hampton & Rye, NH, USA - Exeter, NH
Managing Broker
Todd: Thanks for commenting.  Something else that we are seeing a lot more now is short sale listings.  They are advertised in the MLS at bargain prices and (as we all know) are subject to bank approval.  Many times, the banks are not willing to settle for such a low selling price.  It's just something else that buyers should beware of. If it sounds to good to be true......
Apr 07, 2008 03:26 AM
Matthew Heavener
ERA Heavener Realty Co. - Jacksonville, FL
If the selling agent sends a full price offer that matches the terms of the MLS Listing doesn't that obligate the listing broker to pay a commission regardless of the sellers acceptance?
Apr 07, 2008 04:14 AM
Katherine Anderson
Coldwell Banker Hobin Realty, LLC - Hampton & Rye, NH, USA - Exeter, NH
Managing Broker
Matthew: That's a good question.  I am not sure about how that would play out.  I know that the seller doesn't have to sell, but could be obligated to pay a commission under the terms of their listing agreement.  As for the buyers REALTOR, coming through the MLS... I am not certain how that would work.  I haven't seen a case where someone went after their commission in such a scenario. It would be interesting to see how that would work though.    
Apr 07, 2008 04:21 AM
Tony and Suzanne Marriott, Associate Brokers
Serving the Greater Phoenix and Scottsdale Metropolitan Area - Scottsdale, AZ
Coldwell Banker Realty

False Advertising of any kind is a hot topic for me right now.  It's incredible and appalling how some agents that are clueless when it comes to Short Sales boast of hundreds of transactions and high closing ratios - neither metric being supported by the MLS.

Aug 30, 2010 04:26 AM