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Don't let your fingers get your butt in hot water

Take a look at this little piece of news that just came across my google alert. Make sure that you aren't out making libelous commentary because it could land you in hot water.

Wisconsin man gets 18 months probation in criminal libel case

Where were his libelous comments made? Yep, you guessed it, right here on ActiveRain. The article also mentions that he had his real estate license suspended for a year.

Please be careful what you are writing when posting on ActiveRain. Libel is real and it can cost you your career.

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Posted by Bob Stewart - Community Evangelist - ActiveRain on 08/12/2008 11:10 AM

Comments (144)

libel

Originally posted at: ActiveBob.....It's always Raining!: Don't let your fingers get your butt in hot water

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144 Comments on Don't let your fingers get your butt in hot water

AUG

2008

Are you serious? our Mariana?

Thanks for the reminder.

Good Lord. (Ok, maybe not the right phrase to use..but it was the first thing that came to my mind fingers)

I saw this on twitter. Actually I saw Matt Tweeting about it. AJ

Yea AJ you did it !!! Are you following me @missycaulk

Widow Maker...

We've all been told over and over and over...To watch what we say. You would think that it's just common sense. But Nooooooooooooooo.They type it anyway in spite of the risk.

Can we all say...Pay to Play or Damn Trolls :)

TLW...ROAR!

Shameful that we need to be reminded of this. His comments are unprofessional and silly. Friends don't let friends don't let friends drink and type...

Bob~ Wow. I can't believe it! Thanks for the heads up about it. I guess we all need to be aware of what could happen if you aren't careful what you type.........

Nope I found who it was, she hasn't posted since then, but at least it didn't mention which social network, thank GOD.

Missy, one of the articles that Bob linked to mentioned ActiveRain. Yikes.

Where? Not in my link, I found her post on AR.

Sorry trying to skype with Kim and Cyndee.

Missy, it's the second link.

My link does not mention AR, sorry

Only a re website.

Yikes...I can't believe someone would actually write that stuff...too bad that A|R was mentioned as the platform he used for his comments. We should all be more aware and follow the Golden Rule always.

Unbelievable. Leads to a lot of questions: did this guy take a licensing course? You know, where they include ethics???

the woman's name was Solo? Wonder if she was related to Han? good st uff!

Makes me want to go out and get a muzzle, or duck tape my fingers together.

There were some horrid things said. Looks like he got what he deserved. Funny how stupid people that use the internet are about IP addresses.

Bob, so did his blogging license get suspended as well? That would be a huge punishment for a lot of us!

HMMMM - neither one of those links brought up anything. Did it get pulled down already?

Too bad for everyone involved. How often we forget about libel and slander as issues that can get us in trouble quickly. Thanks for reminding us!

All the Best!

KatFish

Never mind - I got it - must have been the mad rush to access the site.

Another great reminder.... maybe they'll get it....

I say hip hip hooray. Shame on him for being so nasty and ugly. Shows a real lack of professionalism. Now, maybe folks will think twice before speaking out of turn. I don't understand people like this, at all. Thanks for sharing this!

Would it be libelous for me to say he acted moronicly?

How "careful" can you warn someone to be? "Hot coffee at McD's" comes to mind.

"zubrovka" How apt. :D

Always think before you speak type. I'll never understand what they were thinking.

I can not believe what I'm reading, What was this guy thinking. That nobody was going to respond to his malice or what. Good grief. Professionalism at it worst. ~Newbie Roy

This guy had to be stupid to put names in a blog that were libelous. Goodness.

If you don't have something nice to say don't say anything at all!

Somebody remind me not to accuse anyone of being in the Russian mob...

Bob in the time that I have been on ActiveRain I have seen several comments made that were worst than that. Those individuals were extremely lucky that others did not press charges against them. Some people do not use common sense, or somehow do not seem to realize that saying it on a blog is the same as saying it face to face, or even worst because now you have a whole Internet of people as a witness to what you said.

And just think, everyone was worried about reblogs...who should worry about then when you should be concerned about being libel!

He got off pretty easy, tough way to learn a lesson, tho'.

Boy am I glad you posted this. And to think that I was just about to write about somebody's ties to Dick Cheney--whew!

AUG

2008

Kent~Too funny!!!! You'd better be careful or you might get shot! hahahaha

Hahahahahahaha, lol @ Sardi!

Man, oh man! How many of us could afford to lose our license for a year?....all the more reason to be extremely careful how we conduct ourselves, in both real and virtual realms....

Hard to believe anyone would be so foolish........

Wow! This is unbelievable, that someone would be so careless to write about another on the World Wide Web and not think they would be brought to justice. I'm thankful that I'm not involved that's all I can say.

I cannot imagine making comments that would offend anyone in person or on the internet. I always tend to blog on the positive side.

Wow - it's a wake up call to every Blogger.

"Keep our words soft and sweet" ...... 'cos one day we may need to eat them!

Those were indeed outrageous comments ! And then to contact current clients ! The sentence seems a little on the light side.

Bob thanks for the information, I will make sure that I watch what I say in my blogs and comments

Oh, for crying out loud. He actually sent letters to her clients saying she was funding Russian terrorism? For pete's sake, I would probably nail someone like that to the proverbial bloggers cross as well. Crazy stuff.

I have to go with Jesse I believe the letters to the clients was the part which got him suspended. I mean come on if some one is sending letters out to your clients you have to do something.

My parents always told me, and I passed it along to my children, "If you can't say something nice about/to someone, then you don't say anything at all." Terrible comments to make - ever - to anyone!! or about anyone!!!

This guy was waaaaaay over the top...so pleased Mariana fought back and WON!

Wow isn't that something.........! Words are very powerful...both for evil and for good........plus you can't really take them back once they're posted/written/said!

Good to know. You would think it was ok to have/voice a personal opinion on a website. I guess this was more than that calling the other agent part of the Russian mafia?!?! That is a little wacked IMHO.

Interesting that this was a "joke." Maybe next time he will want to change his jokes.

Oh man! That is something else. Good reminder on watching your "P's & Q's".

People need to think before they type!

I always try to add something positive. I will actually stay away from making a comment on some blogs that look like they may be headed toward trouble. Just a better way to proceed.

Common sense should prevail, but some people don't get it and want to grind that ax in public.

Bob,

I've adopted a policy which seems to help me a lot, and that is to post a controversial post to draft and then come back in a day or so and review it. I usually change things around and make them more palatable and not so sharp. When we are emailing or blogging or even commenting it is usually coming from an emotional perspective and that side of us can really get us in big trouble.

Hi Bob, I don't see how you do it! Handling all of our issues so quickly and professionally, and staying up with everything at the same time. This is a terrific example of what not to do, thanks for effort to educate and prevent another problem. It pays to be nice, and honest. Thanks!

That was pretty bad, he lost his re license for only a year....

I'm in the same boat as a few of you......I can't believe he only lost the license for a year. I would think the state of Wisconsin Real Estate Licensing Department should take a closer look at this case and come down with a punishment that sends a much stronger message.

It's bad enough that he was contacting her past clients, but to also be making libelous statements?

Someone mentioned that they have seen far worse here. I have too and I really hope this serves as a wakeup call to people that you can be held accountable for what you write.

Bob, Thank you for the reminder. Short but to the point. We need to avoid writing about others.

My goal is never be mean sprited towards anyone on my blog, even if I don't agree with them. I definetly don't want to be sued for saying something whether true or not.

I noticed how nice everyone is being on their comments, are they concerned about something...;)

Thanks Bob, Always consequences when someone does stupid stuff.

That is a solid reminder that it's just as important to control your written words as it is to control your spoken ones.

Thanks Bob,

Not exactly very bright blogging ideas, that's for sure.

This just shows, that if you do the right things and say the right things, you do not have anything to worry about. Can't we all just get along!!

there are many defences to defamation-one being truth...

this guy sounds like he really went over the top-i think most people just use sites like this to express fair opinions and comment......

Patricia Houlihan LLB, Macdonald Realty Ltd., Vancouver, Canada

Bob, I sure hate to see ActiveRain mentioned in this case. Bummer!! I am however very pleased the legal system did something. I'm not quite sure how losing a license for a year is going to make a difference. It should have been a revocation. This serious character flaw will not just go away.

And this is why people say bad things about agents...when there are such people about!!!

Sigh. The dolts we shall always have with us.

It takes all kinds. To say something negative, while not very becomeing, has it's cetain acceptance in todays blogging ... especially to the blog trolls. BUT .. taking it to the level he did is unacceptable!

Brian C. Aber

I guess he felt like he was within his rights to do what he did not realizing there may be a cost to pay. I am surprised he wasn't penalized more too.

If you're going to post something negative, better have all the facts really correct and be able to back them up. Here's a link to another libel suit:

http://www.blogherald.com/2008/02/04/real-estate-blogger-being-sued-for-25m-for-alleged-libel/

Sounds like he got what he asked for. Maybe a year out of the business and a little counseling will do him good. Hopefully he has learned his lesson.

Common sense isn't so common, is it? As one of my mastermind cohorts says "CFS...Can't Fix Stupid"!

His fingers didn’t get his butt in trouble – his unprofessional business practices did. Hard to believe isn’t it? Oh and we here AR still have his profile up – and there are a few links to him/and another article. Do we have a bloggers jail?

Raleigh Realtor – Pamela St. Peter

Good to know. It's too bad that some people think professionalism and courtesy goes out the door just because we are interacting over the internet.

Thank goodness for less-than-brilliant criminals. That aside, what was this guy thinking? If he gets her to quit the business, he will suddenly become the local real estate czar? Bad pun, but it takes all kinds...

Seriously that guy couldnt have been thinking straight to act like that and think it wouldnt affect him. There is another person in Miami being sued for $25 million on something similar with a builder.

Do not want to get in trouble for commenting on someone else's mental state. But the court found him guilty of doing something that I do not think your common everyday agent would even consider doing. Not to mention it is a violation of the Code of Ethics, is it not? Oh well, a little less competition now in the Green Bay area. :) If we were criminals, wouldn't we be making more money, haha. Guess that is proof we are being honest and law- abiding. At least my bank account says so.

Wow,

If you want to get sued, he went about it in all the right ways. How do you defend yourself when you say stuff like that?

Shame, why would someone be so foolish to write such things. Did he really think nothing was going to happen to him. Maybe he needs some help.

I guess what I learned in Kindergarten still applies. Advice from my Elementary School Principal Mrs. Fine...."If you don't have anything nice to say, sit on your hands."

Wow, what an example of What Not To Write! Sounds like this person could use some counseling and maybe anger management classes? He must have been really mad to say those things in print about someone.

That was a pretty serious accusation....I'm surprised he didn't get fined more.

I had a client once (seller) who was in a grocery store yaking about the buyer on his house being a ditz and probably not financially able to afford his house...guess who was in front of him??? Needless to say, that buyer never bought his house.

Good manners applies to all of us, not just realtors...but all of us. Gossip, defamation, lies, pointing fingers...it is all bad.

I believe he got a slap on the wrist. He lost a real estate license for a year. Big deal. He can still work. If he has caused harm to the professional reputation of the person he libeled, that could cost her many many thousands of dollars if she lost one single transaction.

I make folks pay more than his fine for stealing one of my maps.

Kind of reminds me of a saying they gave us in real estate school:

Be careful of the words you speak

Make them soft and sweet

You never know from day to day

which ones you will have to eat!

Remember even the most innocent comment can be twisted into something mean and hurtful and get you in alot of trouble.

Wow, I honestly didn't realize how bad it is out there until this post and all of the comments. Lenn, we ALL know better than to steal your maps!

The only positive twist to this is...we aren't exactly in the middle of a very lucrative year in real estate that he is banned from...

I've said it before and I will say it again...Can't we all just get along :)

It was a slap on the wrist... he faced up to 45 months in jail and $50,000 in fines or both from what I read.

Why in the world would anyone be stupid enough to do something like this? It's beyond comprehension.

Once again justice does not prevail. A slap on the wrist to say the least. A slanderous remark to attempt or to damage a persons reputation should be dealt with more severe punishment. Should have been banished from real estate foreever and given jail time, plus a fine. I hope she looks into seeking monetary damages.

Should always practice the Three Monkey Rule.

Seems to be a very minimal punishment for very bad behavior. This is just common sense and professional courtesy, which are both very important among realtors.

Wow - how true - anything that gets printed anywhere (emails too) is OUT THERE in the world and has the potential to get into anyone's hands, fingers, and inbox .... I am careful about forwarding emails - we never know where it will end up - and somewhere - someone who was never intended to read it - reads it! Writing something on a BLOG ~ what were they thinking?

I am just glad that guy did not write about my back. Who knows what mob I might have been linked to! Probably that notorious Wales-Caulk mob from Metro Detroit. Those two are notorious you know. Notorious good bloggers. I think their talents are wanted everywhere. I just keep hearing that song "Indiana wants me"

I guess you need to be careful in everything you say but to put it in writing make sure you can back it up. Good post thanks.

The title of this post makes me think of the Cake song "where do your fingers go?" ... now it's stuck in my head.... arrggghh

astounding! thought we had a built in village-idiot filter here. guess it stopped working at the same time the one in Washington did.

forgot to call about localism / community stuff. we do tomorrow... if I don't get too distracted.

told rich to tell you that we're happy to be AR cheerleaders again in LV... he'll tell you the rest.

best

richard

AUG

2008

I had to look it up ... i was curious. http://activerain.com/blogsview/420342/If-I-can-do

There is the infamous link (you too can DELETE this comment, if you choose not to have it on your blog)

Ok, I just read Russ's remark. Too darned funny! (Especially in light of the fact that I am in awe of Russ's creative writing AND SEO knowledge.)

I am sorry to hear that no matter how many people blog about the dangers of blogging this person went as far as he did. I've read quite a few strange accusations in the forum and always wondered when the ___ would hit the fan. Unfortunately, there will be more of this coming down the road...

Yes dear. I will watch my P's and Q's.

Russ, Kris sent me here to read your comment. We've all had fun with this post, but I feel terrible for her.

Does make you think before you type and hope my mind does not wonder when responding to those special people I like dealing with on a daly basis.

He really deserves suspension from real estate for life!

The very idea......counseling indeed.

AUG

2008

If one can't say something nice in public then best not to say it at all. It is interesting how some people seem to make these comments that get them in trouble in public places.

That is a sad story - what surprises me most is that the penalties were SO LIGHT given how nasty this guy's intentions were. I'm assuming he's been banned from AR permanently. At least I would hope so.

What was wrong with him that he was defaming like that? You really gotta wonder.

He is still a member of AR isn't he? Has a very sketchy profile. The post with the comments are still up.

I am also surprised that the penalty was light. Scary stuff.

I agree with Bryant, he should have lost his license. To me that was a mean and vicious criminal act. Pity the poor broker that would take him back. I think Ohio would have taken a much tougher approach to this moron.

Reminds me of the old saying if you can't say anything nice than do not say anything at all.

Hi Bob, This is totally shocking that one our Rainers would do such a thing. Thanks for the reminder about this and we must all be careful what we write. I am sure it has been said before but "If I you can't be constructive and positive, best let your fingers tap the deskboard and not the keyboard".

AUG

2008

Thank you Bob for this post!

I had no idea that things can get that out of hand!

Of course, a lot has to do with manners, civility, and common sense! But we should all be careful when we name names---I know so many times I am tempted to name the names of unethical agents but I hold back-because I don't want to be accused of slander.

What did this person write about? Wow! I would think we would want our content to be upbuilding in general and if we needed to gripe we would not mention names.....

AUG

2008

Well....maybe I should re-blog this for a certain group of people, and for the comments made on Rich's Post the other day.....libel is libel, and I do not understand why some people do not figure it out! Letting anger or other emotions write for you can be very dangerous....and assuming because you have a right to write whatever you want gives people the right to put others down....no I don't think so.

Libel ... A serious accusation to toss around lightly. Certainly warranted in the case referenced here. Certain folks would do equally well to understand what a libelous statement entails before waving around accusations of such, lest those very accusations be libelous themselves. Silly rabbits, torts are for offenses.

AUG

2008

I think there has to be a new rule on AR if people are going to run around and leave intriguing comments like Kathy and Paul's they have to keep their comments visible, for inquiring minds. Or is it enquiring minds? The National Inquirer? The National Enquirer?

No disrespect meant to Marina, the State of WI, or Bob.... Libel is a serious subject.

SEP

2008

This guy was a dangerous (to himself) combo of stupid and ignorant. Wow, perhaps Wisconsin is better off for his being suspended, yes?

NOV

2008

Cars and computers tend to allow some personalities to feel more annonymous than they really are. And unfortunately, some people may tend to feel like that anonymity gives them rein to be nasty. It sounds (from the three paragraphs I read) the guy in this story went way beyond just a a little indiscretion.

On the other hand, it is too easy for vicious people to bring frivilous lawsuits. Of course, if you don't say anything mean or deceptive, it should be pretty easy to get along, no?

Mother's golden rule* is still golden though...

(*you know - "If you can't say anything nice..." )

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Hey Bob - Did you tick someone off? lol

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2008

Now, this was a provacative SUBJECT LINE:)

MAR

2009

Just clicked that info about what was said - all I can say is good grief....what are people thinking.

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